Financial Fair Play / Profit & Sustainability

[Guest]

Would think our spending settles a bit anyway now and the commercial revenue catches up. We've been handicapped by needing to spend a shit load to stay up then push to the top 6, with little in the squad other than Maxi worth selling.

 

We've probably got about 19-20 senior players we'd be happy with. Season by season I could see 3-4 signings a season with 2-3 going out for better money than we've been bringing in other than Maxi going back as far as Ayoze really.

 

We can still be excited and push on.

[Bally21]

I put this in the "general nufc" chat, but might be better placed in this chat:

 

I notice that the season ticket renewal deadline is 20th May this year, rather than July as it was last year.

 

Wonder if this may be related to FFP.

 

Anyone renewing season ticket as a one off payment would be paying in May at the latest (as opposed to July last year), also for those spreading the cost it states first payment will be 5th June - it was 5th July last year.

 

I think the FFP period ends sometime in June?

 

Maybe they are trying to pull some of next seasons revenue into this FFP period?

 

Smart move if so, but may create a revenue reduction in the next 3 year period. 

[The Prophet]

 

[The Prophet]

This is a highlight:

 

 

[The College Dropout]

36 minutes ago, Optimistic Nut said:

Would think our spending settles a bit anyway now and the commercial revenue catches up. We've been handicapped by needing to spend a shit load to stay up then push to the top 6, with little in the squad other than Maxi worth selling.

 

We've probably got about 19-20 senior players we'd be happy with. Season by season I could see 3-4 signings a season with 2-3 going out for better money than we've been bringing in other than Maxi going back as far as Ayoze really.

 

We can still be excited and push on.

You don't understand. According to last years accounting but next year (or two) rules - we can't spend anything. We have to sell to be compliant.

[The Prophet]

17 minutes ago, The College Dropout said:

You don't understand. According to last years accounting but next year (or two) rules - we can't spend anything. We have to sell to be compliant.

 

Maguire's analysis applied the proposed new rules to last year's accounts. We were about £30 million short of compliance.

 

This excludes new and significant sponsorship, along with player sales, as well as the fact the new rules don't fully kick in for a couple of years. 

 

Still expect us to sell to maximise out budget though.

 

 

Edited April 12 by The Prophet

[timnufc22]

17 hours ago, TheBrownBottle said:

Agreed re middle ground on rules, but Spurs’ success was still built on huge income.  The year they reached the Champions League final - five seasons ago - their income was roughly double ours was in 22/23.  In fact you have to go back a decade before their income was the same as ours last season - well before the explosion in income levels.  We’re not likely to hit £400m in income any time soon with the current rules in place and no new stadium - I just don’t see how we do that.

 

Depressing or not, that is the current position.  We can’t compete without being put on financial steroids for a period to bring in sustained success - that’s how you get the big sponsors and international revenues.  Sad cases the world over need to buy the merchandise and consume shite with our badge slapped on it.  

 

And how did Spurs gain that income? I stand to be corrected, but I don't believe it was through a sugar daddy injecting huge amounts of money from nowhere. They made a great managerial appointed (Pochettino) and recruited very well. Their academy produced one of the worlds best strikers. They clearly obtained great commercial deals. Granted they're a London club so I appreciate that is a caveat to this conversion.

 

They hadn't moved into their new stadium so were not generating income through NFL events etc. They were playing at Wembley, where again I stand corrected if they somehow had an event tie-in situation. Their average attendance there was 68k, which is a big boost to what they were used to at WHL, but not a massive amount more than some people are turning their nose up at for a SJP extension (61-62k).

 

I'm not naïve to the task again for us or any other similar sized football club nor to the clear vested interests from certain clubs to stop others progressing. But if we can strike together the right elements, it is possible to break into the top 6 and even top 4. The size of such a task means it would only be that much more rewarding. No pride in the Man City route and it would get boring fast too imo (the Etihad atmosphere attests to this). 

 

Howe is clearly a manager players love to play for, he has a special connection with the players and I'm sure word travels in the football world how great he is, especially on a personal level. If he learns the lessons of this season and proves to be our long-term man, I think it can help to attract players, who will know they're in safe hands. If we extended SJP to 61-62k, sorted out the seating arrangements, the place would look and ideally sound stunning and one of the most special & unique venues to play at and would be a great selling point. Swap that with a new stadium if that's your preference. The more we maintain a European place EL/ECL - the more we can increase sponsorship and the more chance we have of cracking top 4 again. If we persist not only can we do it, but we can maintain it for a period I think too.

 

[Mikky]

Was the Sela deal included in the 22:23 accounts? I am assuming no? Likewise Noon would have been a part payment as they joined during the season?

[The College Dropout]

30 minutes ago, The Prophet said:

 

Maguire's analysis applied the proposed new rules to last year's accounts. We were about £30 million short of compliance.

 

This excludes new and significant sponsorship, along with player sales, as well as the fact the new rules don't fully kick in for a couple of years. 

 

Still expect us to sell to maximise out budget though.

 

 

 

We sold £25m. 
 

We spent £150m. 
 

I expect us to be right up against that 70% threshold again.  
 

Im certain we won’t have the buffer to spend on more than 1 big transfer without significant sales. 

