How to "fix" domestic cups

[Geordie_once_removed]

So the League Cup was between Arsenal and Man City. The FA Cup will be be between Man City and Chelsea. All 4 teams played in the Champions League and their fans apart from on the day and maybe the week after won't really care it they win. Their finances won't be impacted much either as they get so much money from elsewhere. In short these competitions are increasing won by clubs who on the whole don't care and don't need the wins.  So how about this as a suggestion.

 

1. You qualify for the Champions League (you could make this all European competitions) you don't play in domestic cups

2. Bring back replays as these really help out smaller clubs and were got rid of purely to ease match congestion of clubs playing in Europe. They're also fun if you aren't playing 2 times a week for 2/3 of the season.

3. Bin off VAR in the cups, just because it's a bit shit and there she be all about living in the moment and not micro analysing decisions.

 

I know you might argue would devalue these competitions as the best teams weren't in them, but honestly if Newcastle won the 2027 FA Cup final against Leeds and some bellend said "You only won that because X weren't in it" would you care? I wouldn't, I'd just find it a useful dickhead detecting device.

[Theregulars]

They’re already fixed.

[bobbydazzla]

2025 cup winners:

 

Newcastle

Palace

 

 

 

 

[Heron]

10 minutes ago, Geordie_once_removed said:

So the League Cup was between Arsenal and Man City. The FA Cup will be be between Man City and Chelsea. All 4 teams played in the Champions League and their fans apart from on the day and maybe the week after won't really care it they win. Their finances won't be impacted much either as they get so much money from elsewhere. In short these competitions are increasing won by clubs who on the whole don't care and don't need the wins.  So how about this as a suggestion.

 

1. You qualify for the Champions League (you could make this all European competitions) you don't play in domestic cups

2. Bring back replays as these really help out smaller clubs and were got rid of purely to ease match congestion of clubs playing in Europe. They're also fun if you aren't playing 2 times a week for 2/3 of the season.

3. Bin off VAR in the cups, just because it's a bit shit and there she be all about living in the moment and not micro analysing decisions.

 

I know you might argue would devalue these competitions as the best teams weren't in them, but honestly if Newcastle won the 2027 FA Cup final against Leeds and some bellend said "You only won that because X weren't in it" would you care? I wouldn't, I'd just find it a useful dickhead detecting device.

For me the CL should consist of champions of the the domestic league and cups and not the top 5 or 6 in the league. Might not fix this particular issue, but might put more focus on winning the cups and being champions of something and not happy go lucky runners ups in the league (at varying levels).

[Geordie_once_removed]

2 minutes ago, Heron said:

For me the CL should consist of champions of the the domestic league and cups and not the top 5 or 6 in the league. Might not fix this particular issue, but might put more focus on winning the cups and being champions of something and not happy go lucky runners ups in the league (at varying levels).

I'd also not be against this. But it's something that depends on UEFA so harder to achieve, especially as they are going in the complete opposite direction. The suggestion I put forward would be purely a domestic decision (I think).

[Stifler]

1: You can’t do it, UEFA decides who qualifies for the Champions League, and they have rules that Champions League places are not for reward in cup competitions, or play offs. The Dutch had to change their play offs a few years ago to reflect this.

 

2: It won’t really help them. The difference between top level clubs and the lower and non-league clubs is massive now. You have teams like Chelsea who are able to have 3 squads worth of players on their book, all of quality most teams wouldn’t have 1 player of similar quality. Draws are a rare occurrence when the difference is so big. I’d also argue that most league clubs shouldn’t be relying on income from cups to get by.

 

3: There is an arguement to be had over VAR, however in my opinion the negatives of it won’t be addressed until we move away from referees and former referees being the ones to make the decisions. This also raises further discussions over the quality of our officials. 

[Geordie_once_removed]

9 minutes ago, bobbydazzla said:

2025 cup winners:

 

Newcastle

Palace

 

 

 

 

Remarkable very much because it was this. The last 15 years has largely the same Champions League qualifying clubs winning.

[SteV]

13 minutes ago, Geordie_once_removed said:

So the League Cup was between Arsenal and Man City. The FA Cup will be be between Man City and Chelsea. All 4 teams played in the Champions League and their fans apart from on the day and maybe the week after won't really care it they win. Their finances won't be impacted much either as they get so much money from elsewhere. In short these competitions are increasing won by clubs who on the whole don't care and don't need the wins.  So how about this as a suggestion.

 

1. You qualify for the Champions League (you could make this all European competitions) you don't play in domestic cups

2. Bring back replays as these really help out smaller clubs and were got rid of purely to ease match congestion of clubs playing in Europe. They're also fun if you aren't playing 2 times a week for 2/3 of the season.

3. Bin off VAR in the cups, just because it's a bit shit and there she be all about living in the moment and not micro analysing decisions.

 

I know you might argue would devalue these competitions as the best teams weren't in them, but honestly if Newcastle won the 2027 FA Cup final against Leeds and some bellend said "You only won that because X weren't in it" would you care? I wouldn't, I'd just find it a useful dickhead detecting device.

