Mole_Toonfan Posted April 21, 2013 Share Posted April 21, 2013 Ba has nothing to do with it. We were on something like 20 points from 20 games with him an ever-present. Honestly Ba is the case in in point of how we don't attack as a team properly.... First Ba was the only one getting in the box and now Cisse is the only one. Its absolutely horrendous and no surprise they are the only ones who score when no one else is allowed anywhere near the penalty area. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted April 21, 2013 Share Posted April 21, 2013 I hear what you are saying Dave, some of the tactics and formations this year have been frustrating. The set pieces are shocking, not being able to clear the first man in inexcusable and that free kick routine to Williamson was dog shit. Some of the team choices were a bit off for me as well, some of our players just look out of position at times. But no matter how frustrated I am there has been a fair bit has went against us this season. Our injury list is the worst in the league (arguably this could be down to coaching), we did have a few more games to play, Ba fucking off half way through the season didn't help, not strengthening in the summer was just plain daft (don't think this was Pardew's fault). All in all I think Pardew deserves another season. I just hope he learns a lot from the mistakes this season and we push on. That's fair enough, I was in the same boat until Sunderland which I felt was just unforgivable. An absolute shitload has gone wrong and not all of it can be laid at Pardew's door, even if the majority can IMO. If we are to continue with Pardew (and I've still no reason at all to believe this won't be the case) then some major investigations have to be carried out into just how badly this season has played out. The squad investment, injuries, playing style, subs, coaching. The lot needs looking at, because it ain't working. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Brendan_Rice Posted April 21, 2013 Share Posted April 21, 2013 Ba has nothing to do with it. We were on something like 20 points from 20 games with him an ever-present. I think he unsettled the team a bit with his transfer bullshit. I know if I was in a team with someone that didn't want to be there I would want him just to go. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted April 21, 2013 Share Posted April 21, 2013 http://i.imgur.com/UXSYMYb.png Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ponsaelius Posted April 21, 2013 Share Posted April 21, 2013 A lot of clubs use Europe as a positive - give some minnows a midweek kicking then send the players out full of confidence on Sunday - Bobby did it all the time, even Souness basically let that principle carry him in his first fifteen games. Not in Pardew's nature though - why get a confidence boosting win when you can grind out a draw against Maritimo? twice Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Brendan_Rice Posted April 21, 2013 Share Posted April 21, 2013 I hear what you are saying Dave, some of the tactics and formations this year have been frustrating. The set pieces are shocking, not being able to clear the first man in inexcusable and that free kick routine to Williamson was dog s***. Some of the team choices were a bit off for me as well, some of our players just look out of position at times. But no matter how frustrated I am there has been a fair bit has went against us this season. Our injury list is the worst in the league (arguably this could be down to coaching), we did have a few more games to play, Ba f***ing off half way through the season didn't help, not strengthening in the summer was just plain daft (don't think this was Pardew's fault). All in all I think Pardew deserves another season. I just hope he learns a lot from the mistakes this season and we push on. That's fair enough, I was in the same boat until Sunderland which I felt was just unforgivable. An absolute shitload has gone wrong and not all of it can be laid at Pardew's door, even if the majority can IMO. If we are to continue with Pardew (and I've still no reason at all to believe this won't be the case) then some major investigations have to be carried out into just how badly this season has played out. The squad investment, injuries, playing style, subs, coaching. The lot needs looking at, because it ain't working. Would agree with that, if we can't learn from all the mistakes we made this season then something is badly wrong. Hopefully the summer brings a few decent signings and a lot of preseason work with the team/formations etc. If we under perform next season, Pardew should resign. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mole_Toonfan Posted April 21, 2013 Share Posted April 21, 2013 http://i.imgur.com/UXSYMYb.png Someone should show that to Pardew Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deuce Posted April 21, 2013 Share Posted April 21, 2013 More European matches than any of the others. Vindication. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Brendan_Rice Posted April 21, 2013 Share Posted April 21, 2013 http://i.imgur.com/UXSYMYb.png Someone should show that to Pardew If anyone didn't realise that we have went backwards this season... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deuce Posted April 21, 2013 Share Posted April 21, 2013 Also, it's completely disgraceful that we've played a whopping total of 2 cup matches this season. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
