Heron

best thing the toon ultras can do is to join the NUSC, get the best of both worlds, the extra clout and influence that NUSC can only be good in spreading the message that the toon ultras are trying to portray. Heza don't believe most of this thread as its based on blinkered opinions and not showing a true reflection on the NUSC from the 3 meetings i have been to. Aye, I agree, I am just uncertain as to whether they would be open to this idea and I wonder how it would work... I have a sneaking suspicion that they would see it as them doing us a massive favour rather than it being reciprocal, but that's just an assumption. It would be best for a few lads from Toon Ultras to go to the next meeting though....

I'm forever blowing bubbles, pretty bubbles in the air, they fly so high, they nearly reach the sky, then just like Sunderland they fade and die, Tottenhams always running, Chelsea, Arsenal too, The Leazes end is running, They're coming after you! UNITED!!! UNITED!!! UNITED!!! well i can honestly say i've never heard that when i've been at the match and to be honest i'm quite glad cos its pretty embarrassing. BBTN have come up with some good songs and are helping improve the atmosphere but that song is crap. Yeah, but in the 70's and 80's it wouldn't be quite as embarassing as hooliganism was far larger back then. It wasn't a song we made up....

Firstly, I apologise for reverting back to the thing I always do, and that's the Toon Ultras... Secondly, I think it's vital for any form of new supporters group to be genuine and open minded in their approach, especially if they want to grow (which pretty much every group will want to do). I personally believe that Toon Ultras as a group, when it started out, was very ignorant and stubborn in its approach (probably due to its overwhleming amount of young members). However, we as agroup have became far more open-minded and taken on board various opinions and have managed to grow even if it is only by a little bit. I also believe that despite it only growing slightly it has now been accepted by the majority of Newcastle Fans who know of its existence. On the other hand, you have NUSC - who are equally as ignorant and stubborn in their approach. This is something I don't mind, as like I say the group I get involved with most was in a similar position. The difference being, like mentioned in previous posts, we were and are a bunch of inexperienced young lads, looking to do something positive, and our goal has never really moved or changed - we still intend to Bring Back The Noise. The NUSC is a bunch of experienced, respectable older blokes, who are far more knowledgeable and wiser than alot of our members and they are aiming for something which is arguably far more negative. Now this isn't the problem, but rather the name of their group is (haven't we heard this old debate before)..the Toon Ultras actually can claim to putting a non-hooliganesque spin on the name, as an Ultra is just someone who claims to be fanatical about something. Newcastle United Supporters Club is a bit more rigid and will always be interpreted as the main group listening to the vast majority of supporters and claiming to represent the majority....even though it currently isn't. If it were to grow it would need to take a less stubborn approach, and it would also need to stop asking members to pay to join. What the fuck do they actually do with the money? Make Anti-Ashley banners? Why the fuck can they not make some pro-Newcastle ones too if this is the case? If not where does this money go? I don't have anything against anyone who is anti-ashley, I don't really have any complaints in fans voicing their views to the club, it's all about timing though. Now is not the time and to answer someones question earlier in the thread - no, Mike Ashley is definately not the main issue at this club at present, staying the Premiership is. Anyone, in my opinion, who can't see this is a bit of a mongoloid....I think some people (not all) would rather we went down and got rid of Ashley than we stayed up and he stayed. I can understand Dave and more people need to turn up and voice opposing views or pose questions about there other aims and goals. However, in the mean time I think it's down to the NUSC to promote a more democratic outlook, which would be more appealing to potential members. Until they speak to the supporters, they will be limited. Finally, I just want to re-ittirate my annoyance about how these as a group have managed to come under far less scrutiny than the Toon Ultras, and I feel rather annoyed by the constant portrayal that us Newcastle Fans are all Ashley hating savages who are on one mission and that's to get rid of Big Mike. We are passionate about our club, and what is best for it. What is best for it is staying up. Anti-Ashley rallys certaintly aren't best for it, backing the boys on the pitch is something that could significantly help.

I'm forever blowing bubbles, pretty bubbles in the air, they fly so high, they nearly reach the sky, then just like Sunderland they fade and die, Tottenhams always running, Chelsea, Arsenal too, The Leazes end is running, They're coming after you! UNITED!!! UNITED!!! UNITED!!!

Will be interesting for the remainder of this season and the beginning of next, as to whether or not an "official singing section" still exists, and how heavy handed the stewarding becomes...

How about everyone singing you'll never walk alone in the 70's, teams all around the country singing "we're by far the greatest team the world has ever seen" and teams using the I'm forever blowing bubbles tune for songs, like our version of it? Like previosuly mentioned, get over it, either that or suggest somethign good and catchy that people can put a song to..

