Eddie Howe

[Mills and Boon]

6 minutes ago, greenhill said:

Because we make decisions based on what he is doing now, not his CV.

 

Since that Everton game we had been poor for some time, and things are not fixed yet.

 

And FYI, Bruce got 12 points from his last 12 league games in charge.

Maybe we were too hasty

[Interpolic]

7 minutes ago, greenhill said:

Because we make decisions based on what he is doing now, not his CV.

 

Since that Everton game we had been poor for some time, and things are not fixed yet.

 

And FYI, Bruce got 12 points from his last 12 league games in charge.

 

 

Liverpool had spells like this last season, with nowhere near the issues we've had. Should they have sacked Klopp off? 

[greenhill]

Just now, Interpolic said:

 

 

Liverpool had spells like this last season, with nowhere near the issues we've had. Should they have sacked Klopp off? 

I agree with you and that's my point. I think we should keep our faith on Howe at least for the moment, but we need to be rational at the end of the season. If we are poor for 24 games not 12 then questions have to be raised.

[KaKa]

2 minutes ago, Interpolic said:

 

 

Liverpool had spells like this last season, with nowhere near the issues we've had. Should they have sacked Klopp off? 

 

How quickly everyone forgets man. It's just sad really.

 

Making out even the top managers don't have ropey moments.

 

 

[Holmesy]

19 minutes ago, KaKa said:

 

It all sounds so simple.

 

So when Mourinho was stinking at Spurs why didn't he just change setting? 

 

When Conte was stinking at Spurs why couldn't he just change setting?

 

These are the elite managers we should be after right? Why couldn't they both just figure it out, even without an injury crisis?

 

 

Perhaps they couldn't, and that ultimately led to their demises. Maybe they reached the limit of what they were capable of with the groups of players they had.

Maybe the same is true of Eddie. Who knows?!  Maybe he is literally a one setting manager.

 

What you've described in your post is the various different ways we've tried to implement setting 1. Even when we were down to bare bones, we still had the pace and the players available to play an effective counter-attacking style, which we didn't do even once. Instead, we further rinsed the players we had trying to play high intensity front foot for 90 minutes.

 

 

 

 

Edited February 27 by Holmesy

[LiquidAK]

27 minutes ago, The Prophet said:

 

It's not like he hasn't tried. We've had...

 

Bruno deeper.

 

Miley and Longstaff deeper.

 

Miley right, Longstaff left.

 

Longstaff left, Miley right.

 

Man for man pressing.

 

Zonal pressing.

 

Sure, it's his job to find the answer and he hasn't done so yet, but we've tried variations of the flat midfield three. Perhaps he should have implemented a more radical change, but he has been shuffling it about.

 

My personal view is we could benefit from a more natural defensive minded midfielder. They don't have to be a stopper, but an option who has that discipline to sit in the gap between the midfield and back four.

 

 

 

No plan B though m8.

[KaKa]

5 minutes ago, Holmesy said:

Perhaps they couldn't, and that ultimately led to their demises. Maybe they reached the limit of what they were capable of with the groups of players they had.

Maybe the same is true of Eddie. Who knows?!  Maybe he is literally a one setting manager.

 

What you've described in your post is the various different ways we've tried to implement setting 1. Even when we were down to bare bones, we still had the pace and the players available to play an effective counter-attacking style, which we didn't do even once. Instead, we further rinsed the players we had trying to play high intensity front foot for 90 minutes.

 

 

 

 

 

 

The problem is though we don't know the extent to which these alternative approaches have been explored in training, and whether the current players available were deemed to be better off persisting with the current approach, with the more minor tweaks Howe has tried here and there.

 

There is no certainty that a change in formation, or a more defensive and counter attacking approach suddenly cures all ills.

 

I think some of us just have more faith in the manager and his decision making and are fine to let him work through this tough period, while others seemingly see it as evidence he is not up to the task, which in my opinion is incredibly shortsighted.

[Erikse]

26 minutes ago, KaKa said:

 

It all sounds so simple.

 

So when Mourinho was stinking at Spurs why didn't he just change setting? 

 

When Conte was stinking at Spurs why couldn't he just change setting?

 

These are the elite managers we should be after right? Why couldn't they both just figure it out, even without an injury crisis?

 

 

 

It all sounds so simple.

When Bruce was stinking at Newcastle why didn't he just change setting?

When Pardew was stinking at Newcastle why didn't he just change setting?

When Kinnear was stinking at Newcastle why didn't he just change setting?

 

Why do we criticise managers ever? Being a manager is not easy!

 

By the way I wouldn't want Mourinho near our club. He's way past his prime.

[buzza]

I think Eddie has probably had one his hardest seasons:

Injuries

Suspensions (including bruno on tenderhooks for last 4-5 games)

Lots of players falling out of form (Tripps/Burn/Botman/Wilson/bruno)...

