The Managerial Merry Go Round™

[Froggy]

Just now, gdm said:

Fair point. Thing is would anyone be surprised if it’s true? 

 

I'd personally be delighted if we were tightening the purse strings a bit, but it's definitely not true.  While I don't think we'll be firing out £350k pw contracts for a while, we're still going to pay players and managers a hefty chunk more than 99% of clubs.

 

Our budget isn't £35m either, it's at least double that. I think that £35m figure originally came from Morgan as well, the lying little prick.

[gdm]

7 minutes ago, Froggy said:

 

I'd personally be delighted if we were tightening the purse strings a bit, but it's definitely not true.  While I don't think we'll be firing out £350k pw contracts for a while, we're still going to pay players and managers a hefty chunk more than 99% of clubs.

 

Our budget isn't £35m either, it's at least double that. I think that £35m figure originally came from Morgan as well, the lying little prick.

All I can go off is the Ashworth situation and offering £2m then £3m for a guy that cost £6m only 18 months or so ago suggests they don’t have much money 

[Ghandis Flip-Flop]

47 minutes ago, Froggy said:

 

And finally you, Sir Pata.

 

Martinez was a bargain for starters. He's incredible, and integral to the way Ten Hag wants to play. The only way you can suggest he's not worth every penny and more is because he's spent significant time on the injury table. Regardless, he was signed to be a partner for Varane. Varane is now gone, so a new CB is required.

 

Casemiro. Ten Hag didn't want him. Everyone knows this. He was a panic buy because we couldn't sign anyone else. He was quality in his first season, but either his legs have gone or he's checked out or both. Either way, we need a defensive midfielder now, as Amrabat will likely leave in the summer also. We literally do not have one.

 

Hojlund was signed to share time with Martial and grow as a player. He ended up being the only striker all year. He's great, and will have a class future, but it's far too much pressure for a 21 year old to play 50-60 games a year as the lone striker. We needed a striker all season to support him, we just didn't have any money to be able to sign one in January. Not even a Weghorst.

 

Yes, ETH wanted Antony, and he's shit. His price was €40m when Ten Hag asked for him. We tried to negotiate, left it too late, Ajax dug their heels in and we ended up making one of the worst signings in Premier League history.

 

Also, the injuries. I've addressed this another thread. I'm trying to be kind. Our injuries were much worse than yours. We had more individual injuries, more individual players out injured, more players injured in a specific role. I've looked further into it to counteract the "days lost" stat, which is the only metric where you were above us injury wise. It doesn't include any injuries that were in place before the start of the season. That means Malacia, Mainoo, Diallo, Hojlund etc. all not included in that stat, which is around 16 months worth of injuries as well.

 

Also, we all know wor Eddie did a great job this season. The same way Ten Hag did a great job last year given the mess he came into. Ignore the fact Ten Hag has won two trophies for a second. If Howe has a bad season next year and finishes say 12th or 13th, would you be calling for his head or would you back him? What if rival fans started laughing at you saying it's great that you're keeping Howe as you were so bad. Would you think they were complete morons who didn't have the slightest clue what they were talking about? Hopefully you see what I'm getting at here.

Please don’t come anywhere near me when I’m in work, as if you come out with something like that in person, I think I’d be off to sort out an MHO and Consultant Psychiatrist and be looking for an inpatient bed.

 

i particularly like the idea that the reason you guys have failed the eye test for the past two years, is purely because everybody hate Man Utd. I hate to break it you, but I hate Liverpool and Arsenal too, but I can see they have an identity and structure on the pitch. You lot are like Steve Bruce's Newcastle with higher quality players.

[Froggy]

2 minutes ago, gdm said:

All I can go off is the Ashworth situation and offering £2m then £3m for a guy that cost £6m only 18 months or so ago suggests they don’t have much money 

 

I don't see it that way. We have other executives in place and this isn't a sprint. Why would we overpay for someone who desperately wants to join us and can do so for free in 12 months time? 

 

I'd have been incredibly unhappy at us wasting a fortune to bring him in early.

[Froggy]

2 minutes ago, Ghandis Flip-Flop said:

You lot are like Steve Bruce's Newcastle with higher quality players.

 

And trophies.

[Ghandis Flip-Flop]

Just now, Froggy said:

 

And trophies.

