N'Zogbia: Lyon interested according to agent

[madras]

I think Zoggy is more technically limited than many realise - he doesn't have a naturally good touch on the ball. He ought to have improved more (although he's not a Ronaldo in the making) and I think some of it is down to his personality. He just doesn't impose himself, and looks quite isolated within the team. He still has the demeanour of a teenager making his debut.

 

Why some people expect a player who has been totally shafted at NUFC to be grinning and smiling all the time is beyond me. I'm miserable as f*** just watching Damien Duff, never mind sitting on the bench at his expense.

don't want him grinning and smiling,just showing the same application as others who haven't got things their own way.

[Wullie]

not really. chez also went on to say "Runs with his head down, little awareness, and opts to carry the ball rather than pass and move into space countless times a match."

 

brief but true.

 

So nothing fundamentally wrong with his game, all thing which can be worked on, Ronaldo had some similar problems in his first year but was given the environment and coaching to iron out those weaknesses.

 

I see no reason why Zog cant solve these problems, hes eternally confident in his abilty and always looking to attack.

i see it the other way around. technique etc can be worked on. nouse,finding and using space,picking the right,simple pass etc is not so easily taught.

 

he has the raw ball skill type talent but is severly lacking  in the other major areas.

 

How do you explain Ronaldo's transformation from ball carrying antelope to the player he is today? With his decision making and less ball carrying and creativity.

 

I see a lot of similarities between present day Zog and 18 year old Ronaldo.

 

What areas do you think that Zog severly lacks in that cant be worked on to make him the player he could be? Assuming LW is his strongest position.

experience. ronaldo learns from experience,n'zogbia doesn't.

 

Exactly, because he hasn't had any.

 

Over 100 games like

 

Disclaimer: According to wiki

 

Half of those before Duff arrived and those since include sub appearances, central midfield, left back, even right wing on occasions, back and forth from one to the other. Young players just don't develop like that.

 

You can't tell me that the Charles N'Zogbia who skinned four mackem players in the derby before slotting home or the one who made Brad Friedel look like a total clown would have developed exactly the same (i.e. not at all) if we hadn't bought Duff. He's gone backwards and the club is to blame. Total and utter mismanagement.

right enough. last thing we should do is buy players for positions in which we only have one player,an experienced versatile international at that.

 

some times young starlets don't develop the way you'd think. this is one such case.

 

Big clubs don't buy over-the-hill wasters to replace their young stars. That's why they develop and ours hasn't.

[ShearMagic]

He used to be my favourite player, but at the end of the day I don't think his heart is in it.

 

It's all well and good thinking you know everything, and you're entitled to, fans are welcome to opinions, however, we don't see him every day.

 

It's surely no coincidence that he's never really been in favour with any of our managers, including Keegan who usually loves those kinds of players. To be honest I'd prefer to see a less talented Duff that WANTS to play for Newcastle, than a more talented N'Zogbia that doesn't want to.

[Wullie]

He used to be my favourite player, but at the end of the day I don't think his heart is in it.

 

It's all well and good thinking you know everything, and you're entitled to, fans are welcome to opinions, however, we don't see him every day.

 

It's surely no coincidence that he's never really been in favour with any of our managers, including Keegan who usually loves those kinds of players. To be honest I'd prefer to see a less talented Duff that WANTS to play for Newcastle, than a more talented N'Zogbia that doesn't want to.

 

N'Zogbia wanted away long before KK arrived though, the rot set in a long time prior to that. I can't blame him for being unhappy - the irony is that often the same people who criticize Harper for not going will criticize Charlie for not wanting to sit on the bench.

 

The idea that Duff wants to play for NUFC is absolutely ridiculous. The snivelling little coward.

[Cronky]

not really. chez also went on to say "Runs with his head down, little awareness, and opts to carry the ball rather than pass and move into space countless times a match."

 

brief but true.

 

So nothing fundamentally wrong with his game, all thing which can be worked on, Ronaldo had some similar problems in his first year but was given the environment and coaching to iron out those weaknesses.

 

I see no reason why Zog cant solve these problems, hes eternally confident in his abilty and always looking to attack.

i see it the other way around. technique etc can be worked on. nouse,finding and using space,picking the right,simple pass etc is not so easily taught.

 

he has the raw ball skill type talent but is severly lacking  in the other major areas.

