Rafa Benítez (now unemployed)

[Guest Howaythetoon]

I've seen a few comments saying we have the worst squad in the league.. is it really weaker than burnleys?

 

I think it is the worst and arguably one of the worst we’ve ever seen from a Premier League Newcastle United, especially in terms of ability. But again, we cannot just use that as an excuse to accept well this is the way it is. Ironically Rafa isn’t, hence the chopping and changing and this and that tactic or deployment of a player in a certain role. He’s trying to find answers to the problems that having a poor squad of average players brings. But... it’s almost halfway through the season and he is no closer to finding the right solution with the players he has and that’s what worries me. Again, I get the feeling many on here are just waiting for a takeover and using that not so much as an excuse, but a reason why we are playing crap and dropping down the table or why certain players are being used and that this will all change post takeover. Fair enough, but if a takeover doesn’t happen and no investment in new players doesn’t materialise, I’d be massively pissed off if this is the way it goes til the end of the season.

[AyeDubbleYoo]

It seems massively unlikely that the takeover will happen in time to increase January spending. We might still be allowed to spend a little bit if Ashley is worried about relegation affecting the value of the club.

[Guest Howaythetoon]

It seems massively unlikely that the takeover will happen in time to increase January spending. We might still be allowed to spend a little bit if Ashley is worried about relegation affecting the value of the club.

 

We obviously need major investment on top quality players all over the park, but say he was given just 15m in January, what would people want him to do? I’d personally prefer it if we spent all that on just one player with something a bit special about them because such a player can transform a team. I remember when we bought Bellamy and Robert for then decent money and some of the arguments were that those 2 were not enough, that the team was poor or average and we needed more quality, but those two transformed us. I’d happily settle for say blowing 15m on another Robert or Bellamy type of player in the sense of them transforming us rather than on a few squad filler type players.

[Ikon]

Also, Burnley have been in it for longer since we got relegated.

[AyeDubbleYoo]

It seems massively unlikely that the takeover will happen in time to increase January spending. We might still be allowed to spend a little bit if Ashley is worried about relegation affecting the value of the club.

 

We obviously need major investment on top quality players all over the park, but say he was given just 15m in January, what would people want him to do? I’d personally prefer it if we spent all that on just one player with something a bit special about them because such a player can transform a team. I remember when we bought Bellamy and Robert for then decent money and some of the arguments were that those 2 were not enough, that the team was poor or average and we needed more quality, but those two transformed us. I’d happily settle for say blowing 15m on another Robert or Bellamy type of player in the sense of them transforming us rather than on a few squad filler type players.

 

A number ten would be a good addition, or a striker. But the amount of money we'll have probably means neither will be guaranteed to be successful. A couple more options would at least take the edge off the squad weakness until the takeover is done.

[mighty__mag]

I've seen a few comments saying we have the worst squad in the league.. is it really weaker than burnleys?

 

I think the Souness prem side was as bad if not worse.

 

Burnley are a unit, they play for each other. I think with some of the lads here now and the way they get isolated by Rafa it cant help unity. You would have to be very thick skinned and ultra diciplined to be managed like this. Mourinho is similar with his players. If you cant handle it get out. It must frustrate the life out of some lads though that sit on the bench for 3 months for 1 bad game, while another player has numerous bad games and still gets picked, I think that would be the signal its personal then?

[Dave]

It seems massively unlikely that the takeover will happen in time to increase January spending. We might still be allowed to spend a little bit if Ashley is worried about relegation affecting the value of the club.

 

I actually now think we'll spend either way IMO. This form cannot be ignored, irrespective of manager or takeover talk.

 

If the takeover comes off I simply expect more money to be made available up front, nothing staggering.

[Guest Howaythetoon]

I've seen a few comments saying we have the worst squad in the league.. is it really weaker than burnleys?

 

Definitely imo

 

The thing about this squad is every player has a question mark over them. The team that faced Chelsea:

 

Darlow - signed from Forest, effectively a Championship player a few years ago.

Manquillo - was playing on loan to the mackems last season.

Mbemba - signed from Anderlecht who play in a poor league and has rarely featured under Rafa.

Lejune - signed from a mid-table La Liga side and is new to the league.

Clarke - relegated with Villa where he wasn’t a first team regular to start with.

Ritchie - a few years back he was playing in league two and was signed from Bournemouth, new to the PL who finished 16th.

Murphy - signed from the Championship, young and new to the league.

Diame - signed from Hull who had just went up from the Championship, a bit of a journey man who hasn’t been a regular under Rafa.

