TRon

id give him the pay rise he wants so long as he agrees to play rightback! This is probably the only place in the world he'd get paid whatever he wanted to play right back. He must be that good.

He isn't an unknown quantity With this injury he is. It would be a ludicrous risk to sign him right now, as Yorkie said. Agree - this kind of injury affects players differently. Much of the subsequent problem can be in their head. Some get over it but look at Shearer ; mentally very strong and played for a futher 9 years but was never as dangerous as before because he lost some speed. With Shearer we knew what we had whereas with HBA we really don't ; is it the player who scored a cracking goal at Everton or is it the one who was ineffective against Stoke ? Then there are the off-field issues he had with previous clubs..... NUFC hasn't the money to risk so unless the trial can be extended, I wouldn't take the risk. Ineffective against Stoke? care to elaborate? Would you care to outline any incidents in which he created problems for them..?? If you didn't see them then what's the point? He was our best player in the first half, his dribbling alone opened up plenty of space, but then you need movement from other players to benefit from it. Tbh even if he had a shit game it's beside the point. If you can't see a good player there then you aren't much different to the West Ham fans who whinged about Mascherano and Tevez.

I was just reminded of Alan Pardew and his assessment of Tevez and Mascherano in the Hughton thread. This one is up there with it and it's always good for a laugh to see our fans pronounce such judgements on p[layers like HBA....because our side's just loaded with quality of course.

Not sure he's a better bet than Shola in any case.

Ah yes, Alan Pardew...the insightful manager who dropped Mascherano and Tevez from his side because they were upsetting the team morale amongst the bunch of talentless cloggers which made up the West Ham side in those days. What a trade up that would be.

There's a difference between "didn't like" and "hated with a passion". I didn't like Dyer either but I knew when we sold him we wouldn't get a better player. The fans I am talking about are those who screamed abuse at him on every occasion.

Both of these are currently forming one of the worst forward line partnerships in the premier. Absolutely no chemistry whatsoever. At least on the pitch.

The selling of dyer, was the start of our midfield looking slow and work man like. At least with dyer you knew you had someone who could run with the ball. It's okay being able to run with the ball but he can't do it whilst he's sat on the treatment table. If he's had stayed, it's probable in how things work he wouldn't of got that major injury, but I know where your coming from though. I'm still 50-50 whether it was good business or not Crazy talk. You bemoan Barton on a regular basis for taking 65k a week but are unsure if a player who had a shocking injury record and, was on a reported 80 grand a week basic wage should have been sold? Can you see the double standards? Right, getting a major injury is something that's usually a freak accident, that is what Dyer got, he got a broken leg, nothing like any of his usual hamstring or shin splints injuries. So it's likely if dyer had stayed he would of never of got his broken leg, in the same way in which barton or luque for example would of got their major injuries with us. I have other problems with Barton as well though, like his criminal record for starters. But you highlight the fundamental flaw in your own argument. His USUAL injuries, he was notorious for not being able to string a run of games together because he was always injured. I don't debate the fact that had he stayed at Newcastle it's unlikely he'd have broken his leg, instead he'd have gone through a frustrating cycle of treatment table, reserve games, first team games, injury. Now you also highlight Barton's off field transgressions as a strike against him, something I can't argue he's been far from a model professional but, is Kieron Dyer really the kind of person you want to compare him with? A player who once famously pissed in the street, had total disregard for the fans who adored him, and I'd argue even topped Barton in the stupidity ranks by fighting with a team-mate on the pitch. To be fair, I regularly piss in the street. Also, didn't Dyer burn money in front of fans? If he did that's comparable to Barton in terms of sheer twattiness for me. Dyer was a c*** to own his friends let a lone the fans. The money went to his head, and he believed that the £20m move to Man United was coming anytime now. care to expand (even by pm), just i've said it before i regularly saw him and titus in town and they were so timid after the intitial glare had worn off (yes they were annoying at first) but then became like kids, always at the cinema and hiding in corners in pubs. I always felt that the sort of fans who hated Dyer with a passion were probably far bigger tossers than Dyer himself.