 

How do you explain Ronaldo's transformation from ball carrying antelope to the player he is today? With his decision making and less ball carrying and creativity.

 

I see a lot of similarities between present day Zog and 18 year old Ronaldo.

 

What areas do you think that Zog severly lacks in that cant be worked on to make him the player he could be? Assuming LW is his strongest position.

experience. ronaldo learns from experience,n'zogbia doesn't.

 

Exactly, because he hasn't had any.

 

Over 100 games like

 

Disclaimer: According to wiki

 

Half of those before Duff arrived and those since include sub appearances, central midfield, left back, even right wing on occasions, back and forth from one to the other. Young players just don't develop like that.

 

You can't tell me that the Charles N'Zogbia who skinned four mackem players in the derby before slotting home or the one who made Brad Friedel look like a total clown would have developed exactly the same (i.e. not at all) if we hadn't bought Duff. He's gone backwards and the club is to blame. Total and utter mismanagement.

right enough. last thing we should do is buy players for positions in which we only have one player,an experienced versatile international at that.

 

some times young starlets don't develop the way you'd think. this is one such case.

 

Big clubs don't buy over-the-hill wasters to replace their young stars. That's why they develop and ours hasn't.

 

Duff, for all his faults, shows the sort of qualities that I think Zoggy lacks. He works hard, he communicates with his team mates, he looks for the ball, he shows initiative and passion, he's positive and tries to shape the game. It all boils down to this sense in football that you need 11 leaders, because when you're on the ball it's down to you to dictate things. A new young player who's just been promoted to the first team usually struggles to do that, but then acquires that confidence. Zoggy still looks stuck on the starting blocks.

 

I know you're going to say that it's no good being enthusiastic if you cock everything up, and I don't want to get into a debate about how good / bad Duff is. The point I'd like to make is that if Zoggy had Duff's attitude he'd be a lot better player.

 

And that problem isn't because he hasn't been given chances. He was promoted into the first team at quite a young age and has had plenty of time to make his mark.

[Wullie]

not really. chez also went on to say "Runs with his head down, little awareness, and opts to carry the ball rather than pass and move into space countless times a match."

 

brief but true.

 

So nothing fundamentally wrong with his game, all thing which can be worked on, Ronaldo had some similar problems in his first year but was given the environment and coaching to iron out those weaknesses.

 

I see no reason why Zog cant solve these problems, hes eternally confident in his abilty and always looking to attack.

i see it the other way around. technique etc can be worked on. nouse,finding and using space,picking the right,simple pass etc is not so easily taught.

 

he has the raw ball skill type talent but is severly lacking  in the other major areas.

 

How do you explain Ronaldo's transformation from ball carrying antelope to the player he is today? With his decision making and less ball carrying and creativity.

 

I see a lot of similarities between present day Zog and 18 year old Ronaldo.

 

What areas do you think that Zog severly lacks in that cant be worked on to make him the player he could be? Assuming LW is his strongest position.

experience. ronaldo learns from experience,n'zogbia doesn't.

 

Exactly, because he hasn't had any.

 

Over 100 games like

 

Disclaimer: According to wiki

 

Half of those before Duff arrived and those since include sub appearances, central midfield, left back, even right wing on occasions, back and forth from one to the other. Young players just don't develop like that.

 

You can't tell me that the Charles N'Zogbia who skinned four mackem players in the derby before slotting home or the one who made Brad Friedel look like a total clown would have developed exactly the same (i.e. not at all) if we hadn't bought Duff. He's gone backwards and the club is to blame. Total and utter mismanagement.

right enough. last thing we should do is buy players for positions in which we only have one player,an experienced versatile international at that.

 

some times young starlets don't develop the way you'd think. this is one such case.

 

Big clubs don't buy over-the-hill wasters to replace their young stars. That's why they develop and ours hasn't.

 

Duff, for all his faults, shows the sort of qualities that I think Zoggy lacks. He works hard, he communicates with his team mates, he looks for the ball, he shows initiative and passion, he's positive and tries to shape the game. It all boils down to this sense in football that you need 11 leaders, because when you're on the ball it's down to you to dictate things. A new young player who's just been promoted to the first team usually struggles to do that, but then acquires that confidence. Zoggy still looks stuck on the starting blocks.

