The thread about how we should play

[duo]

Ba and Cisse looked lost in 442 - seem to be v.similar players fighting for the same type of balls.

[Deuce]

Ba and Cisse looked lost in 442 - seem to be v.similar players fighting for the same type of balls.

 

They looked to be occupying the same area for much of the game.

[Parky]

It's the equivalent of ManC starting with 2 Dzeko's who stand near each other and go for the same balls.

[mikejaxer]

Sell Ba and replace him for a winger who can play in a 433 that doesn't sulk while doing it.

[johnnypd]

Sell Ba and replace him for a winger who can play in a 433 that doesn't sulk while doing it.

 

or buy a winger who can play in a 4-3-3 and tell all our forwards that they are competing for a place, ba vs new player, ba vs cisse etc. would be nice to have that sort of depth.

 

If Malaga are still having troubles in january then Isco would fit into a front 3 pretty well, and even challenge Cabaye for a role at the head of the midfield.

[Mick]

I used to love 4-4-2 when we had the players to make the system work, now though it's a burden.  We don't have the players to make 4-4-2 work on a regular basis.  It's bad enough when we go up against another team playing that system but when we go in with 4-4-2 against a 5 man midfield we're losing too much possession and games can go away from us from the off.

 

We should start games with a 5 man midfield and try to control games from the off.  Controlling midfield would make it much easier to go looking for goals rather than being on the back foot from the off.

 

[Ryan_Taylor]

Sell Ba and replace him for a winger who can play in a 433 that doesn't sulk while doing it.

 

or buy a winger who can play in a 4-3-3 and tell all our forwards that they are competing for a place, ba vs new player, ba vs cisse etc. would be nice to have that sort of depth.

 

If Malaga are still having troubles in january then Isco would fit into a front 3 pretty well, and even challenge Cabaye for a role at the head of the midfield.

 

Marveaux?

[johnnypd]

Sell Ba and replace him for a winger who can play in a 433 that doesn't sulk while doing it.

 

or buy a winger who can play in a 4-3-3 and tell all our forwards that they are competing for a place, ba vs new player, ba vs cisse etc. would be nice to have that sort of depth.

 

If Malaga are still having troubles in january then Isco would fit into a front 3 pretty well, and even challenge Cabaye for a role at the head of the midfield.

 

Marveaux?

 

Would be great. Not sure he has that extra bit of explosiveness needed for a front-three role currently, but he might regain it if he stays fit.

[Mole_Toonfan]

Would love to see a explosive winger in the Ben Arfa mould to play on the left and have Ba and Cisse rotate for the CF spot.

 

Would never happen, but a lad can dream 

[Guest n4e]

I really think we missed a trick with Mirallas. Everton got him at a good price and he's capable of playing through the middle and out wide. I'm really not sure about the suggestion of Marveux as part of a front three, I think from what we have  Ba-Cisse-Ben Arfa is still the best to go with.

[cubaricho]

I really think we missed a trick with Mirallas. Everton got him at a good price and he's capable of playing through the middle and out wide. I'm really not sure about the suggestion of Marveux as part of a front three, I think from what we have  Ba-Cisse-Ben Arfa is still the best to go with.

 

I like having the "natural goal scorer" of Ba on the park but I think Marveuax would just work better in a system like that.

[Dyeyzzon]

Please just put Ba at LW or use one of them for Europe and another for the league please.

[Ikon]

Having another CM there in a more advanced position automatically pulls away one of the oppositions central midfielders to a more withdrawn position, that results in our midfield getting more space and time on the ball cause we don't get pressured nearly as much.

 

As almost every other team play with more men in midfield than us in a 4-4-2 they can easily press us and crowd us out

so that our own cm's are forced to go deep to find space and receive the ball.

 

It's the same when not in possession, our central midfielders will have to defend deep for being one player short, and that naturally brings our wingers in to the same deep line, if they don't do that it very easily becomes 5 vs our 2 cm's and we get overrun in the most important area of the pitch.

 

And if we win the ball we'll have 4 players way too deep in the same line across the pitch and a space far too big between our midfield and strikers.

 

 

This is my view of the 4-4-2 VS  the 4-3-3/4-2-3-1 that the opposition often if not always play.

 

 

 

 

 

I might be dumb.   

[Guest palnese]

We play more of a 4-4-1-1 than a flat 4-4-2. Ba is always dropping deep.

[Flip]

Krul

Simpson Sayls Colo Santon

          Tiote  Jonas

              Anita

Benny  Cisse  Ba

 

Give Anita all the freedom in the world, let Tiote and Jonas start up play from the back. I feel Anita could play well in that role, he seems to have the speed and creativity, he just needs to find time on the ball right now which he will with Bigi and Tiote there protecting him.

 

Cisse has to play centrally and give Ba some freedom with Santon overlapping on the left. We are set for some good results if Pardew can just play the way we did last season at the end there. 

[Kanj]

I'd like to see Anita take Jonas spot in your team and I'd like to see Marv play in the Cabaye role if I'm honest. But I like your team none-the-less.

[Cronky]

With 4-3-3, you have to make sure that the main striker isn't isolated, and that your goals can come from a number of sources. So I think it's best that at least one of your more withdrawn / wider players is a striker that can operate in that area, rather than just have midfielders who like to get forward.

 

Hoilett or Moses would have been good choices, and I'm not sure who would be a) good and b) available in January. The nearest equivelent we have at the moment is Sammy, who ideally we would be using more sparingly.

