Ronaldo Posted November 6, 2013 Share Posted November 6, 2013 Mertesacker holds the entire Arsenal ship together for me. I honestly thought he was an iffy signing when they bought him (and for a long time afterwards), but he's one of their most important players. He's a brilliant example of a defender who protects his total lack of athleticism and doesn't 'need' a quick partner to compensate for it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Village Idiot Posted November 7, 2013 Share Posted November 7, 2013 Messi had a good game at last though; hopefully he'll slowly get back to his usual form. Cesc's having a great start to the season, but Xavi-less experiments (like away against Celta last week) haven't worked too well yet. Cesc likes to go forward too much to play in his position. Didn't see enough of the second half, but in the first half Messi was very meh, imho. True, have they tried Neymar - Messi - Cesc? Yeah, the Clásico. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SEMTEX Posted November 7, 2013 Share Posted November 7, 2013 Thiago Silva defending in a league for pussies Except when he's defending for the national team you mean. A national team that haven't played a proper game for two years. Thiago Silva took the pussy route, he's never played for a proper team. At least Per plays in a proper league. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SEMTEX Posted November 7, 2013 Share Posted November 7, 2013 Proper. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest n4e Posted November 7, 2013 Share Posted November 7, 2013 Rosicky get's a lot of stick on here but I thought he's put in two really good shifts in big games this week. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flip Posted November 7, 2013 Share Posted November 7, 2013 Thiago Silva defending in a league for pussies Except when he's defending for the national team you mean. A national team that haven't played a proper game for two years. Thiago Silva took the pussy route, he's never played for a proper team. At least Per plays in a proper league. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
La Parka Posted November 7, 2013 Share Posted November 7, 2013 Btw does those who doubted Mertesacker still think he's not good enough? I don't think he's a great defender no. They defend well as a team, not necessarily their players. Mertesacker is a good defender, don't get me wrong, I just don't see him as a top 5 defender in the PL. Who would you rate higher than him at CB? I'm only coming up with a few. His positional awareness and aerial ability are excellent. Not great with the ball at his feet, but that's Koscielny's job. Luiz He's terrible. Awful positional sense and discipline Chelsea look far better when he's not involved. Agger (whenever he's fit), Koscielny (prefer him), Terry, Luiz, Colo, Kompany. I do realize it's hard to really compare them like that since it's different kinds of defenders, but there's something with Mertesacker and the ball at his feet like you mentioned that kills me. So stiff in a way, I also like Kaboul and Vertonghen for those reasons as well. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nobody Posted November 7, 2013 Share Posted November 7, 2013 I'll hold my hands up and say that I was one who wasn't impressed with Mertesacker when he first came to Arsenal. Looked terribly slow, so many players seemed to be able to exploit this as well. His positioning and reading of the game has improved massively since his first six months in England, whether that's down to him just not being used to the PL or Wenger or both, I have no idea. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted November 7, 2013 Share Posted November 7, 2013 I'll hold my hands up and say that I was one who wasn't impressed with Mertesacker when he first came to Arsenal. Looked terribly slow, so many players seemed to be able to exploit this as well. His positioning and reading of the game has improved massively since his first six months in England, whether that's down to him just not being used to the PL or Wenger or both, I have no idea. Same, I just thought he must have something about him because of his previous experience. He has adapted really well though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flip Posted November 7, 2013 Share Posted November 7, 2013 Btw does those who doubted Mertesacker still think he's not good enough? I don't think he's a great defender no. They defend well as a team, not necessarily their players. Mertesacker is a good defender, don't get me wrong, I just don't see him as a top 5 defender in the PL. Who would you rate higher than him at CB? I'm only coming up with a few. His positional awareness and aerial ability are excellent. Not great with the ball at his feet, but that's Koscielny's job. Agger (whenever he's fit), Koscielny (prefer him), Terry, Luiz, Colo, Kompany. I do realize it's hard to really compare them like that since it's different kinds of defenders, but there's something with Mertesacker and the ball at his feet like you mentioned that kills me. So stiff in a way, I also like Kaboul and Vertonghen for those reasons as well. Luiz He's terrible. Awful positional sense and discipline Chelsea look far better when he's not involved. Clueless. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flip Posted November 7, 2013 Share Posted November 7, 2013 I'll hold my hands up and say that I was one who wasn't impressed with Mertesacker when he first came to Arsenal. Looked terribly slow, so many players seemed to be able to exploit this as well. His positioning and reading of the game has improved massively since his first six months in England, whether that's down to him just not being used to the PL or Wenger or both, I have no idea. Like I said earlier, I still see him as a very good defender, I just don't think he's a fantastic defender. I might be wrong though, and maybe what Mole says goes for me when I see him as he isn't a very good footballer but a fantastic defender. I just seem to have fixated that opinion you have on him still. I don't see enough Arsenal though to make a perfect judgement like many on here probably, but he's never impressed me for the national team or in there CL games (didn't see the one last night). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Flash Posted November 7, 2013 Share Posted November 7, 2013 Another goal for Bony. There's an unstoppable monster in there somewhere. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Segun Oluwaniyi Posted November 7, 2013 Share Posted November 7, 2013 Btw does those who doubted Mertesacker still think he's not good enough? I don't think he's a great defender no. They defend well as a team, not necessarily their players. Mertesacker is a good defender, don't get me wrong, I just don't see him as a top 5 defender in the PL. Who would you rate higher than him at CB? I'm only coming up with a few. His positional awareness and aerial ability are excellent. Not great with the ball at his feet, but that's Koscielny's job. Agger (whenever he's fit), Koscielny (prefer him), Terry, Luiz, Colo, Kompany. I do realize it's hard to really compare them like that since it's different kinds of defenders, but there's something with Mertesacker and the ball at his feet like you mentioned that kills me. So stiff in a way, I also like Kaboul and Vertonghen for those reasons as well. Luiz He's terrible. Awful positional sense and discipline Chelsea look far better when he's not involved. Clueless. Felipe, please understand. Luiz has incredible talent, so he obviously isn't just terrible, but the previous poster is right. He is extremely lacking in some of the most important mental areas for a centreback. He is often out of position for no reason whatsoever and commits simple errors that result from a lazy mentality defensively. Even when them played him as a deep midfielder last season, he cost them a big goal against Tottenham by simply not being in the defensive position required of him for no reason. He might be top three in the world for ninety percent of the time, but the ten percent of poor play will always hold him back from achieving full potential. It will be interesting to see how Chelsea handle his situation at the club once Omeruo takes his place in the side. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flip Posted November 7, 2013 Share Posted November 7, 2013 Btw does those who doubted Mertesacker still think he's not good enough? I don't think he's a great defender no. They defend well as a team, not necessarily their players. Mertesacker is a good defender, don't get me wrong, I just don't see him as a top 5 defender in the PL. Who would you rate higher than him at CB? I'm only coming up with a few. His positional awareness and aerial ability are excellent. Not great with the ball at his feet, but that's Koscielny's job. Agger (whenever he's fit), Koscielny (prefer him), Terry, Luiz, Colo, Kompany. I do realize it's hard to really compare them like that since it's different kinds of defenders, but there's something with Mertesacker and the ball at his feet like you mentioned that kills me. So stiff in a way, I also like Kaboul and Vertonghen for those reasons as well. Luiz He's terrible. Awful positional sense and discipline Chelsea look far better when he's not involved. Clueless. Felipe, please understand. Luiz has incredible talent, so he obviously isn't just terrible, but the previous poster is right. He is extremely lacking in some of the most important mental areas for a centreback. He is often out of position for no reason whatsoever and commits simple errors that result from a lazy mentality defensively. Even when them played him as a deep midfielder last season, he cost them a big goal against Tottenham by simply not being in the defensive position required of him for no reason. He might be top three in the world for ninety percent of the time, but the ten percent of poor play will always hold him back from achieving full potential. It will be interesting to see how Chelsea handle his situation at the club once Omeruo takes