One of which you traditionally wouldn’t have bothered trying for, if you weren't a million miles away from challenging for the league 🤷🏻‍♂️

[Froggy]

Just now, Ghandis Flip-Flop said:

One of which you traditionally wouldn’t have bothered trying for, if you weren't a million miles away from challenging for the league 🤷🏻‍♂️

 

Time to stop living in the past isn't it? No, the league cup didn't hold great importance when we were winning the league every other year, but when you haven't won a trophy in 6 years a league cup is massively appreciated. The FA Cup even more so. 

 

Starting to downplay trophies is a really bad look. 

[Kid Icarus]

1 hour ago, Froggy said:

 

It's not that at all though. It's a negative. It's effective when you're a high possession side. When you're conceding 55/60% of the ball and still pressing that much and that high you're going to fade and leave huge gaps which is what we saw all year. 

 

It's just a response to short sighted comments about no style of play. We absolutely have a style of play under Ten Hag. Aside from the last few games of the season where he went more defensive, we had the same style of player all year which was to press high, turnover high and counter. We were poor though, and instead wasted opportunities and then got ran through on the counter. 

 

If you mean that the press was so poor that it was mostly unrecognisable as a press (at least compared to Arsenal, Man City, even us) then I take the point, but I watched a ton of Man United matches last season (obv not as much as you) and in your worst performances I can't say kamikaze pressing stood out to me as a root cause of your problems. Definitely not as much as lack of possession, sloppiness in possession, and conceding space and chances.

[gdm]

32 minutes ago, Froggy said:

 

I don't see it that way. We have other executives in place and this isn't a sprint. Why would we overpay for someone who desperately wants to join us and can do so for free in 12 months time? 

 

I'd have been incredibly unhappy at us wasting a fortune to bring him in early.

There’s overpaying and there’s underpaying and being cheap. £2m is an insulting offer when he cost £6m and every report I’ve read suggests ashworth not being in place is hampering your summer 

[Nobody]

2 hours ago, Froggy said:

 

Of course, because you don't really watch us and when you do, like others, you do it with a bit between your teeth and want to see faults everywhere you look. 

 

Fact remains, we've had the highest counter press success rate in the league the last two years running. We've had the most possession won in the final third and middle of the pitch. We had the second most pressing sequences in the league this year. It would be quite incredible to have those stats being a defensive side.

 

We are absolutely anything but boring. your comment just proves you either don't watch us at all or you simply don't know what you're talking about. 

 

I don't watch many Newcastle games. But what I read on here suggests you're a high intensity team. You had the intensity of a wet fart in the cup final last year. You had the intensity of a wet shart at Old Trafford in a must win game against a defence of Casemiro and Jonny Evans. You're not in Europe because of that game. Should I base my opinion on those? It seems like that's what you're doing with us.

 

 

 

I knew this post was coming some  bollocks stats to 'prove' your point. If anything, those stats show just how shit of a manager he is then, because despite them you're still a team that is absolutely rubbish on the eye and look completely incoherent. Ask 100 football fans who they think is the team that applies the highest press and not a single one says Man U. 

 

Oh, and Man U is the team Ive watched most other than Newcastle the last 4 or so seasons as I work with a Man U fan. Reckon Ive seen more of them than you have, as you seem to be reading off a stats sheet and watch some Youtuber talk about your games. 

[SUPERTOON]

We still talking about Man Utd ?

[Froggy]

2 minutes ago, Kid Icarus said:

If you mean that the press was so poor that it was mostly unrecognisable as a press (at least compared to Arsenal, Man City, even us) then I take the point, but I watched a ton of Man United matches last season (obv not as much as you) and in your worst performances I can't say kamikaze pressing stood out to me as a root cause of your problems. Definitely not as much as lack of possession, sloppiness in possession, and conceding space and chances.

 

What you've said is exactly what I mean, but you know as well as I do that I don't articulate things very well when it comes to football debates.

 

We were trying to play a man for man press with players like Rashford and Scott McTominay on the field which was suicidal from Ten Hag, hence the kamikaze press comment. If one man doesn't pull his weight, it falls apart. When we had a front four of Hojlund, Garnacho, Fernandes and Antony, the press actually worked fairly well and was effective and our stats in this field were high. That leads in to your comment about sloppiness in possession which is absolutely correct. Ineffective wingers not passing the ball, or running into traffic. Hojlund just not receiving the ball at all. There were games where Onana was the one with the most passes to Hojlund. That's absolutely insane. The team is young though, I'm hoping that development will come with experience and time.

