Kanj Posted October 1, 2013 Share Posted October 1, 2013 a lot of the goals we concede appear to be down to this, How many times have people slagged off various players already? Debuchy, Santon, Colo and & Mbiwa last night. We must have some of the most error prone defenders in the league. It makes you wonder how those "error prone" defenders have all been capped at various levels. Or won league titles, or played in the champions league, or world cup/euros Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
r0cafella Posted October 1, 2013 Share Posted October 1, 2013 Exactly, I'm sorry but when everyone in the side is making individual errors I think it's time to look at the bigger picture. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unbelievable Posted October 1, 2013 Share Posted October 1, 2013 We can talk until the cows come home about organisation, Pardew, pressing, defending as a team, etc, but it doesn't detract from the fact that the primary reason the contest was over before it had eveb begun was individual mistakes by four of our back five. Which happen week in and week out... No they don't. a lot of the goals we concede appear to be down to this, How many times have people slagged off various players already? Debuchy, Santon, Colo and & Mbiwa last night. We must have some of the most error prone defenders in the league. Well, there wouldn't be many mistakes in football if players didn't make mistakes. Our players aren't perfect, they make mistakes, as does every other defender. When they do, they deserve criticism, and when it happens often, they need dropping or replacing. I'm not denying defensive organisation is part of the problem (our high number of goals conceeded since the start of last season), but there's more to it than that, such as seasoned professionals not even challenging for a bouncing goal kick.. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
r0cafella Posted October 1, 2013 Share Posted October 1, 2013 We can talk until the cows come home about organisation, Pardew, pressing, defending as a team, etc, but it doesn't detract from the fact that the primary reason the contest was over before it had eveb begun was individual mistakes by four of our back five. Which happen week in and week out... No they don't. a lot of the goals we concede appear to be down to this, How many times have people slagged off various players already? Debuchy, Santon, Colo and & Mbiwa last night. We must have some of the most error prone defenders in the league. Well, there wouldn't be many mistakes in football if players didn't make mistakes. Our players aren't perfect, they make mistakes, as does every other defender. When they do, they deserve criticism, and when it happens often, they need dropping or replacing. I'm not denying defensive organisation is part of the problem (our high number of goals conceeded since the start of last season), but there's more to it than that, such as seasoned professionals not even challenging for a bouncing goal kick.. It appears their is a lack of ownership being taken by everyone in the team. But Pardew is the one selecting the players, he's the one coaching them day in and day out. No one should have a clearer idea of who is good at what. Every single player we've bought has regressed under him. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unbelievable Posted October 1, 2013 Share Posted October 1, 2013 Another part of the problem is simply this: Carr and Pardew had identified and agreed on a target who would have been able to deal with your Benteke's or Lukaku's. Llambiass all but got the deal done, for nowt, until Kinnear came in and decided he knew better. He didn't. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unbelievable Posted October 1, 2013 Share Posted October 1, 2013 We can talk until the cows come home about organisation, Pardew, pressing, defending as a team, etc, but it doesn't detract from the fact that the primary reason the contest was over before it had eveb begun was individual mistakes by four of our back five. Which happen week in and week out... No they don't. a lot of the goals we concede appear to be down to this, How many times have people slagged off various players already? Debuchy, Santon, Colo and & Mbiwa last night. We must have some of the most error prone defenders in the league. Well, there wouldn't be many mistakes in football if players didn't make mistakes. Our players aren't perfect, they make mistakes, as does every other defender. When they do, they deserve criticism, and when it happens often, they need dropping or replacing. I'm not denying defensive organisation is part of the problem (our high number of goals conceeded since the start of last season), but there's more to it than that, such as seasoned professionals not even challenging for a bouncing goal kick.. It appears their is a lack of ownership being taken by everyone in the team. But Pardew is the one selecting the players, he's the one coaching them day in and day out. No one should have a clearer idea of who is good at what. Every single player we've bought has regressed under him. Pardew must go, I don't need convincing about that. It just bugs me people will blindly point at him and let Colo off the hook for schoolboy errors the latter (and others) made.. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
