Guest firetotheworks Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 They've backed their manager and spent money on players. It's as simple as that, who they are as people is completely irrelevant. Exactly, i don't really get the argument they are the same as ashley Wasn't Bilic whining the other day that he had no sympathy for Rafa because West Ham's Net spend was less than ours, and just look at that team that turned up at SJP, James f***ing Collins at CB, that's tragic. Not sure they've backed Bilic at all this summer although unlike Rafa that's probably a wise move. Bilic isn't going to blame himself is he, nor is he right about the net spend. There was a table a few pages back. James Collins, agreed. They also turned up with Hernandez, Zabaleta, Hart, and without a suspended Arnautovic too. Zabaleta and Hart are long past their sell by dates, thought they were both extremely poor at SJP. Arnautovic is average at best and as much of a live wire as Shelvey or Mitro. Hernandez is their best singing of the summer but is only useful to you inside the penalty area (heard a startling fact during the commentary on Saturday, that all his PL goals have come inside the penalty area), he's Gayle like in his contribution to the build up play, they are struggling to get the ball in the box, so could be argued that he's not going to be a great fit there. This is all irrelevant, man. The point is about backing managers and Rafa would have his own signings. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
afar Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 They've backed their manager and spent money on players. It's as simple as that, who they are as people is completely irrelevant. Exactly, i don't really get the argument they are the same as ashley Wasn't Bilic whining the other day that he had no sympathy for Rafa because West Ham's Net spend was less than ours, and just look at that team that turned up at SJP, James f***ing Collins at CB, that's tragic. Not sure they've backed Bilic at all this summer although unlike Rafa that's probably a wise move. Bilic isn't going to blame himself is he, nor is he right about the net spend. There was a table a few pages back. James Collins, agreed. They also turned up with Hernandez, Zabaleta, Hart, and without a suspended Arnautovic too. Zabaleta and Hart are long past their sell by dates, thought they were both extremely poor at SJP. Arnautovic is average at best and as much of a live wire as Shelvey or Mitro. Hernandez is their best singing of the summer but is only useful to you inside the penalty area (heard a startling fact during the commentary on Saturday, that all his PL goals have come inside the penalty area), he's Gayle like in his contribution to the build up play, they are struggling to get the ball in the box, so could be argued that he's not going to be a great fit there. This is all irrelevant, man. The point is about backing managers and Rafa would have his own signings. Hey I agree he will go when a club come along that look like they know what they are doing, West Ham though are not that club. Money talks though, if they pay up the break clause and offer Rafa a salary equal to one he's on here, you would be crazy not to worry that he will take it but it's not because West Ham are better run than us because they are not, those two jokers don't have the wealth of Ashley either, so he'll be working under the same restrictions of spending what the club makes. It'll be either a choice between the "grass is greener" or "better the devil you know for him". That's why he may very well decide to sit it out and wait for a better situation to open up, he can surely pick and chose his options. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
midds Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 Rafa keeping this squad up would be a better achievement than promoting us last season. Not that I'm sure he'll be around to see it through like... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest firetotheworks Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 Agree to disagree. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
xLiaaamx Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 Not sure Gold and Sullivan will ever let the manager completely decide who he gets. Love their mercenaries them two. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wallace Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 Not sure Gold and Sullivan will ever let the manager completely decide who he gets. Love their mercenaries them two. They are very close to an agent or two which influences a lot of their buys and a lot of the players are bought by Sullivan rather than the manager. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
afar Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 Rafa keeping this squad up would be a better achievement than promoting us last season. Not that I'm sure he'll be around to see it through like... Yeah that's not true like, there's a lot of dross at the bottom of the PL. Getting up was a major achievement that had the potential to be career threatening for Rafa, he was expected to get us up, now he's working under an owner that has not backed him, a lot less pressure on him and a lot easier to play the style of counter attacking football he likes. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
