Hatem Ben Arfa (now retired?)

[Guest Haris Vuckic]

Good lad Hatem

 

 

[Tiresias]

Hatem counting that Pardew will get fired soon and new manager isn't completely demented?

[Kanj]

What the fuck is wrong with Pardew. Welcome back lads, you're still frozen out 'Atem and Sylv.

[B-more Mag]

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"A failure to clear the decks of unwanted players has at least given Pardew a squad to select from . . ."

 

[Ketsbaia]

Good lad, Hatem Banking on Pardew getting sacked.

[Wullie]

Delighted that Tom has crawled back from Toontastic with a sackful of horrendous patter now that the heat has died down on Pards.

[Guest neesy111]

  On 08/07/2014 at 19:24, Wullie said:

Delighted that Tom has crawled back from Toontastic with a sackful of horrendous patter now that the heat has died down on Pards.

 

WAT?

[Toondave]

If it werent for that fact Ben arfa was shat upon from a great height I don't think so many would react so violently to criticism towards marveaux, ads style criticism not HV drivel. A player having a bad attitude and pardew being a bellend aren't mutually exclusive, although the latter probably caused the former.

[DJ_NUFC]

  On 08/07/2014 at 18:55, oldtype said:

The guy said "Pardew is a cunt" something like five times in his original post How does he end up being a Pardew supporter

 

Wasn't aimed at him specifically, but more at the Anti Ben Arfa types, I just threw in the Pardew supporters in there to highlight they suffer from the same delusion.

 

My brush has extremely large and wide bristles and tars all and sundry in its wake.

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  On 08/07/2014 at 18:55, oldtype said:

The guy said "Pardew is a cunt" something like five times in his original post How does he end up being a Pardew supporter

Thank you!

[DJ_NUFC]

  On 08/07/2014 at 18:35, ads said:

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Before the abuse comes I'm not a Pardew fan, far from it, but have any of you actually wondered if maybe Marveaux and Ben Arfa just have an incredibly poor attitude and so haven't earned a first team place based on reputation and ability alone?

 

There was a time when Pardew visibly cherished Ben Arfa, there must have been a reason that went pear shaped? I know it's easier to blame Pardew for being a c*** and a poor tactician, but maybe Marv and Benny are just too laid back and not showing enough effort.

 

Like I said, Pardew is a c***, I'm not doubting that, but these guys need to take some of the blame. Marv seems injury prone and downright lazy on the pitch, Ben Arfa is in poor shape physically. It's an idealistic point of view to expect the other 9 or 10 players to carry the flair players, however much we want to see them on the pitch.

 

On a lesser scale talent wise but a grander scale c*** wise, look at Nile Ranger, he was a cult hero here at first, we wanted him to get game time but he barely did. As time went on it became apparent that he was just a bell end with a horrible attitude.

 

You need to maintain a happy squad, not just one or two happy flair players. I'm not condoning anything Pardew does but we don't know the full story.

 

It's interesting that you mention Nile Ranger, because after everything that happened, after he was thrown out of the squad for not showing up for training or for being late, Pardew publicly told us that he was going to give him a chance. We also had Yohan Cabaye who refused to play for us then walked straight back into the team.

 

IF Ben Arfa and Marveaux have bad attitudes then there's still a staggering case of double standards at the least. Cabaye was arguably our most important player, but I would have still had Ben Arfa on par as one of the most important. Ranger wasn't worth his salt as a footballer either, so it's not like it was Pardew overlooking someone like Suarez and giving him a chance.

 

Ben Arfa in particular was dropped immediately after being in excellent form. The exact series of events was:

 

Played away against Man City (4-0 without Cabaye)- Subbed for Shola Ameobi after 65 minutes

Played home against West Ham (0-0 without Cabaye) - Our main threat throughout

Played home against Fulham (1-0 Cabaye returns on 65 minutes) - Scored and was easily the best player on the pitch

Played away against Aston Villa (1-2 Cabaye starts) - Scored one, Gouffran scored from his saved shot and he generally took the p*ss out of Villa. Probably the best individual performance from last season, alongside Krul vs Spurs.

