Eddie Howe

[Erikse]

In the same way that Arsenal just has better player than us, the 11 players we played against Luton and Bournemouth at home were certainly of much higher quality than that of the opposition, regardless of our injuries. We need an alternative gameplan for sitautions where we can't do plan A anymore, because right now, we are underperforming with the quality of players that we have. Bournemouth and Luton would only dream of having players like Botman, Bruno and Trippier. A Miley and a Dubravka doesn't change the fact that our 11 was much better, they aren't THAT bad.

[The Prophet]

21 minutes ago, Hanshithispantz said:

Nobody has said things aren't bad 

 

We cannot defend because Howe relies on pressure to push the ball into non threatening areas. We cannot do that at the minute.

 

The fact we're still in games and have been able to string results together despite this is a possitive sign, and makes the calls for his job to be reviewed look silly, but it obviously doesn't mean we're a good side atm.

 

Cannot be arsed for another day of repeating obvious things like so will leave it here.

 

This is it. We all recognise the problems, but there's a lot of mitigation and fair reasons for the causes of them.

[OverThere]

Sometimes you have to employ the short blanket. 

[greenhill]

Since that loss against Everton we got only 11 points from 12 league games, that equates to ~35 points in 38 games. Bruce got 44 and 45 points in his two full seasons. Compared to 3 or 4 seasons ago, we got upgrades including Bruno, Trippier, Botman, Burn, Livramento, Gordon, Isak, and Miley featuring heavily during this run, the major subtractions are ASM, Shelvey and Willock (mostly injured). I don’t mean we should sack Howe now, but it is a fact that he is doing worse than Bruce with a much stronger squad at the moment. We are just not as good as we should be right now, even if injuries are accounted. He has to turn things around or questions will be raised.

[KaKa]

21 minutes ago, Erikse said:

In the same way that Arsenal just has better player than us, the 11 players we played against Luton and Bournemouth at home were certainly of much higher quality than that of the opposition, regardless of our injuries. We need an alternative gameplan for sitautions where we can't do plan A anymore, because right now, we are underperforming with the quality of players that we have. Bournemouth and Luton would only dream of having players like Botman, Bruno and Trippier. A Miley and a Dubravka doesn't change the fact that our 11 was much better, they aren't THAT bad.

 

Very simplistic way of looking at the quality of players.

 

Luton and Bournemouth have a number of dynamic attackers with pace and power.

 

Our defence is currently being exposed due to the current midfield which lacks dynamism and recovery speed.

 

This allowed both Luton and Bournemouth to capitalise against our defence which is not the quickest, and at the same time the goalkeeper is not good coming off his line as a sweeper, like Pope is.

[The Prophet]

4 minutes ago, greenhill said:

Since that loss against Everton we got only 11 points from 12 league games, that equates to ~35 points in 38 games. Bruce got 44 and 45 points in his two full seasons. Compared to 3 or 4 seasons ago, we got upgrades including Bruno, Trippier, Botman, Burn, Livramento, Gordon, Isak, and Miley featuring heavily during this run, the major subtractions are ASM, Shelvey and Willock (mostly injured). I don’t mean we should sack Howe now, but it is a fact that he is doing worse than Bruce with a much stronger squad at the moment. We are just not as good as we should be right now, even if injuries are accounted. He has to turn things around or questions will be raised.

 

Why is Bruce even relevant?

[greenhill]

1 minute ago, The Prophet said:

 

Why is Bruce even relevant?

When everyone think that Bruce had done an awful job and someone is doing worse than Bruce, there must be something wrong.

[Mills and Boon]

5 minutes ago, greenhill said:

When everyone think that Bruce had done an awful job and someone is doing worse than Bruce, there must be something wrong.

 

Worse than Bruce over a curated set of fixtures chosen to make Howe look as bad as possible

[KaKa]

12 minutes ago, The Prophet said:

 

Why is Bruce even relevant?

 

I can't believe the correlation.

 

Bruce had ten men in our box the whole game as sitting ducks. Just waiting to concede all game after which we were done. Just because this meant we didn't concede as much playing this way, even though we then lost much more because we often had no chance of getting a result, they actually think this means Bruce was doing better!

 

Words fail me man. 

[Miggys First Goal]

Tell me somebody isn’t trying to pass off Bruce as a better manager than Eddie. 

