Alan Pardew

[AyeDubbleYoo]

 

Not at all, but I accept that limited spending is that way that Ashley is going to run the club, and I don't think it's a bad thing in principle. Spunking massive fees on overpaid wasters is just as bad IMO.

 

I agree that spunking massive fees on overpaid wasters is just as bad, nobody is suggesting that we do that.

 

Not one single person that I know of in fact

 

I know, I was just implying that big spending doesn't necessarily bring success.

 

It might, it might not, the question is getting the balance right. As I've said loads of times, I'm not saying Ashley has set the bar at the right place, but it's not an exact science anyway.

[Mick]

 

There isn't only one way to run a business.

 

But, cutting costs in one of the most important ways that a company losing money can reduce its losses and even make a profit.  In fact, it's probably the first thing that any purchaser of any business would do.

 

We've cut our costs and have a budget to work to that we've been told had us close to break even before selling Carroll.

 

We've had a cash windfall and most businesses would use that to crack on and build up the business, we don’t seem to be willing to do that. 

 

[mrmojorisin75]

There isn't only one way to run a business.

 

But, cutting costs in one of the most important ways that a company losing money can reduce its losses and even make a profit.  In fact, it's probably the first thing that any purchaser of any business would do.

 

cheers Sherlock

 

there's cutting costs and cutting costs - you're so keen to compare football to other businesses would a manufacturing company cut costs by using inferior materials, machinery and people and expect their business to maintain itself or grow?  i fucking doubt it

 

unless you have no choice, i.e. going bust is looming, you don't just butcher everything, cut every cost and stop investing in expanding your business, there has to be balance - presently we have no balance, it's all one way

 

ashley is not in that position, he's not short of money himself he's choosing to run the club this way

[mrmojorisin75]

I know, I was just implying that big spending doesn't necessarily bring success.

 

no one is even asking for "spending big" anymore ian, just some modest investment to try and improve us on the pitch and stop us standing still or going backwards

 

i've never had more faith in our scouting than i have at the moment but like everything with ashley it's always dysfunctional - should be an ashley meme:

 

"ASSEMBLE CRACK SCOUTING SQUAD, DON'T BUY ANY PLAYERS"

[Guest ykmkmdd]

I like him. Pardew that is. Didn't think I would, but seems a canny enough bloke to me. Has to work under an interfering arsehole of a boss, but 90% of us have been there and managed to get on with it OK - sometimes if you value your job you've just got to swallow some shite from above.

[Dave]

I know, I was just implying that big spending doesn't necessarily bring success.

 

no one is even asking for "spending big" anymore ian, just some modest investment to try and improve us on the pitch and stop us standing still or going backwards

 

i've never had more faith in our scouting than i have at the moment but like everything with ashley it's always dysfunctional - should be an ashley meme:

 

"ASSEMBLE CRACK SCOUTING SQUAD, DON'T BUY ANY PLAYERS"

 

 

So true. We've got this amazing chief scout who the club love to praise at every turn, yet we seemingly aren't willing to back his judgement with transfer fees. What's the fucking point?

[AyeDubbleYoo]

Fair point, as I've said it's all about balance, and Ashley could be argued to have gone too far in his cutting of costs. The thing that helps me come to terms with it is that we still have managed to sign some exciting players and get some great results.

[AyeDubbleYoo]

I know, I was just implying that big spending doesn't necessarily bring success.

 

no one is even asking for "spending big" anymore ian, just some modest investment to try and improve us on the pitch and stop us standing still or going backwards

 

i've never had more faith in our scouting than i have at the moment but like everything with ashley it's always dysfunctional - should be an ashley meme:

 

"ASSEMBLE CRACK SCOUTING SQUAD, DON'T BUY ANY PLAYERS"

 

 

So true. We've got this amazing chief scout who the club love to praise at every turn, yet we seemingly aren't willing to back his judgement with transfer fees. What's the fucking point?

 

If he's recommending players that will cost a fortune, then he is wasting his time. I'm sure he knows the limits he's operating under.

[AyeDubbleYoo]

I like him. Pardew that is. Didn't think I would, but seems a canny enough bloke to me. Has to work under an interfering arsehole of a boss, but 90% of us have been there and managed to get on with it OK - sometimes if you value your job you've just got to swallow some shite from above.

 

I feel the same, don't understand why everyone hates him at all. He could resign in protest, but how would that help us? Any manager we have will have to work with Ashley and Derek.

[Ishmael]

Fair point, as I've said it's all about balance, and Ashley could be argued to have gone too far in his cutting of costs. The thing that helps me come to terms with it is that we still have managed to sign some exciting players and get some great results.

 

Nobody can say either way on here because nobody knows the real state of the clubs finances.