 

I know you're going to say that it's no good being enthusiastic if you cock everything up, and I don't want to get into a debate about how good / bad Duff is. The point I'd like to make is that if Zoggy had Duff's attitude he'd be a lot better player.

 

I've not seen any of those "qualities" in Damien Duff for one single second. He is the biggest reason for the on-field malaise at NUFC imo and has been since he got here.

 

Initiative? Passion? Positivity? Damien Duff? Has the world gone stark staring mad?

[Wullie]

He was promoted into the first team at quite a young age

 

And then binned despite being our best player the season before. If you think that is the right message to send out to a young player, one which will give him confidence and make him a better player, then you must think Arsene Wenger is a right no-hoper.

[Mick]

 

I've not seen any of those "qualities" in Damien Duff for one single second. He is the biggest reason for the on-field malaise at NUFC imo and has been since he got here.

 

Initiative? Passion? Positivity? Damien Duff? Has the world gone stark staring mad?

 

You saved me from typing that.

[Tooj]

not really. chez also went on to say "Runs with his head down, little awareness, and opts to carry the ball rather than pass and move into space countless times a match."

 

brief but true.

 

So nothing fundamentally wrong with his game, all thing which can be worked on, Ronaldo had some similar problems in his first year but was given the environment and coaching to iron out those weaknesses.

 

I see no reason why Zog cant solve these problems, hes eternally confident in his abilty and always looking to attack.

i see it the other way around. technique etc can be worked on. nouse,finding and using space,picking the right,simple pass etc is not so easily taught.

 

he has the raw ball skill type talent but is severly lacking  in the other major areas.

 

How do you explain Ronaldo's transformation from ball carrying antelope to the player he is today? With his decision making and less ball carrying and creativity.

 

I see a lot of similarities between present day Zog and 18 year old Ronaldo.

 

What areas do you think that Zog severly lacks in that cant be worked on to make him the player he could be? Assuming LW is his strongest position.

experience. ronaldo learns from experience,n'zogbia doesn't.

 

Exactly, because he hasn't had any.

 

Over 100 games like

 

Disclaimer: According to wiki

 

Half of those before Duff arrived and those since include sub appearances, central midfield, left back, even right wing on occasions, back and forth from one to the other. Young players just don't develop like that.

 

You can't tell me that the Charles N'Zogbia who skinned four mackem players in the derby before slotting home or the one who made Brad Friedel look like a total clown would have developed exactly the same (i.e. not at all) if we hadn't bought Duff. He's gone backwards and the club is to blame. Total and utter mismanagement.

right enough. last thing we should do is buy players for positions in which we only have one player,an experienced versatile international at that.

 

some times young starlets don't develop the way you'd think. this is one such case.

 

Big clubs don't buy over-the-hill wasters to replace their young stars. That's why they develop and ours hasn't.

 

Everyone at the time thought Duff was a bargain though, yourself included.

[Mick]

 

Everyone at the time thought Duff was a bargain though, yourself included.

 

I thought that he was a bargain that we didn't need, now I know I was wrong about him being a bargain. 

[Cronky]

not really. chez also went on to say "Runs with his head down, little awareness, and opts to carry the ball rather than pass and move into space countless times a match."

 

brief but true.

 

So nothing fundamentally wrong with his game, all thing which can be worked on, Ronaldo had some similar problems in his first year but was given the environment and coaching to iron out those weaknesses.

 

I see no reason why Zog cant solve these problems, hes eternally confident in his abilty and always looking to attack.

i see it the other way around. technique etc can be worked on. nouse,finding and using space,picking the right,simple pass etc is not so easily taught.

 

he has the raw ball skill type talent but is severly lacking  in the other major areas.

 

How do you explain Ronaldo's transformation from ball carrying antelope to the player he is today? With his decision making and less ball carrying and creativity.

 

I see a lot of similarities between present day Zog and 18 year old Ronaldo.

 

What areas do you think that Zog severly lacks in that cant be worked on to make him the player he could be? Assuming LW is his strongest position.

experience. ronaldo learns from experience,n'zogbia doesn't.

 

Exactly, because he hasn't had any.

 

Over 100 games like

 

Disclaimer: According to wiki

 

Half of those before Duff arrived and those since include sub appearances, central midfield, left back, even right wing on occasions, back and forth from one to the other. Young players just don't develop like that.

