Newcastle United 0 - 0 Derby County - 28/12/09 - post match reaction from p12

[Liam Liam Liam O]

I'd like to see Guthrie given a decent run in the middle because IMO you can see the Liverpool schooling in him; he's always willing to move in order to receive the ball and then gets his head up looking to pass it on. He also has a good first touch. He's by no means brilliant at it or else he wouldn't be playing for us in this league, but at this point in time I rate him higher than Nolan who simply offers nothing as a midfielder.

 

Good post.

 

Saturday was an opportunity against a very poor side to play Guthrie and Nolan in the middle if he'd wanted to do something forward thinking and positive.

[Yorkie]

Yorkie, 7/10 for Nolan?  He was rubbish.  

 

The reason Derby started to get into the game in the second half was because of the massive hole Nolan was leaving in the middle of the pitch.

 

2/10 for me.

 

Aye, dunno what i was thinking really. He frustrated me for the most part. He just got stuck in with a few crunching tackles that made me tingle with glee and levity; and i think those momentary bouts of excitement just carried over into that analysis. S'all i can put it down to.

[ElDiablo]

We're still unorganised as fuck, massive gaping holes all over the pitch. Derby got at our defence with ease whenever they wanted. We don't defend from the front either, which means anyone with an ounce of ability will rip us apart. I honestly think we'll get beaten off WBA in a few weeks.

[Amir_9]

Im not worried yet, if we dont beat Reading I will be worried, weve got WBA, Leicester and Cardiff coming up. We really need to up our game.

[Guest BlacknWhiteArmy]

It happens every time, we come out after the break in a good position to go and win the game (Or are already ahead- see Sheffield Wednesday away) and we come out relaxed and complacent and slow paced and either throw away the lead or don't get all three points. It makes you wonder what the hell goes on in our dressing room.

 

Guthrie should have been on for Nolan early on and Ranger should have come on for Carroll with at least twenty minutes to spare.

[Liam Liam Liam O]

Yada Yada.

 

I know I'm only picking up on a small amount of your post but I thought Smith & Nolan were both diabolical tonight.  Their midfield had 60 yards of free space in front of them every time they broke from the back.

 

A 7 was generous for Nolan, probably - but not for Smith i'd say. Derby hardly came here to attack but Smith breaks up the play so well in this division and actually generates some forward momentum. He's meant to play deep - the full-backs have a chance to overlap and he passes the ball in a forward direction. It's good retaining of possession.

 

I honestly don't know what role Nolan plays. "The guy who scores quite a bit" is about the only label i can give him.

 

I thought Smith was appalling when they were playing down our right hand side in the first half and 3 of them were playing triangles around R Taylor and Simpson, but Smith still refused to leave the D on the edge of the 18 yard box to help out or break up those attacks.

 

He is primarily responsible for the fact that we sit too deep and invite teams on because he himself sits too deep when the opposition have the ball. Whether that's as a result of instructions he's been given or a choice he's making himself is another matter though.

[Parsley]

Am I alone in thinking that Ryan Taylor played well tonight btw?

[Guest toonlass]

Harper - 6 - One decent save after he didn't bother to shout for an easier chance to come and get a ball. Kicking was terrible tonight.

Simpson - 6 - Nowt to write home about.

Taylor - 6 - Alright but not his usual standard tbh, wasted the header by putting it straight at Bywater.

Colocinni - 6 - The same as above. Not great. Not bad. Just average.

Enrique - 6 - Definitely had a couple of poorer games, poor going foward, alright at the back.

R. Taylor - 6 - Meh, hit the crossbar and missed the one on one when a few feet either way would have gone past the keeper.

Smith - 6 - Effort was there, challenges were alright in the main, but again nowt special from him.

Nolan - 5 - Very poor, looked lethargic and off the pace.

Jonas - 7 - The best player on the field tonight, and I am not his biggest fan, but he got forward, got back, crossed and should have had more support from his team-mates.

Lovenkrands - 6 - Alright performance, put in a cross early in the first half that Carroll should have done better with, and should have scored himself.

Carroll - 5.5 - Fluffed a couple of decent headed chances, not a great performance from him.

