AyeDubbleYoo

Because the PR and statements they put out have been very poor. The first statement they put out was several hours after the inital rumours broke, and didn't answer what everyone wanted to know - whether Keegan had gone. They then waited another two days to respond further, answering what everyone wanted to know in the first place - that Keegan wasn't sacked, and hadn't resigned, so effectively was still at the club. Then, after KK's resignation and statement of reason (manger should be allowed ot manage, etc) they issued what can only be dscribed as a very unprofessional, almost childish response, with their list of 'facts' - a list of facts that contradict quotes direct from Ashley, Wise, et al in the previous weeks/months. KK isn't blameless in this, but the Board have acted quite poorly, and would do well to remember what they have said in articles/interviews previously, before stating 'facts'. Well I know, both sides have previously said everything was fine on bringing in players. The board have said that KK had a say, and he himself never spoke out about it before. What we don't know is what say he did have and what the dispute was about in detail. But football clubs don't put out statements every couple of hours to respond to ongoing press speculation. When they were having discussions they said so, and when something was decided they announced it. To say the problems were cause by the PR and not by the reality of KK leaving us just seems a bit misleading to me. There's nothing the club could have said that would have stopped people turning against them like they have. At least I can't think of it.

I agree with you on this, but you'd better be prepared to wear out your keyboard defending yourself!

Whoah there! To be fair I think most of the opinions expressed over the last few days on both sides are mainly based on speculation.

So afar, if Keegan has to take some of the blame then how come it is only Ashley/Wise that have to take the brunt of the fans ill-informed rage? If you're saying it's because of poor PR then I can't go along with that at all, they put out statements when they had something to say. No other club would have acted any differently in their dealings with the fans (read 'media'). It seems to me like he is getting a very easy ride on all counts, even if a small minority of people have enough sense to see what Baggio is saying.

I spoke to a lass outside the Sports Direct shop in the Silverlink yesterday who worked there. She said they'd been practically empty all day with hardly any business. Good! But that needs to continue long term for it to have any effect on Ashley. I bought some 5-a-side trainers, shorts and socks in Sports Direct on Saturday.

I'd prefer that this wasn't true, because if it is then my love of Keegan is well and truly shattered. No reason to think it's true though have we? Why would he be able to veto the signings listed above but not Xisco, Gonzalez etc?

never mind that, they are cockney wankers/poisoned dwarves (etc, etc...ad infinitum) It's so dissapointing to see such a simplistic view being taken. As far as i'm concerned, the only issue was in their differences with KK, which I am sure he was equally guilty for. Other than that, they have shown they are certainly good at what they are doing. Calling them all the names under the sun will not change that. A dangerous amount of sense being talked here lads.

Those were players we were 'linked' with, which basically means we have no way of knowing whether we were close to signing any of them or not. I do have doubts over Keegan's views on transfers after him walking out after a summer of good signings, but I think this is taking it a bit far.

I dunno, I think he bought us for a bit of fun and because he likes football. He just doesn't want to make a massive loss in the process. Don't know whether that motive is any better, but to say he's done it 100% for money is a bit unfair IMO.

Despite having roughly half our turnover, Everton outspent us this Summer and last, so I can't see Moyes chomping at the bit to join us. Maybe he's keen to be relieved of the pressure of choosing who plays for him though, I don't know. I know that was probably sarcastic, but I reckon if I was a manager like Keegan (enthusiastic, good motivator etc) I might actually not be that bothered about not buying my own players. If the recruitment guys were delivering the likes of Jonas and Coloccini then I might be happy to let them get on with it.

True, I noticed that as well. Can't disagree with much of Sir Bobby's article at all, all I would say is that even he doesn't know the real goings-on behind the scenes and what Keegan did or didn't agree to when he joined. The principles of what he said are sound though.

He's only sacked one manager because he's only been here for a year. He's also forced another one out. How you can claim he's any better with regards to managers is a huge mystery, because the evidence against it is staggering, and the evidence for it is absolutely non-existant. Well his decision to sack Allardyce was correct, that's all I'm saying. And whether or not Keegan was 'forced out' we don't know. Seems it takes a lot less to force Keegan out than might be ideal. Also, I think that a manager leaving because he doesn't agree with your structure and long term plan for the club is not as bad as just hiring an endless string of big name managers, letting them run the club into the ground with reckless spending, then getting rid of them one-by-one. We've all seen that the old way can't deliver consistent progress.