 

You can't tell me that the Charles N'Zogbia who skinned four mackem players in the derby before slotting home or the one who made Brad Friedel look like a total clown would have developed exactly the same (i.e. not at all) if we hadn't bought Duff. He's gone backwards and the club is to blame. Total and utter mismanagement.

right enough. last thing we should do is buy players for positions in which we only have one player,an experienced versatile international at that.

 

some times young starlets don't develop the way you'd think. this is one such case.

 

Big clubs don't buy over-the-hill wasters to replace their young stars. That's why they develop and ours hasn't.

 

Duff, for all his faults, shows the sort of qualities that I think Zoggy lacks. He works hard, he communicates with his team mates, he looks for the ball, he shows initiative and passion, he's positive and tries to shape the game. It all boils down to this sense in football that you need 11 leaders, because when you're on the ball it's down to you to dictate things. A new young player who's just been promoted to the first team usually struggles to do that, but then acquires that confidence. Zoggy still looks stuck on the starting blocks.

 

I know you're going to say that it's no good being enthusiastic if you cock everything up, and I don't want to get into a debate about how good / bad Duff is. The point I'd like to make is that if Zoggy had Duff's attitude he'd be a lot better player.

 

I've not seen any of those "qualities" in Damien Duff for one single second. He is the biggest reason for the on-field malaise at NUFC imo and has been since he got here.

 

Initiative? Passion? Positivity? Damien Duff? Has the world gone stark staring mad?

 

You really do have a thing about Duff. I mean, I've been a bit disappointed with him, but he can't be criticised for his attitude. He does work hard and get involved. He loses possession more than I'd like, but that's often because he's trying to do too much or force through passes that aren't on.

 

The on-field malaise started two years before Duff's arrival, when we sunk from being a Champions League team to bottom half of the table strugglers. That's the rut that we still haven't got out of.

[Skirge]

If Big Al had the managers job Charlie would not be leaving, Al would have him sorted out, but no point keeping an unhappy player is there. He has wanted away for long enough now and whoc an blame him when Duff keeps him out of the team.

[Dave]

Duff works hard in the same way Smith works hard.

[Skirge]

Frenchman could find exit door opens soon

 

CHARLES N’Zogbia’s agent has been told his client will be part of the January sales at St James’s Park.

http://www.journallive.co.uk/nufc/newcastle-united-news/2008/11/25/frenchman-could-find-exit-door-opens-soon-61634-22330045/

[Cronky]

Frenchman could find exit door opens soon

 

CHARLES NZogbias agent has been told his client will be part of the January sales at St Jamess Park.

http://www.journallive.co.uk/nufc/newcastle-united-news/2008/11/25/frenchman-could-find-exit-door-opens-soon-61634-22330045/

 

  In any case, we need to start giving more first team experience to Lua Lua, who I think will turn out to be a much better player.

[TRon]

Frenchman could find exit door opens soon

 

CHARLES NZogbias agent has been told his client will be part of the January sales at St Jamess Park.

http://www.journallive.co.uk/nufc/newcastle-united-news/2008/11/25/frenchman-could-find-exit-door-opens-soon-61634-22330045/

 

  In any case, we need to start giving more first team experience to Lua Lua, who I think will turn out to be a much better player.

 

Is he a left winger?

[TRon]

not really. chez also went on to say "Runs with his head down, little awareness, and opts to carry the ball rather than pass and move into space countless times a match."

 

brief but true.

 

Agreed he does have those drawbacks. On the plus side, you have pace, power, explosive shooting, dangerous crossing, ability to run past players and can tackle.

 

What you have to weigh up is who will bring more to the team over a sustained period on the left wing, Duff or N'Zogbia. I think Dave said it best when he said Duff works hard for the team in the same way as Smith does. Fill your team with Duffs, Smiths and Nicky Butts and sooner or later you will have to come to the same conclusion as Keegan did last season; it will end in relegation unless changes are made.

 

 

[UV]

He was promoted into the first team at quite a young age

 

And then binned despite being our best player the season before. If you think that is the right message to send out to a young player, one which will give him confidence and make him a better player, then you must think Arsene Wenger is a right no-hoper.

 

Is this the season he was "binned" ?

