Minhosa

I couldn't see a thread on this but please merge if I've missed it. Being quite close to the action on Saturday, I couldn't believe the general poor conditioning/fitness of many of the players. The likes of Perez, Sissoko, Riviere, Anita, Shelvey, Colback literally blowing out of their arses so early in the game/early after coming on. Considering they've just had a warm weather jolly, the difference in fitness levels between the squads was noticeable. Janmaat was the only one who stood out in terms of running power/acceleration late in the game. What are these goons doing to them in training?

It makes you wonder why they keep starting him then. If this is a guy who doesn't work hard or can't cross, why is always one of the first names on the team sheet? It's either muddled thinking or trying to blame the player for their own lack of authority and direction. Perhaps their frustration is with the lack of alternatives. Fuck knows why he always starts when his contribution in so many games is close to fuck all.

The only person with a 'key position' at NUFC is Ashley the rest are just the hired help. Charnley, Carr etc are about as important as the kids dishing out pies and pints every game.

Yep - fuck knows how he's somehow become rated for finishing just outside of the relegation zone with decent Leicester side. Nobody seems to be questioning why the daft big cunt had them there in the first place .

Sherwood is a complete cock but when has that ever stopped them? Pearson would be an utter shambles of an appointment. Can you imagine Mini Mike trying to stand up to him? 'Mike, It's Lee, can you send someone in to help? Nigel's pinned me to the ceiling again'. 'FFS Lee'.

I'd hope you'd be in a fucking long queue. If/When SMc goes, I'll be having a small wager on Sherwood as he fits the 'Ashley' profile perfectly..... If, for no other reason, than he'd be another one of the 'Grateful Dead' like AP/SMc/Charnley etc whose careers were fucking lifeless before he gave them a leg up.

You just described Pardew.... Or Tim Sherwood. He'd tick many of the Ashley boxes btw.

I'm not even sure he'd be a good short term bet. There's as much chance of him doing another Sociedad as there is another Everton. There's also some rose coloured specs about his time at Everton, some of which was utter garbage. It's easy to criticise and see the negative with all of the names being bandied about and not come up with an alternative but I honestly can't think of one (realistic) alternative that I'd be happy with. A big part of the problem is that as NUFC fans you're no longer able to dream of the unrealistic/unthinkable/out of the box options that you perhaps would have in the times of SJH and Shepherd, where public opinion/sentiment could potentially sway such decisions. For all of their faults (and christ knows, there were many) at least the direction to the manager was a positive one. At best, I suspect the next manager/head coach () will get is a neutral 'keep us up, toe the line, don't kill the brand' message. Still, that's life in a corporate operation and not sporting institution. If you dance with the devil...........

Where McClaren has failed, I think, is on the character front. He's not been able to engage the squad or to make them want to play for him. At times, in fairness to him, and albeit in fleeting moments earlier in the season he's had us playing some ok football. The problem has been in the resolve of the squad to keep going when the tide turns. There's not enough character in the squad and he's not been able to create any form of backbone in them. If you compare him to someone like a Klopp or a Keegan whose personality resonates and lifts up a whole club, or indeed city then there's a huge and fundamental difference. The side effect of appointing a warm, motivator type is that they are generally quite 'emotional' beings who will, on occasion, get the hump and need managing themselves. They'll also need to believe that everyone, from top to bottom, is engaged in the 'project'. God, I fucking hate that term, in relation to football. When you work for a cold, calculated money man who is not motivated by sentiment or indeed motivated at all other than survival then where do you get your motivation from? That leaves either a young coach full of energy (like a Howe at Bournemouth/Neville type character) or an older, perhaps safer alternative, who can drill a system/playing regime into the squad which would make us effective/harder to beat. I guess Moyes falls into the latter in terms of character but I'm not sure he inspires much other than organisation. He certainly wouldn't be the lift we'd necessarily get from a positive influencer like a KK. This city is driven by emotion. Half the battle is the feel good factor. Robson brought it, KK brought it and, to a far lesser extent, Chris Hughton did through his professionalism/just downright decency. I don't think David Moyes brings it in the same way I didn't think SMc did, all those months ago. There's a real skill in making people perform for you and the key is them feeling like they are actually wanted/needed/valued. If you didn't personally choose that player (as has been the case with many of the new signings under SMC - see Saivet, Doumbia etc) then the chances of the player actually performing have to be far reduced. This all points to the recruitment process needing to be based on the ability of the applicant to motivate, to be a 'man manager' and to be able to be a force for cohesion across the club including fanbase etc. I don't think I know of anyone out there who could do this, as of now. Edit - if TL/DR - then the team is a reflection of the manager. That's why we're a souless mess at the minute. Robson's and KK's had heart, energy and positivity in abundance.

