Miguel Almirón (now playing for Atlanta United)

[Yorkie]

28 minutes ago, The Butcher said:

Who's done that?

 

Well it seemed like that's what you were saying!

[Myleftboot]

59 minutes ago, bobbydazzla said:

He’s the best Mexican to play for us in my lifetime 

 

And anyone who disagrees best watch their letterbox

 

Adios Miggy, you have an incredible work ethic and a lovely smiley face but you were mostly frustrating 

 

Enjoy yourself in Charlotte 

 

 

 

 

[ponsaelius]

It would be absolutely sensational if we were able to get him gone in January.

 

Don't think we're getting any new signings unless players leave.

 

 

Edited December 20, 2024 by ponsaelius

[TheBrownBottle]

2 hours ago, Yorkie said:

Wouldn't describe Almiron as a headless chicken at all tbh. On the contrary, he's been an exemplary slave to Howe's system; in particular he was a critical cog in those immense pressing machines from 22/23 and the early part of last season.

 

Excluding the ones that are apparently inadmissible, his numbers have typically been poor. But he's more than contributed to our success under the current manager and helped to transform Rafa's last season too. Much of the Bruce years I've mercifully blanked out, but my recollection is that he helped out in those very lean years as well (when he wasn't at RWB or wherever that brain-dead prick shoved him).

 

I'm massively in favour of us selling him at this point because he's no longer that useful to us and we need the cash, but painting him as some waste of money based entirely on his lack of assists is incredibly disingenuous and just agenda-driven.

It’s hardly agenda-driven to state views on a player - does anyone actually hate Almiron?  He’s a hard player to dislike never mind hate or have an agenda against.  When I wrote headless chicken I was referring to his need for excellent coaching and intelligent players around him - without it he looks lost.  And he was hardly transformative for Rafa - his output was effectively zero.

 

He wasn’t a waste of money, but we overpaid for what he was and is.  He absolutely wasn’t a bad signing, but he wasn’t a particularly good one either.  He was ok - which on balance is probably closer to what Almiron has been for us.  Pretty much ‘ok’.  

[TRon]

18 minutes ago, TheBrownBottle said:

It’s hardly agenda-driven to state views on a player - does anyone actually hate Almiron?  He’s a hard player to dislike never mind hate or have an agenda against.  When I wrote headless chicken I was referring to his need for excellent coaching and intelligent players around him - without it he looks lost.  And he was hardly transformative for Rafa - his output was effectively zero.

 

He wasn’t a waste of money, but we overpaid for what he was and is.  He absolutely wasn’t a bad signing, but he wasn’t a particularly good one either.  He was ok - which on balance is probably closer to what Almiron has been for us.  Pretty much ‘ok’.  

 

People need to realise criticism of players isn't personal, it's just part of wanting to get to the next level. I was a massive defender of Miggy when Bruce was here, and for good reason. He was one of our best players then, and our expectations were low. It was the same for Wijnaldum and Sissoko when they were here. They weren't world beaters but they were our best players.

 

Even the club knows that Miggy is no longer good enough for where we want to go. That's a good thing.

[TheBrownBottle]

5 minutes ago, TRon said:

 

People need to realise criticism of players isn't personal, it's just part of wanting to get to the next level. I was a massive defender of Miggy when Bruce was here, and for good reason. He was one of our best players then, and our expectations were low. It was the same for Wijnaldum and Sissoko when they were here. They weren't world beaters but they were our best players.

 

Even the club knows that Miggy is no longer good enough for where we want to go. That's a good thing.

Yep.  I’ve zero bad feelings about the lad, and I can’t imagine that there will be many with truly negative feelings about him when he goes or when his name comes up in any future conversation.  Ultimately, attacking players are usually judged on output, unless they are truly exceptional talents and provide moments which live forever in the memory (Ginola, HBA etc) - it is a harsh reality.  

