Shak Posted September 3, 2007 Share Posted September 3, 2007 It was a big problem last season with Parker, and before him it was a bit of an issue in Shearer's last year or two. We had a captain that, arguably, shouldn't have been playing every game for us but was undroppable due to his captain status and the apparent problems dropping him might have caused. And, low and behold... http://www.cynical-c.com/archives/bloggraphics/oopspage_01.jpg The same thing could be about to happen with our new captain, Geremi. Emerged as the obvious choice in pre-season due to his good form, experience and natural calmness on the ball and apparent good attitude and influence in the dressing room. But, as everyone gets fit in CM I wonder if Geremi is going to be someone we want in our starting line-up. Not a natural DM by any means, works hard but doesn't get about the place and break up play to the level that Butt does, and doesn't seem to have a natural ability to assess danger and protect the back 4 accordingly. Not a box-to-box player either and his passing and creativity isn't particularly outstanding so not a playmaker. Useful to have in midfield as he's generally pretty decent at everything, without being really outstanding at anything in particular. If Emre gets fullly fit and playing well (massive question marks over that tbf) I'd have him in ahead of Geremi every day of the week. Will Sam drop him if needs be? I'd like to think so. What happens then though? Deputy Captain? Barton seems a good bet, always gonna play when fit you'd imagine and it'd give him some responsibility without going the whole way. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parky Posted September 3, 2007 Share Posted September 3, 2007 Any player can be dropped for whatever reason if it's for the good of the team imo. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leazes1986 Posted September 3, 2007 Share Posted September 3, 2007 Big Sam will not be afraid to drop anyone if its needed. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parky Posted September 3, 2007 Share Posted September 3, 2007 Big Sam will not be afraid to drop anyone if its needed. Infact I'd go further to say it is the sign of a good manager and a signal to the whole team if a regular is dropped when playing badly or for tactical reasons. Sometimes players do it for no reason but only to Gee up the others [Clough/] Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ohmelads Posted September 3, 2007 Share Posted September 3, 2007 After a brilliant pre-season his form has dipped a bit. I don't think he's playing poorly as a few have suggested, rather just average. When Barton, Butt, Faye, Emre and Smith are all vying for those two or three positions then there may be times when he's not worthy of a first team place. Problem is there's no outstanding, undroppable player in our squad (yet). There are even calls to drop the likes of Owen and Given. One might yet emerge, but it could cause a stir taking the captaincy off Geremi permanently. I guess Sam will have to try and play down the significance of the armband early doors. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parky Posted September 3, 2007 Share Posted September 3, 2007 After a brilliant pre-season his form has dipped a bit. I don't think he's playing poorly as a few have suggested, rather just average. When Barton, Butt, Faye, Emre and Smith are all vying for those two or three positions then there may be times when he's not worthy of a first team place. Problem is there's no outstanding, undroppable player in our squad (yet). There are even calls to drop the likes of Owen and Given. One might yet emerge, but it could cause a stir taking the captaincy off Geremi permanently. I guess Sam will have to try and play down the significance of the armband early doors. Agreed we really need Barton to hit the ground running. Of course if he isn't running he'll hurt himself. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
McCormick Posted September 3, 2007 Share Posted September 3, 2007 i'd drop butt. we'd lose something in set pieces if geremi was omitted Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shak Posted September 3, 2007 Share Posted September 3, 2007 i'd drop butt. we'd lose something in set pieces if geremi was omitted His set-pieces have been nothing special really, Milner could do it just as well. I'd not be too upset if we lost the long throw either. Think Butt gives us more in general play, can't say I know a lot about Faye but some seem to think he's good enough to be first choice DM. Hope so, don't think Geremi is suited to the role at all. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest teepee Posted September 3, 2007 Share Posted September 3, 2007 he can and should be dropped on occasions. he is a decent player, but not exactly our gerrard, terry or the shearer of old tbh. So i hope sam will have the nerve to do what is right for the team, and i think he will! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gash Posted September 3, 2007 Share Posted September 3, 2007 no player is undroppable, no player is irreplaceable, some managers should remember this, Big Sam not being one may i add Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Icke - Son of God Posted September 3, 2007 Share Posted September 3, 2007 Just thought i'd rock the boat and add 79% of Geremi's passes were accurate. The highest out of our whole midfield. I'm sure these are the sort of stats Big Sam will be looking at and analysing. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