[TBG]

25 minutes ago, greenhill said:

 Bruce got 44 and 45 points in his two full seasons.

 

Howe got 109 in a season and a half. 

 

Pretty sure we got Champions League as well, but someone will have to clarify. 

[54]

36 minutes ago, greenhill said:

Since that loss against Everton we got only 11 points from 12 league games, that equates to ~35 points in 38 games. Bruce got 44 and 45 points in his two full seasons. Compared to 3 or 4 seasons ago, we got upgrades including Bruno, Trippier, Botman, Burn, Livramento, Gordon, Isak, and Miley featuring heavily during this run, the major subtractions are ASM, Shelvey and Willock (mostly injured). I don’t mean we should sack Howe now, but it is a fact that he is doing worse than Bruce with a much stronger squad at the moment. We are just not as good as we should be right now, even if injuries are accounted. He has to turn things around or questions will be raised.

Penn (Or was is Luke), is that you?

[greenhill]

5 minutes ago, Mills and Boon said:

 

Worse than Bruce over a curated set of fixtures chosen to make Howe look as bad as possible

I don't suggest Howe is a bad manager nor we should sack him now, he is probably a much better manager than Bruce but our current results is worse than that under Bruce is also a fact. I hope and I still have some faith that he could turn things around. But if that doesn't happen before the end of this season, we have to reflect why we were that bad. We still have 12 more league games to play, if our performance and results remain that bad over 24 games it's hard to argue it's over 'a curated set of fixtures'.

[Conjo]

[Rod]

1 minute ago, greenhill said:

I don't suggest Howe is a bad manager nor we should sack him now, he is probably a much better manager than Bruce but our current results is worse than that under Bruce is also a fact. I hope and I still have some faith that he could turn things around. But if that doesn't happen before the end of this season, we have to reflect why we were that bad. We still have 12 more league games to play, if our performance and results remain that bad over 24 games it's hard to argue it's over 'a curated set of fixtures'.

"He is probably a better manager than Bruce"!  Words fail me.

[Rod]

1 minute ago, Conjo said:

I've just realised ....... it's school holidays isn't it?

[Conjo]

2 minutes ago, Rod said:

I've just realised ....... it's school holidays isn't it?

 

It is in west coast in Norway at least. Don't know about you guys.

[Holmesy]

2 hours ago, Shadow Puppets said:

I maintain it is ALL down to the midfield not functioning properly at all without the legs of Joelinton and Willock.

You're probably spot on with that, but isn't it the manager's job to find a way around it? For me, some of the criticism of Eddie is way over the top, but some of it is warranted.

 

One of the frustrating narratives is that he can't do anything about it when it's literally his job to do something about it. Who is it setting the midfield up to push so far forward? Who is it deciding not to play one of the midfielders deeper? Who is it not experimenting with different formations, shapes and systems to negate our weaknesses? Who persisted with probably the slowest outfield player in the PL game after game, when he was getting torn to shreds after the pedestrian midfield was bypassed?

 

You can't say it's down to the midfield and absolve Eddie of blame, when he sets up the midfield. It's like we're stuck on one setting and people are defending Eddie by saying we don't have the right players to play that setting, so what do you expect?! Honestly, I expect us to be able to change setting. 

 

 

Edited February 27 by Holmesy

[KaKa]

3 minutes ago, Rod said:

"He is probably a better manager than Bruce"!  Words fail me.

 

I'm completely floored man ... I mean, how can anyone see things this way. What is the point of even following the sport? This is just sad.

[Erikse]

58 minutes ago, KaKa said:

 

Very simplistic way of looking at the quality of players.

 

Luton and Bournemouth have a number of dynamic attackers with pace and power.

 

Our defence is currently being exposed due to the current midfield which lacks dynamism and recovery speed.

 

This allowed both Luton and Bournemouth to capitalise against our defence which is not the quickest, and at the same time the goalkeeper is not good coming off his line as a sweeper, like Pope is.

 

I'm sure you could make an argument for every team in the league to have strengths against us. Does Luton and Bournemouth not have weaknesses of their own? Weaknesses is something that you try to compensate for tactically. For example, our defence was struggling with pace against Luton while Livra was on the bench.

 

Now that the fatiguer factor is gone, we have to find new excuses it seems.