[Stifler]

At the time of him coming in, anyone outside of the top 6 would just have players in midfield with no real consistent end product as well as the ability to offer an outlet and track back. If they did, the big clubs snapped them up.

Miggy offered us an outlet, and off the ball work, which considering we were a club fighting relegation, without having much of the ball, it was probably more needed.

Now of course scouting and statistical analysis has came on so much, that more teams can get more rounded players. Ourselves, with the takeover releasing new funds, and aims for the club, we are also in a position where we need to get that more rounded player.

Just because Miggy isn’t what we need going forward, doesn’t mean he hasn’t been an asset for us, and it doesn’t mean he wouldn’t be an asset for someone else.

 

We can’t confuse were we are today as a club, to the club we were 3 years ago, and judge the players from 3 years ago, on todays standards.

 

 

Edited December 20, 2024 by Stifler

[alexf]

Will always be thankful of his form that helped fire us back to the champions league for first time in 20 years. 

 

But like Wilson, we should have cashed in that summer where their stock was at its highest, as it was always unlikely he wasn't going to be able to maintain that purple patch. Same way it was always unlikely Wilson could maintain his fitness.

 

 

Edited December 20, 2024 by alexf

[TRon]

6 minutes ago, Stifler said:

At the time of him coming in, anyone outside of the top 6 would just have players in midfield with no real consistent end product as well as the ability to offer an outlet and track back. If they did, the big clubs snapped them up.

Miggy offer us an outlet, and off the ball work, which considering we were a club fighting relegation, without having much of the ball, it was probably more needed.

Now of course scouting and statistical analysis has came on so much, that more teams can get more rounded players. Ourselves, with the takeover releasing new funds, and aims for the club, we are also in a position where we need to get that more rounded player.

Just because Miggy isn’t what we need going forward, doesn’t mean he hasn’t been an asset for us, and it doesn’t mean he wouldn’t be an asset for someone else.

 

We can’t confuse were we are today as a club, to the club we were 3 years ago, and judge the players from 3 years ago, on todays standards.

 

You raise some good points. Even if his end product is lacking, he does still have qualities like pace and a fantastic work rate. I don't think that's enough in the Premier, hence the lack of interest. All the clubs in the PL believe they can find someone with the end product if they look across the leagues around the world.

 

But in a less competitive league like the MLS, he could probably tear it up. They will be one of the few who can afford his wages as well.

[Yorkie]

56 minutes ago, TheBrownBottle said:

It’s hardly agenda-driven to state views on a player - does anyone actually hate Almiron?  He’s a hard player to dislike never mind hate or have an agenda against.  When I wrote headless chicken I was referring to his need for excellent coaching and intelligent players around him - without it he looks lost.  And he was hardly transformative for Rafa - his output was effectively zero.

 

He wasn’t a waste of money, but we overpaid for what he was and is.  He absolutely wasn’t a bad signing, but he wasn’t a particularly good one either.  He was ok - which on balance is probably closer to what Almiron has been for us.  Pretty much ‘ok’.  

 

My agenda comment was aimed at Butcher's ott criticism. But anyone (whoever) discounting numbers which actually happened definitely speaks to having an agenda. 

 

He was pretty transformative under Rafa, like, despite the figures. We went from relegation candidates to European form after he came in. 

 

Wary that I'm going to get accusations off happyclappery (for want of a better term) thrown at me again... for the record I'm not a massive Almiron fan - he's been a bit of a mixed bag here like you say - but I do recoil at really ott criticism of people who've played out of their skins for the club and contributed well to one of the best eras in recent memory.

[TheBrownBottle]

9 minutes ago, Yorkie said:

 

My agenda comment was aimed at Butcher's ott criticism. But anyone (whoever) discounting numbers which actually happened definitely speaks to having an agenda. 

 

He was pretty transformative under Rafa, like, despite the figures. We went from relegation candidates to European form after he came in. 

