Eddie Howe

[Pilko]

I don't understand "we've been poor in the league, but so has everyone this year, it's a poor league" as an argument. 

 

We're saying the standard of team is lower across the board - so why does that mean we just lower ourselves to that level? If some of these sides are that bad we might occasionally look comfortable and win convincingly, which we hardly ever do.

[Zero]

And again why blame the strikers? I mean there are really a lot of people saying failed to sign a direct replacement for Isak is the cause of this years collapse. 
 

is it though? If that’s the case we should have a lot of draws and our scoring record should be shit. And no. We all know this isn’t the case.

 

you can say we failed to buy a great striker that can bail out Howe when he is in trouble. You can’t say Howe’s failure this season is down to not having another Isak. It’s the defence (or the approach, attitude, whatever) that caused us having a double derby loss in a season. How can you accept we concede 2 goals to this fucking shit Sunderland?

 

 

[Mountain]

5 minutes ago, TheBrownBottle said:

I honestly never understand the ‘he wasn’t first choice’ patter.  Targeting players who go to bigger clubs isn’t good scouting or management - it’s the opposite.  It’s also a piece of piss given that everyone in football knew that the big boys were interested in them.  
 

Woltemade was an extraordinarily poor signing, given Howe’s lack of flexibility to his approach.  He can’t have been blindsided - all these guys do is live and breathe football and are paid handsomely to do so.  He should’ve been able to see Woltemade’s unsuitability to the system by watching a single match. 

 

 

Unfortunately I think our system only works with lots of rest.

 

If you need lots of rest for your philosophy to work, you need bodies and to sacrifice some games.

 

We could have signed 15 decent players for the money we spent, and if genuinely and fully rotated, the key players could have been kept fresh enough to bear fruit.

 

Instead we wastefully spent the money, with full control by the manager.

 

The issue is that every other manager seems incompetent also, so who do you replace him with.

 

Slot was a genius last year, now the majority of Liverpool fans want him gone. Iraola is incredibly ugly in appearance, I wouldn't want him if he was the best manager in the world, Thomas the Frank Engine looked the bees knees, now he's a loser, Maresca exposed as useless and his replacement is even worse, Glasner is doomed etc. Everyone is shit so no point getting rid tbh.

 

Eddie just needs a stern telling off and someone else to sort the transfers.

[Decky]

6 minutes ago, alexf said:

 

How many others were forced into selling their best player for a £120m? Contributing to desperate rushing around trying to sign 4th/5th choices for way over their value because we were desperate. 

 

I don't know why context is never applied to last summer. It was an absolute cluster fuck with so many problems. So to try and point to us spending the Isak money and a bit more to try and get in the numbers we needed to compete on 4 fronts this season as a stick to beat Eddie with constantly is abit odd.

 

The players signed ultimately don't look good enough and were likely big mistakes, but it's pretty obvious why that scenario might have happened due to the chaos going on behind the scenes at the time.

 

We lost Isak late in August but we lost Wilson at the end of the previous season and replaced him on September 1st. Spent all summer chasing shadows. The clubs a shambles at the minute. 

[Mountain]

3 minutes ago, Zero said:

And again why blame the strikers? I mean there are really a lot of people saying failed to sign a direct replacement for Isak is the cause of this years collapse. 
 

is it though? If that’s the case we should have a lot of draws and our scoring record should be shit. And no. We all know this isn’t the case.

 

you can say we failed to buy a great striker that can bail out Howe when he is in trouble. You can’t say Howe’s failure this season is down to not having another Isak. It’s the defence (or the approach, attitude, whatever) that caused us having a double derby loss in a season. How can you accept we concede 2 goals to this fucking shit Sunderland?

 

 

 

The entire argument is irrelevent because Isak was shit for Liverpool for months then got an injury which he may never be the same after. 125 million was superb business, we just wasted the money.

[Tiotes Witch Doctor]

22 minutes ago, Super Duper Branko Strupar said:

Who are you like, Andrew Tate?  And not even a season, btw.

 

You need to try meditation or something, you're just winding yourself up. We got to the semis of the League Cup to be knocked out by City. Decent in the FA cup to be knocked out by City. Beating multiple PL sides along the way. Canny decent in the CL to be knocked out by Barcelona (who we also deserved to beat at home). Yes we were embarrassed away and by losing to the Mackems twice. Yes our league form has been generally poor this year. I'd tak on to that who's been good? Its a poor league. 