afar Posted September 3, 2007 Share Posted September 3, 2007 I've yet to see anything to convince me Geremi is worthy of a first team place once everyone is fit, not convinced though that Sam thinks the same way however. Whatever happens we are going to need a vice captian for January as I'm sure he'll be of to the African Cup of Nations. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shak Posted September 3, 2007 Share Posted September 3, 2007 Just thought i'd rock the boat and add 79% of Geremi's passes were accurate. The highest out of our whole midfield. I'm sure these are the sort of stats Big Sam will be looking at and analysing. Didn't see the match on Saturday myself but I thought in the previous games he really didn't try anything adventurous and most of his passes were safe, efficient ones. That's fin if you're a holding midfielder, but we can't be playing with two of them and I think Butt does the job better. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Parky Posted September 3, 2007 Share Posted September 3, 2007 Just thought i'd rock the boat and add 79% of Geremi's passes were accurate. The highest out of our whole midfield. I'm sure these are the sort of stats Big Sam will be looking at and analysing. Didn't see the match on Saturday myself but I thought in the previous games he really didn't try anything adventurous and most of his passes were safe, efficient ones. That's fin if you're a holding midfielder, but we can't be playing with two of them and I think Butt does the job better. Exacertly I don't really give a shit about their passing as long as there isn't two of them doing it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
McCormick Posted September 3, 2007 Share Posted September 3, 2007 i'd drop butt. we'd lose something in set pieces if geremi was omitted His set-pieces have been nothing special really, Milner could do it just as well. I'd not be too upset if we lost the long throw either. Think Butt gives us more in general play, can't say I know a lot about Faye but some seem to think he's good enough to be first choice DM. Hope so, don't think Geremi is suited to the role at all. i just don't rate butt really.. usually loses the ball, passing is average- i just think geremi brings more to the table. not much worse at tackling either.. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
KaKa Posted September 3, 2007 Share Posted September 3, 2007 Wow ... Butt has given the ball away a hell of a lot this season, and is a bit too reckless in his tackling for me. Geremi does a great job of getting the ball from the back four and kickstarting our forward play. He also takes up good positions defensively, but isn't as noticeable because he doesn't go flying into tackles like Butt. Geremi plays like Gilberto at Arsenal. I prefer my defensive midfielders not to go flying into the tackle like Butt and Parker, which isn't disciplined and can often lead to gaps in midfield when a tackle is missed. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Sam Posted September 3, 2007 Share Posted September 3, 2007 Did Sam ever drop Nolan at Bolton? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stozo Posted September 3, 2007 Share Posted September 3, 2007 Butt is the one who shouldn't be anywhere near our midfield. Gets a nosebleed as soon as he gets into the opponents half. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
morpeth mag Posted September 3, 2007 Share Posted September 3, 2007 Agree with KaKa I think Geremi is much more effective than Butt and it was interesting last week that it Was Geremi that was holding whilst Butt broke further forward as opposed to the reverse against Villa. I thought against Villa and Barnsley it was noticable how we tried to play from the back as opposed to hitting long balls into Viduka like we did against Villa. Granted Villa were the best team of the three and that Capaca only played the last two but to me Geremi has been solid and the best of the central midfielders. On a side note I think Sam needs to have a word with Butt and Smith about staying on their feet - get them to watch Capaca. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRon Posted September 3, 2007 Share Posted September 3, 2007 If Michael Owen has to fight for a place, I don't think it will be any different for Geremi. For me though, he's done quite well. While Butt might be better defensively, he doesn't offer anything like the same options going forward. In a 4-3-3 line up with hard-working midfielders, I think Geremi isn't a bad choice for the holding role. Butt would be a better option only if we had a far more attacking line up in front of him. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest jamesmartinsmith Posted September 3, 2007 Share Posted September 3, 2007 We won't need Geremi and Butt, when Emre and Barton are back and in my opinion Butt is better in the holding role. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Posted September 3, 2007 Share Posted September 3, 2007 The Telegraph have this amazing incredible stat machine on their match report this season. It truely is the best I've ever seen, a mini-prozone as it were. Anyway, from that, Geremi received the most passes from defence in particular from Cacapa, and then passed the ball around pretty evenly to other players. This certainly indicates a contribution given the way the defence continuosly got the ball intothe midfield area on Saturday. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest michaeljbuck Posted September 3, 2007 Share Posted September 3, 2007 Geremi may do his work quietly, but that doesn't mean he doesn't do any. Geremi had the highest pass accuracy in the midfield in the game against Wigan (79%), and he also made more passes than any other player in the team (70, which is more than twice Butt's 33). Furthermore, he won more balls than any other player in the team. Got all that from the Telegraph . Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yorkie Posted September 3, 2007 Share Posted September 3, 2007 Could we? Yes. Should we? No. Stick him in with an offensive player in a 4-4-2 and he'll be in there doing a very decent job. What sort of creative centre-midfield do you want from a Nicky Butt/Geremi partnership? Never mind Alan 'the grafter' Smith. How long's Emre out for? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ElDiablo Posted September 3, 2007 Share Posted September 3, 2007 I think Butt is underrated going forward. He seems to get himself into good positions when he ventures forward, should be encouraged to do it a bit more I think/ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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