TRon Posted June 19 Share Posted June 19 1 minute ago, AyeDubbleYoo said: Yes and no, I don’t think Paris has that much potential except when artificially boosted by Qatari money. TBH I still think of them as a weird Frankenstein club in some ways, a relatively average club in an average league but with loads of money making them big. You might be right. As stated already, I don't really follow French football, this is just my perception that a Paris club had the potential to be one of the world's biggest. Maybe once the money dries up they will go back to being a farmers league. Maybe that could be true of Man City and Chelsea for that matter. They were well known clubs when I was growing up, but certainly no world beaters. Money definitely catapulted them into the stratosphere, and being associated with London and Manchester probably helped. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monters Posted June 19 Share Posted June 19 (edited) 57 minutes ago, The College Dropout said: No they weren't man. You need to let that one go. Man U are a sleeping giant. Liverpool were a sleeping giant. PSG ascension is only possible with the crazy investment they have received - that's not a sleeping giant. You were wrong on that point man. When? Unless I have miss counted sixteen major honors since 2000 not including Charity Shields Most be the lightest of light sleepers, not sure Man U are that asleep either Edited June 19 by Monters Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBrownBottle Posted June 19 Share Posted June 19 20 minutes ago, TRon said: Paris being Paris is always going to attract eyes, same way as London. I accept that the French League wasn't much of a competiton, but that's not what I'm saying. My point is that PSG being based in Paris always had the potential to be one of the biggest teams in the world. I mean, that's how it has played out right? Totally agree re the general appeal of Paris, but not in terms of them being potentially one of the world’s biggest clubs - despite the size of the city (over 10m in the urban area), it doesn’t have another top flight club, and PSG never attracted large or fervent support. It just isn’t a football city. Of course, they’re winning constantly, so they can fill their ground - which is smaller than the Stadium of Shite. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRon Posted June 19 Share Posted June 19 1 minute ago, TheBrownBottle said: Totally agree re the general appeal of Paris, but not in terms of them being potentially one of the world’s biggest clubs - despite the size of the city (over 10m in the urban area), it doesn’t have another top flight club, and PSG never attracted large or fervent support. It just isn’t a football city. Of course, they’re winning constantly, so they can fill their ground - which is smaller than the Stadium of Shite. I think the ethnic mix of Paris now as compared to a few decades ago might have changed that historical view a bit though. Those with African or north African heritage tend to follow football ahead of other sports so I don't really see PSG becoming a small time club again. But if Le Pen grabs power who knows. They might re-nationalise the French league and start using Parc de Princes to sell goats and pigs in the not too distant future. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JT24 Posted June 19 Share Posted June 19 8 minutes ago, TheBrownBottle said: Totally agree re the general appeal of Paris, but not in terms of them being potentially one of the world’s biggest clubs - despite the size of the city (over 10m in the urban area), it doesn’t have another top flight club, and PSG never attracted large or fervent support. It just isn’t a football city. Of course, they’re winning constantly, so they can fill their ground - which is smaller than the Stadium of Shite. Very much does have another top flight club. In fact, they play next door to PSG. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
madras Posted June 19 Share Posted June 19 (edited) 6 minutes ago, JT24 said: Very much does have another top flight club. In fact, they play next door to PSG. Now it does or at least will from August. How many of the past 20yrs has Paris had more than PSG in the top flight. Edited June 19 by madras Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted June 19 Share Posted June 19 12 minutes ago, Monters said: When? Unless I have miss counted sixteen major honors since 2000 not including Charity Shields Most be the lightest of light sleepers, not sure Man U are that asleep either Pre-FSG - they were a long way away from the revenues of Arsenal and Man U. Didn't maximise their global reach. FSG have realised Liverpool's potential as a properly elite club. There was 20-30% of unrealised potential for 30-odd years. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicken Dancer Posted June 19 Share Posted June 19 Aye, Liverpool were very much a 'cup' team in my life (36) until Klopp imo. They had the odd flirt with the title under Benitez & famously with Rodgers. The Klopp appointment changed everything there for sure & it just shows what the right appointment can do for a club. They're an absolute monster now, like they were before my day - or so me fatha tells me. But that's only really changed in the last decade I reckon, even under Rodgers in 2014 the consensus was that they were massively overachieving. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monters Posted June 19 Share Posted June 19 The American chancers brought them down but Liverpool have always been and will always be a massive football institution especially by UK standards. So revenue is the metric to judge now? Arsenal 7 major honors in the same time period... and they are also a massive institution. Highbury was an unreal ground behind the scenes in it's day but they are still smaller than Liverpool. In grates typing this born in the 70's so lived through the Liverpool love in from Paisley onwards and despise them more than any other club apart from the unwashed down the road but you can't ever say they've been anything other than a big club since Shankly and their first influx of cash Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whitley mag Posted June 19 Share Posted June 19 1 hour ago, TheBrownBottle said: It isn’t anticompetitive to have FPPT for membership - PIF refused to go through it. The PL’s objections were dropped literally one day after KSA paid the fine and allowed BeIN back into the country. You say that as though it’s gospel which it clearly isn’t, maybe Ashley could have saved himself thousands in legal bills and got your advice first. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted June 19 Share Posted June 19 3 minutes ago, Monters said: The American chancers brought them down but Liverpool have always been and will always be a massive football institution especially by UK standards. So revenue is the metric to judge now? Arsenal 7 major honors in the same time period... and they are also a massive institution. Highbury was an unreal ground behind the scenes in it's day but they are still smaller than Liverpool. In grates typing this born in the 70's so lived through the Liverpool love in from Paisley onwards and despise them more than any other club apart from the unwashed down the road but you can't ever say they've been anything other than a big club since Shankly and their first influx of cash I agree with the bolded. Arsenal are historically the 3rd biggest club in England. By a distance from the top 2. England has 2 European aristocratic teams. I would count about 8–10 across Europe with 6-8 able to be competitive due to the size of their leagues (so excluding Benfica and Ajax). I count: Real Barca Juve Bayern Man U Liverpool could argue both Milan clubs too For 25 years - Liverpool operated at a level below these. For 25 years they operated below the level of Arsenal. They were less successful on the pitch, smaller revenues, couldn’t attract the same calibre of player. As late as the mid 10’s Alexis Sanchez was choosing Arsenal over Liverpool. Players were doing that in 00’s and most of the 90’s. FSG have returned Liverpool to being an elite European club. They knew that was possible when they bought them and it could be done sustainably. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monters Posted June 19 Share Posted June 19 Agree with your club list. Personally I’d always go Milan over Inter but that’s purely Maldini worshipping Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRon Posted June 19 Share Posted June 19 1 hour ago, Monters said: The American chancers brought them down but Liverpool have always been and will always be a massive football institution especially by UK standards. So revenue is the metric to judge now? Arsenal 7 major honors in the same time period... and they are also a massive institution. Highbury was an unreal ground behind the scenes in it's day but they are still smaller than Liverpool. In grates typing this born in the 70's so lived through the Liverpool love in from Paisley onwards and despise them more than any other club apart from the unwashed down the road but you can't ever say they've been anything other than a big club since Shankly and their first influx of cash I heard that Liverpool weren't really considered a big team until Shankly's era, then they had massive success in the league and in Europe and that cemented them as legends across the world. How much of that is true I don't know. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monters Posted June 19 Share Posted June 19 Very true, that’s why I mentioned Shankly in the post 😆 From memory and happy to be corrected they were back rolled by the family behind the football pools competition around then too. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whitley mag Posted June 19 Share Posted June 19 2 minutes ago, TRon said: I heard that Liverpool weren't really considered a big team until Shankly's era, then they had massive success in the league and in Europe and that cemented them as legends across the world. How much of that is true I don't know. It’s true prior to the 1974 cup final against us we were on the same number of trophies, they played in front of 20k crowds pre Shankly. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRon Posted June 19 Share Posted June 19 Just now, Monters said: Very true, that’s why I mentioned Shankly in the post 😆 From memory and happy to be corrected they were back rolled by the family behind the football pools competition around then too. But it does show that being a massive club is relative. Liverpool are a major city so always had potential to be a big club because of their catchment area. Paris would be similar I imagine for the same reason, and also the international awareness being France's premier city. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBrownBottle Posted June 19 Share Posted June 19 10 hours ago, Whitley mag said: It’s true prior to the 1974 cup final against us we were on the same number of trophies, they played in front of 20k crowds pre Shankly. True re the cup wins, but Liverpool’s lowest post-war average crowd was 29k when in a long stretch in the second division (and that was under Shankly). Their averages in the five seasons before he joined - all in the second division - were all above 35k. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Whitley mag Posted June 20 Share Posted June 20 Very similar to us in the same period but yes granted they were in the old 2nd division, though some of our league placings in the same seasons look very mediocre. https://nufc-history.co.uk/nufc-fans-attendances.html Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myleftboot Posted 6 hours ago Share Posted 6 hours ago The Saudi version of MASH Holdings. Hopefully not. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scoot Posted 6 hours ago Share Posted 6 hours ago 3 minutes ago, Myleftboot said: The Saudi version of MASH Holdings. Hopefully not. ? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stifler Posted 5 hours ago Share Posted 5 hours ago 1 hour ago, Myleftboot said: The Saudi version of MASH Holdings. Hopefully not. There have been some absolute shite accounts join this forum since the takeover like. They have spent over £30m to bring in Bruno when it looked like we were going down, brought in Trippier to try and steady the ship. Sacked Bruce as soon as he gave himself enough rope, brought in an up and coming manager. Took us to 2 cup finals in 3 years, winning a trophy for the first time since 1969, first domestic trophy since 1955. Brought in Isak for £60m, plus £10m in add ons. Brought in young players we can develop. Invested in the women’s team to take them from the lower leagues of women’s football, to compete for a place in the WSL. Twice invested in the training ground whilst we await a suitable site for a new academy complex. Bought the Strawberry land back in the off chance we’ll need it to expand SJP, but are instead looking at building us a new stadium worth between £2bn-£4bn (potentially the most expensive stadium build in the world). Mike Ashley could buy another club and own them for the same 14 years he owned us, and between us and them he wouldn’t even touch what PIF have done for us in less than 4 years. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myleftboot Posted 5 hours ago Share Posted 5 hours ago 1 minute ago, Stifler said: There have been some absolute shite accounts join this forum since the takeover like. They have spent over £30m to bring in Bruno when it looked like we were going down, brought in Trippier to try and steady the ship. Sacked Bruce as soon as he gave himself enough rope, brought in an up and coming manager. Took us to 2 cup finals in 3 years, winning a trophy for the first time since 1969, first domestic trophy since 1955. Brought in Isak for £60m, plus £10m in add ons. Brought in young players we can develop. Invested in the women’s team to take them from the lower leagues of women’s football, to compete for a place in the WSL. Twice invested in the training ground whilst we await a suitable site for a new academy complex. Bought the Strawberry land back in the off chance we’ll need it to expand SJP, but are instead looking at building us a new stadium worth between £2bn-£4bn (potentially the most expensive stadium build in the world). Mike Ashley could buy another club and own them for the same 14 years he owned us, and between us and them he wouldn’t even touch what PIF have done for us in less than 4 years. Was a lot of that not Amanda Stavely though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unbelievable Posted 5 hours ago Share Posted 5 hours ago Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myleftboot Posted 5 hours ago Share Posted 5 hours ago Like I say hopefully not. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keegans Export Posted 5 hours ago Share Posted 5 hours ago 4 minutes ago, Myleftboot said: Was a lot of that not Amanda Stavely though. Tit Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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