 

It's such an odd way to go on. Not long ago Howe was touted as a genius for how we dominated Arsenal home and away along with many other performances that year. And previous. And now he all of a sudden has no answers in such a relatively short space of time? You seem to lack so much understanding it's really quite baffling. 

 

 

 

Not sure what relevance Andrew Tate has to any of that but I'm sure the cult will be in with a few likes for your troubles you insufferable bellend.

 

Blah blah blah, we're shite mate, 5 years in hundreds of millions spent and we are absolutely pathetic on and off the field, recruitment is a joke and our performances are a joke but I'm sure we'll have another dressing room inquiry before our next game to sort it all out.

 

I know everyone loves the Howe story about how he saved us and did this and that but ultimately he's done all he can here and the bloke needs put of out his misery, and so do we.

[Zero]

Surely even if we are finding replacement for Isak last summer, we could still broker a deal for another back up RB and LB? And also find a defensive mid (the no. 6) if Howe wanted to? Just like Kaka mentioned it just cost 25m euro for a decent one in the market.

 

I cried for reinforcement for the both full back position the whole summer. I prayed for a loan at January. And in the end we still give Trippier most minutes and Halls only backup is Burn. What in the actual fuck is this?

 

If it’s Howe who decided the current defence lineup is good enough and not a priority to reinforce (except Thiaw), then sorry I think he is fully accountable for this collapse.

 

seriously how can you have a good league record when you are the team that conceded most in Europe?

 

 

Edited March 23 by Zero

[Super Duper Branko Strupar]

4 minutes ago, Tiotes Witch Doctor said:

Not sure what relevance Andrew Tate has to any of that but I'm sure the cult will be in with a few likes for your troubles you insufferable bellend.

 

Blah blah blah, we're shite mate, 5 years in hundreds of millions spent and we are absolutely pathetic on and off the field, recruitment is a joke and our performances are a joke but I'm sure we'll have another dressing room inquiry before our next game to sort it all out.

 

I know everyone loves the Howe story about how he saved us and did this and that but ultimately he's done all he can here and the bloke needs put of out his misery, and so do we.

 

You're a peculiar guy.

[Tiotes Witch Doctor]

Just now, Super Duper Branko Strupar said:

 

You're a peculiar guy.

I know.

[TheBrownBottle]

16 minutes ago, dcmk said:

  

 

I think it stems from the inability to be able to work on multiple targets at the same time - that screwed us over the most.  Having no DoF scuppered the chances of moving quickly.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Yeah, completely agree - this is one of those areas where the club utterly failed Howe

[TheBrownBottle]

10 minutes ago, Mountain said:

 

 

Eddie just needs a stern telling off and someone else to sort the transfers.

I’m not against this as an outcome tbh

[Mountain]

1 minute ago, TheBrownBottle said:

I’m not against this as an outcome tbh

 

 

Same, I'd love to keep him, someone just needs to tell him off.

[TheBrownBottle]

17 minutes ago, alexf said:

 

How many others were forced into selling their best player for a £120m? Contributing to desperate rushing around trying to sign 4th/5th choices for way over their value because we were desperate. 

 

I don't know why context is never applied to last summer. It was an absolute cluster fuck with so many problems. So to try and point to us spending the Isak money and a bit more to try and get in the numbers we needed to compete on 4 fronts this season as a stick to beat Eddie with constantly is abit odd.

 

The players signed ultimately don't look good enough and were likely big mistakes, but it's pretty obvious why that scenario might have happened due to the chaos going on behind the scenes at the time.

Isak was a club / board problem, not a Howe problem.  I think it is a problem though if a football man like Howe has a scattergun approach to his replacement, especially if he’s not willing to change the system or approach to accommodate his replacement. 

[Carlito]

2 hours ago, dcmk said:

I rate Woltemade.

 

But to say he's been scapegoated is BS.  When he's been playing as the striker he is usually never in the box when the ball comes in. It's much more noticeable when it's been flashed across the goalmouth.

 

 

 

It's not BS at all. While his movement does need some work, he generally has to come deep to get the ball because none of the wide players are looking to pass it to him and it's conditioning him to play deeper so he's not isolated the entire match. There have been a number of occasions where both Woltemade and Wissa have been through on goal and the likes of Hall or the central midfielders won't play them through. Instead they play it wide, then overlap and the opportunity is gone.