 

As for Dave's comment about not backing our scouts...  well, it reeks of a desperate plea rather than an actual discussion point.

[Dave]

More than £0 would be a start.

[Mick]

 

Nobody can say either way on here because nobody knows the real state of the clubs finances.

 

As for Dave's comment about not backing our scouts...  well, it reeks of a desperate plea rather than an actual discussion point.

 

We do know the real state of the clubs finances, almost breaking even plus 35 million, plus 4 million, plus 2 million, minus 4.5 million.

[Ishmael]

Nice one Mick

[AyeDubbleYoo]

 

Nobody can say either way on here because nobody knows the real state of the clubs finances.

 

As for Dave's comment about not backing our scouts...  well, it reeks of a desperate plea rather than an actual discussion point.

 

We do know the real state of the clubs finances, almost breaking even plus 35 million, plus 4 million, plus 2 million, minus 4.5 million.

 

And for the last 10 years? And our amount of debt?

[timnufc22]

I like him. Pardew that is. Didn't think I would, but seems a canny enough bloke to me. Has to work under an interfering arsehole of a boss, but 90% of us have been there and managed to get on with it OK - sometimes if you value your job you've just got to swallow some s**** from above.

 

I feel the same, don't understand why everyone hates him at all. He could resign in protest, but how would that help us? Any manager we have will have to work with Ashley and Derek.

 

Because some people think he has intetionally strung the fans along.

[Hughesy]

There isn't only one way to run a business.

 

But, cutting costs in one of the most important ways that a company losing money can reduce its losses and even make a profit.  In fact, it's probably the first thing that any purchaser of any business would do.

 

cheers Sherlock

 

there's cutting costs and cutting costs - you're so keen to compare football to other businesses would a manufacturing company cut costs by using inferior materials, machinery and people and expect their business to maintain itself or grow?  i f***ing doubt it

 

unless you have no choice, i.e. going bust is looming, you don't just butcher everything, cut every cost and stop investing in expanding your business, there has to be balance - presently we have no balance, it's all one way

 

ashley is not in that position, he's not short of money himself he's choosing to run the club this way

 

As Ian is saying - it is about getting the balance right.  I think Ashley should be spending some more money, but I can see the reasoning why he might not think it is prudent to do so.  Until anyone of us actually knows the exact financial state of NUFC, we are all guessing.

 

As for other businesses, if a manufacturing company saw that it was spending too much on its employees, materials etc, then of course it would cut its costs.  Why wouldn't it?  If it is making a loss, it would look to cut costs wherever it could.  I assume once the manufacturing company had stabilised itself, it would then reassess and work out if investment would increase profitability or how it would work.  My personal view is that NUFC are at this point or certainly close to it.

 

I don't see that Ashley's personal wealth comes into it though - unless I have misunderstood your point.  It isn't as if you buy a football club and are then duty bound to pump money into it.  Arguably he has already done that and has had enough.

[Mick]

 

And for the last 10 years? And our amount of debt?

 

From the horses mouth:

 

Mike Ashley has only ever put money into this football club. He has never taken a single penny out.

 

'And he won't take a single penny of this £35m either - all the money will go to the club and we are already working on identifying transfer targets for the summer.'

[Mick]

 

As Ian is saying - it is about getting the balance right.  I think Ashley should be spending some more money, but I can see the reasoning why he might not think it is prudent to do so.  Until anyone of us actually knows the exact financial state of NUFC, we are all guessing.

 

As for other businesses, if a manufacturing company saw that it was spending too much on its employees, materials etc, then of course it would cut its costs.  Why wouldn't it?  If it is making a loss, it would look to cut costs wherever it could.  I assume once the manufacturing company had stabilised itself, it would then reassess and work out if investment would increase profitability or how it would work.  My personal view is that NUFC are at this point or certainly close to it.

 

I don't see that Ashley's personal wealth comes into it though - unless I have misunderstood your point.  It isn't as if you buy a football club and are then duty bound to pump money into it.  Arguably he has already done that and has had enough.

 

A manufacturing company would go bust if it didn't have materials or the staff to produce the goods it sells

[Dave]

The lesser profile players I would suggest our chief scout has watched extensively and been backed over the acquisition of are Tiote, Cabaye, Abeid, Marveaux and Erdinc. So that would be a total of around £14m over two seasons, if we sign Erdinc; around half that if not. I would wager there was no chance we'd sign Cabaye if not for that contract clause, Abeid is a kid who was free anyway and Marveaux has had major injuries in the recent past. In the meantime, according to various sources we're enquiring about Peter Crouch and Jermain Defoe. Are we really so low on ideas? Isn't Carr's judgement trusted? Something just doesn't stack up IMO.