 

Games played by Charles N'Zogbia in 2006/2007 Goals Cards

15-07-2006 UEFA Intertoto Cup Newcastle 1-1 Lillestrom 0

22-07-2006 UEFA Intertoto Cup Lillestrom 0-3 Newcastle 0

10-08-2006 UEFA Cup Ventspils 0-1 Newcastle 0

19-08-2006 English Premier Newcastle 2-1 Wigan 0

24-08-2006 UEFA Cup Newcastle 0-0 Ventspils 0

27-08-2006 English Premier Aston Villa 2-0 Newcastle 0

09-09-2006 English Premier Newcastle 1-2 Fulham 0

14-09-2006 UEFA Cup Levadia Tallinn 0-1 Newcastle 0

20-09-2006 English Premier Liverpool 2-0 Newcastle 0

24-09-2006 English Premier Newcastle 1-1 Everton 0

28-09-2006 UEFA Cup Newcastle 2-1 Levadia Tallinn 0

01-10-2006 English Premier Man Utd 2-0 Newcastle 0

15-10-2006 English Premier Newcastle 1-2 Bolton 0

19-10-2006 UEFA Cup Newcastle 1-0 Fenerbahce 0

22-10-2006 English Premier Middlesbro 1-0 Newcastle 0

25-10-2006 English League Cup Newcastle 3-0 Portsmouth 0

28-10-2006 English Premier Newcastle 0-0 Charlton 0

02-11-2006 UEFA Cup Palermo 0-1 Newcastle 0

04-11-2006 English Premier Newcastle 0-1 Sheff Utd 0

07-11-2006 English League Cup Watford 2-2 Newcastle 0

11-11-2006 English Premier Man City 0-0 Newcastle 0

18-11-2006 English Premier Arsenal 1-1 Newcastle 0

23-11-2006 UEFA Cup Newcastle 2-1 Celta Vigo 0

26-11-2006 English Premier Newcastle 1-0 Portsmouth 0

30-11-2006 UEFA Cup E. Frankfurt 0-0 Newcastle 0

06-12-2006 English Premier Newcastle 3-2 Reading 0

09-12-2006 English Premier Blackburn 1-3 Newcastle 0

13-12-2006 English Premier Chelsea 1-0 Newcastle 0

25-02-2007 English Premier Wigan 1-0 Newcastle 0

03-03-2007 English Premier Newcastle 0-0 Middlesbro 0

15-03-2007 UEFA Cup AZ Alkmaar 2-0 Newcastle 0

18-03-2007 English Premier Charlton 2-0 Newcastle 0

09-04-2007 English Premier Newcastle 0-0 Arsenal 0

14-04-2007 English Premier Portsmouth 2-1 Newcastle 0

30-04-2007 English Premier Reading 1-0 Newcastle 0

 

It's 105 starts, 39 sub appearances in less than 4 years btw. 35 games a year isn't too shabby really, I'm sure it's more than most 22 year old players have had. Using Duff as a way to excuse N'Zogbia's lack of development is very weak. Every young player has to depose a more experienced one to get into the team, it's part of their development and they should use it as a learning experience and a challenge. If the player can't or won't compete for a place in the team, and just sulks when he's not automatically given a start, then what use is a character like that? There's only so much any manager can do, the main drive has to come from the player themselves (I'm not necessarily saying that's what N'Zogbia is like btw as I don't know him, but this is what he's accused of and what he's being defended for).

 

There was nothing wrong with the purchase of Duff (or any other quality experienced winger who should be in their footballing prime) to go above N'Zogbia in the pecking order, unless of course you want a young developing player flogged to death playing week in week out, have no cover, and not have the option to bring on a fresh sub winger (one of the most tiring positions to play). Player development doesn't just happen for 90 minutes once a week you know.

[Lotus]

Not disagreeing with the majority of your post but the purchase of Duff was unecessary. We had a decent player in that position and more important areas to spend a third of the transfer budget. That's not hindsight, he was not in his prime, he was sold 'cheap' for a good reason. It's not a bad idea to take a gamble sometimes but we had other problems in the squad, LW was ok.

 

[TRon]

The bottom line is if we sell Zog, that leaves us with Duff as our only left winger. No matter how good a lad he is, I don't believe in Duff, I can't see him as being anything other than a loser playing for a losing team in the long run. I would love it if we sold Butt, Smith and Duff in January. As it is I think we'll get more for Zog than we would for all three if they were put up for sale.