 

Ameobi- 5- Can't remember him doing much other than miscontrolling the ball

Pancrate - 4 - not good at all

Ranger - 5 - Unlucky not to score. Needs more than 10-12 minutes to play in a match tho.

 

For me it was an average game by all, we were poor from about the 25 minutes in mark until about 75 minutes gone, and wasted chances. Atmosphere was shit, with some comedians singing "Your support is fucking shit" to the Derby fans when we had sang nothing for about 5 minutes up in the corner. The players need to support each other more, there were loads of times when Jonas especially had no options as no-one would make himself available for him. A couple of times Simpson was free out on the right and was ignored, and players need to show more awareness as they seemed to be constantly looking to play it down the left despite there being players free on the right who were free.

[Mick]

Am I alone in thinking that Ryan Taylor played well tonight btw?

 

I didn't think he played well but his set pieces were our best chance of getting a goal and taking him off was puzzling. 

[ElDiablo]

Yada Yada.

 

I know I'm only picking up on a small amount of your post but I thought Smith & Nolan were both diabolical tonight.  Their midfield had 60 yards of free space in front of them every time they broke from the back.

 

A 7 was generous for Nolan, probably - but not for Smith i'd say. Derby hardly came here to attack but Smith breaks up the play so well in this division and actually generates some forward momentum. He's meant to play deep - the full-backs have a chance to overlap and he passes the ball in a forward direction. It's good retaining of possession.

 

I honestly don't know what role Nolan plays. "The guy who scores quite a bit" is about the only label i can give him.

 

I thought Smith was appalling when they were playing down our right hand side in the first half and 3 of them were playing triangles around R Taylor and Simpson, but Smith still refused to leave the D on the edge of the 18 yard box to help out or break up those attacks.

 

He is primarily responsible for the fact that we sit too deep and invite teams on because he himself sits too deep when the opposition have the ball. Whether that's as a result of instructions he's been given or a choice he's making himself is another matter though.

 

 

Said this to my mate, Smith thinks the way to play as a defensive midfielder is to stand in front of the two centre backs and try to block shots, Nolan does the exact same thing as well. Which meant Derby got down the channels easily, that good chance they had in the first half when Colo rushed out, that man who crossed it should have been Smiths or Nolans but he was just left to run, meaning Colo had a decision to make when he should have just held on to his man. Thick as fuck the pair of them. Nolan should be played off the striker or not at all.

[Liam Liam Liam O]

Pancrate looks a poor player having seen a bit more of him since the wonder goal.

[Weezertron]

All Hughton needs to do is play the soundtrack of the motion picture Rocky before the match and at halftime. Fuck his team talk and his tactics.

 

I bet we'd see a vast improvement.

[Cronky]

Yada Yada.

 

I know I'm only picking up on a small amount of your post but I thought Smith & Nolan were both diabolical tonight.  Their midfield had 60 yards of free space in front of them every time they broke from the back.

 

A 7 was generous for Nolan, probably - but not for Smith i'd say. Derby hardly came here to attack but Smith breaks up the play so well in this division and actually generates some forward momentum. He's meant to play deep - the full-backs have a chance to overlap and he passes the ball in a forward direction. It's good retaining of possession.

 

I honestly don't know what role Nolan plays. "The guy who scores quite a bit" is about the only label i can give him.

 

I thought Smith was appalling when they were playing down our right hand side in the first half and 3 of them were playing triangles around R Taylor and Simpson, but Smith still refused to leave the D on the edge of the 18 yard box to help out or break up those attacks.

 

He is primarily responsible for the fact that we sit too deep and invite teams on because he himself sits too deep when the opposition have the ball. Whether that's as a result of instructions he's been given or a choice he's making himself is another matter though.

 

I don't think Smith has much choice. He's not got the legs to chase the ball further upfield so he stays in position.

 

It looks to me that it is just part of the overall strategy for our rather immobile midfield to get behind the ball and snuff out attacks when they reach the penalty area. In nearly every game I've seen, the opposition has had plenty of possession, time and space - they just don't usually have the ability to take advantage.

