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Financial Fair Play / Profit & Sustainability


Mattoon

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Just now, FloydianMag said:

Agreed, but clearly the PL thought that’s what they could do believing all would be good to go within 10 days of the judgement🤷‍♂️

 

If they "Blue Pencil" the bits they lost on would it not make Man City's case even stronger ?

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1 minute ago, Ben said:

 

If they "Blue Pencil" the bits they lost on would it not make Man City's case even stronger ?

I’d of thought so…..as @Keegans Export pointed out now that ‘shareholder loans’ have to be added and assessed the whole APT rules will need a rewrite imo. This also impacts FFP/PSR calculations. It’s a mess of the PL’s making.

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Just now, FloydianMag said:

PL asked all clubs to provide details by last Thursday, quite a few including Arsenal and Chelsea.

Chelsea £100m+ to their PE overlords

Arsenal £200m+ to the Kroenkes

Brighton £300m+ to Tony Bloom although reduced by £30m last year.

Everton £400m to Moshiri but expected to be wiped clean when Friedkin completes the takeover

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1 minute ago, FloydianMag said:

PL asked all clubs to provide details by last Thursday, quite a few including Arsenal and Chelsea.

How can the premier league set rules for restricting income or invest while some teams lurk in the shadows getting interest free support from their shareholders. [emoji38]

 

 

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Just now, NG32 said:

How can the premier league set rules for restricting income or invest while some teams lurk in the shadows getting interest free support from their shareholders. [emoji38]

 

 

Aye…….bent and corrupt as fuck.

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24 minutes ago, Nucasol said:

Chelsea £100m+ to their PE overlords

Arsenal £200m+ to the Kroenkes

Brighton £300m+ to Tony Bloom although reduced by £30m last year.

Everton £400m to Moshiri but expected to be wiped clean when Friedkin completes the takeover

 

Someone made the point in an Athletic article that, unlike the PL, UEFA already include shareholder loans in their FMV stuff, therefore you'd assume any of those clubs who have been playing in Europe are probably still (mostly) fine.

 

Everton though...RIP...

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1 hour ago, NG32 said:

How can the premier league set rules for restricting income or invest while some teams lurk in the shadows getting interest free support from their shareholders. [emoji38]

 

 


 

to be honest I think the loans interest is just a convenient fuck up by the premier league.  You can put in funds via loans or equity through issuing shares.  Both of these act the same way with regard to PSR rules.  Owners chose loans as it makes getting money out (without the sale of the club) and with less tax cost to the owner.  Just like Brighton did. If that was equity they have needed to take a dividend and pay just short of 40% tax on the thirty million.  

 

I would imagine if we do anything to the ground that would be funded with an equity injection and that would be irrelevant to any PSR calcs. 
 

 

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6 minutes ago, KetsbaiaIsBald said:


 

to be honest I think the loans interest is just a convenient fuck up by the premier league.  You can put in funds via loans or equity through issuing shares.  Both of these act the same way with regard to PSR rules.  Owners chose loans as it makes getting money out (without the sale of the club) and with less tax cost to the owner.  Just like Brighton did. If that was equity they have needed to take a dividend and pay just short of 40% tax on the thirty million.  

 

I would imagine if we do anything to the ground that would be funded with an equity injection and that would be irrelevant to any PSR calcs. 
 

 

 

The tax implications must be a minefield, I remember years ago the agents were telling players not to register themselves as companies because they would need to pay VAT on their transfers (or something like that, my mind goes to mush with that sort of thing) even the Chancellor or the Exchequer needs help with her tax. 

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3 hours ago, Ben said:

 

That cant be true 

 

It only relates to the powers the tribunal have to amend the rules in their final decision.

 

The PL can amend them however they like (subject to a vote and risk of furgher challenge, obviously).

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2 minutes ago, Jackie Broon said:

 

It only relates to the powers the tribunal have to amend the rules in their final decision.

 

The PL can amend them however they like (subject to a vote and risk of furgher challenge, obviously).

 

TBF after doing a bit reading on it, it seems like a sensible way to get rid of wording when issues come to a standstill, I still don't think its an option in this case though  

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1 hour ago, NG32 said:

How can the premier league set rules for restricting income or invest while some teams lurk in the shadows getting interest free support from their shareholders. [emoji38]

 

 

We did for years under Ashley. He loaned us well over £100m for more than a decade. That loan was cleared when the takeover completed. 

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20 minutes ago, Ben said:

 

TBF after doing a bit reading on it, it seems like a sensible way to get rid of wording when issues come to a standstill, I still don't think its an option in this case though  

 

I think that was his point to be fair.

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25 minutes ago, 500bhp said:

We did for years under Ashley. He loaned us well over £100m for more than a decade. That loan was cleared when the takeover completed. 

 

In that case I think we could argue that we paid above FMV interest on his loans in kind through free sponsorships, worth possibly £100m+.

 

 

Edited by Jackie Broon

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2 hours ago, KetsbaiaIsBald said:


 

to be honest I think the loans interest is just a convenient fuck up by the premier league.  You can put in funds via loans or equity through issuing shares.  Both of these act the same way with regard to PSR rules.  Owners chose loans as it makes getting money out (without the sale of the club) and with less tax cost to the owner.  Just like Brighton did. If that was equity they have needed to take a dividend and pay just short of 40% tax on the thirty million.  

 

I would imagine if we do anything to the ground that would be funded with an equity injection and that would be irrelevant to any PSR calcs. 
 

 

There is another route although there are tax implications and that is a company can buy back shares . Profit based on time held  will attract CGT but in theory can I believe only be done in one transaction if the company has surplus cash 

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Hopefully the ESL will get the same reaction from fans that it got the last time. Utter contempt. They'll be trying a different method to try and get around it this time, so we'll see how it goes. 

 

I'm not saying that there's a combined effort to ruin the Premier League in order to make the ESL seem more attractive by comparison, but that's generally the tactic that's used to manufacture consent for unpopular decisions and the Premier League certainly does appear to be being ruined...

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Just now, El Prontonise said:

I honestly hope the whole sport goes bust.  It's rotten to the core.

Does feel like it’s morphed into Greedball. I can still enjoy watching the game but fuck me, I absolutely hate it when I’m not watching it 

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