Merino - signed from Dortmund reserves, young and new to the league.

Perez - signed from the equivalent of the Spanish Championship as a development player.

Gayle- signed from Palace reserves, a bit of a journey man.

 

Subs:

 

Yedlin - signed from Spurs reserves, young and quite new to the league.

Hayden - signed from Arsenal reserves, young and quite new to the league.

Shelvey - signed from Swansea, wasn’t always a regular and has came from the lower leagues.

 

Delve even deeper o to our squad a you will find a similar theme with all of our players. It’s obvious that there has been a chronic lack of serious investment in the playing squad since Ashley took over. We don’t compete for players with other clubs, we don’t pay top end wages and we haven’t broken our transfer record which stands at over a decade.

 

If we stay up with this squad, it will be an achievement.

[Greg]

I've seen a few comments saying we have the worst squad in the league.. is it really weaker than burnleys?

 

I think the Souness prem side was as bad if not worse.

 

 

The Souness side was shite because Souness was an idiot. Talent and ability wise it was a million miles better than this one.

 

Shay Given, Kieron Dyer, Craig Bellamy, Patrick Kluivert, Laurent Robert, Emre etc. I could go on but the talent in that squad compared to what we have now, the difference is monumental.

[mighty__mag]

I've seen a few comments saying we have the worst squad in the league.. is it really weaker than burnleys?

 

I think the Souness prem side was as bad if not worse.

 

 

The Souness side was shite because Souness was an idiot. Talent and ability wise it was a million miles better than this one.

 

Shay Given, Kieron Dyer, Craig Bellamy, Patrick Kluivert, Laurent Robert, Emre etc. I could go on but the talent in that squad compared to what we have now, the difference is monumental.

 

Sorry yeah, I was talking after the lunatic flogged half if not all those players you said.

 

He had utter dross toward the end of his time, It should actually read Roeder then, as it was him who picked up the shit Souness left behind.

 

 

[triggs]

I've seen a few comments saying we have the worst squad in the league.. is it really weaker than burnleys?

 

Definitely imo

 

The thing about this squad is every player has a question mark over them. The team that faced Chelsea:

 

Darlow - signed from Forest, effectively a Championship player a few years ago.

Manquillo - was playing on loan to the mackems last season.

Mbemba - signed from Anderlecht who play in a poor league and has rarely featured under Rafa.

Lejune - signed from a mid-table La Liga side and is new to the league.

Clarke - relegated with Villa where he wasn’t a first team regular to start with.

Ritchie - a few years back he was playing in league two and was signed from Bournemouth, new to the PL who finished 16th.

Murphy - signed from the Championship, young and new to the league.

Diame - signed from Hull who had just went up from the Championship, a bit of a journey man who hasn’t been a regular under Rafa.

Merino - signed from Dortmund reserves, young and new to the league.

Perez - signed from the equivalent of the Spanish Championship as a development player.

Gayle- signed from Palace reserves, a bit of a journey man.

 

Subs:

 

Yedlin - signed from Spurs reserves, young and quite new to the league.

Hayden - signed from Arsenal reserves, young and quite new to the league.

Shelvey - signed from Swansea, wasn’t always a regular and has came from the lower leagues.

 

Delve even deeper o to our squad a you will find a similar theme with all of our players. It’s obvious that there has been a chronic lack of serious investment in the playing squad since Ashley took over. We don’t compete for players with other clubs, we don’t pay top end wages and we haven’t broken our transfer record which stands at over a decade.

 

If we stay up with this squad, it will be an achievement.

Saying Shelvey came from the lower leagues is a bit disingenuous mind. He started at Charlton but made his debut at 16 and was at Liverpool by the time he was 18. Its like saying Dele Alli came from the lower leagues when rating the Spurs squad

[Greg]

I've seen a few comments saying we have the worst squad in the league.. is it really weaker than burnleys?

 

I think the Souness prem side was as bad if not worse.

 

 

The Souness side was s**** because Souness was an idiot. Talent and ability wise it was a million miles better than this one.

 

Shay Given, Kieron Dyer, Craig Bellamy, Patrick Kluivert, Laurent Robert, Emre etc. I could go on but the talent in that squad compared to what we have now, the difference is monumental.

 

Sorry yeah, I was talking after the lunatic flogged half if not all those players you said.

 

He had utter dross toward the end of his time, It should actually read Roeder then, as it was him who picked up the s*** Souness left behind.

 

 

 

Still on another level to what we have now.