 

I'm not very confident about Guthrie and don't see him as the answer. He's skilful but struggles under any kind of physical challenge and when pressured.

 

Barton can give us the boost we need. Is there any news about him?

[Dave]

Am I alone in thinking that Ryan Taylor played well tonight btw?

 

Nope, I think his delivery was good and he offers genuine width.

[Guest Heneage]

Pancrate looks a poor player having seen a bit more of him since the wonder goal.

How many starts has he even had though? Not every player is just good, he doesn't speak a word of English and is new here, I think it would be better to give him some time.

[Thespence]

Theres been nothing to base him being better on the wing on atall.

 

Hes done well on the wing, we've not even seen him in the middle in this league yet. Last season he did alright in the middle, played in several through balls for the strikers. He has good vision, hes good on the ball, he can move with the ball & he can loop it in from the middle anyway so makes no sense to leave him isolated on the wing. He can dictate play for us if given the chance.

 

Lets move the CCC 2nd most creative player if assists are a indicator just for the crack. The scouse thug should/is back soon so he will more than likely want to be/will be the main man in the middle of the park.

 

You're assuming that his assists will just dry up in the centre - why?

 

I want to know this as well...I'm confused.

 

He has not got the speed of thought for the middle of the park. A lot of his good work comes from when he has that bit extra time you need to think & he gets this by playing in the wide position.  A bit like why Fergie would never (rarely if any footy anoarks are around) play Beckham in the middle for MUFC, Fergie did try Rio in there once but he got fucking obliterated as the game was too quick for him.

[Liam Liam Liam O]

Yada Yada.

 

I know I'm only picking up on a small amount of your post but I thought Smith & Nolan were both diabolical tonight.  Their midfield had 60 yards of free space in front of them every time they broke from the back.

 

A 7 was generous for Nolan, probably - but not for Smith i'd say. Derby hardly came here to attack but Smith breaks up the play so well in this division and actually generates some forward momentum. He's meant to play deep - the full-backs have a chance to overlap and he passes the ball in a forward direction. It's good retaining of possession.

 

I honestly don't know what role Nolan plays. "The guy who scores quite a bit" is about the only label i can give him.

 

I thought Smith was appalling when they were playing down our right hand side in the first half and 3 of them were playing triangles around R Taylor and Simpson, but Smith still refused to leave the D on the edge of the 18 yard box to help out or break up those attacks.

 

He is primarily responsible for the fact that we sit too deep and invite teams on because he himself sits too deep when the opposition have the ball. Whether that's as a result of instructions he's been given or a choice he's making himself is another matter though.

 

I don't think Smith has much choice. He's not got the legs to chase the ball further upfield so he stays in position.

 

It looks to me that it is just part of the overall strategy for our rather immobile midfield to get behind the ball and snuff out attacks when they reach the penalty area. In nearly every game I've seen, the opposition has had plenty of possession, time and space - they just don't usually have the ability to take advantage.

 

I'm not very confident about Guthrie and don't see him as the answer. He's skilful but struggles under any kind of physical challenge and when pressured.

 

Barton can give us the boost we need. Is there any news about him?

 

In the Premier League perhaps, but even Smith & Nolan have their uses a level down.

[Liam Liam Liam O]

Pancrate looks a poor player having seen a bit more of him since the wonder goal.

How many starts has he even had though? Not every player is just good, he doesn't speak a word of English and is new here, I think it would be better to give him some time.

 

Started at Barnsley and was poor and has been poor in every substitute appearance since that goal.

[Greg]

Pancrate looks a poor player having seen a bit more of him since the wonder goal.

How many starts has he even had though? Not every player is just good, he doesn't speak a word of English and is new here, I think it would be better to give him some time.

 

Started at Barnsley and was poor and has been poor in every substitute appearance since that goal.

 

He was s**** when he started at Coventry, missed a sitter as well.

[Yorkie]

Am I alone in thinking that Ryan Taylor played well tonight btw?

 

Nope, I think his delivery was good and he offers genuine width.