He has the same problem as Nolan in that he's too slow/physically incapable to be a be a box to box player so ends up just hovering round a small area of the pitch leaving all the movement to other players. He's certainly slow, but he does get into the penalty area. I'm not saying he's a Lampard, but I don't think there's an issue with his mobility. If we had a striker who could drop back and link with the midfield, I think we'd see some exchanging of positions and Barton getting into the box a bit more - in the way that Beardsley and Lee used to interchange. At the moment we look a bit static. At the end of the day, do we have anyone better for CM? I don't think so. The alternatives all share the same faults, i.e., lack of pace and desire to get in the penalty area. Guthrie and Smith in any case, and Nolan just isn't physically capable of getting there from a midfield position which is why Hughton ends up playing him as a forward. Dan Gosling was probably bought for this reason. Barton's definitely the best midfielder we've got technique wise, but when he's got Tiote behind him you would expect to see him doing far more damage in the opposition half than he is currently.

He has the same problem as Nolan in that he's too slow/physically incapable to be a be a box to box player so ends up just hovering round a small area of the pitch leaving all the movement to other players.

I always got the impression Jol would be happy to come here, the reason he won't is firstly Ajax wouldn't let him leave in a hurry and more importantly he's not a low brand bargain basement manager which is the first requirement on the CV when it comes to Ashley.

If you go beyond the win = good game, loss = bad game then there's a bit more to it than that. Like the rest of our central midfielders apart from Tiote, Barton doesn't sprint, he casually strolls along then stops after passing the ball. It's why he never gets beyond the forwards to get into the penalty area. He's got goods ability on the ball but in the premier the opposition won't allow you to play at half tempo and that's what Barton does. Believe it or not, I wasn't actually analysing Barton's performances simply on whether we won or not... Yeah I realise you were analysing the comments as you didn't really say anything about Barton's performance. But that was my analysis of Barton and it's been pretty consistent whatever the result.

If you go beyond the win = good game, loss = bad game then there's a bit more to it than that. Like the rest of our central midfielders apart from Tiote, Barton doesn't sprint, he casually strolls along then stops after passing the ball. It's why he never gets beyond the forwards to get into the penalty area. He's got goods ability on the ball but in the premier the opposition won't allow you to play at half tempo and that's what Barton does.

While I get frustrated with his team make up most weeks - Guthrie has rarely looked interested in playing wide, and he hasn't got the pace to do it anyway - Hughton still seems like a fairly intelligent bloke and I reckon will go on to be one of the better managers in English football. We just need to get through this season.

I don't expect everyone to understand it to be fair.

in which alternate universe would this happen? Probably in the veterans league is my guess. Is he just the latest scapegoat after Nolan? Or are they both too slow/lazy to get in the penalty box from a central midfield position?

At least we showed some character. Not easy coming back from 2-0 down. Might turn out to be one of the most important points of the season, if we'd lost three at home on the bounce it would not have looked good.

I think Hughton saw his pace and got sucked in by that. At Newcastle it's a quality we lack through the side, but the player has to have some ability as well. Taylor's better going forward but I still think Perch is a better defender. He needs to be rested though, then I wouldn't be surprised to see him come back looking a lot better. Ryan Taylor hits a nice cross but he's a shocking defender.

I would much rather see Shola or Ranger play instead. Lovenkrands had his chance and blew it.

Said this before the game. Guthrie hates playing on the wing and he's too slow anyway. Like I said in the pre-match thread, why not try playing midfielders in midfield, wingers on the wing, and forwards up front? Oh and if we must play 4-5-1, the attacking midfielder shouldn't be a fat bastard.

He's still shit.

Captain Colo-ssuss

or Ben Arfa. Eh? Eh? Aye, fucking exactly. I wasn't really having a go at Hughton FWIW, more the crap mamagement which refused to play Zog left wing despite it being obvious he was one of our better players. Yes he had a shit attitude but good attitude workhorses still get pissed on at this level.

Hughton's built a great team spirit here with a bunch of good honest lads. At least that's not being threatened by disruptive cunts like that N'Zogbia...

The only alternativ is Routledge who has been shite in the last matches. So what would you want Hughton to do? Routledge hasn't been great so I can understand why Hughton might have gone for Guthrie, but he's been shite on the wing as well previously. I think it's fair enough for this match, my comment was more about Hughton in general playing midfielders up front, or strikers on the wing (Ranger/Lovenkrands). It would be nice to see him just play wingers on the wing, midfielders in midfield and forwards up front once in a while.