Newcastle United 0-1 Manchester City - 27/12/17 - Post-match reaction from pg.26

[Guest ElCid]

Some of the comments man dear me no wonder other fans think we are deluded. Trying to make out it was a masterful performance just because coty didn’t have their shooting boots with them. And as for people still actually questioning what chances ???

[Heron]

Don't think anyone has said it was some sort of masterful performance tbh. I just think people see why we did what we did and why it nearly worked.

 

For what it's worth, virtually every team in the division has lost regardless how they've played against City, so there's no need for anyone to be condescending about the opinions in here. Cause ultimately none of the tactics deployed by any team are working.

 

It simply boils down to their wealth in strength in depth and other teams inability to compete and that is purely down to money.

[Paully]

https://twitter.com/bigchrisholt/status/946502350428168192

[loki679]

Whatever happened to Happy Face?  Haven't seen him post for ages.

[xLiaaamx]

People keep saying how many chances they missed, but it felt more like them passing it around outside the box for ages rather than chance after chance. 

[Mr Logic]

There's no getting past the first 30 odd minutes were, at the very least, disconcerting. We didn't have the benefit of knowing the game plan and it was hard to see there was any sense at all in playing that way. It wasn't particularly well executed, or was it, I don't know what Rafa told them. I think there was a certain amount of nerves and the three players who had the responsibility as outlets struggled in that period. Maybe Rafa considered pressing the ball might open us up even more considering the quality of some of their passing.

 

I think there are three ways to look at it.

 

We were lucky not to be 3 down at half-time.

My god , we could have won that. Aarons and Gayle (twice).

 

Both of those are perspectives, equally valid depending on how you choose to view it. The truth is it could have ended either way.

 

The third way, and imo the balanced perspective, we lost 1-0 to a team that have been turning over pretty much everyone they played. Not bad.

 

Viewing the first 30m in isolation is horrible, but the whole game? I think we did alright and the players may even have increased in confidence a little despite the loss, hopefully that is what the backroom team are telling them.

 

 

 

 

[loki679]

It's nonsense.  If you said before the game that we should open up and attack them you'd be rightly decried as an idiot.

 

Rafa and the team were a hair away from getting us a point against possibly the best team the PL has ever seen, a team who are steamrollering their way through much better teams than us, a team whose winger cost more than our entire first XI.

[Guest Howaythetoon]

It's nonsense.  If you said before the game that we should open up and attack them you'd be rightly decried as an idiot.

 

Rafa and the team were a hair away from getting us a point against possibly the best team the PL has ever seen, a team who are steamrollering their way through much better teams than us, a team whose winger cost more than our entire first XI.

 

For the 100th time, no one asked for the team to go at them, but those 35 first half minutes man were appalling, just nothing but kicking the ball away when it come to us. We didn’t even close them down or put tackles in we just let them have the ball and invited them to do what they wanted to us. The fact they only scored one goal was a blessing in disguise and it kind of worked for us. It could so easily have been the other way around though.

 

I’ve rewatched the first half and again, we were abysmal, the worst I’ve ever seen us play at home. Again not because we made mistakes or players were playing badly, just that we offered nothing and dint engage or try and compete with them.

 

Man City can be beaten by the way, you have to keep them out of the box, man mark De Bruyne and keep Sterling and Augeuro outside of the box also. It’s tough of course, but not impossible. They are a great side and arguably the best footballing side the PL has seen, but I feared Man Utd and Arsenal more in their prime because they could beat you by playing scrappy, by other means basically.

 

Every side let’s Man City have the ball and say do your worst like we did and they often do their worst. Can they play another way though? We don’t know because no-one has asked them to. I remember Fergie once saying he didn’t mind if a team set up against them defensively or offensively or if they wanted a battle because his team were able to basically out play anyone.

 

Henry said the same about Arsenal in their pomp.

 

By the way, that was probably why we didn’t win the league back in 95-96, because we could only play one way so it was all or nothing, meanwhile Man Utd we’re picking up 1-0 wins and grinding out results. We struggled against teams who could combat our offensive all out attacking style.

 

I do find it kind of embarrasing for the so called best league in the world to have a side that has won 17 games on the trot. Ironically it will probably be a Big Sam or someone who stops them in their tracks and the likes of Sky will hail him a tactical genius and no doubt say Man City need more English grit in there.