 

 

Edited February 27 by Erikse

[Mills and Boon]

11 minutes ago, greenhill said:

I don't suggest Howe is a bad manager nor we should sack him now, he is probably a much better manager than Bruce but our current results is worse than that under Bruce is also a fact. I hope and I still have some faith that he could turn things around. But if that doesn't happen before the end of this season, we have to reflect why we were that bad. We still have 12 more league games to play, if our performance and results remain that bad over 24 games it's hard to argue it's over 'a curated set of fixtures'.

 

Well when you've decided to stop at 12 games it is curated. Why not include the whole season? Or Howe's full record as you did for Bruce?

 

Because it then becomes obvious that Howe is better and you don't want to say that for some reason.

 

What's the average points per game of Bruce's last 12 games in charge out of interest?

[KaKa]

12 minutes ago, Erikse said:

 

I'm sure you could make an argument for every team in the league to have strengths against us. Does Luton and Bournemouth not have weaknesses of their own? Weaknesses is something that you try to compensate for tactically. For example, our defence was struggling with pace against Luton while Livra was on the bench.

 

Now that the fatiguer factor is gone, we have to find new excuses it seems.

 

 

 

 

Yeah, it's all just excuses. Fine. 

[The Prophet]

21 minutes ago, Holmesy said:

You're probably spot on with that, but isn't it the manager's job to find a way around it? For me, some of the criticism of Eddie is way over the top, but some of it is warranted.

 

One of the frustrating narratives is that he can't do anything about it when it's literally his job to do something about it. Who is it setting the midfield up to push so far forward? Who is it deciding not to play one of the midfielders deeper? Who is it not experimenting with different formations, shapes and systems to negate our weaknesses? Who persisted with probably the slowest outfield player in the PL game after game, when he was getting torn to shreds?

 

You can't say it's down to the midfield and absolve Eddie of blame, when he sets up the midfield. It's like we're stuck on one setting and people are defending Eddie by saying we don't have the right players to play that setting, so what do you expect?! Honestly, I expect us to be able to change setting. 

 

It's not like he hasn't tried. We've had...

 

Bruno deeper.

 

Miley and Longstaff deeper.

 

Miley right, Longstaff left.

 

Longstaff left, Miley right.

 

Man for man pressing.

 

Zonal pressing.

 

Sure, it's his job to find the answer and he hasn't done so yet, but we've tried variations of the flat midfield three. Perhaps he should have implemented a more radical change, but he has been shuffling it about.

 

My personal view is we could benefit from a more natural defensive minded midfielder. They don't have to be a stopper, but an option who has that discipline to sit in the gap between the midfield and back four.

 

 

Edited February 27 by The Prophet

[greenhill]

9 minutes ago, Mills and Boon said:

 

Well when you've decided to stop at 12 games it is curated. Why not include the whole season? Or Howe's full record as you did for Bruce?

 

Because it then becomes obvious that Howe is better and you don't want to say that for some reason.

 

What's the average points per game of Bruce's last 12 games in charge out of interest?

Because we make decisions based on what he is doing now, not his CV.

 

Since that Everton game we had been poor for some time, and things are not fixed yet.

 

And FYI, Bruce got 12 points from his last 12 league games in charge.

[KaKa]

22 minutes ago, Holmesy said:

You're probably spot on with that, but isn't it the manager's job to find a way around it? For me, some of the criticism of Eddie is way over the top, but some of it is warranted.

 

One of the frustrating narratives is that he can't do anything about it when it's literally his job to do something about it. Who is it setting the midfield up to push so far forward? Who is it deciding not to play one of the midfielders deeper? Who is it not experimenting with different formations, shapes and systems to negate our weaknesses? Who persisted with probably the slowest outfield player in the PL game after game, when he was getting torn to shreds after the pedestrian midfield was bypassed?

 

You can't say it's down to the midfield and absolve Eddie of blame, when he sets up the midfield. It's like we're stuck on one setting and people are defending Eddie by saying we don't have the right players to play that setting, so what do you expect?! Honestly, I expect us to be able to change setting. 

 

 

 

 

It all sounds so simple.

 

So when Mourinho was stinking at Spurs why didn't he just change setting? 

 

When Conte was stinking at Spurs why couldn't he just change setting?

 

These are the elite managers we should be after right? Why couldn't they both just figure it out, even without an injury crisis?