Contracts coming to an end

[Yorkie]

It took us 18 months to get rid of Boumsong... our squad decreased but our defense improved.

 

Bramble's been here for 4 years+...

 

Catch my drift?

 

What an appropriate expression.

 

Continue drifting, go with the flow, let the tide of popular opinion take you where it will...

 

...watch out for rocks.

 

So, because my opinion is shared by the majority - that makes it incorrect?

 

That's what you're saying.

 

Odd.

 

No, the fact that it's incorrect, makes it incorrect.

 

All your opinion being shared by the majority makes is: me depressed.

 

Let's look at what you're saying:

 

Give Bramble away for free.

 

Some issues that might arise from that course of action:

 

1. We have a wafer-thin squad, which you are suggesting we make even thinner.

 

2. We have hardly any money, but you want to use what little we do have, not on strengthening our wafer-thin squad, but on replacing a player we already have, but you want to give away for free.

 

3. Blatantly if we give him away, whoever picks him up will turn him a good, reliable, dependable, central-defender, because they will have coaches that actually know what they are doing.

 

4. How many more of our players would you suggest we simply give away? Dyer, Shola, Luque, etc, etc, etc? Who's going to play for us next season? Me? You?

 

The team is going to be strengthened in January/in the summer. Bramble is expendable, even if he is just 'replaced' and the squad doesn't get any bigger, i'm not bothered. The squad will have improved no matter what. I'm sick off seeing Titus Bramble in the squad when he has never, ever been good enough and never will be at this club. Simple as really.

 

That's the end of it as far as i am concerned.

[indi]

 

 

The team is going to be strengthened in January/in the summer. Bramble is expendable, even if he is just 'replaced' and the squad doesn't get any bigger, i'm not bothered. The squad will have improved no matter what. I'm sick off seeing Titus Bramble in the squad when he has never, ever been good enough and never will be at this club. Simple as really.

 

That's the end of it as far as i am concerned.

 

Well it's a good job you're not running the club then, thank god we've got a highly qualified and experienced management team in place to make these decisions, people who really know what they're doing... ...oh wait.

[Matt]

So you're suggesting getting rid of players from our squad at Christmas and not replacing them until the summer!?!

 

Erm, no. The contracts expire in June. They wouldn't be going anywhere. I don't suggest selling anyone anywhere in my post. Just not renewing contracts.

 

Not renewing a contract is no guarantee that player will join another club. There are cases of players remaining at clubs over the summer and re-signing (presumably as they was no better option). It would be nice to think it wouldn't come to this. This scenario is only likely to affect Bramble- while I don't rate him, the wider perception of his ability is still harsh. I don't think he'll have a big queue of suitors.

 

My comment about big-name replacements reflect the fact we rarely unearth rough-diamonds and too often find ourselves with expensive failures. You wanted me to provide you with names and prices- why? I only regularly watch the Premier League and the odd Nationwide game and can only admit to being clued up on the form of our own players. My best guess would be players with decent reputations and the accompanying price tag. What I'm saying is that some of the best value players out there could well be people most of us have never heard of. So coming out with suggestions would counteract my point that we perform poorly in our scouting of players. What I know is that Bramble is clumsy and stupid and Moore, while half-decent against less mobile players, needs 24 hours notice before a striker turns on the ball.

 

There's no need to get patronising. I'm not stupid.

[Dr. Nguyen Van Falk]

Renew all contracts even if its just for a year.

[lovejoy]

None of them.

 

seconded.

 

 

 

[CaliMag]

I am pretty sure Solano intends to return to Peru next year and change careers to being a manager. He said after he re-signed with us that he would play for us and then leave the UK when his contract was up. He kept to door open for returning to England as a coach, but only after he has proven to himself he can do it in Peru... so there may not be a choice there. I think Nobby is planning to be a player manager for one of the teams in Lima. So it could be a moot point.

 

Moore - similar story. He wants to go back to OZ and it would really be up to him.

 

Sibi... we have a paper thin squad and he is better than most of what we have so I would keep him for another year.

 

Titus - nee chance man. Off to Ipswich you go.

[indi]

So you're suggesting getting rid of players from our squad at Christmas and not replacing them until the summer!?!

 

Erm, no. The contracts expire in June. They wouldn't be going anywhere. I don't suggest selling anyone anywhere in my post. Just not renewing contracts.

 

Ok fair enough.

 

Not renewing a contract is no guarantee that player will join another club. There are cases of players remaining at clubs over the summer and re-signing (presumably as they was no better option). It would be nice to think it wouldn't come to this. This scenario is only likely to affect Bramble- while I don't rate him, the wider perception of his ability is still harsh. I don't think he'll have a big queue of suitors.

 

Do you want rid of these players or not!?!

 

Why would you not renew a player's contract if you had even the slightest desire to keep hold of them?

 

You make it sound like it would be unlikely that they'd go anywhere else and that we would then re-sign them at the end of the summer, that's pure fantasy!! Why would the club, or the player, want to do that.

 

My comment about big-name replacements reflect the fact we rarely unearth rough-diamonds and too often find ourselves with expensive failures. You wanted me to provide you with names and prices- why? I only regularly watch the Premier League and the odd Nationwide game and can only admit to being clued up on the form of our own players. My best guess would be players with decent reputations and the accompanying price tag. What I'm saying is that some of the best value players out there could well be people most of us have never heard of. So coming out with suggestions would counteract my point that we perform poorly in our scouting of players. What I know is that Bramble is clumsy and stupid and Moore, while half-decent against less mobile players, needs 24 hours notice before a striker turns on the ball.

