The old Chris Hughton discussion thread

[Guest maccan]

Can't blame Hughton after yesterdays match. I think he's got the tactics right(except playing Guthrie on the left-wing) . Swansea is a ball possession team who have big problems with their goalscoring. I saw the game Swansea - Forest earlier this season and Forest controlled the game very defensive and Swansea had the possession. Forest waited for Swansea to make their mistakes and Forest could easily counter-attack and win the game with 2-0.  And I think Hughton wanted to play this way yesterday, but the players is to blame. Nolan was crap alongside Smith and Guthrie. And I thinks that is a very big worry. Can't wait for Bartons comeback...

[Bad Mongo]

Didn't our dip in form coincide with the injuries to Jonas and Enrique, the two (now three, with Routledge) players we have with genuine pace? The rest of the players may have some technique and ability to pass, but that doesn't matter when the team is entirely static.

[johnnypd]

Can't blame Hughton after yesterdays match. I think he's got the tactics right(except playing Guthrie on the left-wing) . Swansea is a ball possession team who have big problems with their goalscoring. I saw the game Swansea - Forest earlier this season and Forest controlled the game very defensive and Swansea had the possession. Forest waited for Swansea to make their mistakes and Forest could easily counter-attack and win the game with 2-0.  And I think Hughton wanted to play this way yesterday, but the players is to blame. Nolan was crap alongside Smith and Guthrie. And I thinks that is a very big worry. Can't wait for Bartons comeback...

 

can't remember us doing much counter attacking yesterday. we hit long passes up to carroll and that's basically the only tactic we had. if we'd wanted to counter attack ranger would've been a better option up top, i also would've probably put van aanholt on the wing or too while a conscious decision to play the ball on the ground would've helped.

[Mick]

Didn't our dip in form coincide with the injuries to Jonas and Enrique, the two (now three, with Routledge) players we have with genuine pace? The rest of the players may have some technique and ability to pass, but that doesn't matter when the team is entirely static.

 

It depends what you class as our dip in form, I think it goes back to December when we had almost a fully fit side.

[midds]

Didn't our dip in form coincide with the injuries to Jonas and Enrique, the two (now three, with Routledge) players we have with genuine pace? The rest of the players may have some technique and ability to pass, but that doesn't matter when the team is entirely static.

 

It depends what you class as our dip in form, I think it goes back to December when we had almost a fully fit side.

 

Which year? 

[Guest maccan]

Our defense is forced to put up the long balls because our midfield is shit. Lovenkrands and Routledge has the pace for counter attacks but we have no-one who can set them up with good passes. I would love to see a player like Orlandi on the midfield very good and calm with the ball, good technique. Alongside him we need a pacey box to box player with good work rate and an eye for goals.

[TRon]

Can't blame Hughton after yesterdays match. I think he's got the tactics right(except playing Guthrie on the left-wing) . Swansea is a ball possession team who have big problems with their goalscoring. I saw the game Swansea - Forest earlier this season and Forest controlled the game very defensive and Swansea had the possession. Forest waited for Swansea to make their mistakes and Forest could easily counter-attack and win the game with 2-0.  And I think Hughton wanted to play this way yesterday, but the players is to blame. Nolan was crap alongside Smith and Guthrie. And I thinks that is a very big worry. Can't wait for Bartons comeback...

 

can't remember us doing much counter attacking yesterday. we hit long passes up to carroll and that's basically the only tactic we had. if we'd wanted to counter attack ranger would've been a better option up top, i also would've probably put van aanholt on the wing or too while a conscious decision to play the ball on the ground would've helped.

 

In order to counter attack effectively you need players who can bring the ball out of tight situations and thread a pass. Solano was brilliant at this. Guthrie and Nolan tried to do it yesterday and were constantly robbed in possession as they took an age to control the ball and then release it. That's down to the individual player rather than any poor tactics or coaching.

[Yorkie]

If teams start coming to Newcastle and trying to win the games then were in deep shit because our home form is only the way it is because very few teams have the bottle to try and come at us.  If they start having a go then the players who are being exposed away from home will be exposed at St James because they are just as vulnerable.    QPR had a go at us and we looked shit against them for most of the match but managed to get an equaliser because QPR tried to hold on to a one goal lead instead of trying to get a second.

 

Disagree with this bit, Mick. It's when teams come to SJP with a view to playing football, when we kill them off - and usually pretty quickly. It's when they sit back and shut up shop, a la Bristol/Derby - we struggle. It reaches the 30th minute, we still haven't scored, and we're absolutely knackered - not a clue what to do. Teams come and start the game a bit more open, and on a lot of occassions, we've killed them off (or at the very least - scored) within the first twenty minutes.