 

 

Edited April 12 by The College Dropout

[Jonas]

7 hours ago, duo said:

Never mind catching them we can't even keep up. The new rules just make them even richer.

its an Achillies Paradox.

Whilst ourselves, Villa etc. take a step in that direction, because they can say 'were established, and they've been cut off at the knees' their sponsorship ought to be bigger than ours and the gap widened.

Behind the scenes I bet they cant believe they've got away with it.

[Shearergol]

1 hour ago, The Prophet said:

 

Maguire's analysis applied the proposed new rules to last year's accounts. We were about £30 million short of compliance.

 

This excludes new and significant sponsorship, along with player sales, as well as the fact the new rules don't fully kick in for a couple of years. 

 

Still expect us to sell to maximise out budget though.

 

 

 

We have to sell. There’s no other option. I think we’ll go into next season with an almost identical squad hoping injuries don’t happen.

[manorpark]

17 minutes ago, Shearergol said:

We have to sell. There’s no other option. I think we’ll go into next season with an almost identical squad hoping injuries don’t happen.

 

Selling Miggy and/or Callum Wilson would more than satisfy the need, when added to the Champions League money, the SELA money and the Adidas money that would give us a LOT of capability (in our y/e 30th June Accounts) to spend in this summers transfer window,

[Shearergol]

4 minutes ago, manorpark said:

 

Selling Miggy and/or Callum Wilson would more than satisfy the need, when added to the Champions League money, the SELA money and the Adidas money that would give us a LOT of capability (in our y/e 30th June Accounts) to spend in this summers transfer window,

Unfortunately we’re not getting much for either of them. Selling both might allow us to spend on a right winger but that’s about it. The facts are in the accounts. It’s not even speculation.

[The Prophet]

1 hour ago, The College Dropout said:

We sold £25m. 
 

We spent £150m. 
 

I expect us to be right up against that 70% threshold again.  
 

Im certain we won’t have the buffer to spend on more than 1 big transfer without significant sales. 

 

 

 

 

There is no threshold for another season. 

[The Prophet]

To clarify I fully expect us to sell (the likes of Dubs, Almiron, Wilson, etc) to give us more spending power. 

[Rod]

7 minutes ago, Shearergol said:

Unfortunately we’re not getting much for either of them. Selling both might allow us to spend on a right winger but that’s about it. The facts are in the accounts. It’s not even speculation.

Honestly, talk about glass half empty.  You are the champion of doom and gloom.

Can I ask how do you know "we're not getting much for either of them".  Also I need to know how you have access to NUFC's accounts.  You appear to have so much knowledge (sigh).

[Colos Short and Curlies]

2 hours ago, Bally21 said:

I put this in the "general nufc" chat, but might be better placed in this chat:

 

I notice that the season ticket renewal deadline is 20th May this year, rather than July as it was last year.

 

Wonder if this may be related to FFP.

 

Anyone renewing season ticket as a one off payment would be paying in May at the latest (as opposed to July last year), also for those spreading the cost it states first payment will be 5th June - it was 5th July last year.

 

I think the FFP period ends sometime in June?

 

Maybe they are trying to pull some of next seasons revenue into this FFP period?

 

Smart move if so, but may create a revenue reduction in the next 3 year period. 

nope.

 

the ticket money will be in next years accounts regardless on when money is paid.

 

in simple terms you recognise income when it is earned (or when the games are played) and not when the cash is received.

[54]

Chelsea have spent more on agent fees in the last year, then the total price we paid for Isak. (£75 million)

[Bally21]

17 minutes ago, Colos Short and Curlies said:

nope.

 

the ticket money will be in next years accounts regardless on when money is paid.

 

in simple terms you recognise income when it is earned (or when the games are played) and not when the cash is received.

Fair enough. Every day is a school day.

[Ghandis Flip-Flop]

2 hours ago, The College Dropout said:

We sold £25m. 
 

We spent £150m. 
 

I expect us to be right up against that 70% threshold again.  
 

Im certain we won’t have the buffer to spend on more than 1 big transfer without significant sales. 

 

 

 

Brilliant but it’s several years until the 70% threshold is a thing, so it’s pointless getting your knickers in a twist until it is

[Keegans Export]

1 hour ago, 54 said:

Chelsea have spent more on agent fees in the last year, then the total price we paid for Isak. (£75 million)

Presumably agents fees are included in the FFP calculations and aren't amortised the same as transfer fees? That must have a massive impact. 

[Shearergol]

2 hours ago, Rod said:

Honestly, talk about glass half empty.  You are the champion of doom and gloom.

Can I ask how do you know "we're not getting much for either of them".  Also I need to know how you have access to NUFC's accounts.  You appear to have so much knowledge (sigh).

Christ, I’m usually the positive one on here  I’m just realistic about the values of those players in question. 
 

as for the accounts, unless there have been extra deals we’re not aware of, it’s kinda public knowledge where we are right now based on last year’s accounts.

[Novocastrian]

If the new regulations are going to be so deleterious to our immediate prospects and future growth why did our owners vote it through? 

[black_n_white]

44 minutes ago, Novocastrian said:

If the new regulations are going to be so deleterious to our immediate prospects and future growth why did our owners vote it through? 

The lesser of two evils

[Ben]

WTF