r0cafella Posted October 1, 2013 Share Posted October 1, 2013 We can talk until the cows come home about organisation, Pardew, pressing, defending as a team, etc, but it doesn't detract from the fact that the primary reason the contest was over before it had eveb begun was individual mistakes by four of our back five. Which happen week in and week out... No they don't. a lot of the goals we concede appear to be down to this, How many times have people slagged off various players already? Debuchy, Santon, Colo and & Mbiwa last night. We must have some of the most error prone defenders in the league. Well, there wouldn't be many mistakes in football if players didn't make mistakes. Our players aren't perfect, they make mistakes, as does every other defender. When they do, they deserve criticism, and when it happens often, they need dropping or replacing. I'm not denying defensive organisation is part of the problem (our high number of goals conceeded since the start of last season), but there's more to it than that, such as seasoned professionals not even challenging for a bouncing goal kick.. It appears their is a lack of ownership being taken by everyone in the team. But Pardew is the one selecting the players, he's the one coaching them day in and day out. No one should have a clearer idea of who is good at what. Every single player we've bought has regressed under him. Pardew must go, I don't need convincing about that. It just bugs me people will blindly point at him and let Colo off the hook for schoolboy errors the latter (and others) made.. I'm not letting anyone off personally. But I will reserve judgement on our entire squad until I see then play under a manager of some ability. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wullie Posted October 1, 2013 Share Posted October 1, 2013 We can talk until the cows come home about organisation, Pardew, pressing, defending as a team, etc, but it doesn't detract from the fact that the primary reason the contest was over before it had eveb begun was individual mistakes by four of our back five. Which happen week in and week out... No they don't. a lot of the goals we concede appear to be down to this, How many times have people slagged off various players already? Debuchy, Santon, Colo and & Mbiwa last night. We must have some of the most error prone defenders in the league. Well, there wouldn't be many mistakes in football if players didn't make mistakes. Our players aren't perfect, they make mistakes, as does every other defender. When they do, they deserve criticism, and when it happens often, they need dropping or replacing. I'm not denying defensive organisation is part of the problem (our high number of goals conceeded since the start of last season), but there's more to it than that, such as seasoned professionals not even challenging for a bouncing goal kick.. It appears their is a lack of ownership being taken by everyone in the team. But Pardew is the one selecting the players, he's the one coaching them day in and day out. No one should have a clearer idea of who is good at what. Every single player we've bought has regressed under him. Pardew must go, I don't need convincing about that. It just bugs me people will blindly point at him and let Colo off the hook for schoolboy errors the latter (and others) made.. But there's no solution to that other than getting shot of the manager is there? Yes we can buy four centre halves in January, two new full backs, along with a new midfield and three new forward players (arf!) but is anyone convinced that would solve the problem? I'd put heavy wedge on the new players making exactly the same cock-ups a year down the line. Sick of reading the same constant cycle of criticism, which comes up with the valuable insight that all the players in the entire squad are shit (apart from the one who's only been here a month, funny that) and that what we really need in the team right now is the ones who've been out of the team for a while because I've forgotten how shit they are. I don't think it really needs pointing out that the players individually and as a team have been dreadful for over a year. Pointing out individual errors isn't going to solve the problem, and going off the evidence of last January, nor is replacing the players. So what's the solution? There's only one. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tooj Posted October 1, 2013 Share Posted October 1, 2013 Another part of the problem is simply this: Carr and Pardew had identified and agreed on a target who would have been able to deal with your Benteke's or Lukaku's. Llambiass all but got the deal done, for nowt, until Kinnear came in and decided he knew better. He didn't. Yanga-Mbiwa and Colo dealt with Benteke very well though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
