More transfer rumours

[Ikon]

What’s the deal with someone like Luka Jovic these days? Days totally numbered or in need of a new environment and proper game time? Could someone like him come in on loan and end up being a very good signing with some luck? 

[macphisto]

30 minutes ago, Manxst said:

Odegaard, Cucurella, Tomiyasu, Cornet, Daka, Bentacur, Kulusevski, Mendy, Eze, Raphina, Thiago, Tsimikas, Walker-Peters have all been signed within the last year or two, were all within the 20-30m bracket and all would improve us. It’s easy to splash mega money on players but a decent scouting setup will go a long way to prevent us blowing money simply for the sake of it. Granted, at some point we’ll have to spend past that bracket on a regular basis simply to keep improving, but I don’t think we have to unless an exceptional deal becomes available, or if we (for example) wanted a ‘guaranteed’ 20 goal striker. 

I could also give you a lot of others, many more than you listed, who are in the price bracket and would not improve the team. Just have a look at the transfers for this season. 

 

If we have the money then why not go out and buy the best players you can who are willing to come? It's like some people have been Ashleyized and are frightened to spend big money. Stuff this slowly, slowly approach. That is not to say there is not room for free transfers, buying cheap older players for experience like Trippier, but in the main to make significant improvements to the team we'll have to spend big money.

 

Who knows what our scouting system is at the moment but even if we had the best setup then we'd still recruit as many bad players as good in the £20/£30 million bracket. 

 

 

 

Edited April 10, 2022 by macphisto

[Ikon]

There are lots of good signings to make. Buying guaranteed success and in form players will cost you a bomb. We can’t just buy these type of players. We have to make some shrewd business too.  The balance has to be right because we can’t just buy anyone we would like. 
 

Getting a fringe player from a club for example. One that should start for them but doesn’t have the vote of confidence in them from their manager, or someone in ridiculous form might be the reason X quality player doesn’t play and could be available and so on.. 

 

 

Edited April 10, 2022 by Ikon

[macphisto]

14 minutes ago, Lush Vlad said:

I’m sure there will be players from Europe and/or in the last year of their contract that we can get and not get ripped off. We have wasted money and over-spent previously But also got some bargains. I don’t think it’s that unrealistic. 
 

Targett is going to be £15m, supposedly. He’s not far off decent and is far better than what we have had of late. Burn was £12m and is decent, if not spectacular. Trippier was £12m, albeit with different circumstances to most transfers. Bruno was low 30’s plus add ons, wasn’t he?
 

Depends on your definition, I guess. I originally typed top class and then realised that’s not going to happen for those sort of numbers. 

I agree that in general we have had up and down times in our transfer history but the times we have challenged was when we relatively spent a lot of money. 

 

I am not saying getting ripped off, the key is value for money. I just don't know why some people are wanting to go down the free transfers, last year of contracts route only. There is a place for them but the key principle under these owners should be value for money. If a good player for £60-£70 million wants to come then go for it. 

 

All the players you listed are decent solid players, people like Targett and Burn I could see being around the 1st team for a few seasons ahead. The thing is though is that we can't have too many of that standard in the team overall, if we had the equivalent of those players elsewhere in the team then we wouldn't be much better than we are now.  

[macphisto]

6 minutes ago, Ikon said:

There are lots of good signings to make. Buying guaranteed success and in form players will cost you a bomb. We can’t just buy these type of players. We have to make some shrewd business too.  The balance has to be right because we can’t just buy anyone we would like. 
 

Getting a fringe player from a club for example. One that should start for them but doesn’t have the vote of confidence in them from their manager, or someone in ridiculous form might be the reason X quality player doesn’t play and could be available and so on.. 

 

 

 

These are just examples, I'm not advocating we go for these players but Philips from Leeds or Abraham from Roma. We might be in with a shout for either of those players and they would both cost £60 million-ish. If the club thought they would improve the team then why not go for them? 

 

 

[Lush Vlad]

4 minutes ago, macphisto said:

I agree that in general we have had up and down times in our transfer history but the times we have challenged was when we relatively spent a lot of money. 