 

We're generally excellent from a defensive perspective at home, bar one or two daft ricks like Bednar's vs WBA.

[Mick]

This group of players couldn't play football no matter what so to expect Hughton to get them to play like Brazil is f***ing absurd in the extreme. People need to be more realistic here. On the one hand they lambaste the midfield and the overall lack of genuine ability in the team yet on the other hand they expect a rookie manager who is s**** anyway (in their eyes), to get these players to play football. Howay man...

 

 

"Hey Chris, we know you're s**** and the team isn't the best either but we do expect you to get them playing like Brazil every minute of every game. If you don't we want you out man, never mind the fact you got us top with this s*** team in your first year as a manager at one of the most unstable clubs in world football with a fanbase as demanding as ours, we want ENTERTAINED..."

 

The bloke is doing a very good job if you ask me and is proving himself more than capable at this level, cut him some slack. I had hoped with relegation that the severe analysis of every minute aspect of the club, manager, players and performances would end but I should have known better, if anything the uber critical eye is even bigger these days.

 

We are top of the league and heading up a division. Lets just f***ing get there eh and then do all the bull s*** analysis.

 

Who expects us to play like Brazil?

 

The Bullshit analysis you're on about has and will always take place.  It might happen after the game over a pint or at work the day after a match but it always has and always will take place, especially on a football forum.    You've analysed plenty yourself so to have a go at others for doing the same is a bit of hypocrisy.

[Guest firetotheworks]

Hughton doesn't only pick the team, he also puts the team together and he's done nothing with our central midfield.  Joey Barton coming back is no excuse because we would have brought nobody in if we used players coming back from injury as a reason to do nothing as Coloccini is now back and we'll eventually have a fit Enrique and Taylor.  We've brought in 3 defenders during the transfer window and dropped Kadar who looks like a better defender than Van Aanholt.  We've brought in Pancrate and Routledge to play right wing and let a right winger go out on loan who is probably of more use than Pancrate.  We've brought in Best who looks no better than what we already have up front, we don't need 5 forwards in the first team so bringing in a 5th should have only been done if he offers something that the others don't and I'm still waiting to see if he does and what that might be.

 

Our central midfield is at best gash, at worst it’s a liability and that’s down to Hughton as they have been gash for all of the season.

 

As for motivation, we’ve clearly got a problem as some of our players are going to seed.  We look unfit and we’re getting slower and becoming less able to control a game and less able to string 2 passes together, we’re going backwards from a very low standard to start with.  We’ve tried a different combination for 1 ½ games and reverted to a failed method because things were going wrong for ½ of those games.  We were under more pressure against Swansea with our cloggers than we were against Derby who scored 3 times out of 4 shots on target.  It might look as if we were more in the game against Swansea because they only scored once and we equalised but that’s far too simplistic.  Swansea could have slaughtered us if they were better in front of goal as they had more than twice as many shots on target than Derby.

 

Ranger is a much better footballer than Carroll but isn't getting the time on the pitch to show what he can do, he hasn't scored as many goals as Carroll but he's never going to do that unless he's given the chance.  Ranger hasn't had a chance and he's probably now behind Best yet he hasn't been as ineffective as Carroll has been when he's not scoring.

 

Hughton is a bore and the team is reflecting the manager’s temperament, Hughton was a defender and the team is being put out to defend at all costs in the hope that we can nick something at the other end.  We’re grinding out points which we don’t deserve, that would be a good thing if we were putting in more of the performances like we did against Cardiff but we’re not.  Far too often we hear Hughton telling us how good the opposition are, Derby were a very good team according to Hughton before the match and we played as if they were very good, we played as if we had feared them.

 

If teams start coming to Newcastle and trying to win the games then we’re in deep s*** because our home form is only the way it is because very few teams have the bottle to try and come at us.  If they start having a go then the players who are being exposed away from home will be exposed at St James’ because they are just as vulnerable.    QPR had a go at us and we looked s*** against them for most of the match but managed to get an equaliser because QPR tried to hold on to a one goal lead instead of trying to get a second.

 

The team has no leadership either on or off the pitch.  Off the pitch we have a players committee who the players have used as a reason for us being top of the league.  I have seen no reason to believe that Hughton has any leadership qualities.  How many people would go to work and put in a good days graft if they didn’t have a boss looking over them?  From what I’ve seen during my working life I would guess that 80 to 90 percent of people would do nothing and our players look like that 80 to 90 percent who have nothing to fear if they just turn up and do nothing.

 

 

Very astute.