 

Wary that I'm going to get accusations off happyclappery (for want of a better term) thrown at me again... for the record I'm not a massive Almiron fan - he's been a bit of a mixed bag here like you say - but I do recoil at really ott criticism of people who've played out of their skins for the club and contributed well to one of the best eras in recent memory.

Tbf I don’t like people being accused of being ‘happy clappers’  - I don’t like ‘personalising’ these sort of discussions.  They’re only a fan’s view of a player - no-one’s view is any more valid than anyone else’s .  Nowt wrong with disagreeing over an assessment of a player (nor of singing the lad’s praises). 

 

Almiron’s grafted his bollocks off on pretty much every occasion I’ve seen him play.   I think he’s a good pro and clearly enjoys playing football (and for us).  I sort of wish he’d just been sold in 2023 and left on a real high - it was one of the real success stories of the beginning of Howe’s tenure.  

[Monters]

11 minutes ago, Yorkie said:

 

My agenda comment was aimed at Butcher's ott criticism. But anyone (whoever) discounting numbers which actually happened definitely speaks to having an agenda. 

 

He was pretty transformative under Rafa, like, despite the figures. We went from relegation candidates to European form after he came in. 

 

Wary that I'm going to get accusations off happyclappery (for want of a better term) thrown at me again... for the record I'm not a massive Almiron fan - he's been a bit of a mixed bag here like you say - but I do recoil at really ott criticism of people who've played out of their skins for the club and contributed well to one of the best eras in recent memory.

Totally agree - I've said before it was one of the most galling things about letting Rafa go was that the team didn't need that much tweaking, towards the end of that season we had played some good stuff (relative to the time, squad level etc.) with Rondon through the middle and Perez & Miggy in behind him...

Binning Rafa & Rondon for Bruce and a more expensive Joelinton looked like madness, obvs I didn't predict the midfield transformation of the Brazilian Colossus!  

[SUPERTOON]

Botafogo interested in Miggy.

[duo]

30 minutes ago, SUPERTOON said:

Botafogo interested in Miggy.

[RobsonsWonderland]

Did he ever get a run of games on the left?

 

Even under rafa I remember him running direct towards goal on the right side of the goal and trying to shoot or miss with his left.

 

 

 

[Checko]

He played on the left under Rafa, we had him left, Rondon up top and Perez on the right and it was an effective front three.

 

I remember when he arrived he had about twice the energy of any of our other players and was the only player who consistently wanted to try and make runs and get behind and made something happen.

 

From memory he was moved onto the right when ASM arrived.

[SUPERTOON]

 

[Stifler]

I honestly think he’d do well going back to the MLS. He can retire in the USA, particularly the southern states where there is a lot a Latino culture.

I doubt he wants to go back to South America, he’s just going to end up with a target on his head because of the money he has.

[Sibierski]

Forest owner to do us a favour, after we helped each other out in Summer and they got the better longer term deal?

[ponsaelius]

Olympiacos record signings, fwiw:

 

https://www.transfermarkt.co.uk/olympiakos-piraus/transferrekorde/verein/683

 

We'd not be getting very much from there.

[GeordieDazzler]

Wonder if him going there would be a continuation of our unofficial alliance with the Forest owner. 

[Geordie Ahmed]

14 minutes ago, Stifler said:

I honestly think he’d do well going back to the MLS. He can retire in the USA, particularly the southern states where there is a lot a Latino culture.

I doubt he wants to go back to South America, he’s just going to end up with a target on his head because of the money he has.

 

A target in what way?

[Stifler]

8 minutes ago, Geordie Ahmed said:

A target in what way?

There is an increase in footballers in South America either being robbed, kidnapped, or having their family members targeted in order to extract money.

I’m not sure what the situation is like in Paraguay, but if his options are 2 Brazilian clubs, and MLS team, or an a Greek team, I think long term going to the MLS and retiring there would be best for him.

[SUPERTOON]

 

[Ed210]

Fair well to the absolute sweetest of sweet princes.