The England Thread

[hakka]

England were woeful last night, felt they lacked communication with each other. The only times they opened their mouths were who was to take a freekick and Rooney mouthing off at the ref on numerous occasions. Gerrard was very quiet, yes he's not captain, but as the leader in midfield he still needs to be vocal in his support. The captain mess Capello has brought on himself is getting to boiling point. Weak as piss with his Terry decision and from the start been Capello's England downfall.

 

In a 442 there really is no need for Barry, in fact Barry is fast becoming a really shit England player, while the continuing of playing Rooney at every opportunity shows the incompetence of Capello and lack of depth upfront for England. You can't play a striker that far off form, at one point him and Davies were on the pitch and at club level they had 3 goals, sure 2 of them were from pens.

 

England must bite the bullet and sack Capello, he's never going to win anything, he doesn't have it in him to do well at this level at his age. Bring in an attacking NT manager who goes all out and let him build the squad with young attacking talent, we might lose more games but fuk me at least it will be interesting to watch.

 

 

Good post.  I really rate Capello but it's just not working out.  His stubbornness with tactics, his strange devotion to pick players who are in very poor form and his ignoring of ones who are doing well is undermining the success on the pitch.  The FA are rich enough to sack him no problem so we should ignore the cost part, truth is we should have never offered him that money in the first place, should have been based on success. 

 

The real problem is who the hell do you get in to replace him.  I'd like Martin O'Neil as I think he knows the English way very well and is great at motivating players, he's also available.  Not sure how he would do tactically, but for me England players need proper motivation most of all right now.  I'd prefer Redknapp over O'Neil, but doubt he would leave Spurs just yet.  Perhaps the FA have spoken to him and he is the one to take over once Capello's contract ends.  Who knows, but outside of those two I'm quite twitchy about who we bring in.

 

Overall the England team's performances are terrible at times.  I was thinking about going to 2012 earlier this year but after the World Cup and seeing games like last nights I can just imagine myself spending shit loads and end up watching a bunch of awful lackluster displays that just upset me.

[hakka]

Also, with Crouch playing we need to have wingers on the correct sides so that they can get to the byline and get crosses in.

 

Cutting inside is way overrated in the modern game.

 

We didn't get many early crosses in because of the wingers having to switch feet, and that became quite a problem because we didn't create much down the middle. The crosses were easily read and picked off.

 

As another factor in this, I don't think Glen Johnson has been the same player since the World Cup. He's actually very good going forward, but his confidence seems very brittle at the moment and he's not creating much.

 

What is really worrying is that regardless if wingers need to switch feet or are in acres of space with no pressure, they can't stick a decent ball in to the box each time.  Beckham seems to have covered up a massive flaw in England's game as for 10 years now we have had nobody but Beckham who could actually cross a ball properly.  What also doesn't help is the terrible instinct from our players to get in the box and meet what comes in.  If Rooney drops back to the half way line, wins the ball and sends a winger down the flank we only have Crouch in the box.  He is marked by two players, it's too easy to defend.  The ball needs to be worked in to the box, with more quality on the cross and with more people hungry and making runs to head it in.

[Jordan]

http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,12016_6442730,00.html

Carrolls chance?

[ponsaelius]

Yesterday was crying out to give Wilshere a game in the centre. The kid is streets ahead of Barry in terms of passing, vision, technique etc already. I don't really see what harm it would have done, Barry is just a slow waste of a position who is only going to get worse.

 

[Cronky]

Capello was doing very well right up until the World Cup finals, and apart from last night, the performances haven't been that bad since.

 

I think he made mistakes during the World Cup, in that the boot-camp atmosphere didn't suit the players. However, there were other things - principally Rooney's loss of form - that were beyond his control. Either way, he should be given the chance to learn from those experiences and have a crack at another tournament.

 

I've seen so many England managers struggle over the years, despite their good records at club level. Our only successful one, Ramsey, had the advantage of playing at home during a World Cup. It's a difficult job for all sorts of reasons, and changing things now just feels like panic.

[hakka]

Capello was doing very well right up until the World Cup finals, and apart from last night, the performances haven't been that bad since.

 

I think he made mistakes during the World Cup, in that the boot-camp atmosphere didn't suit the players. However, there were other things - principally Rooney's loss of form - that were beyond his control. Either way, he should be given the chance to learn from those experiences and have a crack at another tournament.

 

I've seen so many England managers struggle over the years, despite their good records at club level. Our only successful one, Ramsey, had the advantage of playing at home during a World Cup. It's a difficult job for all sorts of reasons, and changing things now just feels like panic.

