TRon

Why was Bafra poor exactly? He's not going to score wondergoals every game. [/wink] He is the only player we have who can give good passes into the box and he did that, just that there wa nobody there except Carroll marked by about 500 Jabba's. He's obviously not going to be amazing every game, and I'm not suggesting that. I just thought he was poor. He rarely attempted to run at anyone, and there was 4 or or 5 occassions where Barton was trying to tell him to go past Carroll from flick ons and he just stood there. Obviously, there is a language barrier there to break down, but I just thought he was poor, and practically marked out of the game. Barton might have tried taking his own advice and ran past Carroll himself a few times. The problem with our midfielders is they all want to stroll around in front of the central defenders and watch the game as spectators. I wonder how Tim Cahill gest so many goals? Or Gerrard?

Routledge got in at least two good crosses but there was no one on the end of them, Ben Arfa and Enrique got some beauties across as well.

I don't know how anyone can say HBA wasn't very effective. He was keeping possession, beating players at will and releasing the ball to team mates...there's not really a lot more he can do other than either walk the ball into the net or get on the end of his own passes. I would suggest the problems were elsewhere and trying to batter Stokes massive defenders with Carroll and Nolan wasn't a great game plan.

Even last season we were often outplayed by second tier teams but at that level you don't get punished. I think Hughton would be better off not dwelling too much on losing goals to set pieces, but why in the second half we couldn't keep possession which allowed them to pressure us into conceding free kicks. Stoke barely has a kick in the first half and HBA was one of the highlights as he brought the ball out and rarely lost the ball. Then Hughton subbed him and we lost two goals.

Maybe he thinks Nolan will give us more defensively than Lovenkrands, because that's all I can think off. As a striker, Lovenkrands pace would give the likes of HBA a an option for those killer passes in my view, plus he's far more likely to be able to chase Carroll's knock downs.

A lot of teams play very effectively with one striker, so if we assume that will be a target man then I would say Carroll is more or less fulfilling that role although his hold up play isn't as good as Ranger. With one striker it becomes vital for the midfielders to run beyond him into goalscoring positions, which clearly we are failing to do. Rather than sub Ben Arfa, Hughton needs to make it clear to the likes of Routledge, Barton and Nolan if they aren't getting in the box they will be benched.

So, basically, he was giving the ball away repeatedly? That might be how the Newcastle coaching team will look at it. In much the same way as Milner and Duff were blamed for not producing the goods when we had Nicky Butt and Owen in the team.

HE has dumped Smith & Jonas so far this season. What has that got to do with Nolan not getting dropped? It shows he can MAN UP and drop players. Is that not obvious? Not really.

Yes it does. Two slow central midfielders who like to stroll around in a small area of the pitch because they are short of pace and stamina. But most people can see that without the use of diagrams, although these are useful if you want to spin a players contribution in UV lighting perhaps.

Couldn't agree more. We were never going to beat Stoke by getting in a battle with them. We should have hit their lumbering defenders with speed and skill, HBA had plenty of joy in the first half had anyone had the wit or movement to make the most of it. I like Hughton but he needs to show a bit more faith in his football principles instead of trying to shoehorn all his favourite characters into the team and playing safe.

What I found interesting about that cross was that it had to be almost inch perfect seeing as Nolan can't get to any passes in front of him. This one landed right at his feet and it was the only chance in open play he had all game.

Can't argue with that.

No it isn't, you just have to keep your best footballers on the pitch and encourage them to stick to playing football.

Taylor is a lot worse than Perch defensively, but he will offer more going forwards. Maybe in home games he should be given a go. However, doesn't matter how good his delivery is if there's no one getting in the box to put them away.

Sorry but your attacking central midfielder should be arriving in the box to get on the end of stuff, unless you think only two players in the squad should be responsible for scoring goals. Exactly. In my book both wide players should be looking to get goals as well so Routledge was also disappointing today. We had the ball in some fantastic areas today but the lack of players getting in the box beyond the static Nolan meant Stoke easily absorbed the threat.

Ben Arfa played some lovely through balls into dangerous areas in the first half. Unfortunately with no movement up front he was effectively passing it to their keeper.

He doesn't get in the box beyond the strikers, mostly because he is too slow. When you have Tiote as a dedicated defensive midfielder and you are enjoying 64% possession at home I think we are entitled to expect more.

Barton was shite. How many times did he get into the box to support the strikers? If he can't do it in a home match when we have 64% of the possession when's he going to do it? Spent far too much time casually strolling around without any real intent.

Taking off a defensive player and leaving on an offensive player when we need a goal. Shocking that like. Taking off a player playing well and having a positive influence on our play and leaving on an anonymous player. That's pretty pants. This basically. HBA was the player who was giving Stoke a hard time and taking him off so early just made no sense. Hughton seems to worry far too much about what other sides are going to do to us than what we can do to them. Half an hour to go was too early to shore up the defence and it played into their hands.

In football these things go in cycles, I think barring the appearance of a mega wealthy owner, Liverpool are fucked for a decade while they convert to a low debt busniness model. I never thought I'd say this 24 months ago, but I can honestly see us overtaking Liverpool's position in the Premier within a couple of years.

Maybe UV will produce a graph/statistical analysis on why Shola is an integral first team player based on his last 12 months performances. Or maybe not.

Yes we fucking should.

Krul has been waiting a long time to get his chance. No way would I want to lose him because we were bringing back a former hero who jumped ship. Krul's going to be better anyway, he just needs experience.

I haven't seen too much criticism, just some people pointing out limitations, others taking offence at it. There's similar threads about Jonas regarding the fact he can't cross for his life, should we object to those as well? The fact is he can't cross...or shoot particularly well. It's also a fact that Nolan is slow and it means he's played up front to compensate his lack of mobility. What is wrong with pointing it out?

Is that what he did to get a couple against Villa like? Just pointing out that a graph showing how much ground he covers doesn't mean much if he's chasing shadows. But then some people swear by stats so good luck to them.