 

They are great to watch and from a footballing ideal in terms of playing, my kind of team, but I don’t like how it’s all come about nor the utter surrender to them from the opposition.

 

I know what KK would think going into a match against them...

[Dr Venkman]

Some of the comments man dear me no wonder other fans think we are deluded. Trying to make out it was a masterful performance just because coty didn’t have their shooting boots with them. And as for people still actually questioning what chances [emoji23][emoji23][emoji23]

 

I suppose it depends how you define a ‘chance’ to score. Personally, I don’t include shots from outside the box as a general rule. I was sitting parallel with our goal in the first half and I saw them score from an exquisite pass and a tight angle finish, a great save from Elliot from a set piece, and Aguero hit the post from outside the box. They didn’t seem to make much from open play other than long range shots and the goal. Going in at half time the general consensus where we were sitting was that the game plan worked well.

[healthyaddiction]

I hate to flog a long-dead horse, but all the arguments about how we could have been 3-4-5 down at half-time ignore one massive variable:

 

We have one of the greatest tacticians in the world in our dugout. He regularly changes tactics mid game, and HTT has repeatedly remarked on the 35 minutes thing. At that point our play changed - because Rafa changed the focus.

 

Therefore, assume that Aguero or De Breuyne had scored earlier - why do you think Rafa would not change strategy at that point? You assume he would continue with "As you were boys" instead of making tactical changes?

 

I just don't think it's sound arguing to ignore our greatest asset's greatest asset.

 

You can quote as many variables as you like the fact is that we could and should have been blown out of sight with the chances they missed. People mention the 35 minute mark but really there was no vast improvement until the subs were made. It has been flogged to death now though and there is a massive split in opinion on the game which won’t be changed. Healthy that there is discussion but I think we should all just leave it now and move on. I’m not going to change my opinion, HTT is not, you’re not and I doubt anyone else will either.

 

Actually, the fact is that we didn't

 

Also, changing opinions is moot anyway as it has no baring whatsoever on Benitez or the players or anything that happens on the pitch.

 

Well let’s all close the forum and all go home then!

What are these chances they should have blown us away with?

 

They had 4 good chances in that first half, scoring one of them. Anyway that’s not my point, my point is that when you totally surrender everything to a team like that you are just begging them to score and we all know from the past that when we do concede against the better teams we usually concede a few more. On another day those tactics would have lead to a half-time drubbing renderimg any second half game plan obsolete from our point of view and no doubt more and more goals against. We got lucky and as the game wore on we created chances of our own which would have happened anyway, City always give you a chance or two. Again I wasn’t looking for us to go at them from the off or go toe to toe, I just don’t like nor accept the total surrender at home that was those first 35 minutes or so. It’s suicide football far more than it would have been going at them as has been the argument well made on here. Just IMO of course. I’ll let sleeping dogs lie as it’s been argued to death now.

What were the four good chances? Genuinely not sure. The Aguero header was certainly not a wasted chance. It was a good header that was well saved. Maybe Aguero at the far post but that was really a half chance if anything. It wasn't easy at all.

 

We werent't lucky. We defended well and restricted them to long range shots. With the number of chances they had a goal is reasonable. No team scores 3 or 4 from the number of chances, and the type of chances they got.

[Guest Howaythetoon]

Well they scored from a ball over the top and at the near post, they hit the wood work a few times, Elliot made a fantastic save and they cut us to ribbons at will almost. It wasn’t attack after attack or save after save or chance after chance, but to say we limited them to half chances or whatever is highly misleading.

[Guest Howaythetoon]

I hate to flog a long-dead horse, but all the arguments about how we could have been 3-4-5 down at half-time ignore one massive variable:

 

We have one of the greatest tacticians in the world in our dugout. He regularly changes tactics mid game, and HTT has repeatedly remarked on the 35 minutes thing. At that point our play changed - because Rafa changed the focus.

 

Therefore, assume that Aguero or De Breuyne had scored earlier - why do you think Rafa would not change strategy at that point? You assume he would continue with "As you were boys" instead of making tactical changes?

 

I just don't think it's sound arguing to ignore our greatest asset's greatest asset.

