Steven Taylor (now retired)

[Unbelievable]

Release a statement that he's sorry to have offended people and offer his week's wages to a charity for racism awareness or something, and be done with it. Personally I'm more disturbed by the fact that any hint at "racism" (by which I mean distinguishing between races of human beings, not hatred based on skin colour) still elicites this type of reaction from the general public than by his actual tweet. Whilst incredibly stupid (because of going against PC standards using a public medium) and criminally unfunny, I don't think there was any intent to offend. Much ado about nothing.

I don't get these constant criticisms of those taking offense tbh.

 

Are they supposed to apply some kind of social triage to these situations and only yell about the big ones that you tell them they can care about and ignore everything else? Does reading that sentence help highlight the ludicrous nature of your criticism?

 

That some ills are worse than others doesn't mean anyone has to keep quiet about the small ones and only shout about the large ones. Indeed it's the accumulation of these small social ills that can give rise to larger ones and they are every bit as much worth calling out when they happen.

 

Couldn't disagree more. There is a massive difference between racism (i.e. acknowledging there are differences between several races of human beings) and racial supremacy, institutionalised racism or even discrimination based on race. To play the racism card each and every time there is an air of potential racism about something without looking at the context to my mind diminishes rather than strenghtens the justified battle against the latter (true and infinitely more damaging) types of racism.

[David Icke - Son of God]

Offensiveness is a subjective thing and therefore it is ridiculous to try and quantify how offensive something can legitimately be. I didn't find it offensive (I thought the picture with the blacked out face was borderline IMO) but others might and I can certainly understand why. Would I wag my finger and tell them they're daft to be offended? Not in this instance.

 

The worst thing about this entire incident is that it has allowed insufferable cunts to bang on about "PC gone mad", because pointing out that publicly chastising people for the colour of their skin is a bit fucking dim is the height of political correctness. For that alone I hope he gets a big bloody fine and/or a ban.

[thomas]

Release a statement that he's sorry to have offended people and offer his week's wages to a charity for racism awareness or something, and be done with it. Personally I'm more disturbed by the fact that any hint at "racism" (by which I mean distinguishing between races of human beings, not hatred based on skin colour) still elicites this type of reaction from the general public than by his actual tweet. Whilst incredibly stupid (because of going against PC standards using a public medium) and criminally unfunny, I don't think there was any intent to offend. Much ado about nothing.

I don't get these constant criticisms of those taking offense tbh.

 

Are they supposed to apply some kind of social triage to these situations and only yell about the big ones that you tell them they can care about and ignore everything else? Does reading that sentence help highlight the ludicrous nature of your criticism?

 

That some ills are worse than others doesn't mean anyone has to keep quiet about the small ones and only shout about the large ones. Indeed it's the accumulation of these small social ills that can give rise to larger ones and they are every bit as much worth calling out when they happen.

Couldn't disagree more. There is a massive difference between racism (i.e. acknowledging there are differences between several races of human beings) and racial supremacy, institutionalised racism or even discrimination based on race. To play the racism card each and every time there is an air of potential racism about something without looking at the context to my mind diminishes rather than strenghtens the justified battle against the latter (true and infinitely more damaging) types of racism.

So it sounds like there's a definitions problem as basically no one is defining racism as you are, and when it comes to the "racism card" that's actually a term meant for one of two things -

1. to transform a non racial issue into a racial issue in order to shift the conversation or gain advantage (not happening here as the issue is clearly race)

2. to accuse other people of doing the first in order to dismiss and belittle their claims (this is what you're doing) as spurious.

 

By all means don't be offended if you're not offended but just don't think you have carte blanche to tell other people they shouldn't be, or that if they are, it's only because they're "playing a racism card".

[Unbelievable]

Offensiveness is a subjective thing and therefore it is ridiculous to try and quantify how offensive something can legitimately be. I didn't find it offensive (I thought the picture with the blacked out face was borderline IMO) but others might and I can certainly understand why. Would I wag my finger and tell them they're daft to be offended? Not in this instance.

 

The worst thing about this entire incident is that it has allowed insufferable c***s to bang on about "PC gone mad", because pointing out that publicly chastising people for the colour of their skin is a bit f***ing dim is the height of political correctness. For that alone I hope he gets a big bloody fine and/or a ban.

 

What?

