Eddie Howe

[nufc123]

Just now, astraguy said:

and because of the failed signing he wanted ,Wissa ended up being the isak replacement that got fucked early, 

Thats true, but there is also a big question mark why we dont get anything out of a player who scored close to 20 goals last season.

[astraguy]

1 minute ago, nufc123 said:

Thats true, but there is also a big question mark why we dont get anything out of a player who scored close to 20 goals last season.

are you joking here?

[Milburn]

12 minutes ago, nufc123 said:

They have. Going into the transfer window without a DOF & CEO is amateurish, its nightmare stuff. That said he needs to take some responsibility for the flops we have signed.

 

 

I get that. It wasn’t ideal going into a window without a Sporting Director and CEO, although the Sporting Director likely left due to collaboration issues and a power struggle with Howe.

 

But that cuts both ways. In that situation the manager naturally has even more influence, so you can’t then separate him from the decisions that were made. His nephew was even head of recruitment, which says a lot about how that setup was functioning.

 

I’m not convinced the incoming players would’ve looked much different even with a Sporting Director in place.

[TheInfiniteOdyssey]

We are absolutely crying out for new ideas imo.

[Wandy]

2 minutes ago, LionOfGosforth said:

 

I wasn't talking about this season specifically, the entire era. we've over-achieved massively overall or do you think what's he's achieved is about par? Because the progression hasn't been constantly linear and the going has gotten tough, it's time to get rid looks like. Are we going to do this every time a manager has a down season? Or does out trajectory always have to be upwards without interruption? Because that is pie in the sky. I'm not defending today or the season in general BTW.

 

If you look at the constraints EH has worked within, I doubt anyone else could do better across 5 years. Do you honestly think Iraola (who incidentally plays a very similar way and system to EH), wouldn't flame out after a bright start? Is he even someone we'd have a chance at recruiting anyway? What i'm getting at is, show me a coach who can work within PSR/SCR, get us from near relegation to CL within a year and win us a trophy and actually wants to come. And if he exists, he's probably either someone not attainable or someone not willing to work at a club with a revenue so far behind the top 5.

 

Honestly, you can have the opinion that Eddie's time is done, I won't argue too much. I'm not Howe in at all costs. Just don't expect some elite coach to come swanning in no bother. Honestly, the speed PIF move at, I shudder at who would come through the door. 

 

To be honest I would contest that he has massively overachieved overall. In the 22/23 season certainly but since then? Nah. I'd say he has done very well but hasn't massively overachieved, bearing in mind the money spent.

 

And history is irrelevant to me to. All managers run out of steam eventually and must pay the price for it. And that is what is happening here.

 

I've gone on record here before that I still believe that Howe is a good manager who will learn from this and do well at his next club and I stand by that. But its still time for him to leave here, so that he can recoup and go again. He's not going to turn it around and the idea of giving him a bumper kitty to spend on more Elangas is terrifying.

 

All managers "flame out' and Iraola would do too. But that's not a good enough reason to not go for him.

[Wolfcastle]

41 minutes ago, astraguy said:

i wouldn't trust  any current manager in the top 6 to do what Eddie has done with us or Bournemouth ,The club let him down like we did we Keegan and sir bobby

 

 

 

how did the club let Keegan down? 

[nufc123]

4 minutes ago, Milburn said:

I’m not convinced the incoming players would’ve looked much different even with a Sporting Director in place.

Maybe. Having a DOF in place maybe would have sealed some of the deals slipping through.

[TRon]

Just now, nufc123 said:

Maybe. Having a DOF in place maybe would have sealed some of the deals slipping through.

 

Which ones?

 

 

[nufc123]

Just now, TRon said:

 

Which ones?

 

 

Thats impossible to answer. Could be Pedro for example. He was ready before Chelsea came in . Trafford was ready.

[Milburn]

5 minutes ago, Wandy said:

 

All managers "flame out' and Iraola would do too. But that's not a good enough reason to not go for him.

 

Exactly, and that’s the key point.

 

The next manager will most likely have a shorter cycle than Howe anyway. Nearly five years at one club is already rare in modern football.