littlelunchbox Posted April 21, 2013 Share Posted April 21, 2013 This thread continues to astound me, Till this day we still have turds coming on here preaching about "our fans rate our squad too highly" Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Brendan_Rice Posted April 21, 2013 Share Posted April 21, 2013 http://www.physioroom.com/news/english_premier_league/epl_injury_table.php We are top the league, say we are top the league Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gallowgate Toon Posted April 21, 2013 Share Posted April 21, 2013 My only hope under him is that he stumbles onto a formula that works again. For all the cries that we don't have an attacking game plan, I've been looking over THAT period of games and we were a very threatening side, we can evidently play good football with him as manager. It's interesting going back over those games and seeing so many differences in the team. Despite sending out some absolutely awful defences, we weren't cautious against West Brom, Liverpool or Stoke, which makes me wonder how we've gone from that mentality to this ultra defensive stuff. We sent out Ba, Cisse and HBA at West Brom for example, when we had a back 4 of Simpson, Williamson, Colo and Perch going from that, he obviously doesn't need his best defence to go for it. We looked a lot more balanced as a team then as well. For starters, our wingers were higher up and Cabaye was a little deeper than Sissoko is now. The difference in their styles when in that role is telling. Sissoko encourages individualism (he's not helped by having deeper wide men mind), Cabaye was more like a metronome, keeping possession and picking out intelligent passes etc. he was really making us tick and we moved forward as a team as a result. Jonas was brilliant too, he added something different in that midfield, the ability to create space by picking up the ball and running with it. He still wasn't particularly productive but he was so useful at making space. If you compare that to now, we've had Tiote, Cabaye, Anita and Perch playing in that area but all 4 have the same style, they can't dribble (I'm not sure Jonas can anymore either mind), we're so static and predictable as a consequence. The frustrating thing is, we've got the personnel to still play like that, yet we don't. Gouffran and Ba is a fairly like-for-like switch in that wide forward area, while I thought Jonas was great as a box-to-box midfielder I think Sissoko could do it even better and Debuchy is a massive improvement over Simpson. We've also added some pace at the back in MYM and even though HBA is out, Marveaux is a very good stand-in. Everything's there but he just doesn't seem to know how to get the balance right. I hope his mentality shifts with a clean slate and he stumbles onto the right formula next year, if we're not relegated of course. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
littlelunchbox Posted April 21, 2013 Share Posted April 21, 2013 http://www.physioroom.com/news/english_premier_league/epl_injury_table.php We are top the league, say we are top the league top of the league but with 3 players due back in 5 days apparently. great back to midtable mediocrity in 5 days. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mole_Toonfan Posted April 21, 2013 Share Posted April 21, 2013 My only hope under him is that he stumbles onto a formula that works again. For all the cries that we don't have an attacking game plan, I've been looking over THAT period of games and we were a very threatening side, we can evidently play good football with him as manager. It's interesting going back over those games and seeing so many differences in the team. Despite sending out some absolutely awful defences, we weren't cautious against West Brom, Liverpool or Stoke, which makes me wonder how we've gone from that mentality to this ultra defensive stuff. We sent out Ba, Cisse and HBA at West Brom for example, when we had a back 4 of Simpson, Williamson, Colo and Perch going from that, he obviously doesn't need his best defence to go for it. We looked a lot more balanced as a team then as well. For starters, our wingers were higher up and Cabaye was a little deeper than Sissoko is now. The difference in their styles when in that role is telling. Sissoko encourages individualism (he's not helped by having deeper wide men mind), Cabaye was more like a metronome, keeping possession and picking out intelligent passes etc. he was really making us tick and we moved forward as a team as a result. Jonas was brilliant too, he added something different in that midfield, the ability to create space by picking up the ball and running with it. He still wasn't particularly productive but he was so useful at making space. If you compare that to now, we've had Tiote, Cabaye, Anita and Perch playing in that area but all 4 have the same style, they can't dribble (I'm not sure Jonas can anymore either mind), we're so static and predictable as a consequence. The frustrating thing is, we've got the personnel to still play like that, yet we don't. Gouffran and Ba is a fairly like-for-like switch in that wide forward area, while I thought Jonas was great as a box-to-box midfielder I think Sissoko could do it even better and Debuchy is a massive improvement over Simpson. We've also added some pace at the back in MYM and even though HBA is out, Marveaux is a very good stand-in. Everything's there but he just doesn't seem to know how to get the balance right. I hope his mentality shifts with a clean slate and he stumbles onto the right formula next year, if we're not relegated of course. I wouldn't hold my breath sadly though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Brendan_Rice Posted April 21, 2013 Share Posted April 21, 2013 A little bit of panic sets in every time I see the league table Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted April 21, 2013 Share Posted April 21, 2013 Aye, I gave up on the return to 4-3-3 a good while ago despite all the good points you raise GT. We're more equipped for it now than we were then and Cabaye in particular thrived in that system. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
littlelunchbox Posted April 21, 2013 Share Posted April 21, 2013 A little bit of panic sets in every time I see the league table a little bit of "i dont give a f*** anymore every time i see our team" Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted April 21, 2013 Share Posted April 21, 2013 A little bit of Sandra in the sun. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
littlelunchbox Posted April 21, 2013 Share Posted April 21, 2013 Aye, I gave up on the return to 4-3-3 a good while ago despite all the good points you raise GT. We're more equipped for it now than we were then and Cabaye in particular thrived in that system. still find it surprising that people think a formation is going to change the ability of a manager. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deuce Posted April 21, 2013 Share Posted April 21, 2013 A little bit of Sandra in the sun. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Posted April 21, 2013 Share Posted April 21, 2013 I hear what you are saying Dave, some of the tactics and formations this year have been frustrating. The set pieces are shocking, not being able to clear the first man in inexcusable and that free kick routine to Williamson was dog s***. Some of the team choices were a bit off for me as well, some of our players just look out of position at times. But no matter how frustrated I am there has been a fair bit has went against us this season. Our injury list is the worst in the league (arguably this could be down to coaching), we did have a few more games to play, Ba f***ing off half way through the season didn't help, not strengthening in the summer was just plain daft (don't think this was Pardew's fault). All in all I think Pardew deserves another season. I just hope he learns a lot from the mistakes this season and we push on. Have a look at the teams we've been able to put out against the lesser teams who have either drawn with or beaten us and come back and blame injuries. Pardew doesn't deserve another season at all, that's madness, it's almost like wishing you had a heart attack. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pilko Posted April 21, 2013 Share Posted April 21, 2013 A little bit of Sandra in the sun. Maybe if they stick Sandra in the sun she'll start to melt after a while and then she'll look a bit like her fella. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mole_Toonfan Posted April 21, 2013 Share Posted April 21, 2013 Aye, I gave up on the return to 4-3-3 a good while ago despite all the good points you raise GT. We're more equipped for it now than we were then and Cabaye in particular thrived in that system. still find it surprising that people think a formation is going to change the ability of a manager. Nope not at all, it just frustrates me that we have performed under him before and we are probably more suited to it now than we ever have been but yet we will probably never see anything even close to it again. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted April 21, 2013 Share Posted April 21, 2013 Aye, I gave up on the return to 4-3-3 a good while ago despite all the good points you raise GT. We're more equipped for it now than we were then and Cabaye in particular thrived in that system. still find it surprising that people think a formation is going to change the ability of a manager. He's certainly not going anywhere in the immediate future so maybe it's just people hoping to make the best of a bad situation? As Gallowgate Toon pointed out, in the system we played last season with a weaker set of components we played some attractive football and attained some very good results. Cabaye, Cisse and Ben Arfa looked fantastic in particular. Of course it's not the magic formula, but it might help to have people playing in their correct roles and by balancing the shape of the team out a little bit better? Of course if he did actually change back to that approach/formation then he wouldn't be viewed in such a negative manner, I'd assume, as at least he'd be trying something logical for once. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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