leffe186

For a number of years? We were fifth two years ago FFS . The gaslighting is as endless as the rain. Glad to not be part of the cartel though. All of the approbation none of the benefits: https://www.reddit.com/r/coys/s/YG4NO3QF8A Yeah I think there have been a handful over the years re players choosing us but we’ve never paid enough in wages to make the difference, even when we were really good.

Absolutely. I’m honestly a little proud that our unofficial podcast fan rep is Flav and our clickbaity shouter is Expressions.

About as good as could be hoped for tbh.

That’s one theory.

No idea who’d even want the job right now tbh. You’ve got a hell of a job to turn the team round off and on the pitch, everybody’s crocked and you’re almost certainly not coming back next year.

Aside from the fact he never could pick who he liked or play them where he liked - one reason why he got more rope than usual - it’s absolutely clear that the players had no faith in him. I watched the Frankfurt game very carefully and broke it down at length on Spurscommunity - IIRC the first reply though I was being way too negative. In that game it wasn’t that they weren’t moving completely, it’s that they’d have periods of not moving at all in front of the ball and then suddenly they’d do some really nice work - Kolo Muani coming wide, deep or looking to get behind the defence, Simons or Odobert coming into the space he’d leave, Udogie pushing on, whoever we had at RB looking wide. Then it would suddenly stop happening again. They’d do it some of the time. I wondered if they were conserving energy, or following instructions, or disobeying instructions. It was impossible to tell. Note that two of those players are already injured again and maybe out for the season. Palhinha was sort of playing RCB but the Frankfurt #15 kept finding that space between midfield and defence in the first half and Palhinha would never step up to close him down, or consistently have another right-sided player do it instead. They just let it slide, when Frank or one of the coaches should have been sorting it out - Palhinha’s out of position so I can’t blame him all that much. Ultimately and to what @SteV said about a good quality CF, Solanke came on in the second half and took them apart. Made all the right runs, held the ball up, let Simons play around him. They can do it. It just always seems to wait until we’ve fucked the game then the shackles come off. The Man City game was a case in point. Their first goal came from Bissouma being dispossessed but he shouldn’t even be in the squad let alone starting games. The second goal also came because Man City pressed us and we gave it away…but we’d had the ball for ages. There were no options at all for anyone on the ball at the back because TF had set it all up wrong. People were complaining that the players weren’t working hard enough to find space but that was irrelevant - he’d fucked it up. Then Dragusin (just come back after a year out, should have been getting a few mins as sub to ease him in but now he has to play every game) ended up near his own goal line in the LCB position. He doesn’t get enough on his clearance with his wrong foot - two passes and it’s in the back of the net. All the cockerels coming home to roost. A shitty formation and tactics, and an unfit player forced to play a full game out of position because of injuries to everyone. Then second half, Romero goes off, the formation changes back to four at the back and suddenly we look good. Despite a CM playing at RB (Gray), another CM playing at RCB (Palhinha) and the aforementioned unfit Dragusin at LCB up against Haaland et al we go for it, pull the two goals back and should have got more. Only…Romero came off at half time because he was actually sick and only started because he had to. Odobert was sick too. Was it by accident or design that the change worked? Were all the other late flurries a case of the players telling Thomas to fuck off and doing their own thing?

Injured. Always injured. Supposedly he’s due back after Porro, some time next month I guess.

Was going to guess Expressions but thought you might have meant Flav. Yeah, he can be quite funny . Small doses, mind.

Assuming what now?

Who the fuck is our equivalent of Goodbridge?

There are some stories coming out now that are plausible and instructive. It’s interesting that they didn’t come out a while ago - and weirdly faintly encouraging - but they do suggest that the team above him (as I implied) are incompetent in many ways. He should have been gone in December.

Yeah. Remember telling me this beforehand? There’s a reason I listen to what some fans of other teams say. They often actually know what they are talking about.

We were really good in the 80s. We were really bad in the 90s (bad timing with the Premier League). But it does sometimes seem like people pretend the years from 2009-2022 never happened. Edit: I realize you have a specific reason to do so

Yeah - see my post before about the Captain. The leaders are Romero (suspended), Madders (going to miss the whole season), Kulu (going to miss the whole season), Davies (out for the rest of the season) and maybe Bentancur (out for the rest of the season) and Porro (out for a while). That’s part of the problem. Really the prime candidate is Conor Gallagher right now but he’s only just got here. VDV another candidate but we’re just waiting for his season-ending injury.

Yeah, do you remember your worst period? I just picked a date close to this one (Feb 10) and this was the lineup: NO.NAME 1Martin Dúbravka 4Sven Botman 5Fabian Schär 33Dan Burn 2Kieran Trippier 39Bruno Guimarães 67Lewis Miley 21Tino Livramento 36Sean Longstaff 9Callum Wilson 10Anthony Gordon 17Emil Krafth 24Miguel Almirón 15Harvey Barnes SUBSTITUTES 6Jamaal Lascelles 23Jacob Murphy 3Paul Dummett 18Loris Karius 11Matt Ritchie 20Lewis Hall Presumably Pope, Isak, Joelinton injured, Tonali building up fitness? Who else am I missing? Were you out of the CL by then?

Yeah, we talk about it in general terms but I wanted to look at it in more detail. Like, Vicario will probably start at least 50 games this season but I don’t think more than one other player will even manage to get on the pitch for 40.

Couldn’t give a shit. I’m in. Might be able to afford a Championship season ticket and all our players will have the summer off because they’ll be injured.