[Mick]

If teams start coming to Newcastle and trying to win the games then were in deep s*** because our home form is only the way it is because very few teams have the bottle to try and come at us.  If they start having a go then the players who are being exposed away from home will be exposed at St James because they are just as vulnerable.    QPR had a go at us and we looked s*** against them for most of the match but managed to get an equaliser because QPR tried to hold on to a one goal lead instead of trying to get a second.

 

Disagree with this bit, Mick. It's when teams come to SJP with a view to playing football, when we kill them off - and usually pretty quickly. It's when they sit back and shut up shop, a la Bristol/Derby - we struggle. It reaches the 30th minute, we still haven't scored, and we're absolutely knackered - not a clue what to do. Teams come and start the game a bit more open, and on a lot of occassions, we've killed them off (or at the very least - scored) within the first twenty minutes.

 

We're generally excellent from a defensive perspective at home, bar one or two daft ricks like Bednar's vs WBA.

 

The only two teams that I can think of who have came here and tried to do anything are QPR and Palace.  I thought that we were lucky to get a draw against QPR and Palace had to put the ball in the net to give us the first and they looked like getting an equaliser until we killed the game in the last minute.

[Yorkie]

Bar Ambrose sneaking through the back four, Palace never for a minute looked like scoring - i was astonished to see they'd had more shots than us when i got home - it was a drab game. I haven't seen all the games - i missed QPR admittedly - but the only team who's come here and i can say i've been afraid of them scoring, is West Brom. Swansea put pressure on in the second half but we were already 3-0 up by that point, same with Peterborough. Doncaster played some decent football but we were awful at that point and still won anyway.

 

We're too hard to break down at home and it's been very pleasing all season long. I'm confident of us getting a result against just about anyone at home.

[Guest firetotheworks]

I agree with Palace, I dont think they really had a go. QPR were a full level above us in terms of quality in play, and totally outplayed us. At that point they were the Arsenal of the CCC and we were fortunate to get a draw.

[johnnypd]

Can't blame Hughton after yesterdays match. I think he's got the tactics right(except playing Guthrie on the left-wing) . Swansea is a ball possession team who have big problems with their goalscoring. I saw the game Swansea - Forest earlier this season and Forest controlled the game very defensive and Swansea had the possession. Forest waited for Swansea to make their mistakes and Forest could easily counter-attack and win the game with 2-0.  And I think Hughton wanted to play this way yesterday, but the players is to blame. Nolan was crap alongside Smith and Guthrie. And I thinks that is a very big worry. Can't wait for Bartons comeback...

 

can't remember us doing much counter attacking yesterday. we hit long passes up to carroll and that's basically the only tactic we had. if we'd wanted to counter attack ranger would've been a better option up top, i also would've probably put van aanholt on the wing or too while a conscious decision to play the ball on the ground would've helped.

 

In order to counter attack effectively you need players who can bring the ball out of tight situations and thread a pass. Solano was brilliant at this. Guthrie and Nolan tried to do it yesterday and were constantly robbed in possession as they took an age to control the ball and then release it. That's down to the individual player rather than any poor tactics or coaching.

 

i don't think so. there's worse players than them doing that at other championship clubs. put guthrie in the west brom or swansea side and he'd be able to play first time passes with his eyes closed. likewise, put their players like cotteril or jerome thomas in our side and they'd look just as inept as our lot and you'd have people like HTT saying that they are shit and can't do that even if they tried.

 

there is an issue with lack of mobility and fitness and you can only improve that so much through coaching, though we dont seem to have done so as guthrie looks overweight. but in terms of clever movement, understanding between team mates and confidence, that has to emanate from the manager. put keegan in charge of these players and there wouldn't be an issue. remember how everyone said the likes of Butt, Geremi, Barton, Owen, Martins etc couldn't do all these basic footballing jobs, yet within 8 or 9 games of keegan taking over they looked like they looked like a very good side. indeed, a player like Guthrie as he played vs Man Utd, full of threaded passes, clever touches, confidence and intuitive understanding with team-mates would piss on this league. it is testament to mismanagement how far he has fallen since he joined the club.

[Mick]

I agree with Palace, I dont think they really had a go. QPR were a full level above us in terms of quality in play, and totally outplayed us. At that point they were the Arsenal of the CCC and we were fortunate to get a draw.

 

I've just checked and Palace had more shots on and off target then we did, they had twice as many as we did on target and I don't know if the own goal counts as a shot on target for us, I can only guess that it does.

[Guest firetotheworks]

I agree with Palace, I dont think they really had a go. QPR were a full level above us in terms of quality in play, and totally outplayed us. At that point they were the Arsenal of the CCC and we were fortunate to get a draw.