 

The reason I wanted you to give some suggestions as to who we would replace these players with is because you seem to be under the impression that we can aford to give away four first-team players and replace them, just like that.

 

How much money do you think the club has at the moment? Well the answer is: not much. We made huge losses this year, did you not notice that? There's not a bottomless pit of cash ion the boardroom you know, any money we spend in January will probably be the bank's. So each pound of that puts the club in an even more risky position, when are we going to pay this money off? How's that going to affect our spending in the future? What if we go down?

 

How many players do you think we have? Well the answer is: not many. Our squad is wafer thin, did you not notice that? We're really suffering from injuries this season because it only needs a couple of first-teamers to pick up an injury and we're having to bring in kids, play unfit players, or get OAPs like Pav (legend that he is) in. If we blow all our money on replacing players that we already have, instead of strengthening the squad, then this will continue for another season. Is that a good thing? What if we have more injuries next season? What if that means we do even worse than we are this season? What if we then go down?

 

The fact is we can not afford to be giving players away, either from a financial perspective or a football one. To ignore this shows that you either haven't thought it through, or you're not in touch with the reality of the situation. We need to be strengthening our squad, not weakening it, both in terms of quality and numbers, if we do what you suggest we will not be able to do either to any great extent.

 

There's no need to get patronising. I'm not stupid.

 

Well I'm sorry for that, but I simply can't believe that your argument is the result of much thought. That doesn't mean I think you are stupid, just that you've not got a good argument.

[Northern Monkey]

Nolberto Solano, Craig Moore, Titus Bramble and Antoine Sibierski all have contracts that end during summer 2007. They will all be free to talk to other clubs in the January transfer window.

 

Which are worth keeping?

 

Solano is not the player he once was. If nobody comes in for him the club would be in a strong negotiating position and would probably be able to reduce his weekly wages (assuming Nobby wanted to stay and the club wanted to keep him). The same applies to Bramble. Ipswich have made noises about wanting him but I'm sure he'd prefer to stay at Newcastle. Moore has said if the club don't offer him a new contract soon he will go home to Australia. Sibierski has been a reasonable emergency stop-gap.

 

I know a lot of people will want rid of Bramble but if we can keep him as a squad player on a lot less money than he's on now then he may be worth keeping. We have a very small squad and don't have a lot of money at the moment. We need squad players.

 

 

Nolberto Solano - bin/offer coaching role

Craig Moore - if he wants to stay, keep, but NOT as a first team player, please god.

Titus Bramble - bin, he's shite.

Antoine Sibierski - bin.

[Matt]

So let's say we give the four new contracts now- even for one year (there's nothing to say the players would accept, perhaps fancying a lower wage but more security- like Chopra did last summer). That's a chunk of our already excessive wage bill used up. As senior pros, Solano and Moore will command a reasonable wage. We go into the summer transfer planning (which in theory should get underway as soon as January is through) knowing that a section of the wage is already used up. To use your earlier point, any new contract will also have it's associated agents fees and signing-on fees (though not as great as in the case of a Bosman).

 

I'm not advocating reducing the squad size further without replacement- that should be obvious. My point is that rushing to put players on deals because we're terrified that we'll have no-one left come next September is not a good way to approach contract renewals. I don't think we're in any hurry to renew any of the four deals in question and as such can leave a decision quite late, hopefully evaluating what else is out there.

 

Personally, I reckon we could get in better players- even as depth- come the summer. I don't think players in question would be overjoyed to hear that they'll be getting new contracts but they're no longer in the first-team picture unless there's an injury crisis. Certainly not if we're trying to trim their pay packet at the same time. In my eyes, it's not a case of 'giving players away'. You think that we'd be hard pushed to replace them so we'd be shooting ourselves in the foot to let competent professionals leave the club.

[Optimistic Nut]

Once again another top post by Matt.

 

Agree 100% with it all.

[indi]

So let's say we give the four new contracts now- even for one year (there's nothing to say the players would accept, perhaps fancying a lower wage but more security- like Chopra did last summer). That's a chunk of our already excessive wage bill used up. As senior pros, Solano and Moore will command a reasonable wage. We go into the summer transfer planning (which in theory should get underway as soon as January is through) knowing that a section of the wage is already used up. To use your earlier point, any new contract will also have it's associated agents fees and signing-on fees (though not as great as in the case of a Bosman).

 

I'm not advocating reducing the squad size further without replacement- that should be obvious. My point is that rushing to put players on deals because we're terrified that we'll have no-one left come next September is not a good way to approach contract renewals. I don't think we're in any hurry to renew any of the four deals in question and as such can leave a decision quite late, hopefully evaluating what else is out there.

 

Personally, I reckon we could get in better players- even as depth- come the summer. I don't think players in question would be overjoyed to hear that they'll be getting new contracts but they're no longer in the first-team picture unless there's an injury crisis. Certainly not if we're trying to trim their pay packet at the same time. In my eyes, it's not a case of 'giving players away'. You think that we'd be hard pushed to replace them so we'd be shooting ourselves in the foot to let competent professionals leave the club.

 

Alright fair enough, we'll have to agree to disagree.

[Disco]

any1 got any knowledge on players out of contract at other teams in UK and Europe that could be worth a punt (not that we'll take any of course - purely for some hypothetical debate purposes)

[LoveItIfWeBeatU]

As an update to this thread, Today's Journal (see ICNewcastle - Journal) seem to think that Solano has 18 months to go on his contract: -

 

"With just 18 months left on his contract"

[Mick]

Bump, too late.