 

Which is why the structure matters so much. Managers come and go, but the club’s identity, recruitment model and overall philosophy shouldn’t reset every time there’s a change in the dugout.

 

That’s what we’ve been lacking, and why getting that right now is more important than any individual manager in my opinion.

[Mole]

7 minutes ago, TheInfiniteOdyssey said:

We are absolutely crying out for new ideas imo.

Yeah I agree, I thought Howe deserved the chance to turn it around and give this summer and see where it goes but as each week passes it becomes really difficult to see a scenario where things can be turned around.

[Jesse Pinkman]

He refuses to adapt so he needs to go. 

[LionOfGosforth]

1 minute ago, Wandy said:

 

To be honest I would contest that he has massively overachieved overall. In the 22/23 season certainly but since then? Nah. I'd say he has done very well but hasn't massively overachieved, bearing in mind the money spent.

 

And history is irrelevant to me to. All managers run out of steam eventually and must pay the price for it. And that is what is happening here.

 

I've gone on record here before that I still believe that Howe is a good manager who will learn from this and do well at his next club and I stand by that. But its still time for him to leave here, so that he can recoup and go again. He's not going to turn it around and the idea of giving him a bumper kitty to spend on more Elangas is terrifying.

 

All managers "flame out' and Iraola would do too. But that's not a good enough reason to not go for him.

 

Respect your opinion but i'm going to massively disagree that he hasn't over-achieved. Taking into account where he started from, the state of the squad and the gap to the big teams, what he did in his first full season was an absolute miracle.

 

He followed that up with a CL season where we a little unluckily missed Europe again, then a first trophy in 70 years and another CL campaign. I find the sentence "history is irrelevant" to be quite incredible. I've seen Newcastle win a trophy in my lifetime, something I never thought would happen and this will always be meaningful and looked back on with pride and love. It's not irrelevant at all.

 

This season has been bad no argument, but with the context of Isak, PSR, No DoF or CEO and a mess forged by all the big guns copying our homework and signing everyone we wanted and with the conclusion of us having to sign players way down our list, I get some of it. That's the context and I think as frustrated as we all are, to not apply it to this season's problems is not right. 

 

All that said, if it's the end, then it's the end and I hope he gets the send-off he deserves, bloke's a legend.

[J7]

2 minutes ago, nufc123 said:

Thats impossible to answer. Could be Pedro for example. He was ready before Chelsea came in . Trafford was ready.

Pedro wanted to be in London. Our level of targets was the issue, as was prioritising PL experience. I do like Ramsey, but giving Villa a PSR boost was also ridiculous. 

[TRon]

Just now, nufc123 said:

Thats impossible to answer. Could be Pedro for example. He was ready before Chelsea came in . Trafford was ready.

 

Pedro was ready until Chelsea stepped in. Trafford was ready before City invoked their clause. Who knows if those clubs were always ready to jump in once the negotiations had been done by us. Trafford is the one I think might have slipped through the cracks, but that just sounds like incompetence from our end. 

[Teslact]

6 minutes ago, Wolfcastle said:

how did the club let Keegan down? 

He left on principle knowing the floatation was all about Hall Jr and Shepherd extracting more money from the fans who'd invest in the stock.

[nufc123]

Just now, TRon said:

 

Pedro was ready until Chelsea stepped in. Trafford was ready before City invoked their clause. Who knows if those clubs were always ready to jump in once the negotiations had been done by us. Trafford is the one I think might have slipped through the cracks, but that just sounds like incompetence from our end. 

Maybe, but its nothing new that timing and acting fast is very important in certain deals.

[Milburn]

4 minutes ago, nufc123 said:

Maybe. Having a DOF in place maybe would have sealed some of the deals slipping through.

 

Nah. At the end of the day, those players chose clubs that, from a neutral point of view, are more attractive than Newcastle and operate on a different wage structure. A DoF doesn’t really change that.

 

We also tried moving early on several of those deals, so it’s not like we were sitting still waiting for a structure to fall into place.

 

The one we probably did get wrong was Ekitike. That felt doable if we’d acted differently regarding Liverpool and Isak. 