[David Icke - Son of God]

Offensiveness is a subjective thing and therefore it is ridiculous to try and quantify how offensive something can legitimately be. I didn't find it offensive (I thought the picture with the blacked out face was borderline IMO) but others might and I can certainly understand why. Would I wag my finger and tell them they're daft to be offended? Not in this instance.

 

The worst thing about this entire incident is that it has allowed insufferable c***s to bang on about "PC gone mad", because pointing out that publicly chastising people for the colour of their skin is a bit f***ing dim is the height of political correctness. For that alone I hope he gets a big bloody fine and/or a ban.

 

What?

 

You know what I mean. I'm battling with a fucking vicious cold here, I'm not at my most eloquent.

[Raconteur]

Couldn't disagree more. There is a massive difference between racism (i.e. acknowledging there are differences between several races of human beings) and racial supremacy, institutionalised racism or even discrimination based on race. To play the racism card each and every time there is an air of potential racism about something without looking at the context to my mind diminishes rather than strenghtens the justified battle against the latter (true and infinitely more damaging) types of racism.

I think the bolded bit is the crucial difference. You think there is a "massive" difference between racial differentiation and racial hatred, whereas I (and many, many others) consider there to be a very small difference between the two. Sure, posting a "blackface" pic is different from wearing a KKK hood, but they're in the same general ballpark. How about not paying any attention to racial difference at all, and then there won't be any "grief"...?

[Unbelievable]

Release a statement that he's sorry to have offended people and offer his week's wages to a charity for racism awareness or something, and be done with it. Personally I'm more disturbed by the fact that any hint at "racism" (by which I mean distinguishing between races of human beings, not hatred based on skin colour) still elicites this type of reaction from the general public than by his actual tweet. Whilst incredibly stupid (because of going against PC standards using a public medium) and criminally unfunny, I don't think there was any intent to offend. Much ado about nothing.

I don't get these constant criticisms of those taking offense tbh.

 

Are they supposed to apply some kind of social triage to these situations and only yell about the big ones that you tell them they can care about and ignore everything else? Does reading that sentence help highlight the ludicrous nature of your criticism?

 

That some ills are worse than others doesn't mean anyone has to keep quiet about the small ones and only shout about the large ones. Indeed it's the accumulation of these small social ills that can give rise to larger ones and they are every bit as much worth calling out when they happen.

Couldn't disagree more. There is a massive difference between racism (i.e. acknowledging there are differences between several races of human beings) and racial supremacy, institutionalised racism or even discrimination based on race. To play the racism card each and every time there is an air of potential racism about something without looking at the context to my mind diminishes rather than strenghtens the justified battle against the latter (true and infinitely more damaging) types of racism.

So it sounds like there's a definitions problem as basically no one is defining racism as you are, and when it comes to the "racism card" that's actually a term meant for one of two things -

1. to transform a non racial issue into a racial issue in order to shift the conversation or gain advantage (not happening here as the issue is clearly race)

2. to accuse other people of doing the first in order to dismiss and belittle their claims (this is what you're doing) as spurious.

 

By all means don't be offended if you're not offended but just don't think you have carte blanche to tell other people they shouldn't be, or that if they are, it's only because they're "playing a racism card".

 

Well, let's see. The Oxford English Dictionary defines racism as

the belief that all members of each race possess characteristics, abilities, or qualities specific to that race, especially so as to distinguish it as inferior or superior to another race or races

 

There is no doubt that what Taylor did qualifies as the first part of that definition (infer that members of the same race possess a characteristic specific to their race, i.e. in this case something as innocent as people of the congoid race smile more often than people of other races), but it is very, very questionable that it qualifies as the second (he does not suggest that the congoid race is inferior because of this identified characteristic). Hence why the distinction is actually crucially important; every human being is probably "racist" on a daily basis going by the first part of the definition, but to actually qualify as racism it needs to fit a belief system where one race is inferior/superior. This is what I referred to as racial supremacy, institutionalised racism or even discrimination based on race, the form of racism that needs to be battled as fiercely as any civilised society can and the form you refer to (and that is most commonly referred to when people claim something is racist even if it isn't). To suggest one form is the same as the other, or one leads directly to the other, is quite frankly preposterous, as is the notion that there are no racial differences (be it cultural or genetic), as much as today's political correctness brigade wants to swap all that under the carpet, as if races do not even exist.