 

You can quote as many variables as you like the fact is that we could and should have been blown out of sight with the chances they missed. People mention the 35 minute mark but really there was no vast improvement until the subs were made. It has been flogged to death now though and there is a massive split in opinion on the game which won’t be changed. Healthy that there is discussion but I think we should all just leave it now and move on. I’m not going to change my opinion, HTT is not, you’re not and I doubt anyone else will either.

 

Actually, the fact is that we didn't

 

Also, changing opinions is moot anyway as it has no baring whatsoever on Benitez or the players or anything that happens on the pitch.

 

Well let’s all close the forum and all go home then!

What are these chances they should have blown us away with?

 

They had 4 good chances in that first half, scoring one of them. Anyway that’s not my point, my point is that when you totally surrender everything to a team like that you are just begging them to score and we all know from the past that when we do concede against the better teams we usually concede a few more. On another day those tactics would have lead to a half-time drubbing renderimg any second half game plan obsolete from our point of view and no doubt more and more goals against. We got lucky and as the game wore on we created chances of our own which would have happened anyway, City always give you a chance or two. Again I wasn’t looking for us to go at them from the off or go toe to toe, I just don’t like nor accept the total surrender at home that was those first 35 minutes or so. It’s suicide football far more than it would have been going at them as has been the argument well made on here. Just IMO of course. I’ll let sleeping dogs lie as it’s been argued to death now.

What were the four good chances? Genuinely not sure. The Aguero header was certainly not a wasted chance. It was a good header that was well saved. Maybe Aguero at the far post but that was really a half chance if anything. It wasn't easy at all.

 

We werent't lucky. We defended well and restricted them to long range shots. With the number of chances they had a goal is reasonable. No team scores 3 or 4 from the number of chances, and the type of chances they got.

 

Define defending well... their first goal was down to a player ball watching and to be honest, defensively, you should not concede a goal like that as Elliot did. He wasn’t at fault of course, but I’d rule that one as a goal we could have done much better on, from the ball in to his position in goal. Whenever the ball did come in and we connected, it was to kick it as far away from our goal as possible rendering the midfield and attack obsolete. That’s not good defending, that’s just hacking it clear at all opportunities, anyone can do that. The second half now... that was much better defending!

[Dr Venkman]

It's nonsense.  If you said before the game that we should open up and attack them you'd be rightly decried as an idiot.

 

Rafa and the team were a hair away from getting us a point against possibly the best team the PL has ever seen, a team who are steamrollering their way through much better teams than us, a team whose winger cost more than our entire first XI.

 

I’ve rewatched the first half and again, we were abysmal, the worst I’ve ever seen us play at home.

 

I find this very hard to believe. I can think of the Portsmouth defeat under SA and the Liverpool 0-6 straight away. There must be plenty more.

[Gallowgate Toon]

People keep saying how many chances they missed, but it felt more like them passing it around outside the box for ages rather than chance after chance. 

 

They had 2 open play chances (1 being the goal) and 1 chance from a FK in the first half, iirc? Other good chances were a break and a long shot?

 

Saying that, I was pretty bored throughout large parts of the match so might have been forgetting opportunities Did feel like a lot of passing and fairly little penetration (lol) with the amount of possession they had.

 

In relation to most of their matches this season, they seemed to create less than normal?

[Guest Howaythetoon]

It's nonsense.  If you said before the game that we should open up and attack them you'd be rightly decried as an idiot.

 

Rafa and the team were a hair away from getting us a point against possibly the best team the PL has ever seen, a team who are steamrollering their way through much better teams than us, a team whose winger cost more than our entire first XI.

 

I’ve rewatched the first half and again, we were abysmal, the worst I’ve ever seen us play at home.

 

I find this very hard to believe. I can think of the Portsmouth defeat under SA and the Liverpool 0-6 straight away. There must be plenty more.

 

Nah, those were bad performances but again our players did fuck all on the ball, not a thing. It was literally 35 minutes of Man City knocking it about, scoring, threatening and us just kicking it away when it come to us. Nothing football.

[Dr Venkman]

It's nonsense.  If you said before the game that we should open up and attack them you'd be rightly decried as an idiot.

 

Rafa and the team were a hair away from getting us a point against possibly the best team the PL has ever seen, a team who are steamrollering their way through much better teams than us, a team whose winger cost more than our entire first XI.