He's scored 3 headers in the box this season as well as getting on the end of a cross against Chelsea, and 2 back heel flicks in the box. Pretty sure he's had about 3 cleared off the line as well.

[TheBrownBottle]

Just now, Mountain said:

 

 

Same, I'd love to keep him, someone just needs to tell him off.

If the club was strong enough to tell him to focus on coaching the first team - and also that a change of style is absolutely required (I don’t think a 4-3-3 pressing system is the future) then all good.  I don’t see those characters at the club atm - and I’m not sure Howe would carry on under those circumstances, either. 

[alexf]

2 minutes ago, Zero said:

Surely even if we are finding replacement for Isak last summer, we could still broker a deal for another back up RB and LB? And also find a defensive mid (the no. 6) if Howe wanted to? Just like Kaka mentioned it just cost 25m euro for a decent one in the market.

 

I cried for reinforcement for the both full back position the whole summer. I prayed for a loan at January. And in the end we still give Trippier most minutes and Halls only backup is Burn. What in the actual fuck is this?

Yeah, it really was a nightmare. 

We went from having decent money to spend, CL football to hopefully attract higher caliber of player and key players all on decent contract lengths. 

 

Within days of the season ending we get the Mitchell news that seemed to throw everything in the air and it seems like they then had to dig out their old lists of targets from the previous year and then Isak threw the grenade in and went on strike. 

 

Even then I don't think they anticipated getting rejected by pretty much all their first choice winger and striker targets and the whole thing became desperate as fuck. Agreed the lack of depth at fullback felt inevitable as fuck we'd end up with Trippier and Burn playing there.

 

Felt like our negotiators couldn't do multiple deals and were just getting the piss taken out of them all summer. 

 

For all that...I have some sympathy with Eddie and whoever was tasked with that job, they were out of the depth and shouldn't have been put in that position. So if they made mistakes in Elanga, Wissa, Woltemade etc. then it's understandable. 

 

For that reason alone I want to give Eddie another season to recover from this.

[Super Duper Branko Strupar]

7 minutes ago, Pilko said:

I don't understand "we've been poor in the league, but so has everyone this year, it's a poor league" as an argument. 

 

We're saying the standard of team is lower across the board - so why does that mean we just lower ourselves to that level? If some of these sides are that bad we might occasionally look comfortable and win convincingly, which we hardly ever do.

 

But it's context. It's not to say we cant aspire to be better if teams are poorer, but an explanation of why we're experiencing some of the same problems so many others have. And how fine margins could make it all very different.

Take singings for example. Has Mbuemo been good? Cunha. Sesko. Delap. Gyokeres. Wirtz. Kerkez. Madueke. Guessand. Sancho. Gittens. Dibling. Bobb. Kalimeundo. Simons. Tel. Kuolo Muani. Yet we're awful? 

Who are the PLs top performers? Semenyo. Rice. Bruno F. Harry Wilson. Thiago. Bruno G... Small pool. How are we that much worse than everyone else it means our manager is suddenly awful? 

 

Arsenal are awful to watch and uncreative af but they'll win the league. Saka, Martinelli, Gyokeres, Madueke etc have been poor. City havent been great despite hoovering up creative talent and theyre second. Villa have been poor but somehow 4th. Chelsea and Liverpool have been poor despite spending obscene amounts. Who would we take from Brighton, Brentford, Everton, Bournemouth? Dango Outtara went for 45m. Which other PL side has signed someone from "abroad" that has been a success? 

 

We have a sub par season and all of a sudden we're awful. It's batshit mental. Why are people so blinkered?



 

[TheBrownBottle]

18 minutes ago, Zero said:

And again why blame the strikers? I mean there are really a lot of people saying failed to sign a direct replacement for Isak is the cause of this years collapse. 
 

is it though? If that’s the case we should have a lot of draws and our scoring record should be shit. And no. We all know this isn’t the case.

 

you can say we failed to buy a great striker that can bail out Howe when he is in trouble. You can’t say Howe’s failure this season is down to not having another Isak. It’s the defence (or the approach, attitude, whatever) that caused us having a double derby loss in a season. How can you accept we concede 2 goals to this fucking shit Sunderland?