The array of options are really uninspiring. Those with any calibre/integrity wouldn't want to work in a Mike Ashley NUFC so that rules out Rafa or anyone of that ilk. The Moyes link is probably the most likely but he'd certainly not inspire me. For all of the talk of the job he did at Everton, he had full control, plenty of board support and time. As well as a clearly strong relationship with Kenwright. He's failed in his last two positions and I don't think his record is that much better than McClarens tbh. When you look at the parameters of this job (financially, working for Ashley, having a fucking numbnut to report to, having players effectively thrust upon you to work with) it smacks of only really suiting a young, up and coming coach, who is happy to work in that sort of regime.

You all already know my thoughts on this bloke but suffice to say, and against popular opinion, I think he's a fundamental part of the problem. For all the talk of the pressure all being on him, him being the only attacking outlet etc etc he consistently fails to deliver and should be replaced in the starting eleven. His role is even more pivotal given the lack of other midfield options, I grant you that, but maybe his lack of quality with the ball at his feet is a contributory factor to the lack of movement around him. Nine times out of ten he's naffing up the final ball. He's more likely to react to being dropped given the impending Euro's and, no matter who we replace him with, they can't do much worse in terms of actual contribution. I was sitting right behind the dugouts at the weekend, and the frustration of SMc and PS when he constantly fucked up those early first half crossing opportunities was palpable. Literally walking back into the dugout shaking heads, looking at each other like 'wtf'? That said, I've got sympathy for anyone in our midfield trying to find an opening for that useless cunt Riviere. He's as bad as I've seen in our colours and I was there for Guivarch, Andreas Anderrson etc. As a general point, the sheer lack of working the channels/movement in the final third is absolutely staggering.

Gameweek 29 Spurs 2-1 Arsenal Chelsea 2-1 Stoke Everton 2-1 West Ham Man City 4-1 Aston Villa Newcastle 0-2 Bournemouth Southampton 1-1 Sunderland Swansea 1-1 Norwich Watford 1-1 Leicester Crystal Palace 1-0 Liverpool West Brom 1-1 Man Utd

Don't even think there would have been two as big as Villa and one of us/Mackems. In the event Norwich do survive then certainly not.

Bournemouth will beat us this weekend anyway. They are a far better footballing team than we are. They remind me a bit of Swansea when they were first promoted in terms of having a defined plan and style of play. They know what they are and they're well drilled. How we beat them away, I'll never know. They played us off the park. I agree with that and all. The problem is, I can see us sneaking a win or getting a draw. That will be good enough to keep him here. I'd be shocked. They are a much better team, on good form, on the back of a really good result and they've had an extra days rest. Will only go one way imho.

If we go down, there's no way they will all remain in Ashleys employment. That would be seen as rewarding failure. As far as I'm aware, he's never done that in his professional life. They'll all pay the price for the failure I would think. It's easier to point at their choice never to fire AP after numerous bad runs, shite performances but ultimately, and certainly in the eyes of MA, he was doing his job.

Bournemouth will beat us this weekend anyway. They are a far better footballing team than we are. They remind me a bit of Swansea when they were first promoted in terms of having a defined plan and style of play. They know what they are and they're well drilled. How we beat them away, I'll never know. They played us off the park.