 

I've just checked and Palace had more shots on and off target then we did, they had twice as many as we did on target and I don't know if the own goal counts as a shot on target for us, I can only guess that it does.

 

It was all mainly long shots tbh. They never really posed a threat. Even at 1-0 I wasn't nervous. We were never troubled aside from Ambrose going 1 on 1.

[TRon]

Can't blame Hughton after yesterdays match. I think he's got the tactics right(except playing Guthrie on the left-wing) . Swansea is a ball possession team who have big problems with their goalscoring. I saw the game Swansea - Forest earlier this season and Forest controlled the game very defensive and Swansea had the possession. Forest waited for Swansea to make their mistakes and Forest could easily counter-attack and win the game with 2-0.  And I think Hughton wanted to play this way yesterday, but the players is to blame. Nolan was crap alongside Smith and Guthrie. And I thinks that is a very big worry. Can't wait for Bartons comeback...

 

can't remember us doing much counter attacking yesterday. we hit long passes up to carroll and that's basically the only tactic we had. if we'd wanted to counter attack ranger would've been a better option up top, i also would've probably put van aanholt on the wing or too while a conscious decision to play the ball on the ground would've helped.

 

In order to counter attack effectively you need players who can bring the ball out of tight situations and thread a pass. Solano was brilliant at this. Guthrie and Nolan tried to do it yesterday and were constantly robbed in possession as they took an age to control the ball and then release it. That's down to the individual player rather than any poor tactics or coaching.

 

i don't think so. there's worse players than them doing that at other championship clubs. put guthrie in the west brom or swansea side and he'd be able to play first time passes with his eyes closed. likewise, put their players like cotteril or jerome thomas in our side and they'd look just as inept as our lot and you'd have people like HTT saying that they are shit and can't do that even if they tried.

 

there is an issue with lack of mobility and fitness and you can only improve that so much through coaching, though we dont seem to have done so as guthrie looks overweight. but in terms of clever movement, understanding between team mates and confidence, that has to emanate from the manager. put keegan in charge of these players and there wouldn't be an issue. remember how everyone said the likes of Butt, Geremi, Barton, Owen, Martins etc couldn't do all these basic footballing jobs, yet within 8 or 9 games of keegan taking over they looked like they looked like a very good side. indeed, a player like Guthrie as he played vs Man Utd, full of threaded passes, clever touches, confidence and intuitive understanding with team-mates would piss on this league. it is testament to mismanagement how far he has fallen since he joined the club.

 

Keegan struggled with those players and in the end he had to drop Owen into midfield to make it work. It was a smart move no doubt, and maybe Hughton has options to make a similar change. Until he tries it we won't know, but while we are sitting top of the table he'll continue as he is I suspect.

[Heron]

Hughton still doing a dandy job in my opinion. Just needs a few key players back...

[Ronaldo]

We were more or less full strength against Sheff Wednesday, same problems.

[Heron]

We were more or less full strength against Sheff Wednesday, same problems.

 

Meh, one game. With our home form, and Jonas and Jose back, we'll begin to dominate again.

[Ronaldo]

Defeats to Scunthorpe, Forest and Blackpool. We're missing an awful lot more than a couple of players.

[AyeDubbleYoo]

We look a different side with Jonas and Enrique. Lets not forget that up 'til now the left side has looked our only threat going forward. Routledge might be able to balance things out but he's new to the side and he hasn't played much when we've been at full strength.

 

We rely on the lefties a lot, without them we're toothless.

[eaststar]

One thing I like about hughton is how he supports his players. Just read the article where he says he won't drop Nolan. Don't agree with him not being dropped but when a player is supported like that u have to think of the confidence it gives them and the desire to play for the manager. Just something I think he is doing well. 

[Elliottman]

One thing I like about hughton is how he supports his players. Just read the article where he says he won't drop Nolan. Don't agree with him not being dropped but when a player is supported like that u have to think of the confidence it gives them and the desire to play for the manager. Just something I think he is doing well. 

if that praise was coming from someone like Wenger or Ferguson i would see your point. But from CH, not so much. Cant help but feel - based purley on nothing more than a hunch, that the players feel like they can do what they want, when they want under him. So i cant imagine Nolan putting an extra 105 due to those comments.

[Heron]

I like how he defends his players also. It doesn't matter if you're Wenger or Hughton, a bit of praise and support always helps. I would far rather we were united and f***ing everyone else off than letting other people run our business. Hughton will drop Nolan when he sees fit, but for now I don't think we have to worry too much. We'll get 13 points from our next 6 games and everyone will be happy again...