Played home against Hull (2-3) - He didn't track a winger, that put in a cross for Aluko to score a ridiculous goal

Played away against Everton but was shunned to the left wing (3-2) - He didn't play particularly well and was subbed at half time for Cabaye.

Benched away against Cardiff (1-2) and didn't come on.

Played home against Liverpool (2-2) with 10 men - He played well and was subbed for Shola Ameobi on 78 minutes.

Played away at Sunderland (2-1)  - I don't remember anyone's performance from that

Benched home against Chelsea (2-0) and didn't come on.

Benched away to Spurs (0-1) in a match I would say is the luckiest for us that I've ever seen.

 

We didn't see him again until he got 10 minutes at 1-1 at home to Southampton.

He then got 10 minutes against Palace and scored a pen.

Started home to Stoke (5-1) - Stoke had 2 players sent off but Ben Arfa was the best player on the field, getting an assist, winning a pen, hitting the bar and the post.

Benched home to Arsenal and didn't come on.

 

 

It's indefensible. Whichever way you want to look at it, we had and have significantly worse options than Ben Arfa that are used much more, that do less and are forgiven. Ben Arfa hasn't tracked back in a match, he's been moved to another position and then subbed at half time. He then gets 10 minute cameos to 'do something' then he starts, runs riot, then gets benched. It's laughable.

 

That bit in bold is effectively the only mistake that he was allowed for the entirety of last season, whilst Shola, Gosling and (towards the end) Gouffran were afforded every amount of being s*** and would start the next match.

 

 

 

Pardew supporters and anti-Ben Arfa-ites are much like the Tea Party supporters in the US: facts, evidence and figures be damned, their 'beliefs' are all that matter.

 

I'm so tired of repeating the same stats to these people that I applaud KI simply for having the patience to regurgitate them for the umpteenth time. I no longer have that patience and just want to slap them.

Give it a rest. If you'd read my post properly you'd see that I'm not in favour of Pardew at all.

 

I know, I know, I was simply demonstrating that it's a shared symptom.

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  On 08/07/2014 at 19:57, DJ_NUFC said:

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Before the abuse comes I'm not a Pardew fan, far from it, but have any of you actually wondered if maybe Marveaux and Ben Arfa just have an incredibly poor attitude and so haven't earned a first team place based on reputation and ability alone?

 

There was a time when Pardew visibly cherished Ben Arfa, there must have been a reason that went pear shaped? I know it's easier to blame Pardew for being a c*** and a poor tactician, but maybe Marv and Benny are just too laid back and not showing enough effort.

 

Like I said, Pardew is a c***, I'm not doubting that, but these guys need to take some of the blame. Marv seems injury prone and downright lazy on the pitch, Ben Arfa is in poor shape physically. It's an idealistic point of view to expect the other 9 or 10 players to carry the flair players, however much we want to see them on the pitch.

 

On a lesser scale talent wise but a grander scale c*** wise, look at Nile Ranger, he was a cult hero here at first, we wanted him to get game time but he barely did. As time went on it became apparent that he was just a bell end with a horrible attitude.

 

You need to maintain a happy squad, not just one or two happy flair players. I'm not condoning anything Pardew does but we don't know the full story.

 

It's interesting that you mention Nile Ranger, because after everything that happened, after he was thrown out of the squad for not showing up for training or for being late, Pardew publicly told us that he was going to give him a chance. We also had Yohan Cabaye who refused to play for us then walked straight back into the team.

 

IF Ben Arfa and Marveaux have bad attitudes then there's still a staggering case of double standards at the least. Cabaye was arguably our most important player, but I would have still had Ben Arfa on par as one of the most important. Ranger wasn't worth his salt as a footballer either, so it's not like it was Pardew overlooking someone like Suarez and giving him a chance.