Aye - he's doing himself no favours with his constantly repetitive and annoying patter. Penfold is too weak to intervene so we need the fat man to get involved. It would only ever be Ashley's decision anyway. This football board is a joke that's been thrown together to give some illusion of management, hierarchy and/or structure when, ultimately, none of them matter. Only MA matters. My gut feeling is that he'll get the bullet after we lose this Saturday. Ashley is inherently a gambler and he'll not go down without a final roll of the dice imho. We can all point to the joke of last season and how he acted then but I think this year is very different and for a number of reasons: 1) Last year, we were only ever 'one' win away and that was with about 10 games to go. The fact it never came created a situation that none of them were expecting. The Carver Tailspin wasn't something they foresaw imho. 2) Even with the above in mind, they did actually try to get SMc to take the job with three (!) games to go. They wanted to change the situation. It didn't happen and they continued to gamble on the one win coming. They got lucky. He will know that. 3) He's given a very public statement of intent and he knows that's going to be thrown in his face for eternity if we go down. You might not think he's arsed about that. I happen to think that he will be. He's already shown that he takes criticism very personally. 4) He's allowed the club to spend money this last season and they've bought badly. I get everyone saying 'the money was ours anyway', 'should have done it years ago' etc etc but, ultimately, he's got 100% control of the purse strings and he's given the knackers the authorisation to spend it. He's not done that with the intention of being relegated. He's done that with the intention of consolidating and staying up for the TV money/prestige for SD advertising. 5) Clearly, they haven't appreciated the serious threat of relegation (see numerous positive press statements from club personnel and also the Fans Forum minutes). That threat is becoming a real reality for them and last season, where he was effectively forced to front the crisis by the SSN mock interview) will still be very sore imho. He'll not be happy at all that we are in this situation ESPECIALLY when he's allowed them to spend money. I think, in his mind, there were some mitigating factors for last season and that's why the likes of Charnley etc kept their jobs. This season, he's given them authorisation to administer the club on his behalf with the sole intention, the minimum requirement, of survival. He will know that the writings on the wall and that, this year, more than ever before it will reflect entirely on him. He'll roll the dice. He's going to be left with no choice. Whatever happens this year, and I think we'll go down, I'm almost sure Charnley etc have written their own P45's with their babysitting of his asset.

Didn't want him then, don't want him now. Was never the right man.

It's going to end up like this: Newcastle Norwich Villa

It's not them I'm worried about, it's the mackems - they're only a point behind us, playing much better than us and pretty much guaranteed 3 points in the derby. Yep - Allardyce is doing what he's always done. Made them organised, ugly and they're going to get harder to beat. I still think we'll go.

Aston Villa 0 v 2 Everton Bournemouth 1 v 1 Southampton Leicester 2 v 1 West Brom Norwich 1 v 1 Chelsea Sunderland 1 v 0 Crystal Palace Arsenal 3 v 1 Swansea Stoke 3 v 0 Newcastle West Ham 1 v 2 Spurs Liverpool 1 v 2 Man City Man Utd 2 v 0 Watford

Me too. Whilst these minutes look very light in terms of detail, I imagine there's actually quite a lot of debate between the various attendee's. It just which bits they choose to publish that kills any credibility.

Yes I am I agree with what's being said. Throw the book at him. He's quite clearly not reet in the head. As for Sunderland. If we knew this was coming out and played him anyway, deduct us points. Send us down. Wouldn't put it past Byrne etc. to act this way. Wouldn't be the first time our board have been ridiculous. The two resident mackems on here are great. I work with another Mackem and he's of the same opinion. He can't believe the lack of stick Sunderland have taken for their handling of the situation.

Very interesting concept. I can't see them going bust as they're effectively getting 2% for nothing. Can't also imagine the overhead being too big to run it. Edit - what happens when the club seasons are finished and Internationals start? Do the buzz points still get collected? If so, the likes of Rooney (whose value will presumably drop now he's injured......) would be decent punts knowing he's bound to start for England.

West Ham 1-2 Sunderland Leicester 3-2 Norwich Southampton 1-2 Chelsea Stoke 2-0 Aston Villa Watford 1-2 Bournemouth West Brom 1-1 Crystal Palace Man Utd 1-3 Arsenal Spurs 3-1 Swansea