The thing is dare I say it, with regards to gaining the approval and acceptance of the majority of our support, Toon Ultras are in a better position. Media wise, it's the total opposite. By pointing this out, what I actually mean is that supporters support, therefore to support supporting is always going to go down alot better with fans rather than telling them to boycott products and get "their fucking heads checked" when they buy a pie at half time. NUSC are very one dimensional in their approach at the moment, and don't seem to be willing to budge from what I have heard. It appears to me that they are on some sort of mission to get exactly what they as a team want rather than voicing the opinions of the majority of the Newcastle support. For a group with so many older, more experienced and possibly wiser men and women leading it then they are proving to be very naive in their approach. If this was a bunch of 17 or 18 year olds doing the same thing then they would be slaughtered for it, but because they are the main media outlets for "fans" then they get away with it. This rally is actually beginning to piss me off the more I talk about it...

If this rally actually grows and becomes what those organising it intended it to be then I will find it quite hard not to be embarassed and react in a rather annoyed manner. As for bovril....sexy.

It depends what you mean by "their group has taken off". While the NUSC has had plenty of media coverage because bad news is always better copy for journalists, having witnessed the fabulous support provided at the ground by the toon ultras, I think everyone who sits in other parts of the ground appreciate your cause 100%. It's great that when the opposition chants get amplified by the acoustics of sitting close to the roof, we have our own dedicated fans to out-sing them. Sterling job lads. You're efforts do not go un-noticed. Thanks very much for the compliments like I appreciate them. However, I wasn't fishing for one as it may have seemed, I was just comparing the two. I suppose it makes sense the bad news sells papers quote, I just wish the majority of fans' voices could be heard throguhout the media instead of the same continuous drivel from the NUSC. I believe that now that decision time is coming nearer (relegation) the majority of fans will pull together and back the team which what matters, I just hope those deluded with their own battles don't knock too many of us off course....not that people will let them like...

Mostly bad. I think it has been set up with the right intentions, but it has also been set out with one goal and one purpose and that is to get rid of the likes of Ashley and Wise. For the NUSC to work they need to cover more aspects of the club at one time rather than just focus on Ashley, they began to do this with a fundraiser for Sir Bob (what happened to that money by the way? Did it definately get donated? If so how much was raised?). However, with this latest so called rally they have gone back down in my estimations, as it appears there own success is more important than their beloved clubs'. P.S. I am slightly jealous that their group has taken off reasonably well with quite alot of publicity, when a far more positive group hasn't. But hey, that's life....

If you're honest, he really wasn't, for the last few seasons at least. I would love to know how many assists and headers he won in the middle of the park for the last 3 or 4 years of his career, everything we did still went through Shearer, whether it be to hold up play for the team to progress or to use him as a goal scoring threat. Shearer was magnificent at what he did, he adapted his game perfectly - something 9/10 players will definately struggle to do.

I just find it incredibly frustrating that a group that has only ever had the ambition of increasing and encouraging support in the stands has got less respect and backing than the narrow minded fuckers running the NUSC. I am sure you're all aware of who I'm talking about (the other group), and when we have done any protest or "rally" we too have done it for something we are passionate about, but nevertheless we did it pre-match, went in the stands and done are all to back the lads on the pitch. I wish I could see some of that "backs to the wall - fighting spirit" that you normally see from our fans in these sorts of situations (potential relegation) instead of the bitching and bickering, pessimistic rallying of somethign which is totally irrelevant to our clubs largest problem at this current moment in time. If we really are "the loyalist football supporters the world has ever had" I think now is the time to prove it...

Goals to game Michael Owen is 2nd to very few people. However, I agree his best times are past him now. On the flip side, Shearers best days were when he was at Blackburn and when he had just came to us, but he was still magnificent for the remainder of his career because he adapted his game and offered something else to the team. You cannot really compare anyone to Shearer though tbf. Oba > Owen in our current team/squad though...

exactly. And so was Alf Ramsey. Morale of the story is don't believe everything people say or what papers portray them as saying Basic stuff really. Yep. Slagging off your players in public is the quickest way to lose the dressing-room.... usually followed by your job shortly afterwards. Debateable. It all depends on what the manager and everyone involved with the club portrays as acceptable and unacceptable. If you're a manager and your players stop playing for you then you lose your job quite quickly. Agreed. However, if one of your players clearly does something wrong then you cannot defend the undefendable. For example, if Joey Barton started a fight in Liverpool or wherever, if you were his manager and you were questioned about his actions you could only really give one answer. A tactful one like, but you would have to say he was in the wrong. That might be a bad example but I'm sure you get the sort of example I mean.

Martins will create you something out of nothing, Owen needs to be surrounded by good players.... Obviously you would rather have Owen as a striker, but in our current climate I think Martins is more useful on the pitch.