But as you say, they are worse. We’ve consistently had 10+ out and yes, it has been 13 at at least one point. And this is the third consecutive year of this shit, which is completely demoralising. You had a ton of injuries that year and it was a fantastic achievement, but it helped that manager, tactics and (largely) squad were established. Key players like Bruno, Gordon, Burn, Trippier, Isak and Schär played in most games and Longstaff and Almiron played in well over 40. Pope missed more than half the season and Dubravka isn’t an amazing deputy but he’s adequate. I know Botman only played 22 games - who were the other key players missing? Did anyone miss the whole season? Genuine question. I’ve said before that it’s such a big issue for us this year because Frank is new and he has to implement a new system with a lot of new players. Our best first XI is arguably something like Vicario Porro Romero VDV Udogie Bentancur Gallagher Madders Kulu Kudus Solanke. Key Defensive subs Spence and Danso, Midfield subs Palhinha and Bergvall/Simons, Attacking subs Richarlison and Odobert. 17 outfield players. Right now 10 of those players are injured and one is suspended - only three of the starting 10 are available. After 26 games, only one of those 17 has started more than 20. And only five have even got on the pitch for more than 20 (e.g. Odobert 10 starts, 14 sub appearances - now probably out for the season of course). What was your best team that year? I’d guess Pope Trippier Botman Schär/Burn Livramento Joelinton Tonali Bruno Gordon Almiron Isak? Key Defensive subs Hall and Krafth/Burn? Midfield Murphy and Longstaff? Attacking Barnes and Wilson? 17 outfield players. Seven of the starting ten played in most games and Tonali obviously missed most of the season for other reasons. I really don’t think people have grasped how extraordinary our injuries are this year. I’m well aware of what an incredible achievement your 2023-24 season was in the circumstances and as always not enough is made of it by the usual suspects in the media, but I’ve had three years of this nonsense now and I’m sick of it.

This is going to be really fucking long. A ton of stuff to respond to. It’s a bit of a perfect storm - as you guys well know it needs to be for one of the big clubs to struggle. My bullet points: 1. Injuries. 2. Squad. 3. Captain. 4. Manager. 5. The fans. 6. Higher Management Structure. We were clearly hoping to get through to the Summer and take stock, but that became impossible. Right now we need to get in a coach who can pull what’s left of the squad together enough to win two or three games. With Frank gone I think the fans will respond, and depending upon who comes in hopefully the players will too. We also need to try to get as many players fit as possible - obviously. I think we’re going to make a massive effort to get Poch in the Summer. I even think there’s a chance that he comes if we’re relegated. Will it work? Dunno. It will galvanize the fans. We need a huge effort to sort out pricing with a genuine partnership between fans and the Club. We really, really need a Director of Football with a vision that at least approximates ours of a clubs that plays stylish, attacking football and develops a significant amount of our own players. I think that’s doable in both the Premier League and the Championship. Above all else, if we do get relegated t will be fascinating to see how a team copes with 13 players, 46 league games and a Champions League campaign.

Oh I completely forgot Bissouma existed, although I’m not sure that helps all that much.

I can imagine a timeline where he doesn’t but at best Dr Strange is holding up three fingers.

The obvious difference is that last year there were three very clear relegation teams. Man U spent a shit-ton of money and don’t have Europe, which has helped massively. They have a grand total of three injuries, two of who are expected back in a couple of weeks. We’ll see. I’ll be fairly happy with anything at all from these next two games and more importantly no more injuries.

Yeah it’s possible. Team might be: Vicario Palhinha-Dragusin-Van de Ven Gray-Gallagher-Sarr-Souza Odobert-Solanke-Simons On paper it’s pretty good but then you look at the details. Palhinha out of position, Dragusin just back after a year out, Van de Ven recovering from an injury. Gray out of position, Gallagher new, Sarr was ill and barely played in AFCON, Souza completely new. Solanke just back after months out. The subs? No defenders available - they’re all injured or Romero. No midfielders available - they’re all injured. Kolo Muani on loan and disinterested. I like Tel but he’s learning the ropes. That’s it. We’ve been bringing Byfield on (17yo) because there’s nobody else, the rest will be kids. Rinse and repeat. You want to ease Solanke, Dragusin, Sarr and Van de Ven back in but they have to play every game because they’re all that’s left. You want to introduce Souza gradually but he’ll have to play every game because he’s all that’s left. We have three fit defenders and four fit midfielders…so that’s the team. Until one of them gets - inevitably - injured. I fear that I am seeing it clearly because it’s every week at this point. We’re capable of being good and have been in patches but you don’t even need a red card or letting in a goal for things to crumble. One more player gets injured and we’re giving another teenager a debut…in this situation. That’s a problem.

It just has a lot of the hallmarks of a big team going down. The injuries are genuinely insane. Kulu and Maddison may miss the entire season and Bentancur and Davies almost certainly won’t be back. Danso did an injury I’ve never even heard of before in an innocuous way against Frankfurt, and apparently may not play again this season. Bergvall is out until April at least, as is Kudus. I looked at the injury table and we have at least twice the amount of injuries as every single team except Chelsea and Man City (and nearly twice as many as them anyway). Then you zoom in and their return dates are mainly 8-13th Feb I.e. this week. We’ve got several key players missing for months at a time. It’s just not sustainable.

No I don’t think so. It’s obviously the bottom two plus one. West Ham are on a bit of a roll but have some tougher games coming up, Leeds are starting to put things together, but both they and West Ham (and Forest) have terrible GD. Palace might get sucked in too. I think it’s one of them plus us. Our biggest problem is obviously not knowing who’s going to be available for any games d/t injury and the extra pressure being put on the remaining fit players because of that and the CL. You’ve been through this before - at this point all you need is a couple of things to go against you in a couple of games and you can be right in it - but with the injuries we’re already there. Then youu add in those little things. It was a pretty even game at Old Trafford until the red but then suddenly that game’s gone and now Romero - our club captain - is out for four games. I think we’re going down, but one win could turn it around.