 

Ben Arfa in particular was dropped immediately after being in excellent form. The exact series of events was:

 

Played away against Man City (4-0 without Cabaye)- Subbed for Shola Ameobi after 65 minutes

Played home against West Ham (0-0 without Cabaye) - Our main threat throughout

Played home against Fulham (1-0 Cabaye returns on 65 minutes) - Scored and was easily the best player on the pitch

Played away against Aston Villa (1-2 Cabaye starts) - Scored one, Gouffran scored from his saved shot and he generally took the p*ss out of Villa. Probably the best individual performance from last season, alongside Krul vs Spurs.

Played home against Hull (2-3) - He didn't track a winger, that put in a cross for Aluko to score a ridiculous goal

Played away against Everton but was shunned to the left wing (3-2) - He didn't play particularly well and was subbed at half time for Cabaye.

Benched away against Cardiff (1-2) and didn't come on.

Played home against Liverpool (2-2) with 10 men - He played well and was subbed for Shola Ameobi on 78 minutes.

Played away at Sunderland (2-1)  - I don't remember anyone's performance from that

Benched home against Chelsea (2-0) and didn't come on.

Benched away to Spurs (0-1) in a match I would say is the luckiest for us that I've ever seen.

 

We didn't see him again until he got 10 minutes at 1-1 at home to Southampton.

He then got 10 minutes against Palace and scored a pen.

Started home to Stoke (5-1) - Stoke had 2 players sent off but Ben Arfa was the best player on the field, getting an assist, winning a pen, hitting the bar and the post.

Benched home to Arsenal and didn't come on.

 

 

It's indefensible. Whichever way you want to look at it, we had and have significantly worse options than Ben Arfa that are used much more, that do less and are forgiven. Ben Arfa hasn't tracked back in a match, he's been moved to another position and then subbed at half time. He then gets 10 minute cameos to 'do something' then he starts, runs riot, then gets benched. It's laughable.

 

That bit in bold is effectively the only mistake that he was allowed for the entirety of last season, whilst Shola, Gosling and (towards the end) Gouffran were afforded every amount of being s*** and would start the next match.

 

 

 

Pardew supporters and anti-Ben Arfa-ites are much like the Tea Party supporters in the US: facts, evidence and figures be damned, their 'beliefs' are all that matter.

 

I'm so tired of repeating the same stats to these people that I applaud KI simply for having the patience to regurgitate them for the umpteenth time. I no longer have that patience and just want to slap them.

Give it a rest. If you'd read my post properly you'd see that I'm not in favour of Pardew at all.

 

I know, I know, I was simply demonstrating that it's a shared symptom.

I get what you're saying! But I'm neither a Pardew supporter, nor am I against Ben Arfa, I'd just rather a fully fit and well applied Ben Arfa.

[DJ_NUFC]

There are definite shades of McCarthyism from folks like me on here, accusing anyone and everyone of being a Pardew supporter.

 

Pardew takes full blame for that as well.

[Tiresias]

"we would have signed players, but hatem wouldn't go and the extra £3m would have made the difference, and that's why we're now 10th in division 2"

[TRon]

Reduced to flogging a 27 yr old Ben Arfa for £3m. So much for Ashley getting full value for our players. Pardew has wiped at least £12m off his price in the space of 24 months.

[loki679]

Even better is that he's managed to turn a free transfer (Marv) into a negative value asset as he's adding nothing to the team and costing us wages

 

Pards, the master of the reverse midas, can take something worth £0 and make it worth less.  Legend.

[NewJerseyMag]

  On 08/07/2014 at 23:29, loki679 said:

Even better is that he's managed to turn a free transfer (Marv) into a negative value asset as he's adding nothing to the team and costing us wages

 

Pards, the master of the reverse midas, can take something worth £0 and make it worth less.  Legend.

 

Erm Carrol FREE sold for 35 Million, Cabaye 5 M sold for 18 Million, Debuchy 5M sold for (maybe) 12 Million.

 

Not a good argument, stick to Pardew being a lying c**t. Much safer ground.

