Guest neesy111 Posted September 23, 2013 Share Posted September 23, 2013 Our defending hasn't improved on last season imo. Still leaking goals at a good rate. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrettNUFC Posted September 23, 2013 Share Posted September 23, 2013 Debuchy nowhere to be seen for the first, Colo nowhere to be seen for the second, HBA inability to defend for the third, individual errors cost us goals but Pardew still needs to take responsibility for the fact we lacked any sort cohesion in our play, how we failed to produce any sort of comeback when behind, he had perfect start, he was leading at half time, yet we still couldn't get 3 points. Players were to blame and Pardew needs to take the responsibility as manager to why these players underperformed on the day. Was painful to watch Ben Arfa on Saturday, just wasn't the same feeling you usually get with him. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted September 23, 2013 Share Posted September 23, 2013 I think we are just fragile mentally and in terms of confidence, when we start making mistakes and concede we don't really believe in ourselves enough to keep playing through it. Whether that's entirely Pardew's fault I don't know, it's certainly a feeling that he has allowed to develop. I do think we are showing signs of trying to play the right way, the question is why we don't stick to it when things go wrong. (Hull also worked extremely hard to close every one of our attackers down) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Face Posted September 23, 2013 Share Posted September 23, 2013 Yep, all stemming from a culture of fear. That's why we never stuff sides. We're full of inhibition. We had Gouffran, Remy, Cisse & Ben Arfa on the pitch together. Negative Bastard. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest reefatoon Posted September 23, 2013 Share Posted September 23, 2013 Panic sets in and then we try to hold on to a tiny lead. We can't hold off teams though and it is a huge recipe for disaster. I wish we would just keep on going for the jugular when we are in the lead instead of getting all nervous and trying to defend a lead, something we have never been able to do. Grow some bollocks Pardew. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrmojorisin75 Posted September 23, 2013 Share Posted September 23, 2013 I do think we are showing signs of trying to play the right way, the question is why we don't stick to it when things go wrong. we're about to find out like Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest icemanblue Posted September 23, 2013 Share Posted September 23, 2013 I'm seeing a lot of 'stats' which include our form from last season. As far as I'm aware, the results from last season don't count towards this one. Only last week, the majority of posters were saying that there were evident improvements to our general play, and issues from last season were being addressed. One loss, now we're back to square one? I'm not sure. They were wrong. Our problem was never necessarily long ball. Our main problems have always been lack of movement and inviting teams onto us when we're ahead. Neither of them have changed. Mate, honestly, it does you no favours to be piping up on the back of a loss. I know that you haven't followed a few of our games this season, so you may not be the best person to judge. We've certainly improved in the areas you've mentioned. Piping up on the back of a loss? I've been saying exactly the same thing about Pardew and the way his team plays for years I've seen every minute other than the Villa game, I was at SJP for West Ham and Hull, just calling it as I see it. I know you have, difficult not to, but I haven't seen much from you this season so far. I was only going off your posts, so apologies if you have actually seen these games. In which case, I really can't understand you saying that there's been no improvements. But, I also fail to understand the uproar over a result that was as much the fault of the players as the manager. As I said on Saturday, this 'sitting back on a lead' craic is all over the shop. In our two games prior to this (this season), we attacked and created chances after taking the lead. Against Fulham, that was in the 86th minute. People just use it as their weapon of choice when it fits, regardless of the circumstances or player contributions. It's the same old arguments, anyway. So I don't much fancy getting involved. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Venkman Posted September 23, 2013 Share Posted September 23, 2013 I think we are just fragile mentally and in terms of confidence, when we start making mistakes and concede we don't really believe in ourselves enough to keep playing through it. Whether that's entirely Pardew's fault I don't know, it's certainly a feeling that he has allowed to develop. I do think we are showing signs of trying to play the right way, the question is why we don't stick to it when things go wrong. (Hull also worked extremely hard to close every one of our attackers down) That's Pardew football. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest firetotheworks Posted September 23, 2013 Share Posted September 23, 2013 I'll be honest, I see no sign in us playing better football above and beyond simply having better players on the pitch. That is undoubtedly our strongest XI in most matches. Not having players like Jonas, Tiote, Ameobi, Taylor and Williamson starting makes a difference in terms of the quality of football that we see. Pardew is at absolute best, a fairweather manager. And even then he's still crap. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted September 23, 2013 Share Posted September 23, 2013 It was a very poor result, but I don't think it was one where "typical Pardew bollocks" really works as a criticism. We scored two, we had loads of attackers on, we could easily have come away with at least a draw. We made a lot of errors, that was the reason for the defeat IMO. We do need to work on our character though, and make the better football a gameplan that we stick to even when we're struggling. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest icemanblue Posted September 23, 2013 Share Posted September 23, 2013 It was a very poor result, but I don't think it was one where "typical Pardew bollocks" really works as a criticism. We scored two, we had loads of attackers on, we could easily have come away with at least a draw. We made a lot of errors, that was the reason for the defeat IMO. One for the fridge there, Ian. Congrats. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minhosa Posted September 23, 2013 Share Posted September 23, 2013 Yep, all stemming from a culture of fear. That's why we never stuff sides. We're full of inhibition. We had Gouffran, Remy, Cisse & Ben Arfa on the pitch together. Negative Bastard. All that attacking talent and yet we've averaged 1 goal per game all season. Go figure. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heron Posted September 23, 2013 Share Posted September 23, 2013 Some of their goals were purely down to players just not using their heads and doing their jobs properly. You cannot blame Pardew for that. You absolutely can and I absolutely will. You can blame Pardew for using the wrong personnel and tactics, but players failing to track men and ball-watching is down to the individual player. Pardew isn't the greatest but to blame him for that kind of s*** is ludicrous. It would be if we weren't talking about players that were quality before they arrived here, if they weren't players that weren't starting players in decent Champions League and International teams. Who the f*** drills them? Directs them and tells them what to do? You can put blame on individual errors and the odd poor performance? But the entire team not being able to string passes together, a lack of movement and resorting to hoofing when we're behind? On the back of an away win? Come on. The only player that showed anything was Remy and it wouldn't surprise me if his form dipped once Pardew gets into his head. Everyone except Remy and Anita played badly and it's all down to individual performances? That's a bit of a coincidence don't you think? Players can rub off on one another and when heads go down it can effect the whole team. In my opinion we have a leader on the pitch in Colo', who leads by example. Previously we've had verbal leaders who may be having a shite game but keep the fight and effort there. Colo' doesn't have that attribute, although he has virtually everything else. That's not to say I'm blaming him either by the way, it just highlights how one bad performance can effect a whole team. As I have previously mentioned, Pardew wasn't and isn't faultless. However, when a player is ten yards from his man, ball-watching when he should be slotting in, you cannot blame Pardew for that. FWIW I'm sure you're not saying the players were faultless either. At this point in the season I don't think we are too far from what we all expected. We're maybe 1 or 2 points behind where we should be. Those 1 or 2 points would have us up in the top 6.... it wouldn't surprise me if we get a good result at Everton and all of a sudden everyone cheers up on here again... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest firetotheworks Posted September 23, 2013 Share Posted September 23, 2013 It was a very poor result, but I don't think it was one where "typical Pardew bollocks" really works as a criticism. We scored two, we had loads of attackers on, we could easily have come away with at least a draw. We made a lot of errors, that was the reason for the defeat IMO. We do need to work on our character though, and make the better football a gameplan that we stick to even when we're struggling. So basically, the reasons were everything except Pardew? For one, it's not that we scored two. We scored one, they scored one, then we scored another. You can't view our goals in isolation to our own team in the same way that you can't view any performance in isolation. This is not Pardew's first match, but it's one of the many matches that we've come out of at home, against worse/any opposition, losing after going ahead. We could have come away with a draw? It's a Hull City team managed by Steve Bruce ffs. We were in the lead twice. A draw and I would have been just as pissed off. We should have been, and were, all over them. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Face Posted September 23, 2013 Share Posted September 23, 2013 Yep, all stemming from a culture of fear. That's why we never stuff sides. We're full of inhibition. We had Gouffran, Remy, Cisse & Ben Arfa on the pitch together. Negative Bastard. All that attacking talent and yet we've averaged 1 goal per game all season. Go figure. Cisse and Ben Arfa were fucking shite on Saturday. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wullie Posted September 23, 2013 Share Posted September 23, 2013 Hull looked embarrassingly shit until we scored and took our footf off the gas. They'd hardly touched the ball whilst we were trying to attack. fucks sake wullie man, you're a quality poster but i honestly don't get how you can't see bruce changed shit up after the first goal...he closed down the areas we were getting joy and his players exploited the massive holes in our formation you make it sound like pardew just ordered them back into formation as soon as the first goal went in, that's not how it happened at all We were considerably less positive with the ball after our goal than before it. Our players stopped trying to beat their man, preferring to turn round and ping it back to players in safer positions, and we stopped getting numbers in the box. I didn't expect anything else, that's how Pardew wants his team to play. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heron Posted September 23, 2013 Share Posted September 23, 2013 It was a very poor result, but I don't think it was one where "typical Pardew bollocks" really works as a criticism. We scored two, we had loads of attackers on, we could easily have come away with at least a draw. We made a lot of errors, that was the reason for the defeat IMO. We do need to work on our character though, and make the better football a gameplan that we stick to even when we're struggling. So basically, the reasons were everything except Pardew? For one, it's not that we scored two. We scored one, they scored one, then we scored another. You can't view our goals in isolation to our own team in the same way that you can't view any performance in isolation. This is not Pardew's first match, but it's one of the many matches that we've come out of at home, against worse/any opposition, losing after going ahead. We could have come away with a draw? It's a Hull City team managed by Steve Bruce ffs. We were in the lead twice. A draw and I would have been just as p*ssed off. We should have been, and were, all over them. Which is exactly what I was saying. It's more down to errors / players in this instance (i.e. this game in isolation - which I know you're trying to avoid). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest neesy111 Posted September 23, 2013 Share Posted September 23, 2013 Away team starting bad shocker. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Face Posted September 23, 2013 Share Posted September 23, 2013 it's one of the many matches that we've come out of at home, against worse/any opposition, losing after going ahead. Many? We've only done that twice before in the 3 years Pardew has been here. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest firetotheworks Posted September 23, 2013 Share Posted September 23, 2013 Some of their goals were purely down to players just not using their heads and doing their jobs properly. You cannot blame Pardew for that. You absolutely can and I absolutely will. You can blame Pardew for using the wrong personnel and tactics, but players failing to track men and ball-watching is down to the individual player. Pardew isn't the greatest but to blame him for that kind of s*** is ludicrous. It would be if we weren't talking about players that were quality before they arrived here, if they weren't players that weren't starting players in decent Champions League and International teams. Who the f*** drills them? Directs them and tells them what to do? You can put blame on individual errors and the odd poor performance? But the entire team not being able to string passes together, a lack of movement and resorting to hoofing when we're behind? On the back of an away win? Come on. The only player that showed anything was Remy and it wouldn't surprise me if his form dipped once Pardew gets into his head. Everyone except Remy and Anita played badly and it's all down to individual performances? That's a bit of a coincidence don't you think? Players can rub off on one another and when heads go down it can effect the whole team. In my opinion we have a leader on the pitch in Colo', who leads by example. Previously we've had verbal leaders who may be having a s**** game but keep the fight and effort there. Colo' doesn't have that attribute, although he has virtually everything else. That's not to say I'm blaming him either by the way, it just highlights how one bad performance can effect a whole team. As I have previously mentioned, Pardew wasn't and isn't faultless. However, when a player is ten yards from his man, ball-watching when he should be slotting in, you cannot blame Pardew for that. FWIW I'm sure you're not saying the players were faultless either. At this point in the season I don't think we are too far from what we all expected. We're maybe 1 or 2 points behind where we should be. Those 1 or 2 points would have us up in the top 6.... it wouldn't surprise me if we get a good result at Everton and all of a sudden everyone cheers up on here again... Coloccini is a very good footballer, but he's no captain. That much should be clear after the way that he went on to leave Newcastle. Cabaye too. If they're leading by example, then they're not setting very good examples. This top 6 and level on points with whoever doesn't work this early on in the season man. We've played one team that I've went into the match expecting a hiding from, and we got it. We've drawn against West Ham without so much as a shot on target, beat Fulham with a narrow 1-0 win, had a good performance against Villa, and then surrendered what should have been a comfortable win against fucking Hull. It's not good enough and no one will convince me otherwise. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mrmojorisin75 Posted September 23, 2013 Share Posted September 23, 2013 Hull looked embarrassingly shit until we scored and took our footf off the gas. They'd hardly touched the ball whilst we were trying to attack. fucks sake wullie man, you're a quality poster but i honestly don't get how you can't see bruce changed shit up after the first goal...he closed down the areas we were getting joy and his players exploited the massive holes in our formation you make it sound like pardew just ordered them back into formation as soon as the first goal went in, that's not how it happened at all We were considerably less positive with the ball after our goal than before it. Our players stopped trying to beat their man, preferring to turn round and ping it back to players in safer positions, and we stopped getting numbers in the box. I didn't expect anything else, that's how Pardew wants his team to play. you see that as a preference whereas on saturday i saw that hull had closed down the space and we couldn't adapt to that what doesn't make sense to me is that if it was "our gameplan" to shut up shup after going ahead as you've said why didn't remy and hatem drop in instead of basically playing up with cisse? i know pardew is tactically inept but is he bad enough to think in the PL you can defend with 3-4 players not pulling their weight? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted September 23, 2013 Share Posted September 23, 2013 We could have come away with a draw? It's a Hull City team managed by Steve Bruce ffs. We were in the lead twice. A draw and I would have been just as pissed off. We should have been, and were, all over them. I'm not saying a draw would have been a good result, I'm saying it wouldn't have resulted in as much reaction as this. A win for Hull flattered them a fair bit as well, IMO. Obviously we should be beating them. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest firetotheworks Posted September 23, 2013 Share Posted September 23, 2013 it's one of the many matches that we've come out of at home, against worse/any opposition, losing after going ahead. Many? We've only done that twice before in the 3 years Pardew has been here. Sorry, I meant losing the lead. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gallowgate Toon Posted September 23, 2013 Share Posted September 23, 2013 'We started off well, you could sense that we were going to go on and get a good win but the players dropped down a gear' I'm sure this will be deemed as another Pardew lie but it certainly seemed that way to me. He killed it with some poor changes in the second but that's why I'm annoyed at the players as well as him, I thought it was clear as day that they lost focus and seeing that kind of lack of professionalism really irritated me. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minhosa Posted September 23, 2013 Share Posted September 23, 2013 Yep, all stemming from a culture of fear. That's why we never stuff sides. We're full of inhibition. We had Gouffran, Remy, Cisse & Ben Arfa on the pitch together. Negative Bastard. All that attacking talent and yet we've averaged 1 goal per game all season. Go figure. Cisse and Ben Arfa were fucking shite on Saturday. All season? No good having such attacking talent on the pitch if you score FIVE goals in FIVE games. When was the time we beasted a team? When was the last time we dominated most of a match? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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