midds Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 Rafa keeping this squad up would be a better achievement than promoting us last season. Not that I'm sure he'll be around to see it through like... Yeah that's not true like, there's a lot of dross at the bottom of the PL. Getting up was a major achievement that had the potential to be career threatening for Rafa, he was expected to get us up, now he's working under an owner that has not backed him, a lot less pressure on him and a lot easier to play the style of counter attacking football he likes. We'll see. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happinesstan Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 Rafa keeping this squad up would be a better achievement than promoting us last season. Not that I'm sure he'll be around to see it through like... Yeah that's not true like, there's a lot of dross at the bottom of the PL. Getting up was a major achievement that had the potential to be career threatening for Rafa, he was expected to get us up, now he's working under an owner that has not backed him, a lot less pressure on him and a lot easier to play the style of counter attacking football he likes. Ah. All a cunning plan to reduce the pressure on Rafa, so he can go on and do a Ranieri. I like it. And it might work. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mozy Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 I still think Rafa will keep this squad up with his eyes closed, however we will always think what could have been if Ashley and chums actually cared about the club. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Banaloona Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 The only movement in or out on transfer deadline day saw two loan moves for players who had been told they had no future at the club: Tim Krul - a season-long loan move to Brighton. Achraf Lazaar - a season-long loan move to Italians Benevento. That'll help our bid to avoid relegation.... A year ago today we were congratulating everyone involved for the completion of 45 deals (including five contract extensions) that set up what ultimately proved to be a successful promotion campaign. But this Summer's transfer window couldn't be more different. It has been a complete shambles and everyone associated with the club: the owner, management, agents and players have all contributed to an incredible lack of professionalism even for this club. It can hang its head in shame as a dispirited squad now faces a season of struggle. This looks like a re-run of Summer 2012 when we only brought in Vurnon Anita and then had to panic buy when we got to January in 15th. Sadly the world - and the Premier League - has moved on and we won't be so fortunate this time round. These penny pinchers are gambling with our future yet again - Premier League survival on a shoestring - having twice come a cropper and sailed close to the wind on a few other occasions. But we can't absolve Rafa Benitez from some of the blame as a lot of his signings needed to be unloaded and disgruntled and mismanaged players still remain at the club. To be without a first team left back until January and to offload an international goalkeeper without a replacement is something that few of us expected from this regime. Whatever positivity was at the club in May after winning the Championship, it has dissipated in just three months. That seemed unthinkable. What an irony that Benitez returned from a prestigious UEFA coaching forum to try and manage a club with absolutely no ambition and run like a pub side.... If anyone mentions the word hindsight in May 2018 should disaster strike again then we will not be responsible for our actions. It will have been totally predictable and preventable. The transfer window closed at 11pm on Thursday, here's a recap of what Toon-related business had been completed before then: Inbound: Christian Atsu bought Florian Lejeune bought Jacob Murphy bought Javier Manquillo bought Mikel Merino loaned (with option to buy) Joselu bought Outbound: Vurnon Anita released Sammy Ameobi released Yoan Gouffran released Haris Vuckic released Lubo Satka released Florian Thauvin sold Kevin Mbabu sold Matz Sels loaned Adam Armstrong loaned Daryl Murphy sold Ivan Toney loaned Emmanuel Riviere released Siem De Jong sold Grant Hanley sold Achraf Lazaar loaned Tim Krul loaned This needs highlighting more. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
afar Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 Rafa keeping this squad up would be a better achievement than promoting us last season. Not that I'm sure he'll be around to see it through like... Yeah that's not true like, there's a lot of dross at the bottom of the PL. Getting up was a major achievement that had the potential to be career threatening for Rafa, he was expected to get us up, now he's working under an owner that has not backed him, a lot less pressure on him and a lot easier to play the style of counter attacking football he likes. We'll see. What is there to see ? You are totally under playing the fabulous effort it was to get us up last year, Rafa took a huge personal gamble, had he failed his career would have gone Moyes like. The bulk of the clubs at the bottom of the PL are not that much better than those at the top of Champ, get 40 - 50 points to get safe is not that much more difficult than having to slog through the 46 game Champ season, when every week the other team has their cup final, with Jack Colback and Yoann Gouffran in your team. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest firetotheworks Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 There really isn't a lot of dross in the Premier League anymore, like. Now that the likes of Sunderland, Hull, Villa, Boro, Norwich have gone, and we're the only team not to have made any significant signings around the bottom, we're the dross. And we've already lost to one of our rivals. We have a Championship squad and a Champions League manager, without him we're almost certain favourites for the drop. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
afar Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 I still think Rafa will keep this squad up with his eyes closed, however we will always think what could have been if Ashley and chums actually cared about the club. Spot on. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happinesstan Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 The only movement in or out on transfer deadline day saw two loan moves for players who had been told they had no future at the club: Tim Krul - a season-long loan move to Brighton. Achraf Lazaar - a season-long loan move to Italians Benevento. That'll help our bid to avoid relegation.... A year ago today we were congratulating everyone involved for the completion of 45 deals (including five contract extensions) that set up what ultimately proved to be a successful promotion campaign. But this Summer's transfer window couldn't be more different. It has been a complete shambles and everyone associated with the club: the owner, management, agents and players have all contributed to an incredible lack of professionalism even for this club. It can hang its head in shame as a dispirited squad now faces a season of struggle. This looks like a re-run of Summer 2012 when we only brought in Vurnon Anita and then had to panic buy when we got to January in 15th. Sadly the world - and the Premier League - has moved on and we won't be so fortunate this time round. These penny pinchers are gambling with our future yet again - Premier League survival on a shoestring - having twice come a cropper and sailed close to the wind on a few other occasions. But we can't absolve Rafa Benitez from some of the blame as a lot of his signings needed to be unloaded and disgruntled and mismanaged players still remain at the club. To be without a first team left back until January and to offload an international goalkeeper without a replacement is something that few of us expected from this regime. Whatever positivity was at the club in May after winning the Championship, it has dissipated in just three months. That seemed unthinkable. What an irony that Benitez returned from a prestigious UEFA coaching forum to try and manage a club with absolutely no ambition and run like a pub side.... If anyone mentions the word hindsight in May 2018 should disaster strike again then we will not be responsible for our actions. It will have been totally predictable and preventable. The transfer window closed at 11pm on Thursday, here's a recap of what Toon-related business had been completed before then: Inbound: Christian Atsu bought Florian Lejeune bought Jacob Murphy bought Javier Manquillo bought Mikel Merino loaned (with option to buy) Joselu bought Outbound: Vurnon Anita released Sammy Ameobi released Yoan Gouffran released Haris Vuckic released Lubo Satka released Florian Thauvin sold Kevin Mbabu sold Matz Sels loaned Adam Armstrong loaned Daryl Murphy sold Ivan Toney loaned Emmanuel Riviere released Siem De Jong sold Grant Hanley sold Achraf Lazaar loaned Tim Krul loaned This needs highlighting more. 4 out of 17 were his signings, 2 of whom were signed specifically for the champo. But yeah highlight that over the fact that the other 13 were responsible for holding him back in the transfer market. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
afar Posted August 31, 2017 Share Posted August 31, 2017 Yeah I don't get that from nufc.com, none of this shambles is Rafa's fault, yes he had some failures in the market, but which manager hasn't ? You absolutely need to absolve him from any blame here, it's all completely on the shoulders of the owner and his lackies. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stottie Posted September 1, 2017 Share Posted September 1, 2017 The "Rafa bought a load of shite too" argument is wrong. He's done wonders to shift all the deadwood we had from beforehand in so little time. (Does "released" for Riviere mean a free transfer?) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zero Posted September 1, 2017 Share Posted September 1, 2017 Even though i saw this coming it doesn't make me any more dissapointed or angry. It's very clear now that Ashley and his cock slaves are trying to force Rafa to resign. Rafa thought he had a good relationship with Charnley but i'm sure he realised today that the little worm has been leading him along the whole time. Getting rid of Carr and putting the new "head of recruitment" was purely to try and appease Rafa in the short term after we failed to get any early transfer work done, i wouldn't be surprised to see him get the boot once Rafa is gone. This Justin Barnes c*** that's been brought in is only there to make sure Ashley doesn't get taken to court again and to make things awkward for Rafa, they're hoping Rafa won't be able to take any more and walk, or just as good he takes another job and the fat man scores for some compo. If these rodents all die a slow, painful and humiliating death i'd be ok with that. ? Mike Ashley feels threatened by anyone who is popular with the fans - Keegan, Shearer, Hughton and now Rafa all forced out and treat like s***. Even popular players with an opinion get shown the door (Nolan, Barton etc.). It's much easier for him to appoint a yes man and use him as s*** deflecter, no matter how useless he is. Thinking about who our next manager is gona be genuinely makes me feel sick. Whoever it is, i won't be "giving him a chance" i'm afraid! Top post Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Toon Posted September 1, 2017 Share Posted September 1, 2017 Wey not to worry. Only 18 league games left until the window slams open again. The remaining 17 league games after that maybe seeing a couple of quid thrown at it to try and salvage another season of PL lolly for the fat man. Something tells me that things wont go as smoothly as he thinks from now on. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmonkey Posted September 1, 2017 Share Posted September 1, 2017 Even though i saw this coming it doesn't make me any more dissapointed or angry. It's very clear now that Ashley and his cock slaves are trying to force Rafa to resign. Rafa thought he had a good relationship with Charnley but i'm sure he realised today that the little worm has been leading him along the whole time. Getting rid of Carr and putting the new "head of recruitment" was purely to try and appease Rafa in the short term after we failed to get any early transfer work done, i wouldn't be surprised to see him get the boot once Rafa is gone. This Justin Barnes c*** that's been brought in is only there to make sure Ashley doesn't get taken to court again and to make things awkward for Rafa, they're hoping Rafa won't be able to take any more and walk, or just as good he takes another job and the fat man scores for some compo. If these rodents all die a slow, painful and humiliating death i'd be ok with that. ? Mike Ashley feels threatened by anyone who is popular with the fans - Keegan, Shearer, Hughton and now Rafa all forced out and treat like s***. Even popular players with an opinion get shown the door (Nolan, Barton etc.). It's much easier for him to appoint a yes man and use him as s*** deflecter, no matter how useless he is. Thinking about who our next manager