 

Given, Dyer, Solano, Emre, Martins, Owen, Milner, Parker etc.

[triggs]

The only squad we've had in terms of quality similar to this one in the PL that I can remember is the Pardew/Carver season, but I think the league has improved as a whole since then

[Guest Howaythetoon]

I've seen a few comments saying we have the worst squad in the league.. is it really weaker than burnleys?

 

I think the Souness prem side was as bad if not worse.

 

Burnley are a unit, they play for each other. I think with some of the lads here now and the way they get isolated by Rafa it cant help unity. You would have to be very thick skinned and ultra diciplined to be managed like this. Mourinho is similar with his players. If you cant handle it get out. It must frustrate the life out of some lads though that sit on the bench for 3 months for 1 bad game, while another player has numerous bad games and still gets picked, I think that would be the signal its personal then?

 

No way. We had Shay Given, Nobby Solano, Bellamy, Robert, Shearer, Owen, Luque, Emre, Parker etc. That was a poor team in terms of performances, but it was mismanaged and badly so. Basically it’s failure was down to Souness. Every one of the players if fit and on form would walk into our team.

 

If you could compare this squad to any it would be Hughton’s promotion side, but it contained a few players that stood out and had a very good spine to it which we lack at the moment. The then Harper, Colo, Enrique, Tiote, Jonas, Ben Arfa, Nolan, Carroll and even Routledge and Shola would get into this side. Even some of the back up players would be better.

 

Sadly Pardew was given the best NUFC squad of players to work with under Ashley and he failed miserably. The then likes of Ba, Remy, Santon, Cabaye et al would transform our side today.

[triggs]

The only squad we've had in terms of quality similar to this one in the PL that I can remember is the Pardew/Carver season, but I think the league has improved as a whole since then

 

I feel like this is the first one in ages without a single player who can just make something happen. We've always had at least one recently, and right now we have zero

Don't want to get into an argument about it again but I think people underrated how important Sissoko was in getting us up the pitch.  Even if the end product wasn't always there he'd at least get us into the final third and win a corner or something. I think our biggest issue now is just getting ourselves up into the final third

[Guest Howaythetoon]

I've seen a few comments saying we have the worst squad in the league.. is it really weaker than burnleys?

 

Definitely imo

 

The thing about this squad is every player has a question mark over them. The team that faced Chelsea:

 

Darlow - signed from Forest, effectively a Championship player a few years ago.

Manquillo - was playing on loan to the mackems last season.

Mbemba - signed from Anderlecht who play in a poor league and has rarely featured under Rafa.

Lejune - signed from a mid-table La Liga side and is new to the league.

Clarke - relegated with Villa where he wasn’t a first team regular to start with.

Ritchie - a few years back he was playing in league two and was signed from Bournemouth, new to the PL who finished 16th.

Murphy - signed from the Championship, young and new to the league.

Diame - signed from Hull who had just went up from the Championship, a bit of a journey man who hasn’t been a regular under Rafa.

Merino - signed from Dortmund reserves, young and new to the league.

Perez - signed from the equivalent of the Spanish Championship as a development player.

Gayle- signed from Palace reserves, a bit of a journey man.

 

Subs:

 

Yedlin - signed from Spurs reserves, young and quite new to the league.

Hayden - signed from Arsenal reserves, young and quite new to the league.

Shelvey - signed from Swansea, wasn’t always a regular and has came from the lower leagues.

 

Delve even deeper o to our squad a you will find a similar theme with all of our players. It’s obvious that there has been a chronic lack of serious investment in the playing squad since Ashley took over. We don’t compete for players with other clubs, we don’t pay top end wages and we haven’t broken our transfer record which stands at over a decade.

 

If we stay up with this squad, it will be an achievement.

Saying Shelvey came from the lower leagues is a bit disingenuous mind. He started at Charlton but made his debut at 16 and was at Liverpool by the time he was 18. Its like saying Dele Alli came from the lower leagues when rating the Spurs squad

 

The point still stands, as correct as you are, in that all of our players signed, all have come from a lower level of football be it with their then team, their then league or because they were mainly a reserve.

[joeyt]

Aren't most players that have been signed for teams that are not in the top 6 or whatever usually from the lower leagues or signed from a top team because they can''t get into it and have to drop back to get a game?