 

I see what you're saying, but to be honest you can't excuse how woeful we were during the World Cup.  There is no point in storming through the qualifiers to serve up dog shit when in the real tournament.  We hardly had a tough qualifying group anyway. Most of what went wrong in the World Cup you could argue was due to stubbornness from Capello.  You say he can learn from this, but I don't think he will.  He is too stubborn to be dynamic and adaptive with England imo, however I hope he proves me wrong on that. 

 

For what it's worth I don't think we struggled with Hoddle or Eriksson at the helm.  Both managers got far in tournaments and mostly it was down to bad luck, red cards (Beckham, Rooney etc.) and finally penalties that put us out.  Only Brazil 2002 World Cup were we beaten, and even that was a bit of tremendous luck/skill from Ronaldinho to kill us off.  Even in that tournament we were better than we were in 2010. You could argue that Capello had a stronger team than both Hoddle and Eriksson had and with that he served up the worst football ever when it was the 2010 finals.

 

I want to be proven wrong for thinking that Capello is no longer the right man.  Before the World Cup I firmly believed he was the right calibre of manager, a true World Class manager.  But his formula has not worked when we needed it most.  If he takes that form in to the qualifiers than what hope have we got for him getting it right in the Euro 2012 finals.  Rooney's form is a blow, but he should be big enough to drop him and put someone in who is playing well.  Rooney may even benefit coming off the bench late on in his current situation for all we know.

[JH]

The problem is his so-called 'new' England.

 

We failed at the World Cup - you're supposed to go forward and change things. Ferdinand, Gerrard, Barry, Rooney, Crouch, Cole, Johnson - it's practically the same team as last year - of course it's not going to work.

[hakka]

Yesterday was crying out to give Wilshere a game in the centre. The kid is streets ahead of Barry in terms of passing, vision, technique etc already. I don't really see what harm it would have done, Barry is just a slow waste of a position who is only going to get worse.

 

 

Wilshere has had some very good performances for Arsenal.  The cup game against Spurs was one I saw where he suprised me.  He is hungry for it and clearly has the talent.  He should have come on for Barry against Montenegro and Gerrard could drop back deeper in to Barry's role.

[wormy]

Capello was doing very well right up until the World Cup finals, and apart from last night, the performances haven't been that bad since.

But don't we basically say that every 2 years? England (generally) plough through everyone in qualifying, and get hyped to the hilt, before the crashing realisation that we aren't really going to do that well.

 

Yes, I'd consider a lot of it mental, and no, I've got no idea of a solution apart from hope a manager can finally get this complacency out of them (which is what I think the mental issue is).

 

I've just kind of got bored of the same routine.

[hakka]

The problem is his so-called 'new' England.

 

We failed at the World Cup - you're supposed to go forward and change things. Ferdinand, Gerrard, Barry, Rooney, Crouch, Cole, Johnson - it's practically the same team as last year - of course it's not going to work.

 

Exactly.  And to think we had Wright-Phillips and Downing on the bench to bring on.  Are both even getting a game at the moment? - think they aren't.  If Heskey didn't retire I bet he would have featured and Kevin Davies would have never been called up.

 

The new is still the old, sadly.

[hakka]

Capello was doing very well right up until the World Cup finals, and apart from last night, the performances haven't been that bad since.

But don't we basically say that every 2 years? England (generally) plough through everyone in qualifying, and get hyped to the hilt, before the crashing realisation that we aren't really going to do that well.

 

Yes, I'd consider a lot of it mental, and no, I've got no idea of a solution apart from hope a manager can finally get this complacency out of them (which is what I think the mental issue is).

 

I've just kind of got bored of the same routine.

 

1996, 1998, 2004 and 2006.  In those tournaments we did well and only pens put us out.  Don't think it's fair to apply the hype and fail of 2008 and 2010 to those previous efforts.

[madras]

Capello was doing very well right up until the World Cup finals, and apart from last night, the performances haven't been that bad since.

But don't we basically say that every 2 years? England (generally) plough through everyone in qualifying, and get hyped to the hilt, before the crashing realisation that we aren't really going to do that well.

 

Yes, I'd consider a lot of it mental, and no, I've got no idea of a solution apart from hope a manager can finally get this complacency out of them (which is what I think the mental issue is).

 

I've just kind of got bored of the same routine.

 

1996, 1998, 2004 and 2006.  In those tournaments we did well and only pens put us out.  Don't think it's fair to apply the hype and fail of 2008 and 2010 to those previous efforts.

cross 96 off that list, we didn't play well at all till the semi final.