I hope we hold onto Chris Hughton, seems to be a good coach.

Can't disagree with that at all sadly.

And more importantly, he recognised that the manager was taking us nowhere and made a change. At the time people thought he was incredible - and that was only a few months ago. We'll never get anywhere if we judge people over this kind of time frame. Whether it's on managers appointed/sacked, players signed, money spent or whatever, less than a year is a stupid time period to try and assess a new owner. So is Ashley stupid for judging Allardyce in half a season then? What about the people who have already judged "the system" to be a success worthy of sacrificing the manager who single handedly saved us from relegation apparently? Well fair point, all I would say is that Ashley is just as responsible for saving us from relegation as Keegan is. If he has to take the blame for Keegan leaving then the original appoitment must be to his credit. On Allardyce, yes Ashley only worked with him for a short time, but it was clear that the club was going backwards. With Sam all of the signs were bad, so I think that mitigates the concerns over how quickly he was judged. You can't wait to see if you're relegated before acting, can you?

Hang on, this is supposed to be a defense of Ashley? Yes, he's only sacked one manager, Allardyce. There is only a media circus now because Keegan walked out and the way the fans have reacted. Until then he was keeping fairly quiet wasn't he?

And more importantly, he recognised that the manager was taking us nowhere and made a change. At the time people thought he was incredible - and that was only a few months ago. We'll never get anywhere if we judge people over this kind of time frame. Whether it's on managers appointed/sacked, players signed, money spent or whatever, less than a year is a stupid time period to try and assess a new owner.

Thing is, to me Ashley has made very few wrong decisions. The previous system we had in place (while it delivered success short to medium term) was leading us into terminal decline and financial hardship. An endless media circus and managerial revolving-door, each appointement the opposite of the last. That is no way to run a football club. I can only see a couple of reasons for the Ashley hating, I'm discounting the fact he's a southerner because I hoped most fans could see beyond that. 1) IF Keegan didn't know about his role in the system when he took the job then that was a mistake. 2) The emotional attachment to Keegan from his history with the club. 3) Dennis wise as a player was someone we all hated. 4) The terrific feeling of hope we had that we would be progressing as a club and out of the papers for a while, instantly crushed in a way that is very hard to deal with for us. This sense of injustice needs a scapegoat. Other than that I can see what Ashley is trying to acheive with the system and I still think he can acheive it. I might be marked out as an apologist or whatever, but that's my gut feeling. It could even be said that, on the surface, Keegan would be a manager that would fit into the system - a motivator, an excellent man manager but a man whose knowledge of the transfer market must have been diluted by his time out of the game.

absolutely spot on word for word Agreed, the only question is whether what Ashley thinks is best (and therefore will do) is actually more sensible and successful compared to waht fans would do. We're passionate and we really care, but not many of us has the background in running big organisations that Ashley does.

I hardly think we've got the most secure of futures now, do you? We lost a manager. I hardly think that jeopardizes the future of the club. We'll get a new manager and move on. Yeah, into the Championship... Funny you should mention that, don't forget that's where we would be right now if Ashley hadn't come in and made changes when he did.

I live in Oxford at the moment, I think it does help being away from the hysteria of the whole place, as much as I love it. From Gateshead originally though, been down south for a couple of years... I get to as many away games as I can and about 5 or 6 home games. I suppose I do feel like I'm looking in on this a bit, but I remember the first Keegan era clearly and I'm as hurt as anyone else. All I ask myself is 'what did I want for the club a year or so ago?', and the answer is something like what Ashley has come and put in place. Therefore I can't bring myself to hate him, or the system.

I had a brief moment of doubt when it was announced, but I'm back to this view now.

If it's any consolation I think a lot more agree with you than Sky TV etc, would have us believe Ian. Cheers, I never posted much until this week, I'm not used to having as many opinions! I think everyone wants the same anyway, hopefully we will be able to ride out the initial backlash and salvage something with potential from all this. I'm wondering if I'm too optomistic, but won't be changing over this.

Yeah of course selling the club to someone who will put good players on the pitch will be a disaster. complete load of crap isn't it. The only thing that matters in a football club, is nothing to do with the "system", its the ability of the manager, and the degree of backing and support he gets. The manager is a massive factor in success season-to-season, but only a well-run club can sustain long term consistency.

Meh, think I've said everything I've got on this, people just have opposite views... my fingers are tired trying to argue the same points.