 

I am not saying getting ripped off, the key is value for money. I just don't know why some people are wanting to go down the free transfers, last year of contracts route only. There is a place for them but the key principle under these owners should be value for money. If a good player for £60-£70 million wants to come then go for it. 

 

All the players you listed are decent solid players, people like Targett and Burn I could see being around the 1st team for a few seasons ahead. The thing is though is that we can't have too many of that standard in the team overall, if we had the equivalent of those players elsewhere in the team then we wouldn't be much better than we are now.  

But I listed those players and they cost considerably less than £30m. I’m not saying target those kind of players. I’d also say Trippier and Bruno are a bit more than just decent and solid. 
 

I also don’t think we should be going for freebies or options that are perceived as being cheap. I’m just saying there will be some good players available who clubs can’t afford to lose on a free. So we may be able to get before they wind their contract down. 
 

I don’t for one second think we will penny pinch. But I also think there are too many areas of need for us to be spending £50-£60m on too many players. 

[LFEE]

2 hours ago, Yorkie said:

Would love Abraham. Had a brilliant season for Roma, he just gets on the end of chances.

We don’t make any though. Look at the service Wood has received.

[Mazzy]

Just now, LFEE said:

We don’t make any though. Look at the service Wood has received.

 

This is next season we are talking about though. Going to be very different to how we are now.

[Ikon]

4 minutes ago, macphisto said:

These are just examples, I'm not advocating we go for these players but Philips from Leeds or Abraham from Roma. We might be in with a shout for either of those players and they would both cost £60 million-ish. If the club thought they would improve the team then why not go for them? 

 

 

I’m not saying that we shouldn’t go for 50m players that will improve us no doubt. What I’m saying is that we also need to find “bargains”. Players available with great quality or potential that don’t cost 40-60m but prove to be great signings. We need 4-6 players. We won’t spend 200m or near. 

 

 

Edited April 10, 2022 by Ikon

[SUPERTOON]

2 hours ago, Ikon said:

Actually a very good shout. One that I’ve totally forgot about.  Spending say 60m on him feels more safe than say 30-35m on someone very young that hasn’t really proved anything but great potential. 
 

He’s like what? 24-25? Striker for more or less 10 years. 

 

 

 

Yep and proven in the premier league and has been brilliant for Roma 

[r0cafella]

How good is Philips? He’s played less than 50 games at the highest level at 26 years old. The figures quoted are eye watering too. 

[macphisto]

Just now, Lush Vlad said:

But I listed those players and they cost considerably less than £30m. I’m not saying target those kind of players. I’d also say Trippier and Bruno are a bit more than just decent and solid. 
 

I also don’t think we should be going for freebies or options that are perceived as being cheap. I’m just saying there will be some good players available who clubs can’t afford to lose on a free. So we may be able to get before they wind their contract down. 
 

I don’t for one second think we will penny pinch. But I also think there are too many areas of need for us to be spending £50-£60m on too many players. 

Trippier whilst a good player is 31. As you said, Bruno was more than £30 million and will probably end up closer to £40 million with addons which is the minimum price bracket we should be looking at in general as there are always exceptions. 

 

I understand people thinking we need to address the overall quality of the squad but I actually don't think the squad is that poor now. I could see us shooting up the league if we buy 3/4 real quality players, on a lesser scale but not too dissimilar to when we bought Robert and Bellamy under Robson. I would much rather go for quality over quantity as we can cover some of the holes in the squad that would be left over.

[Ikon]

Just now, r0cafella said:

How good is Philips? He’s played less than 50 games at the highest level at 26 years old. The figures quoted are eye watering too. 

I think he’s very good but I’m not sure he’s worth spending that much money on. Maybe we could get a cheaper option that will improve us and also free up money for other positions which may end up making us stronger on the whole. 
 

For example, get someone like Grillitsch on a free and suddenly we have around 50m for other positions. Is he as good as Phillips? Probably not, who knows how he would do in the PL. he would improve our midfield no doubt. Wee need to strengthen a few positions.

[macphisto]

4 minutes ago, r0cafella said:

How good is Philips? He’s played less than 50 games at the highest level at 26 years old. The figures quoted are eye watering too. 

As I said, I just used him as an example but if the club think he would be an improvement then go for him. That was the main point I was trying to make. 

[Manxst]

27 minutes ago, macphisto said:

I could also give you a lot of others, many more than you listed, who are in the price bracket and would not improve the team. Just have a look at the transfers for this season. 

 

If we have the money then why not go out and buy the best players you can who are willing to come? It's like some people have been Ashleyized and are frightened to spend big money. Stuff this slowly, slowly approach. That is not to say there is not room for free transfers, buying cheap older players for experience like Trippier, but in the main to make significant improvements to the team we'll have to spend big money.

 

Who knows what our scouting system is at the moment but even if we had the best setup then we'd still recruit as many bad players as good in the £20/£30 million bracket. 

 

 

 

 

The point being, that you said we couldn’t get ANY decent players for those prices. Obviously there will be players in that bracket who aren’t particular good and clubs have overpaid for, but that’s the point of decent scouting. 

[r0cafella]

Just now, Ikon said:

I think he’s very good but I’m not sure he’s worth spending that much money on. Maybe we could get a cheaper option that will improve us and also free up money for other positions which may end up making us stronger on the whole. 
 

For example, get someone like Grillitsch on a free and suddenly we have around 50m for other positions. Is he as good as Phillips? Probably not, who knows how he would do in the PL. he would improve our midfield no doubt. Wee need to strengthen a few positions.

I think it’s tricky and one of the major challenges we face. We don’t have many sellable players but at the same time we have an ageing squad which needs improving everywhere. It’s going to be very difficult to find the balance, it’s clear that due to the glass ceiling of FFP We won’t be able to do a city and have a 50million player in every position. 

[r0cafella]

Just now, macphisto said:

As I said, I just used him as an example but if the club think he would be an improvement then go for him. That was the main point I was trying to make. 

Wasn’t a criticism of you, or your post. I genuinely don’t know how good he actually is. 

[WillingtonMag]

New centre forward,Right winger/forward, another centre midfielder and a centre half. If we fill those four positions with quality we can challenge for European places next season.

[SUPERTOON]

13 minutes ago, r0cafella said:

How good is Philips? He’s played less than 50 games at the highest level at 26 years old. The figures quoted are eye watering too. 

He’s strongly linked with Man Utd, I’m with you, I’d rather spend it elsewhere.

[Ikon]

A good example is someone like Targett,especially this early in our “project”. First of all it’s more or less risk free as it’s a loan, and if he does well like has then there is the option of buying him for an decent amount (by the sounds of it). 
 

is he an exciting and elegant signing? I don’t think so. Is it a very good signing that has improved us? Most definitely I’d say. He’s an example of a signing that we need to do in the summer to improve us while not breaking the bank. Allows us to make a couple of marquee signings as the icing on the cake. 
 

 

Say that we had signed a new LB for 30m, would he have done much better than Targett? I don’t think so. Every team has players that are not wow but offer quality and average 7.5/10 performances consistently. 

 

 

 

Edited April 10, 2022 by Ikon

[macphisto]

10 minutes ago, Ikon said:

I’m not saying that we shouldn’t go for 50m players that will improve us no doubt. What I’m saying is that we also need to find “bargains”. Players available with great quality or potential that don’t cost 40-60m but prove to be great signings. We need 4-6 players. We won’t spend 200m or near. 

 

 

 

We could get away with 4 players of top quality in my opinion. 

 

If not £200 million then not far off it, the evidence is in front of our eyes:

1) For PIF to go through the hassle of buying us for over a year, how they were almost publicly humiliated by the delay (at least in their eyes)

2) Al-Rumayyan attending a few matches (he doesn't waste his time and signifies the importance of Newcastle)

3) January transfer window spend that was already high and could have been much higher with the public bids for Carlos, Botman and Ekitike (say another £60-£80 million though maybe we wouldn't have bought Burn)

4) Publicly stated aims to be challenging in the next 5 years

5) Regional prestige of PIF in relation to Qatar and UAE

6) PIF absolutely minted

 

Despite all of the above, do you really think PIF are going to mess around with free transfers, contract clauses and "bargains". Yes some clever transfers will come in handy but they'll also throw serious money at the club too. The main consideration for them will be to ensure they don't get ripped off in the process, spending a lot of money won't be the issue apart FFP.

 

[Lush Vlad]

11 minutes ago, macphisto said:

Trippier whilst a good player is 31. As you said, Bruno was more than £30 million and will probably end up closer to £40 million with addons which is the minimum price bracket we should be looking at in general as there are always exceptions. 

 

I understand people thinking we need to address the overall quality of the squad but I actually don't think the squad is that poor now. I could see us shooting up the league if we buy 3/4 real quality players, on a lesser scale but not too dissimilar to when we bought Robert and Bellamy under Robson. I would much rather go for quality over quantity as we can cover some of the holes in the squad that would be left over.

I think the squad depth is pretty poor. So many nothing players and plenty who are regularly playing. Who should be on the bench or shipped out. 
 

All that said. I do think you could really improve the starting XI on its own with 4-5 players. I think a striker, wide man, DM and a CB would be great. But as I keep saying, I can’t see us spending £40m-£50m plus on more than a couple of those signings. So you still need to supplement that with some that cost a bit less. 
 

[macphisto]

13 minutes ago, Manxst said:

The point being, that you said we couldn’t get ANY decent players for those prices. Obviously there will be players in that bracket who aren’t particular good and clubs have overpaid for, but that’s the point of decent scouting. 

I said there would be exceptions to any price band if you read my original message. 

 

You can have decent scouting but you will still buy as many bad players and good in the £20/£30 million bracket. Look at our January transfer window, it is no coincidence that our best player by far, a level above all the other players we bought, was over £30 million and will probably end up closer to £40 million. 

[Ikon]

2 minutes ago, macphisto said:

We could get away with 4 players of top quality in my opinion. 

 

If not £200 million then not far off it, the evidence is in front of our eyes:

1) For PIF to go through the hassle of buying us for over a year, how they were almost publicly humiliated by the delay (at least in their eyes)

2) Al-Rumayyan attending a few matches (he doesn't waste his time and signifies the importance of Newcastle)

3) January transfer window spend that was already high and could have been much higher with the public bids for Carlos, Botman and Ekitike (say another £60-£80 million though maybe we wouldn't have bought Burn)

4) Publicly stated aims to be challenging in the next 5 years

5) Regional prestige of PIF in relation to Qatar and UAE

6) PIF absolutely minted

 

Despite all of the above, do you really think PIF are going to mess around with free transfers, contract clauses and "bargains". Yes some clever transfers will come in handy but they'll also throw serious money at the club too. The main consideration for them will be to ensure they don't get ripped off in the process, spending a lot of money won't be the issue apart FFP.

 

 

“Apart from FFP” being key words. I know that we could spend a lot despite ffp. But we won’t put all our eggs in one basket, and rightly so. We need to do some sensible spending too. I’m sure we will sign real quality. But they don’t have to cost 50m each. Plus we need more than 4 players anyway.

[macphisto]

8 minutes ago, Ikon said:

A good example is someone like Targett,especially this early in our “project”. First of all it’s more or less risk free as it’s a loan, and if he does well like has then there is the option of buying him for an decent amount (by the sounds of it). 
 

is he an exciting and elegant signing? I don’t think so. Is it a very good signing that has improved us? Most definitely I’d say. He’s an example of a signing that we need to do in the summer to improve us while not breaking the bank. Allows us to make a couple of marquee signings as the icing on the cake. 
 

 

Say that we had signed a new LB for 30m, would he have done much better than Targett? I don’t think so. Every team has players that are not wow but offer quality and average 7.5/10 performances consistently. 

 

 

 

 

Talking about the 1st team, not boosting the squad, Targett was a great signing but I think we now have enough at that level and if we introduced a player of similar pedigree then it would not improve the team. For want of a better way of putting it, we now have a team of Targetts and need to step up in terms of quality.