Frazzle

Stoke aren't some sort of team of monsters, a lot are just six foot blokes, so what? Players like Defoe and Benayoun manage to survive in the PL (Zola in the past as well) no reason why Ranger would struggle (size wise at least).

Sunderland are more likely to be relegated than us at the moment, harder run-in, no Shearer-factor and no good players to come back from injury (Bassong, Barton, Guthrie for us).

Not Messi? Not Messi? Messi aint a scouser Its best player in the world not best scouser in the world.

Not Messi?

They're aren't getting it wrong, they're in the Champions League, we're not. Leeds tried to budget on getting CL football every season and look what happened.

Now likely event that we go down? Surely it was likely to the Chelsea game then, because we were never going to get a result. yeah but the stoke & blackburn results were very damaging for us man, very damaging indeed that's what makes it more likely for me - beating stoke now puts us back to where we were before the chelsea game in real terms We had to accept that some teams playing at the bottom would get results though because most were playing each other. I agree though, that no result at Stoke and it looks bleak.

Now likely event that we go down? Surely it was likely before the Chelsea game then, because we were never going to get a result.

Call me bitter but I can't help smiling whenever I see Man City have lost.

I think it might have been a joke.

He is broke. f***, just seen that on .com Beye, S.Taylor, Coloccini, Bassong. Probably the best we can muster then. Taylor is out as well mate.

Came on against Spurs.

I think its more in spite of, rather than because of.

aye, f***ing idiots to be honest and said so at the time LOL, he's had a handful of decent games at Chelsea and most of those under Hiddink, could you see that happening under Kinnear? As someone has already said, we were being linked with better players at the time and due to our current predicament its no surprise people have changed their minds.

Well said. Our win and draw ratios are a lot higher when Martins starts than when he doesn't, that's for sure. Do you have these stats? If so I wouldn't mind looking at them. In January or February (can't remember and can't be arsed to look it up again), this season we had 1.5 points per game with Martins in the side compared to 0.5 without him. Obviously you can't put it down to one player though, and that's not looking at which games he actually played. I remember someone bringing up a stat that we'd only won 2 of the last 22 games we'd played without Martins in the team. Its probably fairly similar for a few players though, its not like we've won many with Martins.

He took the piss at Old Trafford tbf. He was probably the best player in both games, the rest of his team, however, were ****.

Lost two stone in weight!

This team, for the same reason. The best team rather than the best players.

A single murder still makes the evening news if it's graphic enough. We just happen to be that murder at the moment, our guts hanging out for all to see, regardless of size. Of course we're going to be rammed on TV as much as possible. Ambulance chasers like nothing better than a bit of gore 'n guts 'n misery. Revel in the spotlight now, cos the Championship is going to be a depressing place for the first few months/years (delete as applicable). I'm off to drink some Toilet Duck now. Nope, we're the biggest pull outside the top four, always have been.

Has more passion and desire to win. It's that instinct imo which makes him the great player he is. Rooney has more passion to win? Based on what? The fact that he shouts at referees and gurns after missing chances? I don't think you can get to where Messi has without a massive desire to win. His body language. Rooney typically will hurt more after a defeat. He is a bad loser. I'm talking about the desire to win in match situations. There is no doubting Messi's dedication to his game and self-improvement! Afterall, he is the best player in the world, and I will not deny that at all. I just think some people under-estimate Rooney's immense talent because he's English and plays for Man Utd. I might be a bit more biased in favoring Rooney's style of play, as it is similar to how I wish I could have played football. Personally, I prefer the all-action, all over the park style that Rooney plays. Fair point.

Not a big club apparently....

Has more passion and desire to win. It's that instinct imo which makes him the great player he is. Rooney has more passion to win? Based on what? The fact that he shouts at referees and gurns after missing chances? I don't think you can get to where Messi has without a massive desire to win.

I think we'll all see tonight that Messi is the greatest player in the world at the moment.

revolutionary! Hopefully more revolutionary that JFK's defensive work. didn't that just involve shouting and swearing? a lot No just him chucking Bacon sandwiches at the players and them having to catch them with their mouths. My lass was trying to tell me that Alex Ferguson has bowls of dolly mixtures and jelly babies in the dressing room at half time for his players to dig into to keep their energy up How else do you think he lured Macheda to Old Trafford?

u'll not laugh again if u realize what happened to rossi and forlan... Rossi and Forlan have always been good but had bad spells, Zamora has always been ****.

To be fair their stadium is not even half the size of ours, so in that sense it's not really that mind boggling. I know, I know. Just a throwaway comment guys, a bit of happiness in these barren times.