[Guest Howaythetoon]

The only squad we've had in terms of quality similar to this one in the PL that I can remember is the Pardew/Carver season, but I think the league has improved as a whole since then

 

I feel like this is the first one in ages without a single player who can just make something happen. We've always had at least one recently, and right now we have zero

Don't want to get into an argument about it again but I think people underrated how important Sissoko was in getting us up the pitch.  Even if the end product wasn't always there he'd at least get us into the final third and win a corner or something. I think our biggest issue now is just getting ourselves up into the final third

 

I don’t rate him at all and think he’s shite, but unfortunately he would be an asset to this team, mainly because of things you pointed out.

[Guest Howaythetoon]

Aren't most players that have been signed for teams that are not in the top 6 or whatever usually from the lower leagues or signed from a top team because they can''t get into it and have to drop back to get a game?

 

Aye, but we kind of go to the extreme and that’s all we seem to sign. I’m also pointing out the difference between Ashley’s NUFC and the one before that where we would compete with other clubs for players and actually sign quality proven established players. Parker and Duff were not exactly first teamers at Chelsea admittedly when we bought them, but they were highly coveted by others. IIRC Spurs and Everton wanted both, but they couldn’t compete with us financially. Luque was a star player for Deportivo and Martins was regarded as one of the hottest talents in Serie A. Owen was one of Europe’s most feared strikers when we bought him. Emre was arguably Turkey’s best players.

[Figures 1-0 Football]

“Rafa is shit because he is stubborn and wont play 4-4-2”

*Rafa plays 4-4-2*

the same people...

“Rafa is shit because he changes things”

 

“Mbemba has to play, Rafa is so stubborn”

*Mbemba plays*

the same people...

“Rafa should never have put Mbemba in”

 

 

Some people will never be happy. We have a world class manager trying to get the most out of a Championship squad in the Premier League. We’re losing games based on individual mistakes rather than tactical problems, we cant drop the players making those mistakes, because the players behind them are even worse.

[Guest]

That wasn't the Newcastle Ashley bought though. Duff only came here because he wouldn't sign for Spurs and Shepherd thought he'd blagged a bargain, Martins was a panic buy because Shearer retired, Owen was injured and first choices like Kuyt and Viduka wouldn't come (remember the Milner fiasco). Apart from that, we had Sibierski who was probably at a lower point in his career or similar to Joselu today, Srnicek, Rossi, Bernard and then Onyewu came in.

[tmonkey]

This is why Rafa should really have quit after the last transfer window debacle, as memories are short in this sport. 3 months after being left with a dire squad full of Championship standard players and peanuts to spend on 8th/9th/10th choice targets who noone else wanted (since we won't compete with the likes of Swansea for wages for loanees like Abraham) and the knives are already out for him.

[Disco]

While Rafa is not totally blamless in it. I think it is clear that the 3 promotion teams and Swansea have notably weaker squads than the rest of the league and it's tantamount to the good work done by the 3 promoted teams they're clear of the bottom 3.

 

That said West Ham have the weakest structure as a whole as like us in 08/09 they're just a collection of name individuals on huge contracts with not a care in the world.

[Guest Howaythetoon]

The knives are not out for him, typical hyperbole on here and it seems you cannot question him and if you do you are spoilt, don’t deserve him yada yada...

 

I’m arguably one of his biggest fans, the man is a genius as far as I’m concerned, but he is not infallible or beyond questioning. I guarantee, if we had better players and were much higher up the table and playing poorly and losing games, the very same people basically telling people to be happy, would be the first to offer critical analysis.

 

No one is writing him off. No-one is saying he’s doing a bad job or wanting him out, let’s get that straight.

[Guest Howaythetoon]

That wasn't the Newcastle Ashley bought though. Duff only came here because he wouldn't sign for Spurs and Shepherd thought he'd blagged a bargain, Martins was a panic buy because Shearer retired, Owen was injured and first choices like Kuyt and Viduka wouldn't come (remember the Milner fiasco). Apart from that, we had Sibierski who was probably at a lower point in his career or similar to Joselu today, Srnicek, Rossi, Bernard and then Onyewu came in.

 

Duff came here because we offered him better wages and although I personally felt he was a busted flush when we did sign him, he still managed 40 appearances for the Champions before we signed him. He was in high demand and was regarded as a top PL player.

 

Martins was kind of a panic buy, he was way down on our list for sure, but at the time he was still one of the hottest prospects in Serie A.

 

Anyway my point was is that before Ashley we generally tried to compete for players, proven quality players, and we often paid the going rate. The likes of Sibierski were signed because we had to reign in the excess of the Souness era and because quite frankly, I don’t think FS valued Roeder enough to give him money.