[Wandy]

Just now, LionOfGosforth said:

 

Respect your opinion but i'm going to massively disagree that he hasn't over-achieved. Taking into account where he started from, the state of the squad and the gap to the big teams, what he did in his first full season was an absolute miracle.

 

He followed that up with a CL season where we a little unluckily missed Europe again, then a first trophy in 70 years and another CL campaign. I find the sentence "history is irrelevant" to be quite incredible. I've seen Newcastle win a trophy in my lifetime, something I never thought would happen and this will always be meaningful and looked back on with pride and love. It's not irrelevant at all.

 

This season has been bad no argument, but with the context of Isak, PSR, No DoF or CEO and a mess forged by all the big guns copying our homework and signing everyone we wanted and with the conclusion of us having to sign players way down our list, I get some of it. That's the context and I think as frustrated as we all are, to not apply it to this season's problems is not right. 

 

All that said, if it's the end, then it's the end and I hope he gets the send-off he deserves, bloke's a legend.

 

Without a doubt he is a NUFC legend and a sacking wont change that. But this happens at top clubs all the time. A manager does great things but then goes stale and he inevitably gets the boot.

 

Sacking Eddie will not cloud his legacy in the long term if he goes now. He's the guy who broke the trophy jinx and this shitshow of a season where he has ran out of ideas wont be able to put a stain on that.

[nufc123]

2 minutes ago, J7 said:

Pedro wanted to be in London. 

He did, but if we believe the reports he was ready to join. If that was because he wanted Chelsea to act we dont know.

[Wolfcastle]

1 minute ago, Teslact said:

He left on principle knowing the floatation was all about Hall Jr and Shepherd extracting more money from the fans who'd invest in the stock.

Fully aware of that, less aware how it constitutes being let down 6months after breaking the world record transfer fee.

[nufc123]

Just now, Milburn said:

Nah. At the end of the day, those players chose clubs that, from a neutral point of view, are more attractive than Newcastle and operate on a different wage structure. A DoF doesn’t really change that.

Ah, okey then lets go without one for the foreseeable future .

[TRon]

Just now, nufc123 said:

Maybe, but its nothing new that timing and acting fast is very important in certain deals.

 

Just now, Milburn said:

 

Nah. At the end of the day, those players chose clubs that, from a neutral point of view, are more attractive than Newcastle and operate on a different wage structure. A DoF doesn’t really change that.

 

We also tried moving early on several of those deals, so it’s not like we were sitting still waiting for a structure to fall into place.

 

The one we probably did get wrong was Ekitike. That felt doable if we’d acted differently regarding Liverpool and Isak. 

 

 

Don't think that was doable either tbh. Felt like the time for Pedro and Ekitike was earlier in their career and richer clubs stepped in every time. It was us who dropped the Pedro deal actually, when we got the chance for Isak last minute instead. 

[Stifler]

23 minutes ago, astraguy said:

and because of the failed signing he wanted ,Wissa ended up being the isak replacement that got fucked early, Howe has a damn good record with transfers and improving players bar this one

Wissa wasn’t the Isak replacement though, Wissa is the Wilson replacement he wanted from the 2nd half of last season when we were getting linked with him.

Woltemade ended up being the Isak replacement.

 

Wissa has ended up being the waste of time signing many of us predicted when they said that we wanted to pay £40m-£50m on a 29 year old.

Woltemade hasn’t had the service he requires, and then has been lumped in midfield as if he’s going to be become the next Joelinton.

[Danh1]

7 minutes ago, Milburn said:

 

Exactly, and that’s the key point.

 

The next manager will most likely have a shorter cycle than Howe anyway. Nearly five years at one club is already rare in modern football.

 

Which is why the structure matters so much. Managers come and go, but the club’s identity, recruitment model and overall philosophy shouldn’t reset every time there’s a change in the dugout.

 

That’s what we’ve been lacking, and why getting that right now is more important than any individual manager in my opinion.

Bang on this. I remember when Brighton lost Potter and they already had a list of successors in place to come in and work within their system, kind of like plug and play. 
 

If Howe walked tomorrow you just know we’d have Jones in charge til May whilst they looked for a replacement