 

I’ve rewatched the first half and again, we were abysmal, the worst I’ve ever seen us play at home.

 

I find this very hard to believe. I can think of the Portsmouth defeat under SA and the Liverpool 0-6 straight away. There must be plenty more.

 

Nah, those were bad performances but again our players did fuck all on the ball, not a thing. It was literally 35 minutes of Man City knocking it about, scoring, threatening and us just kicking it away when it come to us. Nothing football.

 

You’re saying it was the worst tactical display you’ve seen at home, not the worst performance.

[ujpest doza]

It's nonsense.  If you said before the game that we should open up and attack them you'd be rightly decried as an idiot.

 

Rafa and the team were a hair away from getting us a point against possibly the best team the PL has ever seen, a team who are steamrollering their way through much better teams than us, a team whose winger cost more than our entire first XI.

 

I’ve rewatched the first half and again, we were abysmal, the worst I’ve ever seen us play at home.

 

I find this very hard to believe. I can think of the Portsmouth defeat under SA and the Liverpool 0-6 straight away. There must be plenty more.

Them 2 yeah but over the years there's been tons more.

Charlton in 1991/92 when we cruised into a 3 nil lead and lost 4-3 comes to mind as do a couple of others including Charlton at home as well.

Coventry at home in 1988 the week after we'd won at Anfield was appalling.

 

[Guest Howaythetoon]

It's nonsense.  If you said before the game that we should open up and attack them you'd be rightly decried as an idiot.

 

Rafa and the team were a hair away from getting us a point against possibly the best team the PL has ever seen, a team who are steamrollering their way through much better teams than us, a team whose winger cost more than our entire first XI.

 

I’ve rewatched the first half and again, we were abysmal, the worst I’ve ever seen us play at home.

 

I find this very hard to believe. I can think of the Portsmouth defeat under SA and the Liverpool 0-6 straight away. There must be plenty more.

 

Nah, those were bad performances but again our players did f*** all on the ball, not a thing. It was literally 35 minutes of Man City knocking it about, scoring, threatening and us just kicking it away when it come to us. Nothing football.

 

You’re saying it was the worst tactical display you’ve seen at home, not the worst performance.

 

No I didn’t, there was no tactics unless you call camping out on your own box and hoofing it when we had the ball tactics. It was total surrender. Shelvey shooting from kick off was like saying this is our only opportunity to shoot.

[Hhtoon]

It's nonsense.  If you said before the game that we should open up and attack them you'd be rightly decried as an idiot.

 

Rafa and the team were a hair away from getting us a point against possibly the best team the PL has ever seen, a team who are steamrollering their way through much better teams than us, a team whose winger cost more than our entire first XI.

 

I’ve rewatched the first half and again, we were abysmal, the worst I’ve ever seen us play at home.

 

I find this very hard to believe. I can think of the Portsmouth defeat under SA and the Liverpool 0-6 straight away. There must be plenty more.

 

Nah, those were bad performances but again our players did f*** all on the ball, not a thing. It was literally 35 minutes of Man City knocking it about, scoring, threatening and us just kicking it away when it come to us. Nothing football.

 

You’re saying it was the worst tactical display you’ve seen at home, not the worst performance.

 

No I didn’t, there was no tactics unless you call camping out on your own box and hoofing it when we had the ball tactics. It was total surrender. Shelvey shooting from kick off was like saying this is our only opportunity to shoot.

 

How do you know there were no tactics and that the players just didn't execute them extremely poorly? i.e hoofing through nerves/lack of quality instead of passing to the (admittedly not many) outlets?

I believe Rafa did set the team up very defensively (ok, probably too much) but I bet he was as disappointed as anyone at the lack of composure shown.

[Guest ElCid]

It's nonsense.  If you said before the game that we should open up and attack them you'd be rightly decried as an idiot.

 

Rafa and the team were a hair away from getting us a point against possibly the best team the PL has ever seen, a team who are steamrollering their way through much better teams than us, a team whose winger cost more than our entire first XI.

 

I’ve rewatched the first half and again, we were abysmal, the worst I’ve ever seen us play at home.