 

If the players aren´t performing I don¨t think system changes will help much. Puts a bit more perspective into it.

[KaKa]

9 minutes ago, Erikse said:

 

It all sounds so simple.

When Bruce was stinking at Newcastle why didn't he just change setting?

When Pardew was stinking at Newcastle why didn't he just change setting?

When Kinnear was stinking at Newcastle why didn't he just change setting?

 

Why do we criticise managers ever? Being a manager is not easy!

 

By the way I wouldn't want Mourinho near our club. He's way past his prime.

 

Ultimately every fan base complains about their manager's decision making and team selections.

 

And so ultimately, what is the manager's ethos, how do they handle themselves, what are their signings like, how do the players respond to them, are they ultimately worth getting behind?

 

I just don't understand how anyone is uncertain on Howe already, and making out he's not up to it, due to his first tough period at the club under difficult circumstances. It is baffling.

 

 

Edited February 27 by KaKa

[madras]

Some might think we are lucky not to be dragged into a relegation battle even before the injuries etc.

[AyeDubbleYoo]

1 minute ago, KaKa said:

 

Ultimately every fan base complains about managers decision making and team selections.

 

And so ultimately, what is the manager's ethos, how do they handle themselves, what are their signings like, how do the players respond to them, are they ultimately worth getting behind?

 

I just don't understand how anyone is uncertain on Howe already, and making out he's not up to it, due to his first tough period at the club under difficult circumstances. It is baffling.

I don’t see the point in posting that much about Howe these days, or at least I try not to. 
 

The ultimate question is whether we should be fully behind him, and the answer is of course we should. 

[Holmesy]

31 minutes ago, KaKa said:

 

The problem is though we don't know the extent to which these alternative approaches have been explored in training, and whether the current players available were deemed to be better off persisting with the current approach, with the more minor tweaks Howe has tried here and there.

 

There is no certainty that a change in formation, or a more defensive and counter attacking approach suddenly cures all ills.

 

I think some of us just have more faith in the manager and his decision making and are fine to let him work through this tough period, while others seemingly see it as evidence he is not up to the task, which in my opinion is incredibly shortsighted.

You could be right. I suppose what this conversation confirms is that there's a definite loss of confidence in Eddie from me, given some of the things we've witnessed this season. I remember under Rafa, I just trusted absolutely in everything he did because he consistently made silk purses out of piles of shit and seemed to have a tactical answer for everything. Last season I felt the same about Eddie, but that confidence has definitely eroded a bit. Hopefully it comes back next season.

[80]

Hypothetical question - if Eddie switches us to a 5-3-2 or a 5-4-1 system and we suddenly go on one of his winning runs for a couple of months putting us right in the mix for 6th, does this make him a genius or a doofus for not looking at doing it earlier?

 

I feel like there are some who would take it as proof he's the man for us even though there have been people proposing it on here for nearly 3 months due to our injury problems. I think that's what some people take issue with - positive confirmation bias.

 

Yes, there are absolutely people on here who get some sort of psycho-sexual stimulation from the idea we'll have to sack him, but there are also a few for whom it's eternally sunshine and lollipops. That thanks to Eddie we live in the best of all possible world, and this season is as good as it ever could have been once you factor in gambling bans and freak injuries. That's the bit I don't think is true.

 

It certainly doesn't mean I want him sacked or am overreacting. But it's ridiculous to catch a lot of shit for slagging off the Fulham performance just because our opponents had Jacob Murphy's finishing instincts, when it turned out to be near enough the exact same disorderly performance we gave against Forest, Luton and Bournemouth. We've never looked so uncoordinated and naive as we have in the past month, even in December when we had near enough the same players, far more fatigue and far less training time. That's what's concerning and makes me think "we could probably be doing something better here".

[Bimpy474]

You don't bin a manager as soon as he and his team go through a bad spell. Imo Eddie has earnt the right to pick results back up.

 

And while those results and performances in the main have been disappointing (at home mostly), I think we've only lost to Man City and Arsenal in the last eight games, so it's not a collapse in form.

[Interpolic]

21 minutes ago, madras said:

Some might think we are lucky not to be dragged into a relegation battle even before the injuries etc.

 

There was definitely a period pre-Everton away when the results and performances we were getting were amazing given what Howe had to work with.

[Dr Venkman]

21 hours ago, AyeDubbleYoo said:

There shouldn’t be any battle about influence. Not sure there is TBH. 
 

Howe is a modern manager and we’re a modern club now. I believe that Howe is sensible enough to know the role of a manager. 

He’s a head coach who repeatedly refers to himself as the manager.

[80]

3 minutes ago, Bimpy474 said:

You don't bin a manager as soon as he and his team go through a bad spell. Imo Eddie has earnt the right to pick results back up.