 

I was wondering all the way through that second half why he was so narrow. Did he get to the byline and cross a ball once all day? The wings are so painfully imbalanced; watching Enrique and Jonas overlap each other to such effect - compared to what was going on down the other flank... hell's teeth. Starting to get frustrated with Simpson n'all. He looks about as timid as AS9 in a boxing ring once he's in that opposition's half.

 

As pissed off and as disgraceful a decision it was to drop Guthrie, i thought that it might be a good chance for Taylor to atleast make a claim for that right side. Thought he fucked it up big-time.

[Thespence]

Several of Guthries assists have come from him dropping further into the middle anyway, so not sure where it comes from.

 

Probably only 2 or 3 of his assists have come from deep on the wing.

 

As I have said a few times he is right midfielder & not your stereotypical right winger. Do you understand comrade?

[Guest Heneage]

Pancrate looks a poor player having seen a bit more of him since the wonder goal.

How many starts has he even had though? Not every player is just good, he doesn't speak a word of English and is new here, I think it would be better to give him some time.

 

Started at Barnsley and was poor and has been poor in every substitute appearance since that goal.

 

He was s**** when he started at Coventry, missed a sitter as well.

Can't expect the lad to be moving mountains so early on, he hasn't been playing football and is clearly quite rusty.

[Cronky]

Yada Yada.

 

I know I'm only picking up on a small amount of your post but I thought Smith & Nolan were both diabolical tonight.  Their midfield had 60 yards of free space in front of them every time they broke from the back.

 

A 7 was generous for Nolan, probably - but not for Smith i'd say. Derby hardly came here to attack but Smith breaks up the play so well in this division and actually generates some forward momentum. He's meant to play deep - the full-backs have a chance to overlap and he passes the ball in a forward direction. It's good retaining of possession.

 

I honestly don't know what role Nolan plays. "The guy who scores quite a bit" is about the only label i can give him.

 

I thought Smith was appalling when they were playing down our right hand side in the first half and 3 of them were playing triangles around R Taylor and Simpson, but Smith still refused to leave the D on the edge of the 18 yard box to help out or break up those attacks.

 

He is primarily responsible for the fact that we sit too deep and invite teams on because he himself sits too deep when the opposition have the ball. Whether that's as a result of instructions he's been given or a choice he's making himself is another matter though.

 

I don't think Smith has much choice. He's not got the legs to chase the ball further upfield so he stays in position.

 

It looks to me that it is just part of the overall strategy for our rather immobile midfield to get behind the ball and snuff out attacks when they reach the penalty area. In nearly every game I've seen, the opposition has had plenty of possession, time and space - they just don't usually have the ability to take advantage.

 

I'm not very confident about Guthrie and don't see him as the answer. He's skilful but struggles under any kind of physical challenge and when pressured.

 

Barton can give us the boost we need. Is there any news about him?

 

In the Premier League perhaps, but even Smith & Nolan have their uses a level down.

 

I was expecting Guthrie to really come into his own at this lower level, but I feel he's been a real disappointment so far. Obviously he's been shunted out wide, which doesn't help, but he's so easily bullied off the ball and I can see why Hughton hasn't wanted to risk him in the middle.

 

Nolan v Guthrie is a difficult choice rather than an obvious one, I reckon.

[Jayson]

Several of Guthries assists have come from him dropping further into the middle anyway, so not sure where it comes from.

 

Probably only 2 or 3 of his assists have come from deep on the wing.

 

As I have said a few times he is right midfielder & not your stereotypical right winger. Do you understand comrade?

 

I know what you're saying, but i see no reason why hed be more limited further in field.

 

Tbf ive had a watch of his assists & theyve all been lobs or crosses of some sort. But 3 or 4 are from closer to the middle of the pitch, so he can obviously pick a man out from there still.

As ive said before, he can move with the ball also & he'll recieve it wider on the pitch at times still as he actually looks for space unlike others. He'll just be dictating more of the play from the middle for the majority of the game, think itd only help us.

[Pilko]

Guthrie may lose the ball by being bullied, but Nolan's piss poor passing loses it just as much. It's hard to say whether Guthrie would get as many goals in a central role as he's hardly figured there.