 

 

43 goals conceded since New Years’ Day.  It’s an unbelievably shit defensive record - which Howe acknowledged.  It’s about 1.9 goals conceded per game.

[Mountain]

11 minutes ago, TheBrownBottle said:

If the club was strong enough to tell him to focus on coaching the first team - and also that a change of style is absolutely required (I don’t think a 4-3-3 pressing system is the future) then all good.  I don’t see those characters at the club atm - and I’m not sure Howe would carry on under those circumstances, either. 

 

You are correct but maybe things will change. 

[alexf]

5 minutes ago, TheBrownBottle said:

43 goals conceded since New Years’ Day.  It’s an unbelievably shit defensive record - which Howe acknowledged.  It’s about 1.9 goals conceded per game.

Yeah this is more the Howe I was expecting. He was known for having  a pretty leaky defence at Bournemouth. But his first few years here it felt like he'd really learnt how to build a solid defensive side and we often looked like we could really lock down a game when needed. 

 

We have been like a sieve this season. So so easy to play through and concede at will. 

[McDog]

I'll withhold most of my thoughts but two things come to mind.

 

1) I underestimated how much everyone would lose their shit over this result despite the signs obviously pointing to it in the lead up.

2) I understand most of the points made tonight but I am surprised at the level of utter distain leveled at several members of the squad. Not just the summer additions. 

Anyway, I've just listened and tried to learn something today. Been a shit league campaign for the most part, but plenty of highlights in the season also.

 

 

Edited March 23 by McDog

[Geordie Ahmed]

51 minutes ago, Decky said:

When Eddie was asked about the project hitting a stumbling block he said there's a limit to what we can spend. How many PL clubs spent more than us last summer? I bet a lot who spent less beat us this season. 

 

Of that lot I'd be interested to know how many of them are also in the CL?

 

And of that how many made it to the League Cup semi final?

 

And of that how many had to face 3 Premier League sides in a row in the FA Cup? 

[Wallsendmag]

31 minutes ago, alexf said:

 

How many others were forced into selling their best player for a £120m? Contributing to desperate rushing around trying to sign 4th/5th choices for way over their value because we were desperate. 

 

I don't know why context is never applied to last summer. It was an absolute cluster fuck with so many problems. So to try and point to us spending the Isak money and a bit more to try and get in the numbers we needed to compete on 4 fronts this season as a stick to beat Eddie with constantly is abit odd.

 

The players signed ultimately don't look good enough and were likely big mistakes, but it's pretty obvious why that scenario might have happened due to the chaos going on behind the scenes at the time.

 

Nothing of what you've said there explains why we can no longer do the basics in defending. 1 clean sheet in the last 17 games. 3+ goals conceded in 6 of those 17 games. Why we can't hold onto a lead, or why we concede so many inury time goals. Nor does it explain why our midfield can't take a grip of a game by the scruff of its neck. Aye I get Isak set us back and his replacements are sub par but that doesn't explain a lot of the other parts of this shit show.

[The Bonk]

2 minutes ago, TheBrownBottle said:

I wouldn’t rank most of them above Howe - but I also don’t know what they’ve have achieved if they’d been able to spend three quarters of a billion in the transfer market, either.  It isn’t that I think that they’re better than Howe - but I do think it lays out that in the modern game the role has fundamentally changed.  A decade ago you could pretty much write a list of ten managers who’d get a job at a PL club regardless of how many failures were on their CV.  These days, clubs are very much set up in a different way - as we should be, but aren’t (mostly a failure of the owners, with some of it on Howe). 
 

Interesting re Hopkinson - I don’t doubt at all exactly what you’ve said, and if he’d replaced Silverstone I’d have a very positive view tbh.  But running a football club?  There’s bot all on his CV to suggest he can. 

I don’t think he was hired to have input into the Football side of things other than finding revenue to support those that are? 
 

I was working on a few native apps (Leafs, Raptors) which were under his team’s portfolio. He had a lot of input into fan experience and engagement from what I remember. (12 years ago)

[Wallsendmag]

2 minutes ago, The Bonk said:

I don’t think he was hired to have input into the Football side of things other than finding revenue to support those that are? 
 

I was working on a few native apps (Leafs, Raptors) which were under his team’s portfolio. He had a lot of input into fan experience and engagement from what I remember. (12 years ago)

 

He's failing miserably on that score then.