is gona be genuinely makes me feel sick. Whoever it is, i won't be "giving him a chance" i'm afraid! If Ashley wanted rid of Rafa because he's popular, then why not get rid after promotion when talks were held to persuade Rafa to stay? He could, in theory, have parted ways with Rafa and brought in a puppet with barely a murmur of discontent (most of us would have considered it a real possibility that Rafa would leave after what happened in January). Could have put out news stories about Rafa wanting to move on or wanting different challenges compared to what NUFC can offer to placate fans. Obviously we don't know if contract clauses would have affected those discussions, though if Rafa was unhappy with the discussions what other option would he have had other than to leave? And whilst I imagine Rafa allegedly communicating his unhappiness with the transfer situation through the media during the summer may have irked Ashley, Rafa did the same in January, so it's nothing new. Nothing makes sense with Ashley. There's many possibilities, but one of them that I won't rule out just yet is that this is all to do with not wanting to spend until the money is actually received and banked. Wishful thinking probably, but it's still a possibility. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
afar Posted September 1, 2017 Share Posted September 1, 2017 Even though i saw this coming it doesn't make me any more dissapointed or angry. It's very clear now that Ashley and his cock slaves are trying to force Rafa to resign. Rafa thought he had a good relationship with Charnley but i'm sure he realised today that the little worm has been leading him along the whole time. Getting rid of Carr and putting the new "head of recruitment" was purely to try and appease Rafa in the short term after we failed to get any early transfer work done, i wouldn't be surprised to see him get the boot once Rafa is gone. This Justin Barnes c*** that's been brought in is only there to make sure Ashley doesn't get taken to court again and to make things awkward for Rafa, they're hoping Rafa won't be able to take any more and walk, or just as good he takes another job and the fat man scores for some compo. If these rodents all die a slow, painful and humiliating death i'd be ok with that. ? Mike Ashley feels threatened by anyone who is popular with the fans - Keegan, Shearer, Hughton and now Rafa all forced out and treat like s***. Even popular players with an opinion get shown the door (Nolan, Barton etc.). It's much easier for him to appoint a yes man and use him as s*** deflecter, no matter how useless he is. Thinking about who our next manager is gona be genuinely makes me feel sick. Whoever it is, i won't be "giving him a chance" i'm afraid! If Ashley wanted rid of Rafa because he's popular, then why not get rid after promotion when talks were held to persuade Rafa to stay? He could, in theory, have parted ways with Rafa and brought in a puppet with barely a murmur of discontent (most of us would have considered it a real possibility that Rafa would leave after what happened in January). Could have put out news stories about Rafa wanting to move on or wanting different challenges compared to what NUFC can offer to placate fans. Obviously we don't know if contract clauses would have affected those discussions, though if Rafa was unhappy with the discussions what other option would he have had other than to leave? And whilst I imagine Rafa allegedly communicating his unhappiness with the transfer situation through the media during the summer may have irked Ashley, Rafa did the same in January, so it's nothing new. Nothing makes sense with Ashley. There's many possibilities, but one of them that I won't rule out just yet is that this is all to do with not wanting to spend until the money is actually received and banked. Wishful thinking probably, but it's still a possibility. I think that is absolutely the case, despite this TV money being guaranteed he's standing to his stance that Rafa can have all the money that we make but no more. The thing that will piss of Rafa most though is the mixed messages he's undoubtedly received, expected to be able to spend that 30 million plus he made last window, expected to be able to spend the upcoming PL TV money, told to ship players out to cut the wage bill, but then not able to secure replacements for the players left. Gibbs was a strange one for me, we were in for him at the start of the window, he goes to Stoke and doesn't agree terms but then ends up at WBA for 7 million. That's a figure surely we should have been all over, but we didn't appear to be interested yet we were desperate for a LB. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zero Posted September 1, 2017 Share Posted September 1, 2017 The LB situation is strange. To me it seems like we don't want to spend any money for a cover. In other words, we are more than satisfied to have Dummett as our starting LB, contrary to most people belief here. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sean Posted September 1, 2017 Share Posted September 1, 2017 The LB situation is strange. To me it seems like we don't want to spend any money for a cover. In other words, we are more than satisfied to have Dummett as our starting LB, contrary to most people belief here. Ashley is. Rafa wanted players ffs. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
nufc4eva Posted September 1, 2017 Share Posted September 1, 2017 I don't actually believe our squad is a sack of shit, however I do believe that we don't have enough game changers or players that fit the number 10 role and no good left back at the club. He should have been able to spend 20 million on an attacking player at least and Gibbs should have been bought. I'm not sure if we will stay up, but I think it will be a lack of goals scored that does it initially. I doubt we will get hammered at any point but will struggle if we ever go a goal down because we lack the attacking players to get us those points. Ultimately Rafa will leave. In fact he will probably get hounded out by our fans as some of the nuggets will fail to see the deficiencies in the squad and how he has not been backed Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts