The Prophet Posted April 15 Share Posted April 15 9 hours ago, andycap said: Silverware experience done it in different leagues. He's won the Europa League with Spanish teams, mainly Sevilla, and Ligue 1 with PSG (after unexpectedly losing it to Lille). Obviously to win the Europa League so many times is very impressive, but most of his good work has come in La Liga. This season is arguably his most impressive league campaign. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abacus Posted April 15 Share Posted April 15 (edited) 18 minutes ago, Froggy said: Do you genuinely not think the rules are better for football? Well supported clubs like Newcastle will prosper regardless. If there was nothing done about this the entire league would have been owned by America, Saudi and Qatar in 20-30 years. Your revenue is growing dramatically by the way. Up 36% on the year before. Your commerical revenue up two thirds. Players like Hendrick and Dummett won't be there for much longer. You've spent big on some great players but were still able to drop £30-40m on prospect full backs like Hall and Livramento who weren't even starting for you. They'd bloody start for us. Like I said, it's only a matter of time. In my humble opinion. The difference being that despite that 36% growth our revenue will continue to be a fraction of yours and those other clubs, so we have less room to make mistakes and no chance of growing it globally without sustained success. Which we then won't have without being able to invest and ... around and around we go. I'm not even again financial controls - I am against something which locks in the status quo. Saying that, I'm equally against something that builds in permanent dominance for one club including ours, though you've probably noticed that's exactly where we are now. Edited April 15 by Abacus Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Froggy Posted April 15 Share Posted April 15 4 minutes ago, Abacus said: The difference being that despite that 36% growth our revenue will continue to be a fraction of yours and those other clubs, so we have less room to make mistakes and no chance of growing it globally without sustained success. Which we then won't have without being able to invest and ... around and around we go. I'm not even again financial controls - I am against something which locks in the status quo. Saying that, I'm equally against something that builds in permanent dominance for one club including ours, though you've probably noticed that's exactly where we are now. I agree that while you're playing catchup, you have less room to make mistakes. I do think you're able to invest to high levels though. FFP is solely talking about player sales as well. There's nothing stopping your owners building state of the art infrastructure which will also lead to increased player performance and success. Look at City's facilities, they're nothing short of mindblowing and it was all done in a relatively short period of time. It's a waiting game, but I can't see anything other than success with that wealth behind you. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted April 15 Share Posted April 15 1 hour ago, Optimistic Nut said: Let's not forget as well that Liverpool have still been able to win a title last 5 years, took it to the last day two seasons recently, will likely do the same this season. Arsenal have spent a shitload and continue to do so. They'll close the gap. Man Utd and Chelsea also have the financial means and have spent the sort of money that should have seen them competing. Can't be put on City just because they've been basket cases off the pitch. There should be scope for decent title races between those 5 clubs. It's just the likes of us, Villa, etc who might have the odd challenge but aren't allowed to spend to keep it up consistently. FFP will slow them down. They are getting closer to the wall. The CL run will do them good but the summer outlay and wages were heavy. 56 minutes ago, Froggy said: You need to rephrase. You can't spend what your owners would like to. You have spent £400m since Howe took charge. That's the same as what City has spent in the same timeframe. It's the same as what Man United has spent albeit we have spent it in one less window. It's more than Arsenal and more than Liverpool. The only team who has spent more than Newcastle since you've been bought over is Chelsea. This narrative that you can't spend is utter bollocks and needs to stop. You've spent a fortune. You're among the highest spenders in the league and will continue to be in the upcoming windows. Our wage bill is considerably lower and we are close to maxxing what we can spend. "You spent the same amount as City". City's wage bill is more than double ours. Man U wage bill is close to double ours. the rules mean we must spend about £100m less than you in wages season on season. We can spend in line with Aston Villa and significantly less than the top 6. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Froggy Posted April 15 Share Posted April 15 2 minutes ago, The College Dropout said: Our wage bill is considerably lower and we are close to maxxing what we can spend. "You spent the same amount as City". City's wage bill is more than double ours. Man U wage bill is close to double ours. the rules mean we must spend about £100m less than you in wages season on season. For now. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted April 15 Share Posted April 15 1 minute ago, Froggy said: For now. And in the short and medium term at least. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ikon Posted April 15 Share Posted April 15 (edited) Emery is class imo. On the same level as Howe, at least. Probably better tactically. So good that these two are the ones we were after. Very happy we got Howe, especially as it’s a long term project. Feels like Howe is likely to stay longer (willing to) Edited April 15 by Ikon Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Optimistic Nut Posted April 15 Share Posted April 15 City have peaked imo. They'll always be strong now but we're probably seeing the best version of City that they'll ever get to. There's several clubs below with the financial means to trouble them (or who should have troubled them) the last couple of years from that "elite 6". Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erikse Posted April 15 Share Posted April 15 (edited) 3 hours ago, Froggy said: Their fanbase is shocking compared to most clubs in the Premier League. They struggle to fill the stadium. I have mates in Manchester who were getting free tickets for City games after they were being handed out at universities to give the illusion of a full ground. The stadium was over half empty by the time they scored the 5th goal on Saturday. They're in a title challenge ffs. Ten Hag's impact was fairly huge in his first season like. Nothing like Howe, Emery or Alonso. I guess that yous have low expecations in general by now, but taking Man United (!) from 6th to 3rd is different from taking teams from 18 to perform like a top 4 team in short time. And in the second year, Man Utd have gone backwards, while the other managers kept the momentum going to do even bigger things. Edited April 15 by Erikse Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
OCK Posted April 15 Share Posted April 15 The "Big Six" having the worst atmosphere is incredible Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted April 15 Share Posted April 15 Man U are a different kettle of fish. 3rd/4th highest wages and squad cost. But finishing 4th is always a good achievement for them. Financial mismanagement is a given for them. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Froggy Posted April 15 Share Posted April 15 9 minutes ago, Erikse said: Nothing like Howe, Emery or Alonso. I guess that yous constanly have low expecations by now, but taking Man United (!) to 3rd is different from taking teams from 18 to perform like a top 4 team in short time. And in the second year, Man Utd have gone backwards, while the other managers kept the momentum going to do even bigger things. Leverkusen were third the season before Alonso took over. After 8 games he took over in October and he finished 6th. Newcastle finished 12th under Bruce the season before Howe took over. After a horrible start he took over in November and you finished 11th. Ten Hag took over after we had finished 6th. We had went out of the league cup in the third round, the FA Cup in the 4th round and got to the last 16 of the Champions League. He took us to third place, won the league cup, final of the FA Cup and quarter final of the Europa League. To suggest Ten Hag's impact was nothing like the others is simply false. To say we've gone backwards while the other managers have kept momentum going is undeniably true. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kid Icarus Posted April 15 Share Posted April 15 Our baseline before the takeover was 14 years in which our total net spend was something like £1.2m You need to either be any combination of braindead, insanely biased, or willfully ignorant to think that that context is irrelevant when comparing it to teams who during the same period spent hundreds and hundreds of millions. Absolutely no one who's reasonable would take an argument like that remotely seriously. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Froggy Posted April 15 Share Posted April 15 There's captain miss-the-point in again with zero substance. Have a day off just once. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Froggy Posted April 15 Share Posted April 15 Original comment that I refuted was: "We're not allowed to spend." You need to either be any combination of braindead, insanely biased, or willfully ignorant to suggest that's true. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abacus Posted April 15 Share Posted April 15 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted April 15 Share Posted April 15 I do love these Froggy fests we get occasionally. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kid Icarus Posted April 15 Share Posted April 15 (edited) 2 hours ago, Froggy said: It's not different at all. The starting base is irrelevant since the takeover. We couldn't sign anyone in January because of FFP and our revenue is triple what yours is. I don't know why you think these rules only apply to your club. I'm sure you'll drop another £100-150m in the summer, same as us. I must have just imagined this then. Edited April 15 by Kid Icarus Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Froggy Posted April 15 Share Posted April 15 1 minute ago, AyeDubbleYoo said: I do love these Froggy fests we get occasionally. I'm not even criticising, that's the thing. I just refuted one comment that is simply not true. I'm not suggesting Newcastle are even remotely close to level footing, financially, with the "big 6." I'm just arguing that saying "we can't spend" is just false. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
OCK Posted April 15 Share Posted April 15 But we can all agree Man U fans, especially Irish ones, are massive wankers. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kimbo Posted April 15 Share Posted April 15 2 hours ago, Froggy said: You need to rephrase. You can't spend what your owners would like to. You have spent £400m since Howe took charge. That's the same as what City has spent in the same timeframe. It's the same as what Man United has spent albeit we have spent it in one less window. It's more than Arsenal and more than Liverpool. The only team who has spent more than Newcastle since you've been bought over is Chelsea. This narrative that you can't spend is utter bollocks and needs to stop. You've spent a fortune. You're among the highest spenders in the league and will continue to be in the upcoming windows. We haven’t spent anywhere near Man U and Man City when wage bill is taken into account, and it should be taken into account as it’s the best indicator how how well a team will perform. Obviously a situation where clubs can spend anything they want (which was apparently fantastic up until the last few years) is far from ideal, but the current rules are designed to bake in the games inequality and kill off potential threats to the big 6. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
OCK Posted April 15 Share Posted April 15 £1bn squads crying about Newcastle. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kimbo Posted April 15 Share Posted April 15 6 minutes ago, Froggy said: I'm not even criticising, that's the thing. I just refuted one comment that is simply not true. I'm not suggesting Newcastle are even remotely close to level footing, financially, with the "big 6." I'm just arguing that saying "we can't spend" is just false. ‘We can spend up to a point that ensures we’re not a serious threat to the status quo’, isn’t as snappy. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Froggy Posted April 15 Share Posted April 15 1 minute ago, Kimbo said: We haven’t spent anywhere near Man U and Man City when wage bill is taken into account, and it should be taken into account as it’s the best indicator how how well a team will perform. Obviously a situation where clubs can spend anything they want (which was apparently fantastic up until the last few years) is far from ideal, but the current rules are designed to bake in the games inequality and kill off potential threats to the big 6. I never suggested you can match those clubs. I'm saying you've spent as much on transfers as those clubs. Simply in reply to a comment that you cannot spend, when the proof is that you absolutely can spend. Your revenue is already up 36%, and will continue to grow, and so will your spending in line with that. And see my point about infrastructure above. State of the art facilities will be on their way. You might have a few less injuries for example when those come into play. What's this weird obsession with trying to act like you aren't rich now? I just don't get it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Froggy Posted April 15 Share Posted April 15 5 minutes ago, OCK said: But we can all agree Man U fans, especially Irish ones, are massive wankers. Agreed. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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