TRon

Can't say I've seen much of him either but he's big and strong with decent ability and they see him as a future England player. They were asking a sunderland fan about him on Talksport and he reckoned he was quick, could score goals and had a decent cross on him. If he's right-sided then Enrique will snuff him dead. If he's up against Simpson I'd be concerned...unless he turns out to be shite and it's all hype.

What's he like then? When I've seen him he looked off the pace and slow. Looked on the sunderland forum and didn't see his name mentioned in the team they expect to be starting.

What's he like then?

Don Hutchinson wasn't slow. I wasn't really comparing players styles in any case, just from what I've seen Bruce seems to have added a bit of athleticism into the Sunderland side, especially the forwards. No idea what their central midfield are like, Cattermole and Cana maybe are not much better than Nolan in this regard so we might have an interesting contest.

Barton is still a central midfielder and like Guthrie, every time he's asked to play wide right he always ends up drifting into the middle a fair bit. Unlike Guthrie though he does have a bit of desire and he gave it a good go against West Ham. I doubt it will come off for Hughton in too many games though so I still think Barton should play centrally with Routledge wide.

No doubt Sundeland fans reading that will be 'discusted'.

5 out of 10 is an average mark. Unsurprisingly given after an average performance..... Since most of us are used to FM/CM type ratings (or whatever system those ratings originated from), a 5 out of 10 is given for a poor/sub-par performance, with 6 or 7 being the average. I'd say Tiote aside, Jonas looked our best player. Was single handedly carrying our attack for much of the game, dribbling past numerous players whilst under pressure/marked. It's a shame he can't cross well and lacks consistency, but that doesn't mean we should ignore just how good he can be at pushing the team forward from nothing positions/situations, and that's exactly what he did against West Ham. Hence why the 5 seems harsh when he was pretty much the one player responsible for our dominance/possession going forward. Very true, it's easy to look at the end product and get frustrated, but in our team the ability to carry the ball from deep in our own half to the opposition penalty area is priceless.

BTW I have no doubts that Check Tiote will be able to match the scum midfield stride for stride and will hopefully kick them off the park.

Nice post, except for the bit quoted above Kevin Nolan is the radical change in attitude from the 'old guard' - he's not one of them. For far too long we've had a collection of individuals, only brought together by the fact that the same company pays their wages. Nolan may not have embraced the 'European lifestyle' but he epitomises someone who is a TEAM player. This is the point we've been alluding to/stating the obvious over the past couple of months. No, Nolan isn't one of our 10 'best' players (on an individual study) but, for all of his glaring deficiencies, he has untangibles that go unnoticed by the majority. Which is why I find him worthy of a place in our team and definitely the club captain. Long may he continue to score goals and shove two fingers up to the whingers. I'll be interested to see how he performs against Sunderland this weekend, because Nolan for me is similar to the players the Mackem team used to be full of when they were yo yo-ing between the leagues a few seasons back. That is, hard-working, honest grafters who couldn't compete with the quality teams but gave it 100%. Sunderland have moved on since then and their team looks faster and more athletic than ours under Bruce and they are getting good results against quality teams. I'm hoping that our great team spirit will give us the edge but I have a feeling they will end up looking the better team. If Nolan ends up bossing that game then I will be happy to give him the credit for it.

Easily. Does he ever lose the ball? It doesn't seem to matter how many people are flying into him he still comes out with it at his feet. Pure quality.

Yep that's a major criticism I have of Barton, but to be fair, one of the main reasons we won was because he put in a wholehearted performance on the right side. He could have just sulked like Guthrie and decided it wasn't his best position but he gave it a good go and what looked like a lop sided midfield worked out ok because of his effort.

I thought that was his best game so far. Seemed to have lost a bit of decisiveness when coming off his line previously but he looked more like the Krul we first saw yesterday. Came out and took some good high crosses and threw the ball instead of just booting it upfield.

Agree with that mostly. I'm far happier to see Nolan in CM. His lack of mobility is a problem but he put in a good shift yesterday and at least Carroll looked less isolated than when Nolan plays up front.

Guthrie starting out wide again? I wonder if he'll even bother.

He isn't an unknown quantity With this injury he is. It would be a ludicrous risk to sign him right now, as Yorkie said. Agree - this kind of injury affects players differently. Much of the subsequent problem can be in their head. Some get over it but look at Shearer ; mentally very strong and played for a futher 9 years but was never as dangerous as before because he lost some speed. With Shearer we knew what we had whereas with HBA we really don't ; is it the player who scored a cracking goal at Everton or is it the one who was ineffective against Stoke ? Then there are the off-field issues he had with previous clubs..... NUFC hasn't the money to risk so unless the trial can be extended, I wouldn't take the risk. Ineffective against Stoke? care to elaborate? Would you care to outline any incidents in which he created problems for them..?? If you didn't see them then what's the point? He was our best player in the first half, his dribbling alone opened up plenty of space, but then you need movement from other players to benefit from it. Tbh even if he had a s*** game it's beside the point. If you can't see a good player there then you aren't much different to the West Ham fans who whinged about Mascherano and Tevez. That's YOUR interpretation of it - mine is that they quickly sussed him and because the other players are not good enough individually to cause teams problems, Stoke were able to put more players on him and snuff him out..just as Wigan did with Jonas and Enrique. What gives YOU the God-given right to decide whether I am like 'those West Ham fans(were you there by the way ?)etc etc.' You might think you know everything about the game but I do not share your opinion - or, incidentally, put much store by it. have you answered my point about his previous managers in France not wishing to keep him ? I wasn't aware that the French League is running over with top class players either... we do not need ANY player who is going to be temperamental and that is obviously the stance they took. There is more to a footballer than being able to do a few pretty dribbles or look good for the odd game...but then, as a NUFC fan for some years, you should be used to that by now ! So isn't that just the same as what I was saying, basically Stoke let our other players go free and instead threw extra players on HBA? So it's his fault the other players are too shit for Stoke to mark? What do you expect him to do, dribble past four players and score every game? By the way, I am not forcing you to agree with my opinion, I rate the lad, doesn't mean you have to. Everyone is entitled to their opinions even West Ham fans who felt Mascherano or Tevez were not good enough for their side.