 

Our players capable of maintaining possession such as Eriksen and Mount either weren't available or don't have the legs anymore to be effective in the middle of the park. Mainoo brought some more balance to this, but with no competent defensive midfielder the midfield was constantly overrun. When we tried to press and were sloppy as you mentioned, we were countered and with everyone high up the pitch and no DM with the legs to cover ground, we conceded shot after shot after shot. 

 

I'm in no way trying to suggest we were even close to good last season, and Ten Hag should shoulder a lot of the blame because when the injuries started flying in and Casemiro was in a back four with Jonny Evans, the only sensible thing to do was to protect them, but we continued with suicide ball.

 

If we were in the same situation this year come October with two or three valuable defensive players out and we continued to play the high press, I'd be the first one calling for his head. I like my manager to be able to adapt, and Ten Hag did just that against Arsenal, Newcastle, Brighton and City to finish the season. It gave me some hope that he's not as stubborn as I initially thought and I felt like he deserved another go at proving he's the man for the job.

 

I hope it makes sense what I'm trying to say.  

[Froggy]

4 minutes ago, Nobody said:

Oh, and Man U is the team Ive watched most other than Newcastle the last 4 or so seasons as I work with a Man U fan. Reckon Ive seen more of them than you have, as you seem to be reading off a stats sheet and watch some Youtuber talk about your games. 

 

OK chief.  I'd say I've been to Old Trafford more in the last 6 months than you've been to SJP in your lifetime. You're not in the position to throw stones.

[Froggy]

9 minutes ago, gdm said:

There’s overpaying and there’s underpaying and being cheap. £2m is an insulting offer when he cost £6m and every report I’ve read suggests ashworth not being in place is hampering your summer 

 

I fully agree it's insulting. I'm just happy we aren't bending over and paying over the odds like we have done for years now.

[STM]

5 minutes ago, Froggy said:

 

I fully agree it's insulting. I'm just happy we aren't bending over and paying over the odds like we have done for years now.

 

Aye but you won't be saying that when you don't sign the players you want because of tightarse ratface.

[Froggy]

3 minutes ago, STM said:

Aye but you won't be saying that when you don't sign the players you want because of tightarse ratface.

 

I still think we'll match the wages of most other clubs, and we'll target players with release clauses so clubs can't bend us over a barrel like Ajax did with Antony.

 

We'll find all of this out in the next month or two anyway.

[Groundhog63]

25 minutes ago, Froggy said:

 

OK chief.  I'd say I've been to Old Trafford more in the last 6 months than you've been to SJP in your lifetime. You're not in the position to throw stones.

[gjohnson]

9 minutes ago, Froggy said:

 

I still think we'll match the wages of most other clubs, and we'll target players with release clauses so clubs can't bend us over a barrel like Ajax did with Antony.

 

We'll find all of this out in the next month or two anyway.

Yep and Mike Ashley mkii will give you a taste of what we endured for 14 years....cost cutting everywhere, buying players for profit and not what the team adds, outstanding lack of awareness, only thing he can't or won't do is that because ineos materials aren't generally available to the public they won't be plastered all over the wreckage that is Old Trafford

[lovejoy]

Take it to a Man Utd forum lads, ffs.

[Froggy]

7 minutes ago, Groundhog63 said:

 

It must have been the Goldbridge insinuation.  

[AyeDubbleYoo]

How about Fabian Hurzeler then lads? 

[SUPERTOON]

9 minutes ago, lovejoy said:

Take it to a Man Utd forum lads, ffs.

Even the Man Utd thread on here would do.

[Froggy]

17 minutes ago, SUPERTOON said:

Even the Man Utd thread on here would do.

 

It's a thread about managerial news. The Ten Hag situation was always going to spark debate in this thread about how he's performed. 

[Cronky]

I always felt that this complicated set up at Man U where the Glazers and Ratcliffe divide responsibilities was going to be problematic. The drawn out decision making over Ten Haag is symptomatic of this. He still looks vulnerable. It’s hard to tell whether they really have confidence in him, or  they just couldn’t find a better alternative. 

[CallumG6]

17 hours ago, Froggy said:

 

Why would they know before that?

I've no reason why they would, but for them to find out at a similar time as everyone else seems a bit suspect.

I read somewhere they expected him to be sacked and were shocked to hear him staying, is that correct?