Shays Given Tim Flowers Posted December 9 Share Posted December 9 If it was that easy to do and win we’d have done it. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRon Posted December 9 Share Posted December 9 31 minutes ago, Shays Given Tim Flowers said: If it was that easy to do and win we’d have done it. Yeah it's obviously quite complicated. You only have to see how doggedly the PL authorities have gone after some clubs outside of the cartel to see that. Just look at the Man City case, they would have dropped that ages ago if they didn't have cartel backing. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfcastle Posted December 9 Share Posted December 9 (edited) Always said if it comes down to money you generate the fleecing of fans would increase. I know it always goes in that direction but clubs gain and lose advantage based on it now. The only clubs that benefit are the cartel and the only fans that benefit are the plastic day-tripper fans of the cartel - their clubs get to remain at the top for their rare expensive visits over. Sadly neither probably is a flaw of PSR/FFP's design but rather its intent. Edited December 9 by Wolfcastle Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jackie Broon Posted December 9 Share Posted December 9 9 hours ago, manorpark said: What we need to happen is for someone, some group, some organisation (which satisfies points (1) and (2) above) to take legal action against the EPL under competition law. As far as I can see it is a certain legal win because we have a proven cartel (we knew it already but Man City exposed the letters) and under competition law a CARTEL IS ILLEGAL. There is no such thing as a certain legal win in a case like that, it would be complex and unpredictable. There is a public interest test and potentially a court could find that there is public interest in the anti-competitive elements of the PL's rules. The response of the Man City tribunal to the letters which you say have proven a cartel was the legal equivalent of 'meh'. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
manorpark Posted December 9 Share Posted December 9 1 hour ago, Jackie Broon said: There is no such thing as a certain legal win in a case like that, it would be complex and unpredictable. There is a public interest test and potentially a court could find that there is public interest in the anti-competitive elements of the PL's rules. The response of the Man City tribunal to the letters which you say have proven a cartel was the legal equivalent of 'meh'. The Tribunal did not comment at all about the specific anti-competitive implications for Newcastle United FC. That remains untested legally. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
manorpark Posted December 9 Share Posted December 9 4 hours ago, Shays Given Tim Flowers said: If it was that easy to do and win we’d have done it. Who is this "we" ?? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shays Given Tim Flowers Posted December 9 Share Posted December 9 Newcastle United. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
manorpark Posted December 9 Share Posted December 9 10 minutes ago, Shays Given Tim Flowers said: Newcastle United. If you read my post (a few up from here) you would have seen that the club cannot do it, the club cannot take external legal action against the EPL. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shays Given Tim Flowers Posted December 9 Share Posted December 9 Please don’t talk down to me babe. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
manorpark Posted December 9 Share Posted December 9 Just now, Shays Given Tim Flowers said: Please don’t talk down to me babe. I am simply commenting on what you said babe !!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jackie Broon Posted December 9 Share Posted December 9 (edited) 32 minutes ago, manorpark said: If you read my post (a few up from here) you would have seen that the club cannot do it, the club cannot take external legal action against the EPL. That remains untested legally. Whilst there is an arbitration agreement in the PL and FA rules, part of our case in the CAT tribunal was that it shouldn't be applied to that claim (in addition to saying SJH hadn't actually signed up to it). So that isn't as cut and dried as you suggest, just like chances of winning a anti-competition case against PSR rules wouldn't be a "certain legal win". Edited December 9 by Jackie Broon Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
FloydianMag Posted December 10 Share Posted December 10 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteV Posted December 10 Share Posted December 10 200 VIP boxes in our new super stadium. £500k a season. Pay upfront for a 20 year lease. PSR sorted forever. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy84 Posted December 10 Share Posted December 10 30 minutes ago, FloydianMag said: Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted December 10 Share Posted December 10 2 hours ago, SteV said: 200 VIP boxes in our new super stadium. £500k a season. Pay upfront for a 20 year lease. PSR sorted forever. Well no you only get the revenue for 3 seasons on the books. But aye even just the 1 season that adds £100m to the books per annum. These are the type of schemes we should be doing. Half the seats at half the rate paid for in 2 year lump sum is still £50m on the books minimum. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted December 10 Share Posted December 10 Can we sell SJP to the Saudis? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteV Posted December 10 Share Posted December 10 2 minutes ago, The College Dropout said: Well no you only get the revenue for 3 seasons on the books. But aye even just the 1 season that adds £100m to the books per annum. These are the type of schemes we should be doing. Half the seats at half the rate paid for in 2 year lump sum is still £50m on the books minimum. Why are Barca bothering with this 20 year business then? Surely whatever they are charging now, they’d get more in 15 years time? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted December 10 Share Posted December 10 Just now, SteV said: Why are Barca bothering with this 20 year business then? Surely whatever they are charging now, they’d get more in 15 years time? To front load revenues so they can spend now? Barcelona have been doing this for some time. Selling off future revenue for revenue right here and now. They sold future rights so they could buy the likes of Lewa and Gundogan. They are insane. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SteV Posted December 10 Share Posted December 10 2 minutes ago, The College Dropout said: To front load revenues so they can spend now? Barcelona have been doing this for some time. Selling off future revenue for revenue right here and now. They sold future rights so they could buy the likes of Lewa and Gundogan. They are insane. So it’s predominantly a cash flow hack, rather than a PSR hack? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyeDubbleYoo Posted December 10 Share Posted December 10 16 hours ago, manorpark said: If you read my post (a few up from here) you would have seen that the club cannot do it, the club cannot take external legal action against the EPL. Who did Man City take action against? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The College Dropout Posted December 10 Share Posted December 10 10 minutes ago, SteV said: So it’s predominantly a cash flow hack, rather than a PSR hack? No Spain has a wage and spend cap linked to revenue. So it’s linked to that which links to PSR. It might be a cash flow thing but I don’t think so. They could take on loans if it was cash flow. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jackie Broon Posted December 10 Share Posted December 10 31 minutes ago, The College Dropout said: Can we sell SJP to the Saudis? No, we don't own the land it's on. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jackie Broon Posted December 10 Share Posted December 10 (edited) 35 minutes ago, AyeDubbleYoo said: Who did Man City take action against? The recent case was an arbitration using the PL's arbitration process. The other court case was a dispute over the arbitration process brought under the Arbitration Act. Anyway, as my post above, manorpark is talking in definite terms about something he doesn't know enough about to know shouldn't be discussed in definite terms. Btw, I'm probably guilty of a big slice of Dunning Kruger effect in discussing this too. Edited December 10 by Jackie Broon Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keegans Export Posted December 10 Share Posted December 10 48 minutes ago, The College Dropout said: Can we sell SJP to the Saudis? 15 minutes ago, Jackie Broon said: No, we don't own the land it's on. But, we do presumably own the stuff it's made from...? "How about a piece of the hallowed St James Park turf? Well, as a relative of the PIF Chairman, we can do you a special deal of only £10m per square meter! Or perhaps you'd like one of these vintage urinals from the legendary Gallowgate End loos? A bargain at just £20m" Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jackie Broon Posted December 10 Share Posted December 10 1 minute ago, Keegans Export said: But, we do presumably own the stuff it's made from...? "How about a piece of the hallowed St James Park turf? Well, as a relative of the PIF Chairman, we can do you a special deal of only £10m per square meter! Or perhaps you'd like one of these vintage urinals from the legendary Gallowgate End loos? A bargain at just £20m" Any of that would be subject to a Fair Market Value assessment. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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