his place in the side. Read what you wrote again and tell me where you actually agree with the previous poster. I completely agree with you fwiw. He was calling Luiz a terrible defender and Chelsea are far better off without him, which in my opinion shows a lack of knowledge. I'm not going to defend him and say he's pure class. But just like you said, for 85-90% of time he's one of the absolute best in the world, if not the best. His problem is consistency due to his mental lapses at times. He doesn't have great discipline, but his positional sense is getting much better. I won't sit here and the defend him till end of time because I've seen what he can do on a bad day, which is what scares me for the World Cup. I just don't agree with calling him terrible, when it's quite clear that on his day he might be the best in the world. (please don't come with the same goes for Bramble) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flip Posted November 7, 2013 Share Posted November 7, 2013 Also David Luiz as a DM is the definition of Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deuce Posted November 7, 2013 Share Posted November 7, 2013 Chelsea is far better off with a CB pairing of Cahill-Terry than with any combination that includes Luiz. He's just not that good of a defender. And there's no way he's better than Mertesacker, Flip. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nobody Posted November 7, 2013 Share Posted November 7, 2013 Can't make my mind up about Luiz He seems to go through spells where he is absolute quality and I think he has finally settled and become the great player he ought to be, but then he goes and make a couple of really poor mistakes that brings him right down again. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flip Posted November 7, 2013 Share Posted November 7, 2013 Chelsea is far better off with a CB pairing of Cahill-Terry than with any combination that includes Luiz. He's just not that good of a defender. And there's no way he's better than Mertesacker, Flip. Blashpemy. Blasphemy. Blasphemy. No FF wins for you. 10 point deduction for every player. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Segun Oluwaniyi Posted November 7, 2013 Share Posted November 7, 2013 Btw does those who doubted Mertesacker still think he's not good enough? I don't think he's a great defender no. They defend well as a team, not necessarily their players. Mertesacker is a good defender, don't get me wrong, I just don't see him as a top 5 defender in the PL. Who would you rate higher than him at CB? I'm only coming up with a few. His positional awareness and aerial ability are excellent. Not great with the ball at his feet, but that's Koscielny's job. Agger (whenever he's fit), Koscielny (prefer him), Terry, Luiz, Colo, Kompany. I do realize it's hard to really compare them like that since it's different kinds of defenders, but there's something with Mertesacker and the ball at his feet like you mentioned that kills me. So stiff in a way, I also like Kaboul and Vertonghen for those reasons as well. Luiz He's terrible. Awful positional sense and discipline Chelsea look far better when he's not involved. Clueless. Felipe, please understand. Luiz has incredible talent, so he obviously isn't just terrible, but the previous poster is right. He is extremely lacking in some of the most important mental areas for a centreback. He is often out of position for no reason whatsoever and commits simple errors that result from a lazy mentality defensively. Even when them played him as a deep midfielder last season, he cost them a big goal against Tottenham by simply not being in the defensive position required of him for no reason. He might be top three in the world for ninety percent of the time, but the ten percent of poor play will always hold him back from achieving full potential. It will be interesting to see how Chelsea handle his situation at the club once Omeruo takes his place in the side. Read what you wrote again and tell me where you actually agree with the previous poster. I completely agree with you fwiw. He was calling Luiz a terrible defender and Chelsea are far better off without him, which in my opinion shows a lack of knowledge. I'm not going to defend him and say he's pure class. But just like you said, for 85-90% of time he's one of the absolute best in the world, if not the best. His problem is consistency due to his mental lapses at times. He doesn't have great discipline, but his positional sense is getting much better. I won't sit here and the defend him till end of time because I've seen what he can do on a bad day, which is what scares me for the World Cup. I just don't agree with calling him terrible, when it's quite clear that on his day he might be the best in the world. (please don't come with the same goes for Bramble) I was agreeing with his poor position and discipline. Reading further, our positions are similar. At 26, the the guy is no child and needs to be improving, though. He should be embarrassed to live in a world where he is dropped for an average Gary Cahill and a finished John Terry. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deuce Posted November 7, 2013 Share Posted November 7, 2013 Chelsea is far better off with a CB pairing of Cahill-Terry than with any combination that includes Luiz. He's just not that good of a defender. And there's no way he's better than Mertesacker, Flip. Blashpemy. Blasphemy. Blasphemy. No FF wins for you. 10 point deduction for every player. Would it matter? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flip Posted November 7, 2013 Share Posted November 7, 2013 Btw does those who doubted Mertesacker still think he's not good enough? I don't think he's a great defender no. They defend well as a team, not necessarily their players. Mertesacker is a good defender, don't get me wrong, I just don't see him as a top 5 defender in the PL. Who would you rate higher than him at CB? I'm only coming up with a few. His positional awareness and aerial ability are excellent. Not great with the ball at his feet, but that's Koscielny's job. Agger (whenever he's fit), Koscielny (prefer him), Terry, Luiz, Colo, Kompany. I do realize it's hard to really compare them like that since it's different kinds of defenders, but there's something with Mertesacker and the ball at his feet like you mentioned that kills me. So stiff in a way, I also like Kaboul and Vertonghen for those reasons as well. Luiz He's terrible. Awful positional sense and discipline Chelsea look far better when he's not involved. Clueless. Felipe, please understand. Luiz has incredible talent, so he obviously isn't just terrible, but the previous poster is right. He is extremely lacking in some of the most important mental areas for a centreback. He is often out of position for no reason whatsoever and commits simple errors that result from a lazy mentality defensively. Even when them played him as a deep midfielder last season, he cost them a big goal against Tottenham by simply not being in the defensive position required of him for no reason. He might be top three in the world for ninety percent of the time, but the ten percent of poor play will always hold him back from achieving full potential. It will be interesting to see how Chelsea handle his situation at the club once Omeruo takes his place in the side. Read what you wrote again and tell me where you actually agree with the previous poster. I completely agree with you fwiw. He was calling Luiz a terrible defender and Chelsea are far better off without him, which in my opinion shows a lack of knowledge. I'm not going to defend him and say he's pure class. But just like you said, for 85-90% of time he's one of the absolute best in the world, if not the best. His problem is consistency due to his mental lapses at times. He doesn't have great discipline, but his positional sense is getting much better. I won't sit here and the defend him till end of time because I've seen what he can do on a bad day, which is what scares me for the World Cup. I just don't agree with calling him terrible, when it's quite clear that on his day he might be the best in the world. (please don't come with the same goes for Bramble) I was agreeing with his poor position and discipline. Reading further, our positions are similar. At 26, the the guy is no child and needs to be improving, though. He should be embarrassed to live in a world where he is dropped for an average Gary Cahill and a finished John Terry. Dropped? Mourinho has been rotating and except for the City game and last night he's played every game for Chelsea this season where he's been fit. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flip Posted November 7, 2013 Share Posted November 7, 2013 Chelsea is far better off with a CB pairing of Cahill-Terry than with any combination that includes Luiz. He's just not that good of a defender. And there's no way he's better than Mertesacker, Flip. Blashpemy. Blasphemy. Blasphemy. No FF wins for you. 10 point deduction for every player. Would it matter? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
La Parka Posted November 7, 2013 Share Posted November 7, 2013 Chelsea is far better off with a CB pairing of Cahill-Terry than with any combination that includes Luiz. He's just not that good of a defender. And there's no way he's better than Mertesacker, Flip. Exactly. Hes being outplayed by a clogger and a grandad.. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SEMTEX Posted November 7, 2013 Share Posted November 7, 2013 Oh yey. It's the return of the super biased flip. Let's defend any old mediocre Brazilian. I'm still waiting for Vagner Love to take the world by storm. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flip Posted November 7, 2013 Share Posted November 7, 2013 Oh yey. It's the return of the super biased flip. Let's defend any old mediocre Brazilian. I'm still waiting for Vagner Love to take the world by storm. http://i.imgur.com/3XqQJJg.png :snod: :snod: Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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