[ujpest doza]

Fantasy Football Show last night on Sky.

 

Julian Dicks was asked what system his team would play.

 

Instant response,"Doesn't matter, systems don't win football matches, players do!"

 

[Ikon]

What a shit response!

[ATB]

I just can´t for my life believe how so many managers at this high level seems to think that, especially in England. No wounder the national team constantly fails.

[madras]

For fucks sake, this has now gone too far, it's very champ manageresque.

 

if we play the fabled 4-3-3 and ben arfa is given license to roam and drops a little deeper, hey presto we've got a 4-4-2 or a 4-3-1-2, if santon attacks down the left have we gone to a 3 man back line ?. julian dicks as described above was basically right. it doen't matter what the system or formation if there is no movement or awareness hence it's players that win games. it's probably this over reliance on formations etc that is negating the movement and making us so rigid.

 

i'd rather, even with the personnel we have, play a mobile type of 4-4-2 that a rigid 4-3-3.

[Ikon]

Regarding the point you made about Ben Arfa, say that we're not in possession and we already have three midfielders in that area of the pitch, that makes it less likely for Ben Arfa to be forced to drop as deep and as often as he would have to in a 4-4-2, it's not rocket science.

[Guest icemanblue]

For fucks sake, this has now gone too far, it's very champ manageresque.

 

if we play the fabled 4-3-3 and ben arfa is given license to roam and drops a little deeper, hey presto we've got a 4-4-2 or a 4-3-1-2, if santon attacks down the left have we gone to a 3 man back line ?. julian dicks as described above was basically right. it doen't matter what the system or formation if there is no movement or awareness hence it's players that win games. it's probably this over reliance on formations etc that is negating the movement and making us so rigid.

 

i'd rather, even with the personnel we have, play a mobile type of 4-4-2 that a rigid 4-3-3.

 

Amen.

[Elliottman]

JONAS GUTIERREZ believes that too much has been made of Newcastle United’s formation this season.

 

And that his team-mates are working around the clock to ensure their losing slump comes to an end.

 

The United stars were back to the drawing board at the club’s Benton base for a double weekend session as they look to see off Wigan Athletic on Monday night.

 

A defeat against the Latics would set a new record for Newcastle who have never lost five Premier League games on the spin in their history.

 

Many United fans prefer the 4-3-3 formation but Jonas feels that life in the top flight is very much a case of “horses for courses” – and flexible Newcastle have got to choose their tactics accordingly. Jonas told the Chronicle: “We have different type of formations – we can play 4-3-3, 4-4-2 and 4-2-3-1.

 

“I think we different types of players.

 

“And so that gives the manager different options and different formations.”

 

United lined up with a 4-4-2 formation against Stoke City on Wednesday night but it did not end their cold streak and they have now lost four successive matches for the first time since 2008 – the season they were relegated.

 

And despite calls for a return to 4-3-3 from fans, versatile Gutierrez – who has played out wide and in the centre of midfield this season – thinks that the Premier League is too complex to stick with one formation or one set of stock tactics.

 

The former Real Mallorca winger said: “It depends on the game and the teams that we play against.

 

“What is more important is the players that play in these positions try to do their best and try to give 100 per cent.”

 

Jonas and his team-mates will face a Wigan on Monday without a host of first-team regulars.

 

Hatem Ben Arfa (pictuerd right) is also unlikely to be fit in time for the clash with Roberto Martinez’s troops.

 

 

[timnufc22]

JONAS GUTIERREZ believes that too much has been made of Newcastle United’s formation this season.

 

And that his team-mates are working around the clock to ensure their losing slump comes to an end.

 

The United stars were back to the drawing board at the club’s Benton base for a double weekend session as they look to see off Wigan Athletic on Monday night.

 

A defeat against the Latics would set a new record for Newcastle who have never lost five Premier League games on the spin in their history.

 

Many United fans prefer the 4-3-3 formation but Jonas feels that life in the top flight is very much a case of “horses for courses” – and flexible Newcastle have got to choose their tactics accordingly. Jonas told the Chronicle: “We have different type of formations – we can play 4-3-3, 4-4-2 and 4-2-3-1.

 

“I think we different types of players.

 

“And so that gives the manager different options and different formations.”

 

United lined up with a 4-4-2 formation against Stoke City on Wednesday night but it did not end their cold streak and they have now lost four successive matches for the first time since 2008 – the season they were relegated.

 

And despite calls for a return to 4-3-3 from fans, versatile Gutierrez – who has played out wide and in the centre of midfield this season – thinks that the Premier League is too complex to stick with one formation or one set of stock tactics.

The former Real Mallorca winger said: “It depends on the game and the teams that we play against.

 

“What is more important is the players that play in these positions try to do their best and try to give 100 per cent.”

 

Jonas and his team-mates will face a Wigan on Monday without a host of first-team regulars.

 

Hatem Ben Arfa (pictuerd right) is also unlikely to be fit in time for the clash with Roberto Martinez’s troops.

 

 

 

But thats what he have done all season with the long ball 4-4-2 (straight off the back of the 4-3-3 winning run last season too)! Hence the outcry! And who wants to see Ben Arfa picking the ball up in his own half all the time?? Its not some complicated agenda, its just common sense, and if Pardew isnt bothered Ben Arfa is having to play so deep then most people are very suprised at that.