 

May just be me, but to me denying the existence of racial differences in the face of mountains of evidence, and preventing them from being debated are more damaging concepts themselves than somebody pointing out a racial difference to his mates in good spirits.. It's as if we're trying to combat discrimination based on race by brainwashing people that there are no racial differences or that they are not allowed to discuss them, whilst the natural inclination should be to teach people to judge other people on their individual merit and performance, not something as shallow as their race (the same goes for age, sex, etc).

[Unbelievable]

Offensiveness is a subjective thing and therefore it is ridiculous to try and quantify how offensive something can legitimately be. I didn't find it offensive (I thought the picture with the blacked out face was borderline IMO) but others might and I can certainly understand why. Would I wag my finger and tell them they're daft to be offended? Not in this instance.

 

The worst thing about this entire incident is that it has allowed insufferable c***s to bang on about "PC gone mad", because pointing out that publicly chastising people for the colour of their skin is a bit f***ing dim is the height of political correctness. For that alone I hope he gets a big bloody fine and/or a ban.

 

What?

 

You know what I mean. I'm battling with a f***ing vicious cold here, I'm not at my most eloquent.

 

I don't. Seriously, how can what Taylor did (as dumb as it is) be construed in any way, shape or form as "chastising people for the colour of their skin"?

[Mike]

There needs to be a word that lies between ignorant and racist. There's no word. The Germans probably have one.

[cp40]

There needs to be a word that lies between ignorant and racist. There's no word. The Germans probably have one.

 

 

Daft?

[B-more Mag]

Christ, man. He responded to jokes about not speaking French well by resorting to a joke based on blackness. He wouldn't respond to white players saying he doesn't defend well by joking about their whiteness.

[Cajun]

Ignoracist.

 

Racorant.

 

[cp40]

InTaylorant.

[Cajun]

InTaylorant.

 

[Unbelievable]

InTaylorant.

 

[Deuce]

Christ, man. He responded to jokes about not speaking French well by resorting to a joke based on blackness. He wouldn't respond to white players saying he doesn't defend well by joking about their whiteness.

 

This.

 

What he did was racist, regardless of his intentions. Accept it.

[Cronky]

Even allowing for Taylor's reputation for being thick, I was quite shocked by those pictures.

 

He has no defence and he's in big trouble now. Apart from the FA punishment, the club may feel they have to let him go.

[Ronaldo]

I think a lot of people need to look up the definition of the word.

[Ronaldo]

the club may feel they have to let him go.

 

Don't be so stupid, man.

[Dokko]

InTaylorant.

 

[Dave]

Even allowing for Taylor's reputation for being thick, I was quite shocked by those pictures.

 

He has no defence and he's in big trouble now. Apart from the FA punishment, the club may feel they have to let him go.

 

And lose money? Don't be daft.

[Robbo]

Even allowing for Taylor's reputation for being thick, I was quite shocked by those pictures.

 

He has no defence and he's in big trouble now. Apart from the FA punishment, the club may feel they have to let him go.

 

Give over They're well aware he's a few sandwiches short of a picnic

[Unbelievable]

Christ, man. He responded to jokes about not speaking French well by resorting to a joke based on blackness. He wouldn't respond to white players saying he doesn't defend well by joking about their whiteness.

 

Irrelevant. Of course there would be no statement that could be construed as racist when it was banter between members of the same race.. Now for example, if Mbiwa made a joke about Williamson's lack of pace or athletecism, would anybody give it a second thought?

[B-more Mag]

You've missed the point.

[David Icke - Son of God]

Offensiveness is a subjective thing and therefore it is ridiculous to try and quantify how offensive something can legitimately be. I didn't find it offensive (I thought the picture with the blacked out face was borderline IMO) but others might and I can certainly understand why. Would I wag my finger and tell them they're daft to be offended? Not in this instance.

 

The worst thing about this entire incident is that it has allowed insufferable c***s to bang on about "PC gone mad", because pointing out that publicly chastising people for the colour of their skin is a bit f***ing dim is the height of political correctness. For that alone I hope he gets a big bloody fine and/or a ban.

 

What?

 

You know what I mean. I'm battling with a f***ing vicious cold here, I'm not at my most eloquent.

 

I don't. Seriously, how can what Taylor did (as dumb as it is) be construed in any way, shape or form as "chastising people for the colour of their skin"?

 

He was taking the piss. Chastising was the wrong word.