[ponsaelius]

We were awful in '06 aswell, ditched out limply by the first half decent side we faced.

 

Infact, I think we were much better in 2002 than we were in 2006.

[hakka]

Capello was doing very well right up until the World Cup finals, and apart from last night, the performances haven't been that bad since.

But don't we basically say that every 2 years? England (generally) plough through everyone in qualifying, and get hyped to the hilt, before the crashing realisation that we aren't really going to do that well.

 

Yes, I'd consider a lot of it mental, and no, I've got no idea of a solution apart from hope a manager can finally get this complacency out of them (which is what I think the mental issue is).

 

I've just kind of got bored of the same routine.

 

1996, 1998, 2004 and 2006.  In those tournaments we did well and only pens put us out.  Don't think it's fair to apply the hype and fail of 2008 and 2010 to those previous efforts.

cross 96 off that list, we didn't play well at all till the semi final.

 

we didn't play well at some of them, but we still got the job done in more games and did well compared to 2008 and 2010.

[hakka]

We were awful in '06 aswell, ditched out limply by the first half decent side we faced.

 

Infact, I think we were much better in 2002 than we were in 2006.

 

ditched out limply? we had 10 men and lost on pens, so perhaps we could have done better but it wasn't a 4 - 1 raping like Germany gave us.  No Owen either through that awful injury he picked up previous game.

[hakka]

http://www.skysports.com/story/0,19528,12016_6442730,00.html

Carrolls chance?

 

Maybe.  Depends if Pearce has a sly word in Capello's ear to put him off.

[ponsaelius]

We were awful in '06 aswell, ditched out limply by the first half decent side we faced.

 

Infact, I think we were much better in 2002 than we were in 2006.

 

ditched out limply? we had 10 men and lost on pens, so perhaps we could have done better but it wasn't a 4 - 1 raping like Germany gave us.  No Owen either through that awful injury he picked up previous game.

 

Yeah but we played like shit throughout that tournament. Own goal to beat Paraguay, fouled our way past TnT, failed to beat Sweden and then just about edged past Ecuador through a set-piece. Anybody could see an exit was on the cards against Portugal, yeah we did well to battle to a shoot-out in the circumstances but in honesty the 'honourable' failure just seemed to sum up a dreadful tournament allround.

[Ronaldo]

We only conceded in 1 game out of 5. Had Rooney not been a c***, we could easily have made the final.

[hakka]

We were awful in '06 aswell, ditched out limply by the first half decent side we faced.

 

Infact, I think we were much better in 2002 than we were in 2006.

 

ditched out limply? we had 10 men and lost on pens, so perhaps we could have done better but it wasn't a 4 - 1 raping like Germany gave us.  No Owen either through that awful injury he picked up previous game.

 

Yeah but we played like shit throughout that tournament. Own goal to beat Paraguay, fouled our way past TnT, failed to beat Sweden and then just about edged past Ecuador through a set-piece. Anybody could see an exit was on the cards against Portugal, yeah we did well to battle to a shoot-out in the circumstances but in honesty the 'honourable' failure just seemed to sum up a dreadful tournament allround.

 

We still did better than 08 and 10 though, even playing poor we got through it.  We supposed to have a better squad in 08 & 10 compared to 06 but we did even worse.

[Ronaldo]

08?

[hakka]

We only conceded in 1 game out of 5. Had Rooney not been a c***, we could easily have made the final.

 

and if Owen didn't break and perhaps if Defoe went instead of Walcott.

[hakka]

08?

 

Euro 2008, we failed to even qualify.

[Ronaldo]

Owen was never going to contribute owt. Neither was Defoe, at that age.

[Ronaldo]

08?

 

Euro 2008, we failed to even qualify.

 

So why mention it in a discussion about tournaments?

[Mowen]

Capello was doing very well right up until the World Cup finals, and apart from last night, the performances haven't been that bad since.

But don't we basically say that every 2 years? England (generally) plough through everyone in qualifying, and get hyped to the hilt, before the crashing realisation that we aren't really going to do that well.

 

Yes, I'd consider a lot of it mental, and no, I've got no idea of a solution apart from hope a manager can finally get this complacency out of them (which is what I think the mental issue is).

 

I've just kind of got bored of the same routine.

 

1996, 1998, 2004 and 2006.  In those tournaments we did well and only pens put us out.  Don't think it's fair to apply the hype and fail of 2008 and 2010 to those previous efforts.

cross 96 off that list, we didn't play well at all till the semi final.

 

Netherlands.