 

I find this very hard to believe. I can think of the Portsmouth defeat under SA and the Liverpool 0-6 straight away. There must be plenty more.

You missed the Jesus and debruyne chances for a start, in your terms of chances being from five yards outn maybe but in mine if you have a clear shooting opportunity from outside the box and within 25 yards then that is a chance to score. Not really bothered what the opinion of some people around you say either I form my own opinion on what I see and don’t need to get back up on what I think. You have your opinion I have mine and as I said earlier the opinions are not going to change on here.

 

[HaydnNUFC]

When you play these you have to limit the space. If someone commits to closing down their intelligence and movement will punish that player for moving out of position and move the ball into the space left by that player.

 

Our ball retention you can put down to the fact we just have poor players, which we do. I doubt in Rafa's tactical approach he wanted the players to hand Man City possession as soon as we won it back, but that's what we did and we do it against many sides. It showed really badly on Wednesday because of how well Man City retain possession and badly we were at retaining it.

 

As for the approach, look at Napoli v Juventus at the start of this month. Juve scored in the first 12 minutes iirc and then camped out in their half for the remainder of the game, about 3-4 players committing to breaks and the same number on attacking set plays. Rest of the team back. Juventus won the game but was that approach cowardly? Was their football just surrendering as you're implying ours was? Allegri was hailed as getting the game tactically spot on. If he lost it I'm sure he would've been lambasted. If we got a point on Wednesday the press would be hailing our tactical approach. And so would many on here who haven't done so.

[Guest ElCid]

It's nonsense.  If you said before the game that we should open up and attack them you'd be rightly decried as an idiot.

 

Rafa and the team were a hair away from getting us a point against possibly the best team the PL has ever seen, a team who are steamrollering their way through much better teams than us, a team whose winger cost more than our entire first XI.

 

I’ve rewatched the first half and again, we were abysmal, the worst I’ve ever seen us play at home.

 

I find this very hard to believe. I can think of the Portsmouth defeat under SA and the Liverpool 0-6 straight away. There must be plenty more.

 

Nah, those were bad performances but again our players did f*** all on the ball, not a thing. It was literally 35 minutes of Man City knocking it about, scoring, threatening and us just kicking it away when it come to us. Nothing football.

 

You’re saying it was the worst tactical display you’ve seen at home, not the worst performance.

 

No I didn’t, there was no tactics unless you call camping out on your own box and hoofing it when we had the ball tactics. It was total surrender. Shelvey shooting from kick off was like saying this is our only opportunity to shoot.

 

How do you know there were no tactics and that the players just didn't execute them extremely poorly? i.e hoofing through nerves/lack of quality instead of passing to the (admittedly not many) outlets?

I believe Rafa did set the team up very defensively (ok, probably too much) but I bet he was as disappointed as anyone at the lack of composure shown.

 

You may well be right here as I have said we will never know as we were not in the dressing room. I would like to think this is the case and I hark on back to the last game to Man City when rafas tactics were spot on. This was the way I was expecting the team to be performing like on Wednesday unfortunately it was nowhere near that.

[Dr Venkman]

It's nonsense.  If you said before the game that we should open up and attack them you'd be rightly decried as an idiot.

 

Rafa and the team were a hair away from getting us a point against possibly the best team the PL has ever seen, a team who are steamrollering their way through much better teams than us, a team whose winger cost more than our entire first XI.

 

I’ve rewatched the first half and again, we were abysmal, the worst I’ve ever seen us play at home.

 

I find this very hard to believe. I can think of the Portsmouth defeat under SA and the Liverpool 0-6 straight away. There must be plenty more.

 

Nah, those were bad performances but again our players did f*** all on the ball, not a thing. It was literally 35 minutes of Man City knocking it about, scoring, threatening and us just kicking it away when it come to us. Nothing football.

 

You’re saying it was the worst tactical display you’ve seen at home, not the worst performance.

 

No I didn’t, there was no tactics unless you call camping out on your own box and hoofing it when we had the ball tactics. It was total surrender. Shelvey shooting from kick off was like saying this is our only opportunity to shoot.

 

There was no tactics? Righto. How can you go on endlessly about loving Rafa and then say that?

[Yorkie]

I'm glad there's another game tomorrow like.

[HaydnNUFC]

I'm glad there's another game tomorrow like.