r0cafella Posted October 1, 2013 Share Posted October 1, 2013 We can talk until the cows come home about organisation, Pardew, pressing, defending as a team, etc, but it doesn't detract from the fact that the primary reason the contest was over before it had eveb begun was individual mistakes by four of our back five. Which happen week in and week out... No they don't. a lot of the goals we concede appear to be down to this, How many times have people slagged off various players already? Debuchy, Santon, Colo and & Mbiwa last night. We must have some of the most error prone defenders in the league. Well, there wouldn't be many mistakes in football if players didn't make mistakes. Our players aren't perfect, they make mistakes, as does every other defender. When they do, they deserve criticism, and when it happens often, they need dropping or replacing. I'm not denying defensive organisation is part of the problem (our high number of goals conceeded since the start of last season), but there's more to it than that, such as seasoned professionals not even challenging for a bouncing goal kick.. It appears their is a lack of ownership being taken by everyone in the team. But Pardew is the one selecting the players, he's the one coaching them day in and day out. No one should have a clearer idea of who is good at what. Every single player we've bought has regressed under him. Pardew must go, I don't need convincing about that. It just bugs me people will blindly point at him and let Colo off the hook for schoolboy errors the latter (and others) made.. But there's no solution to that other than getting shot of the manager is there? Yes we can buy four centre halves in January, two new full backs, along with a new midfield and three new forward players (arf!) but is anyone convinced that would solve the problem? I'd put heavy wedge on the new players making exactly the same cock-ups a year down the line. Sick of reading the same constant cycle of criticism, which comes up with the valuable insight that all the players in the entire squad are s*** (apart from the one who's only been here a month, funny that) and that what we really need in the team right now is the ones who've been out of the team for a while because I've forgotten how s*** they are. I don't think it really needs pointing out that the players individually and as a team have been dreadful for over a year. Pointing out individual errors isn't going to solve the problem, and going off the evidence of last January, nor is replacing the players. So what's the solution? There's only one. Rounds of applause. This is spot on. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted October 1, 2013 Share Posted October 1, 2013 our defenders could start by learning the basics of defending the kind of thing they should already know and not s*** their pants at the sight of Lukaku and it would have been a decent start. They know the basics. Do they? For each goal I wonder what MYM was thinking when a) doesn't go to close down b) loses the ball under no pressure c) runs away from danger. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted October 1, 2013 Share Posted October 1, 2013 We can talk until the cows come home about organisation, Pardew, pressing, defending as a team, etc, but it doesn't detract from the fact that the primary reason the contest was over before it had even begun was individual mistakes by four of our back five. True. Although with Santon always being so far up the pitch - it's a recurring positional problem. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronaldo Posted October 1, 2013 Share Posted October 1, 2013 Another part of the problem is simply this: Carr and Pardew had identified and agreed on a target who would have been able to deal with your Benteke's or Lukaku's. Llambiass all but got the deal done, for nowt, until Kinnear came in and decided he knew better. He didn't. Yanga-Mbiwa and Colo dealt with Benteke very well though. Shame neither of them could mark him when he scored. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted October 1, 2013 Share Posted October 1, 2013 Another part of the problem is simply this: Carr and Pardew had identified and agreed on a target who would have been able to deal with your Benteke's or Lukaku's. Llambiass all but got the deal done, for nowt, until Kinnear came in and decided he knew better. He didn't. Yanga-Mbiwa and Colo dealt with Benteke very well though. Shame neither of them could mark him when he scored. At the time people didn't understand how pathetic this was. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest palnese Posted October 1, 2013 Share Posted October 1, 2013 Another part of the problem is simply this: Carr and Pardew had identified and agreed on a target who would have been able to deal with your Benteke's or Lukaku's. Llambiass all but got the deal done, for nowt, until Kinnear came in and decided he knew better. He didn't. Yanga-Mbiwa and Colo dealt with Benteke very well though. Shame neither of them could mark him when he scored. That was Sissoko's job though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronaldo Posted October 1, 2013 Share Posted October 1, 2013 Exactly. It shouldn't be the job of a young CM new to the PL who can't defend to mark the most dangerous player on the pitch. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unbelievable Posted October 1, 2013 Share Posted October 1, 2013 We can talk until the cows come home about organisation, Pardew, pressing, defending as a team, etc, but it doesn't detract from the fact that the primary reason the contest was over before it had eveb begun was individual mistakes by four of our back five. Which happen week in and week out... No they don't. a lot of the goals we concede appear to be down to this, How many times have people slagged off various players already? Debuchy, Santon, Colo and & Mbiwa last night. We must have some of the most error prone defenders in the league. Well, there wouldn't be many mistakes in football if players didn't make mistakes. Our players aren't perfect, they make mistakes, as does every other defender. When they do, they deserve criticism, and when it happens often, they need dropping or replacing. I'm not denying defensive organisation is part of the problem (our high number of goals conceeded since the start of last season), but there's more to it than that, such as seasoned professionals not even challenging for a bouncing goal kick.. It appears their is a lack of ownership being taken by everyone in the team. But Pardew is the one selecting the players, he's the one coaching them day in and day out. No one should have a clearer idea of who is good at what. Every single player we've bought has regressed under him. Pardew must go, I don't need convincing about that. It just bugs me people will blindly point at him and let Colo off the hook for schoolboy errors the latter (and others) made.. But there's no solution to that other than getting shot of the manager is there? Yes we can buy four centre halves in January, two new full backs, along with a new midfield and three new forward players (arf!) but is anyone convinced that would solve the problem? I'd put heavy wedge on the new players making exactly the same cock-ups a year down the line. Sick of reading the same constant cycle of criticism, which comes up with the valuable insight that all the players in the entire squad are s*** (apart from the one who's only been here a month, funny that) and that what we really need in the team right now is the ones who've been out of the team for a while because I've forgotten how s*** they are. I don't think it really needs pointing out that the players individually and as a team have been dreadful for over a year. Pointing out individual errors isn't going to solve the problem, and going off the evidence of last January, nor is replacing the players. So what's the solution? There's only one. I don't disagree in the slightest. In the meantime, huge individual errors leading to opposition goals are deserving of criticism post match, just like they always are. If people can't deal with that, I'd suggest they stay in the Pardew thread, which coincidentally I'm trying to avoid as it's the type of threadmill "debate" I can't stand to read on a daily basis. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
midds Posted October 1, 2013 Share Posted October 1, 2013 We can talk until the cows come home about organisation, Pardew, pressing, defending as a team, etc, but it doesn't detract from the fact that the primary reason the contest was over before it had eveb begun was individual mistakes by four of our back five. Which happen week in and week out... No they don't. a lot of the goals we concede appear to be down to this, How many times have people slagged off various players already? Debuchy, Santon, Colo and & Mbiwa last night. We must have some of the most error prone defenders in the league. Well, there wouldn't be many mistakes in football if players didn't make mistakes. Our players aren't perfect, they make mistakes, as does every other defender. When they do, they deserve criticism, and when it happens often, they need dropping or replacing. I'm not denying defensive organisation is part of the problem (our high number of goals conceeded since the start of last season), but there's more to it than that, such as seasoned professionals not even challenging for a bouncing goal kick.. It appears their is a lack of ownership being taken by everyone in the team. But Pardew is the one selecting the players, he's the one coaching them day in and day out. No one should have a clearer idea of who is good at what. Every single player we've bought has regressed under him. Pardew must go, I don't need convincing about that. It just bugs me people will blindly point at him and let Colo off the hook for schoolboy errors the latter (and others) made.. But there's no solution to that other than getting shot of the manager is there? Yes we can buy four centre halves in January, two new full backs, along with a new midfield and three new forward players (arf!) but is anyone convinced that would solve the problem? I'd put heavy wedge on the new players making exactly the same cock-ups a year down the line. Sick of reading the same constant cycle of criticism, which comes up with the valuable insight that all the players in the entire squad are shit (apart from the one who's only been here a month, funny that) and that what we really need in the team right now is the ones who've been out of the team for a while because I've forgotten how shit they are. I don't think it really needs pointing out that the players individually and as a team have been dreadful for over a year. Pointing out individual errors isn't going to solve the problem, and going off the evidence of last January, nor is replacing the players. So what's the solution? There's only one. This needs to be fucking framed. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wullie Posted October 1, 2013 Share Posted October 1, 2013 We can talk until the cows come home about organisation, Pardew, pressing, defending as a team, etc, but it doesn't detract from the fact that the primary reason the contest was over before it had eveb begun was individual mistakes by four of our back five. Which happen week in and week out... No they don't. a lot of the goals we concede appear to be down to this, How many times have people slagged off various players already? Debuchy, Santon, Colo and & Mbiwa last night. We must have some of the most error prone defenders in the league. Well, there wouldn't be many mistakes in football if players didn't make mistakes. Our players aren't perfect, they make mistakes, as does every other defender. When they do, they deserve criticism, and when it happens often, they need dropping or replacing. I'm not denying defensive organisation is part of the problem (our high number of goals conceeded since the start of last season), but there's more to it than that, such as seasoned professionals not even challenging for a bouncing goal kick.. It appears their is a lack of ownership being taken by everyone in the team. But Pardew is the one selecting the players, he's the one coaching them day in and day out. No one should have a clearer idea of who is good at what. Every single player we've bought has regressed under him. Pardew must go, I don't need convincing about that. It just bugs me people will blindly point at him and let Colo off the hook for schoolboy errors the latter (and others) made.. But there's no solution to that other than getting shot of the manager is there? Yes we can buy four centre halves in January, two new full backs, along with a new midfield and three new forward players (arf!) but is anyone convinced that would solve the problem? I'd put heavy wedge on the new players making exactly the same cock-ups a year down the line. Sick of reading the same constant cycle of criticism, which comes up with the valuable insight that all the players in the entire squad are s*** (apart from the one who's only been here a month, funny that) and that what we really need in the team right now is the ones who've been out of the team for a while because I've forgotten how s*** they are. I don't think it really needs pointing out that the players individually and as a team have been dreadful for over a year. Pointing out individual errors isn't going to solve the problem, and going off the evidence of last January, nor is replacing the players. So what's the solution? There's only one. I don't disagree in the slightest. In the meantime, huge individual errors leading to opposition goals are deserving of criticism post match, just like they always are. If people can't deal with that, I'd suggest they stay in the Pardew thread, which coincidentally I'm trying to avoid as it's the type of threadmill "debate" I can't stand to read on a daily basis. I doubt there's anybody that can't deal with it but what's the point? "Player A was absolutely shit tonight! He needs dropping immediately!" *dropped* "Replacement X was absolutely shit tonight! We need to buy a new player immediately!" *three months later* "Transfer B was absolutely shit tonight! What we need is to go back to basics - Player A back immediately!" The problem isn't going to improve until the underlying problem is removed. You think bumping the Pardew thread is dull - personally I think bumping the threads of 7 or 8 individual players after each and every game and moaning about how shit they all are (and wondering about what a massive coincidence it is that Newcastle have signed loads of players with excellent pedigree, international caps and European league titles that have turned out to be worse than Mike Williamson) is infinitely more pointless. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest palnese Posted October 1, 2013 Share Posted October 1, 2013 Exactly. It shouldn't be the job of a young CM new to the PL who can't defend to mark the most dangerous player on the pitch. Oh. Got it. I agree. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kanj Posted October 1, 2013 Share Posted October 1, 2013 The Mapou thread has turned into the state of our defense thread.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sifu Posted October 1, 2013 Share Posted October 1, 2013 So I suppose people have calmed down now? Can't believe that some people are willing to write Yanga-Mbiwa off right here, right now. He was atrocious yesterday evening, granted but the knee-jerk reaction is embarrassing imho. Aye, let's write off all players and don't give them a chance to settle. It was a horror show all round from our defence. Bring back Williamson you say? (He did look decent enough when he came on mind) - the man who people were glad to see the back of from the team last season? People just need to find a scapegoat it seems. I, for one, am not writing Yanga-Mbiwa off and I would be more than happy to see him start on Saturday. Now comes for him to show some mental strength. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronaldo Posted October 1, 2013 Share Posted October 1, 2013 Who's written him off apart from Crumpy? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Posted October 1, 2013 Share Posted October 1, 2013 The Mapou thread has turned into the state of our defense thread.... Defence. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted October 1, 2013 Share Posted October 1, 2013 The Mapou thread has turned into the state of our defense thread.... Defence. Defenz. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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