 

[Pandamninator]

  On 09/07/2014 at 02:54, NewJerseyMag said:

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Even better is that he's managed to turn a free transfer (Marv) into a negative value asset as he's adding nothing to the team and costing us wages

 

Pards, the master of the reverse midas, can take something worth £0 and make it worth less.  Legend.

 

Erm Carrol FREE sold for 35 Million, Cabaye 5 M sold for 18 Million, Debuchy 5M sold for (maybe) 12 Million.

 

Not a good argument, stick to Pardew being a lying c**t. Much safer ground.

 

Erm, you're actually crediting Pardew for Carrol;D

[Dan Gleebals]

It is

  On 09/07/2014 at 02:54, NewJerseyMag said:

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Even better is that he's managed to turn a free transfer (Marv) into a negative value asset as he's adding nothing to the team and costing us wages

 

Pards, the master of the reverse midas, can take something worth £0 and make it worth less.  Legend.

 

Erm Carrol FREE sold for 35 Million, Cabaye 5 M sold for 18 Million, Debuchy 5M sold for (maybe) 12 Million.

 

Not a good argument, stick to Pardew being a lying c**t. Much safer ground.

 

a

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Even better is that he's managed to turn a free transfer (Marv) into a negative value asset as he's adding nothing to the team and costing us wages

 

Pards, the master of the reverse midas, can take something worth £0 and make it worth less.  Legend.

 

Erm Carrol FREE sold for 35 Million, Cabaye 5 M sold for 18 Million, Debuchy 5M sold for (maybe) 12 Million.

 

Not a good argument, stick to Pardew being a lying c**t. Much safer ground.

 

 

It is an argument as on the whole this is correct.  He can take no real credit for AC, the other two are at a level that even Pardew cannot destroy quickly although he has tried his best with MD.  They were so cheap initially relative to actual value we were always going to make a profit and there is no way Pardew gets any recognition for that.  As it goes, the profit we made was really taking the piss as we could have pushed for more.

[Yorkie]

Sylvain fucking Margeaux man. Wish we'd just put him in the Luque pile and be done with it.

[buzza]

  On 09/07/2014 at 09:14, Yorkie said:

Sylvain f***ing Margeaux man. Wish we'd just put him in the Luque pile and be done with it.

Agree, apart from a few nice touches he has done jack ship! Come on everyone, rose tinted glasses off!

As for Ben Arfa, there seems to be an equal division of fault here. I personally would have him in the team even though his defensive intent is low, what he gives to the team in an attacking sense counterbalances this easily.

Until the pratt we have as a manager leaves we will never get to the bottom (a rather fat one ) of this...

[TRon]

  On 09/07/2014 at 02:54, NewJerseyMag said:

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Even better is that he's managed to turn a free transfer (Marv) into a negative value asset as he's adding nothing to the team and costing us wages

 

Pards, the master of the reverse midas, can take something worth £0 and make it worth less.  Legend.

 

Erm Carrol FREE sold for 35 Million, Cabaye 5 M sold for 18 Million, Debuchy 5M sold for (maybe) 12 Million.

 

Not a good argument, stick to Pardew being a lying c**t. Much safer ground.

 

 

Carroll was here before Pards, Cabaye and Debuchy were Graham Carr inspired buys. You can have Obertan though, that one was down to Pards special relationship with Fergie. What a fucking steal he was.

[Interpolic]

I love this attitude about Marveaux that he's done fuck-all.  He's barely played.  Aye, he hasn't forced his way into the team enough but the team is selected by an absolute fucking mook.

[Kanj]

When we go on grafting our bollocks off not scoring a single goal with a bunch of box to box cms running all over the pitch and the mighty Ayoze can't get a ball in behind the defense you'll see why people lose their mind about our 2 only creative players being sent to train with the kids, esp on day 2 of preseason. 

[TRon]

It's not even as if anyone's arguing that Marveaux and Ben Arfa don't have baggage, quite clearly they do. But we don't have any alternative players who can either create and score goals, and Pardew's answer, Obertan and Gosling were utter shit.