 

And while those results and performances in the main have been disappointing (at home mostly), I think we've only lost to Man City and Arsenal in the last eight games, so it's not a collapse in form.

I would disagree on that bit as I think it's a mistake to see results and form as the same thing. Otherwise we really were a wonderful operation in Pardew's 5th placed season, and I thought it was obvious we were just a freak outfit at the time.

[AyeDubbleYoo]

3 minutes ago, Dr Venkman said:

He’s a head coach who repeatedly refers to himself as the manager.

And? 

[Interpolic]

3 minutes ago, Holmesy said:

I remember under Rafa, I just trusted absolutely in everything he did because he consistently made silk purses out of piles of shit and seemed to have a tactical answer for everything.

 

Different situations, players, budgets etc but Rafa went long spells where results were awful.  In 18/19 we didn't win until November, which was our 10th match of the season.

 

Howe has better players but far less of them available.  And results have never been as bad as that.  AND he'd already had us in CL-form for almost 2 seasons, before this difficult spell.

 

I've every faith he'll turn it around personally, the bloke just needs a break atm and I'm sure we'll be flying again before too long.

[Orphanage]

Some managers are just stubborn . Sir Bobby Robson stuck with Hately upfront at the World Cup until his own players questionned how the team was set up . In came Beardsley and Lineker . Plus ca change ... 

Was surprised Eddie didnt go 5 3 2 against Arsenal , keeping Burn in as a ch mightve helped us defend better against their set pieces and maybe we wouldve been a better counter attacking force . Smelt of Eddie saying " There told you so " ( re Tino and Burn ) . If all hes got is the one idea of 4 3 3 regardless of personnel and take that one idea and beat it to death then hes never going to progress and neither will we

[Dr Venkman]

8 minutes ago, AyeDubbleYoo said:

And? 

And I love him.

[KaKa]

14 minutes ago, Holmesy said:

You could be right. I suppose what this conversation confirms is that there's a definite loss of confidence in Eddie from me, given some of the things we've witnessed this season. I remember under Rafa, I just trusted absolutely in everything he did because he consistently made silk purses out of piles of shit and seemed to have a tactical answer for everything. Last season I felt the same about Eddie, but that confidence has definitely eroded a bit. Hopefully it comes back next season.

 

Rafa by nature is a more structured, rigid and defensive minded manager, which is an approach that likely would indeed have worked better to grind out results with lesser quality players available.

 

Howe more wants to pressure the opposition and take things to them by nature, and is seemingly looking for solutions to the current situation that still incorporates some of that, rather than consolidating completely. 

 

Maybe Howe eventually incorporates more of a defensive setup during these kind of moments or comes up with some other approach, as he does continuously look to grow, I'm just fine with letting him work through it.

 

 

[timeEd32]

There’s a lot of things that bother me about this whole discussion but another is the fact that this will all be resolved soon enough. 
 

Eddie is not going to put 10 men behind the ball to eke out results in the name of job security. We will either get back to our best or some of you will be proven right that he’s been found out, hit a ceiling, whatever. If that’s the case he’ll be out of a job sometime between November and May of next year. 
 

So, again, patience.

[HaydnNUFC]

29 minutes ago, Interpolic said:

 

Different situations, players, budgets etc but Rafa went long spells where results were awful.  In 18/19 we didn't win until November, which was our 10th match of the season.

 

Howe has better players but far less of them available.  And results have never been as bad as that.  AND he'd already had us in CL-form for almost 2 seasons, before this difficult spell.

 

I've every faith he'll turn it around personally, the bloke just needs a break atm and I'm sure we'll be flying again before too long.

 

2017-18 we went on a run of 4 wins in 24 and didn't win a home league match for almost 4 months. Some shocking performances and results in that run as well, 0-3 at home to Watford, the performance in losing 0-1 at home to Allardyce's Everton, 0-0 at home to Brighton. 

 

2018-19 we didn't win until November as you say, didn't win in the first 10 games and lost every home match in that 10. Likewise some really grim afternoons before Christmas that season as well.

 

It hasn't got as bad as that yet but the showing on Saturday, away at Spurs, against Forest at home, away at Luton have run some of the awful afternoons 5-6 years ago in isolation close. But I have faith that Howe will turn it around just as I had in Benitez having it under control back then.

 

I do think though that Howe is stubbornly married to this current system. Admirable in a way but he's on the record in his press conference yesterday saying the system we play is not the issue. If the current players aren't good enough to play the system then surely the system needs tweaking or altered until the players that are good enough come back? Every single side we've played since we beat Man Utd in December have played through us at will. It's been my only serious, level headed worry about Howe this season.

 

 

Edited February 27 by HaydnNUFC