...when I read this (below) I went through a series of thoughts amd emotions in quick succession, they went as follows.... Rally round the Mags: NUSC update Following Wednesday's public meeting, the Newcastle United Supporters Club (NUSC) has confirmed that it intends to organise a rally in the city centre before the next home game, versus Everton on Sunday Feb 22nd. The police-authorised protest will begin from Grey's Monument at 3pm, allowing fans who are going to the game to take part as well as those who are boycotting. Coverage of the meeting has now appeared in a couple of the nationals, online as follows: Times and Mirror. Why of all times do a rally against Ashley when we are about to go into our last 10 or so games of the season? Are people that obsessed with the stuff behind the scenes that they cannot actually focus on the stuff that happens on the pitch? I really foudn it quite hideous and ridiculous. Oh well... Now this thread can be locked before w ehave another board room debate on our hands...I just wanted to get this off my chest.

exactly. And so was Alf Ramsey. Morale of the story is don't believe everything people say or what papers portray them as saying Basic stuff really. Yep. Slagging off your players in public is the quickest way to lose the dressing-room.... usually followed by your job shortly afterwards. Debateable. It all depends on what the manager and everyone involved with the club portrays as acceptable and unacceptable.

I disagree. I don't think the Premiership is too predictable... Based on league positions..yeah maybe, fair enough. But there is always games that the complete underdog beat the top dog and thats what makes it so entertaining. Villa are breaking itno the supposed "big four", Hull have been loitering around the European spots for the first half of the season and big clubs like us and 'Spurs have both been bottom and in and around there for most the season.

Aside from the fact that he lacks the objectivity to see the weaknesses in his own squad and will forever teeter on the "if only..." edge. Maybe he just refuses to let his teams' and players' weaknesses to be exposed to the rest of the footballing world?

I kind of disagree. Not on the points you mentioned but on what you claim we do and don't have. I believe we have pacey defenders (well at least two) in Bassong and Beye. We have intelligent defenders like Coloccini and Bassong, Beye and even Enrique. We don't have a leader I agree and I think we are reasonably OK Goalkeeper wise. Like I say we are missing a leader and I agree with that, but I reckon our biggest flaw is our managers' (and possibly scouts') work in addressing our oppositions strengths and weaknesses. For example, playing a high line like you say against pacey strikers is pretty dangerous as it is more than likely at least 1 will come off. Sitting deep is equally as dangerous if you don't have the players with the legs to pressure in and around their own goal, especially when you're playing a team with players who can strike one from distance and score. So aye, I don't think it's necessarily our back four, but I would say it is our lack of a midfield and our managerial/scouting weaknesses that force us to concede goals.

I must admit at first I thought it had turned into "one of those threads" like. Bassong is mint, end of.

Bassong is the Premier League signing of the season.

Or maybe realism ? Realistically, (and to use something similar to what someone else said) we don't even have our head in the noose at the minute never mind having it tightened and the stool kicked away. We decide our own fate, and we can certaintly do alot as a club to remove ourselves from this position. I must admit, I myself am far from a realist, I'm an optimist as people have probably gathered by now. However, I am also of the opinion that optimism is a massive factor in what makes us human beings achieve. Where the f*** would we be if everyone said "ah no we just cannot make it" or "that's it, it's a certain failure...no point in trying". True Faith never seem to give any of the positives in these articles at the moment, or even if they do they manipulate it to slate something else. What positives. No, we haven't got our heads in the noose, but so far we've gone from Sitting in the living room eating crisps to standing on a stool with noose in hand. Logic dictates that if we've gone this far, we're eventually going the whole way. In the near future if not this season immediately. We seemed to have stability at this club for the first time in a long, long while for a short period before one little thing started going wrong, immediately triggering a chain reaction that's piled up into a clusterfuck of epic proportions, like a single car breaking down on the highway triggering a thirty-car pileup. You really couldn't make it up. Only at NUFC. We've been flung into the abyss, and while we may not be dead and buried yet, we're stuck into a course that inevitably leads to total destruction. It's like the title of the article: "knife slits water," a feeling of total hopelessness, just watching us slowly die. Watching this club right now is like watching someone who's just passed over the event horizon of a black hole. We all know what's coming next. Yes, but to use your example, if someone behidn the car breaking down slows down and puts their hazards on then the car behind does as well you can avoid a 30 car pile up. So to put that theory into perspective - instead of panicking and thinking "shit i'm going to crash and die" why not show a bit of steel and pull yourself out of the potential mess. Why don't we stick our hazards on to help our fellow club members like we would our fellow drivers? Why not lead the way in driving us to safety? We have a club in which the majority seem to want to expect to crash and die, now is the time to steer clear and be the first to show people there is always a chance of survival if you want there to be. By doing our bit in the stands some more, and by being encouraging to the lads on the pitch, at least we are providing a bit leadership...something we seemingly lack. No i'm not saying you need to sing to be a supporter, but you do have to support to be a supporter. Boycotts and protests don't support anything other than the increased likelyness of relegation.

Sholas one of our best penalty takers like.