 

*awaits someone suggesting Hatem Ben Arfa was an unknown player before we signed him*

[dcmk]

Fair point, as I've said it's all about balance, and Ashley could be argued to have gone too far in his cutting of costs. The thing that helps me come to terms with it is that we still have managed to sign some exciting players and get some great results.

 

You don't seem to be at all bothered about what the management does to the club, the promises made to the fans or the players. 

 

When the manager of a club publicly announces that every penny of the Carroll money will be invested into the team, it's pretty common knowledge that it mean's any contract renewals, transfer and agent fees so to come out of this window with a smaller squad, and making a net gain is indefensible.  Why brazenly lie about it?  Why not explicitly tell the fans at the time it's intentions with the money instead of intentionally misleading? 

 

FWIW Ashley was loaning the club money interest fee, so has every intention of getting every penny back, so there is no point trying to make out he is Mr Charitable.

[Hughesy]

 

As Ian is saying - it is about getting the balance right.  I think Ashley should be spending some more money, but I can see the reasoning why he might not think it is prudent to do so.  Until anyone of us actually knows the exact financial state of NUFC, we are all guessing.

 

As for other businesses, if a manufacturing company saw that it was spending too much on its employees, materials etc, then of course it would cut its costs.  Why wouldn't it?  If it is making a loss, it would look to cut costs wherever it could.  I assume once the manufacturing company had stabilised itself, it would then reassess and work out if investment would increase profitability or how it would work.  My personal view is that NUFC are at this point or certainly close to it.

 

I don't see that Ashley's personal wealth comes into it though - unless I have misunderstood your point.  It isn't as if you buy a football club and are then duty bound to pump money into it.  Arguably he has already done that and has had enough.

 

A manufacturing company would go bust if it didn't have materials or the staff to produce the goods it sells

 

Sorry... did I say it wouldn't buy any materials?  Did I say it would sack all its staff?  Oh wait a second... I didn't.

[clintdempsey]

 

*awaits someone suggesting Hatem Ben Arfa was an unknown player before we signed him*

 

To world famous pundit AS9 he was.

[Ishmael]

I would like to assume that the Crouch and Defoe rumors were purely media creations.

 

Notice how they didn't last particularly long, whereas other targets have stuck around.

[timnufc22]

There isn't only one way to run a business.

 

But, cutting costs in one of the most important ways that a company losing money can reduce its losses and even make a profit.  In fact, it's probably the first thing that any purchaser of any business would do.

 

cheers Sherlock

 

there's cutting costs and cutting costs - you're so keen to compare football to other businesses would a manufacturing company cut costs by using inferior materials, machinery and people and expect their business to maintain itself or grow?  i f***ing doubt it

 

unless you have no choice, i.e. going bust is looming, you don't just butcher everything, cut every cost and stop investing in expanding your business, there has to be balance - presently we have no balance, it's all one way

 

ashley is not in that position, he's not short of money himself he's choosing to run the club this way

 

As Ian is saying - it is about getting the balance right.  I think Ashley should be spending some more money, but I can see the reasoning why he might not think it is prudent to do so.  Until anyone of us actually knows the exact financial state of NUFC, we are all guessing.

 

As for other businesses, if a manufacturing company saw that it was spending too much on its employees, materials etc, then of course it would cut its costs.  Why wouldn't it?  If it is making a loss, it would look to cut costs wherever it could.  I assume once the manufacturing company had stabilised itself, it would then reassess and work out if investment would increase profitability or how it would work.  My personal view is that NUFC are at this point or certainly close to it.

 

I don't see that Ashley's personal wealth comes into it though - unless I have misunderstood your point.  It isn't as if you buy a football club and are then duty bound to pump money into it.  Arguably he has already done that and has had enough.

 

He's duty bound to push the team forward, the main function of the 'company'. But it looks like he's happy to simply stay in the Premier League, with no interest in pushing further - that is not acceptable. IF we dont replace Barton and Enrique Im guessing with quality, and then some really, then it couldnt be more blatent.

[Hughesy]

The lesser profile players I would suggest our chief scout has watched extensively and been backed over the acquisition of are Tiote, Cabaye, Abeid and Erdinc. So that would be a total of around £14m over two seasons, if we sign Erdinc; around half that if not. I would wager there was no chance we'd sign Cabaye if not for that contract clause, and Abeid is a kid who was free anyway. In the meantime, according to various sources we're enquiring about Peter Crouch and Jermain Defoe. Are we really so low on ideas? Isn't Carr's judgement trusted? Something just doesn't stack up IMO.

 

*awaits someone suggesting Hatem Ben Arfa was an unknown player before we signed him*

 

I'd agree with this - in fact, I mentioned in another thread.  If striker search has gone:

 

Gameiro

Gervinho

Erdinc

Long

Crouch

Defoe

Beckford

 

over a course of 7-8 months, something doesn't quite add up.