We have the lip smacking alternative of Nolan and Carroll which has served us so well in recent games after all.

id give him the pay rise he wants so long as he agrees to play rightback! This is probably the only place in the world he'd get paid whatever he wanted to play right back. He must be that good.

He isn't an unknown quantity With this injury he is. It would be a ludicrous risk to sign him right now, as Yorkie said. Agree - this kind of injury affects players differently. Much of the subsequent problem can be in their head. Some get over it but look at Shearer ; mentally very strong and played for a futher 9 years but was never as dangerous as before because he lost some speed. With Shearer we knew what we had whereas with HBA we really don't ; is it the player who scored a cracking goal at Everton or is it the one who was ineffective against Stoke ? Then there are the off-field issues he had with previous clubs..... NUFC hasn't the money to risk so unless the trial can be extended, I wouldn't take the risk. Ineffective against Stoke? care to elaborate? Would you care to outline any incidents in which he created problems for them..?? If you didn't see them then what's the point? He was our best player in the first half, his dribbling alone opened up plenty of space, but then you need movement from other players to benefit from it. Tbh even if he had a shit game it's beside the point. If you can't see a good player there then you aren't much different to the West Ham fans who whinged about Mascherano and Tevez.

I was just reminded of Alan Pardew and his assessment of Tevez and Mascherano in the Hughton thread. This one is up there with it and it's always good for a laugh to see our fans pronounce such judgements on p[layers like HBA....because our side's just loaded with quality of course.

Not sure he's a better bet than Shola in any case.

Ah yes, Alan Pardew...the insightful manager who dropped Mascherano and Tevez from his side because they were upsetting the team morale amongst the bunch of talentless cloggers which made up the West Ham side in those days. What a trade up that would be.

There's a difference between "didn't like" and "hated with a passion". I didn't like Dyer either but I knew when we sold him we wouldn't get a better player. The fans I am talking about are those who screamed abuse at him on every occasion.

Both of these are currently forming one of the worst forward line partnerships in the premier. Absolutely no chemistry whatsoever. At least on the pitch.

The selling of dyer, was the start of our midfield looking slow and work man like. At least with dyer you knew you had someone who could run with the ball. It's okay being able to run with the ball but he can't do it whilst he's sat on the treatment table. If he's had stayed, it's probable in how things work he wouldn't of got that major injury, but I know where your coming from though. I'm still 50-50 whether it was good business or not Crazy talk. You bemoan Barton on a regular basis for taking 65k a week but are unsure if a player who had a shocking injury record and, was on a reported 80 grand a week basic wage should have been sold? Can you see the double standards? Right, getting a major injury is something that's usually a freak accident, that is what Dyer got, he got a broken leg, nothing like any of his usual hamstring or shin splints injuries. So it's likely if dyer had stayed he would of never of got his broken leg, in the same way in which barton or luque for example would of got their major injuries with us. I have other problems with Barton as well though, like his criminal record for starters. But you highlight the fundamental flaw in your own argument. His USUAL injuries, he was notorious for not being able to string a run of games together because he was always injured. I don't debate the fact that had he stayed at Newcastle it's unlikely he'd have broken his leg, instead he'd have gone through a frustrating cycle of treatment table, reserve games, first team games, injury. Now you also highlight Barton's off field transgressions as a strike against him, something I can't argue he's been far from a model professional but, is Kieron Dyer really the kind of person you want to compare him with? A player who once famously pissed in the street, had total disregard for the fans who adored him, and I'd argue even topped Barton in the stupidity ranks by fighting with a team-mate on the pitch. To be fair, I regularly piss in the street. Also, didn't Dyer burn money in front of fans? If he did that's comparable to Barton in terms of sheer twattiness for me. Dyer was a c*** to own his friends let a lone the fans. The money went to his head, and he believed that the £20m move to Man United was coming anytime now. care to expand (even by pm), just i've said it before i regularly saw him and titus in town and they were so timid after the intitial glare had worn off (yes they were annoying at first) but then became like kids, always at the cinema and hiding in corners in pubs. I always felt that the sort of fans who hated Dyer with a passion were probably far bigger tossers than Dyer himself.

He has the same problem as Nolan in that he's too slow/physically incapable to be a be a box to box player so ends up just hovering round a small area of the pitch leaving all the movement to other players. He's certainly slow, but he does get into the penalty area. I'm not saying he's a Lampard, but I don't think there's an issue with his mobility. If we had a striker who could drop back and link with the midfield, I think we'd see some exchanging of positions and Barton getting into the box a bit more - in the way that Beardsley and Lee used to interchange. At the moment we look a bit static. At the end of the day, do we have anyone better for CM? I don't think so. The alternatives all share the same faults, i.e., lack of pace and desire to get in the penalty area. Guthrie and Smith in any case, and Nolan just isn't physically capable of getting there from a midfield position which is why Hughton ends up playing him as a forward. Dan Gosling was probably bought for this reason. Barton's definitely the best midfielder we've got technique wise, but when he's got Tiote behind him you would expect to see him doing far more damage in the opposition half than he is currently.