[Fatwax]

Not disagreeing with the majority of your post but the purchase of Duff was unecessary. We had a decent player in that position and more important areas to spend a third of the transfer budget. That's not hindsight, he was not in his prime, he was sold 'cheap' for a good reason. It's not a bad idea to take a gamble sometimes but we had other problems in the squad, LW was ok.

 

 

We had no other senior LW in the squad and the signing of Duff for only £5m made sense. I wouldn't say it was unnecessary signing, but in hindsight it hasn't worked out for us at all. Not that you can really use hindsight when signing players.

[UV]

Not disagreeing with the majority of your post but the purchase of Duff was unecessary. We had a decent player in that position and more important areas to spend a third of the transfer budget. That's not hindsight, he was not in his prime, he was sold 'cheap' for a good reason. It's not a bad idea to take a gamble sometimes but we had other problems in the squad, LW was ok.

 

 

That's the problem with the "squad" generally today, we have 1 decent first choice player for a position, but very little backup. Allardyce addressed those "problems in the squad" the following season spending substantially more than £5m (I assume you mean the defence) and we subsequently went on to concede twice as many goals - in no small part due to the midfield being weak.

[Lotus]

Not disagreeing with the majority of your post but the purchase of Duff was unecessary. We had a decent player in that position and more important areas to spend a third of the transfer budget. That's not hindsight, he was not in his prime, he was sold 'cheap' for a good reason. It's not a bad idea to take a gamble sometimes but we had other problems in the squad, LW was ok.

 

 

That's the problem with the "squad" generally today, we have 1 decent first choice player for a position, but very little backup. Allardyce addressed those "problems in the squad" the following season spending substantially more than £5m (I assume you mean the defence) and we subsequently went on to concede twice as many goals - in no small part due to the midfield being weak.

 

I don't think you and I are gonna disagree much on this tbh, but regards the defence. Allardyce bought a CB for <3m and one for free, and that's exactly what they looked like. I'd say he got his money's worth for those 2.

Beye is a good buy and i think Ricky is a decent and promising defender.

I think BSA thought he was addressing the MidF with Barton and Smith, Barton i could understand (BSA was unlucky with him tbf), Smith was a mystery in my eyes.

[madras]

He used to be my favourite player, but at the end of the day I don't think his heart is in it.

 

It's all well and good thinking you know everything, and you're entitled to, fans are welcome to opinions, however, we don't see him every day.

 

It's surely no coincidence that he's never really been in favour with any of our managers, including Keegan who usually loves those kinds of players. To be honest I'd prefer to see a less talented Duff that WANTS to play for Newcastle, than a more talented N'Zogbia that doesn't want to.

 

N'Zogbia wanted away long before KK arrived though, the rot set in a long time prior to that. I can't blame him for being unhappy - the irony is that often the same people who criticize Harper for not going will criticize Charlie for not wanting to sit on the bench.

 

The idea that Duff wants to play for NUFC is absolutely ridiculous. The snivelling little coward.

wanted away sooo much he signed a new contract under allardyce didn't he ?

[madras]

Not disagreeing with the majority of your post but the purchase of Duff was unecessary. We had a decent player in that position and more important areas to spend a third of the transfer budget. That's not hindsight, he was not in his prime, he was sold 'cheap' for a good reason. It's not a bad idea to take a gamble sometimes but we had other problems in the squad, LW was ok.

 

 

That's the problem with the "squad" generally today, we have 1 decent first choice player for a position, but very little backup. Allardyce addressed those "problems in the squad" the following season spending substantially more than £5m (I assume you mean the defence) and we subsequently went on to concede twice as many goals - in no small part due to the midfield being weak.

 

I don't think you and I are gonna disagree much on this tbh, but regards the defence. Allardyce bought a CB for <3m and one for free, and that's exactly what they looked like. I'd say he got his money's worth for those 2.

Beye is a good buy and i think Ricky is a decent and promising defender.

I think BSA thought he was addressing the MidF with Barton and Smith, Barton i could understand (BSA was unlucky with him tbf), Smith was a mystery in my eyes.

BSA wasn't unlucky with barton. he knew exactly what he was buyong and if he bought him purely because of his on-field stuff ignoring the players wider life then BSA was a bigger fool than i thought.