TRon

and I'd just like to add: fuck Fat Fred and all his minions.

The timelines are crossed. The past and the future make the present. There is a song in the forest the same you remember as a child.....Dreams within dreams... ..there is another between consciousness and illusion...Darkness lies ahead. At the moment I'm still pleased they are on board. Stay clear of relegation and I'm certain there will be big investment in the summer. If that doesn't happen I'll hold my hands up but until then no knee-jerking from me. Behind Ashley 100%

Would agree with that, but he needs to make some hard choices pretty quickly regarding some of the players he's picking currently. Next season is fine but we need to pick a side which will keep us up in the short term.

He won't have any choice but to drop them if they keep waving the white flag.

A couple of interesting things from that game: firstly injuries meant that experienced pros who had been performing like leadweights (does this strike a chord?) were replaced by youthful, energetic midielders who were prepared to have a go. secondly, we went with a 5 man midfield according to that report, which is something suggested earlier. Might be worth considering. although Ameobi was one of the 'midfielders'.

Found it. It was Ambrose who scored.

Portsmouth have still made some canny signings so it's not like the top 4 can buy everyone

I can remember one match against Man U in recent seasons where due to injuries Darren Ambrose and Zog played as central midfielders and they more that held their own against the Mancs. It's not like any of the alternatives are exactly picking themselves. The best one would probably be Emre, but I don't think he has the mobility to get up and down the pitch, and in matches I've watched, he doesn't get into the final third enough.

Twice the player, 5 times the potential, even at £15m its low when you think about Downing for £10m. Downing is worth no more than £5m, even with him being English and at a rival club, true worth is more like £3m. £15m for the Zog then starts to make sense if we could get Downing for £3m. Under current market price Downing is worth about 5. Apply the "Young, English" multiplier, and he's a fair deal for 10. Would be stunned if Southgate let him go for anything less. Here's a simple rule of thumb. If ANYONE is under 24 and has five or more England caps, he'll not go for anything under 10 mil. That's the world we live in. Zog is worth about 7~8, but he's not English so that's about what we'll get Not saying that I agree with the inflation on English players, that's just the reality. So we'd be getting a worse player and effectively losing about £5m. I think I'll pass on that one.

Lazaru on TT suggested starting Zog and Faye in midfield and I would like to have a look at that. Both players are athletes so at least we wouldn't get over-run, and they couldn't possibly fail to improve the passing. You know for a fact that Zog would support the forwards which should in theory make life much easier for Duff and Milner as well.

I might have missed this, do you think we should sell? If we sold Zog for £7m, then bought Downing for £10m (figures which are being bandied about) would that be good business?

Just seen this post now, and I agree 100% (started a new topic because this one seemed to be about captaincy). Watch the better Premier sides and their movement and passing through the middle is in a different league.

Most of that was true before Keegan took over, otherwise Allardyce wouldn't have been sacked. Liverpool, Portsmouth and so on...remember? Only a clueless, media-led twat would judge Keegan on a team he has inherited. If anybody needs reminding, it started going downhill AFTER Keegan left 11 years ago. It's hardly fair he gets the blame for the shambles left behind by his predecessors, the honorable SBR excluded.

When Faye played centre mid. in a couple of matches what stood out wasn't his passing although it was Beckham-esque compared to most others who have played this season, it was his ability to actually move without blowing a gasket. Butt and Barton were out-muscled, and rendered bystanders by the end yesterday. The same happened against Middlesborough, and I'm starting to feel sorry for the wide players as they get the ball and are expected to beat two players then cross well, while the central midfielders stand like statues, all responsibility relinquished once they've got rid of the ball. Butt is a clapped out shadow of a player, and Barton needs to see a shrink, not play football. He doesn't look like he's enjoying it, looks slow and has more chance of hitting a right hook than a decent pass. Both players are ordinairy at best in any case, when they're confidence is shot there isn't a chance in hell we can string passes together. If they start against Man U we will be destroyed.

£10m for Downing? Yet people were laughing at the ludicrously high price tag some were putting on N'Zogbia. If Downing's worth £10m then we should add another £5m to that to let the Zog go.

What makes a side tick in the successful teams - or cough and splutter in clapped out vehicles like ours at present? Watching us fail to move the ball beyond the halfway line all season without resorting to the long ball, the problems aren't the defenders as all the pundits seem to think, but the central midfielders in my view. Barton and Butt were given the honours yesterday, and between them they took it in turns to pass to the opposition, lose the ball under the slightest pressure and fail to move off the ball to create some space for others. Watching their counterparts in proper football teams like Man U, Liverpool or Chelsea it's like watching a different game. This is the area that has to be addressed if we are going to start looking like a football team again. In the short term the answer might be to lose a forward like Smith who has little impact anyway, and play an extra midfielder like Emre. In the long term none of the current central midfielders are good enough and we need heavy investment next season.

There's an element of self-indungent wallowing in tragedy it's true, similar to the Princess Di over-egging of the omelette.

I'm not even sure if KK's that big a fan despite all the public praise at the moment He dropped him for England on one occasion as manager, and Owen did whinge in his book about Keegan constantly criticising him.

On the plus side, Owen is going to have to come to terms with the fact he isn't valued that highly any more. No one is going to pay a fee for him and he isn't going to a major club in this country IMO. Man City and the like will be his best option or stay here and be part of Keegan's revolution - assuming he's in Keegan's long term plans which is by no means certain.

I don't think it's cut and dried that he wants away, Keegan did say we have some time to work with him, and he does tend to have mood swings, so he might well swing back yet! I doubt replacing him will be that easy, either, although it could be argued that his explosive speed isn't matched by his use of the ball sometimes.

The players you have mentioned there are all cream of the crop. How many of that type are realistically around and available? I'm trying to think of where we need players for specific positions where we are short. A left winger to replace Zog if he leaves? A defensive midfielder to replace Butt? A right winger - Bentley maybe? A mobile centre forward?

Do you think Arsene might be kicking himself a bit? Didn't Bentley ask to leave ... in fact from what I remember he pretty much demanded it! Besides is he really better than any of the players in their first team right now? From what I've seen of him he doesn't look to be that quick, similar to Milner, but his use of the ball is excellent. He also looks like a winner, someone with a bit of hunger which is where the similarity to Milner ends.

It depends on our ambition. If you could get into the Champions League on a regular basis by signing mostly British players other clubs would be doing it. How many of the current top 4 have teams which are made up of predominantly British players?

I think we'll get a draw from this one, Villa aren't in the best run of form either. 1-1.

Wonder why he signed a new contract last year if his family was in London and it was going to become an issue? It might just be his cunt of an agent trying to earn himself another bonus.