1. Would completely devalue the competition for me. May as well put an asterisk next to any winners if they do that.

 

2. Almost logistically impossible now if it involves a team playing in Europe that season.

 

3. Surely that’s a wider point (which many will agree with you on), but can’t really see how they could justify binning it off in the cup whilst keeping it in the league. All in or all out for me.

[Andy]

Half time shows, every player wears go-pros and the footage constantly shifts to them, David Coote Corner where he chips in on refereeing decisions from prison, double-VAR where every VAR decision has to be VAR'd again, goalkeeper interviews while the ball is down the other end of the pitch 

[Geordie_once_removed]

2 minutes ago, SteV said:

1. Would completely devalue the competition for me. May as well put an asterisk next to any winners if they do that.

 

2. Almost logistically impossible now if it involves a team playing in Europe that season.

 

3. Surely that’s a wider point (which many will agree with you on), but can’t really see how they could justify binning it off in the cup whilst keeping it in the league. All in or all out for me.

I think you misunderstood my suggestion. You would do 2 as there wouldn't be any clubs competing in the Champions League in there in the first place. I think any club competing in Europe is too wide a net and as the other European Competitions bring in so much less money. It would still stuff teams playing in the less European competitions but everything has downsides.

[mayubeproud]

You can relegate to League One in order to play in the EFL Trophy, and you won't need to play against 'big' clubs there (teams from Premier League or Championship could only play U21 sides there, so that's roughly what you wanted)

[SteV]

Actually the issue/problem isn’t really the cup(s) as such, it’s the financial disparity between the current ‘elite’ and the rest, and the restrictions placed on clubs that want to close that.

 

If they could improve/lessen that (yes, I know…), then you have more of a competitive balance resulting in a bigger spread of cup winners over time.

[SteV]

2 minutes ago, Geordie_once_removed said:

I think you misunderstood my suggestion. You would do 2 as there wouldn't be any clubs competing in the Champions League in there in the first place. I think any club competing in Europe is too wide a net and as the other European Competitions bring in so much less money. It would still stuff teams playing in the less European competitions but everything has downsides.

OK, I see, so in that sense it would probably be logistically possible, but I still wouldn’t want to see it based on the answer to number 1.

[Moose]

I understand the frustration and sentiment, domestic cups usually seem stale and more often than not, won by teams who treat them as an afterthought, but unfortunately that's just the nature of football. This isn't a problem exclusive to England, look at the most successful cup teams across Europe, outside of freak seasons, it tends to be the ones fighting at the summit of the table.

 

 

Edited April 26 by Moose

[Pata]

I don't think there's much wrong with the Cups. First suggestion would be absolutely horrible and devalue the competition. Best teams doing well in the cups is not a problem, they are the best teams and makes someone else winning it feel even more special.

 

Only thing I would change is that the semis shouldn't be on Wembley, use a neutral stadium. Takes some shine away from the big day that you just were there few weeks prior. Replays were cool but not feasible anymore with the current schedule. Also arguably made it tougher for the underdog to advance when you had to match the superior team for two full games instead of one and an extra time/pens.

 

 

Edited April 26 by Pata

[Stifler]

1 minute ago, SteV said:

Actually the issue/problem isn’t really the cup(s) as such, it’s the financial disparity between the current ‘elite’ and the rest, and the restrictions placed on clubs that want to close that.

 

If they could improve/lessen that (yes, I know…), then you have more of a competitive balance resulting in a bigger spread of cup winners over time.

This.

We got £200k for winning the League Cup.

The FA Cup winners for example get less than the difference between league placings in the Premier League.

For Champions League participants, it’s just over 1 Champions League match win.

[Superior Acuña]

33 minutes ago, Geordie_once_removed said:

So the League Cup was between Arsenal and Man City. The FA Cup will be be between Man City and Chelsea. All 4 teams played in the Champions League and their fans apart from on the day and maybe the week after won't really care it they win. Their finances won't be impacted much either as they get so much money from elsewhere. In short these competitions are increasing won by clubs who on the whole don't care and don't need the wins.  So how about this as a suggestion.

 

1. You qualify for the Champions League (you could make this all European competitions) you don't play in domestic cups

2. Bring back replays as these really help out smaller clubs and were got rid of purely to ease match congestion of clubs playing in Europe. They're also fun if you aren't playing 2 times a week for 2/3 of the season.

3. Bin off VAR in the cups, just because it's a bit shit and there she be all about living in the moment and not micro analysing decisions.

 

I know you might argue would devalue these competitions as the best teams weren't in them, but honestly if Newcastle won the 2027 FA Cup final against Leeds and some bellend said "You only won that because X weren't in it" would you care? I wouldn't, I'd just find it a useful dickhead detecting device.

Absolutely I would care, it would fundamentally destroy the prestige of the cups. As well as removing the top teams it’d mean loads more care less about it. Us and Palsce got to enjoy our cups so much cos we won a top tier comp that included all the (best) teams 

[duo]

31 minutes ago, bobbydazzla said:

2025 cup winners:

 

Newcastle

Palace

Two clubs who swam against the tide - Chelsea run to the final this season was as easy as it gets.  Football is corrupt and the rules favour the big six -  it's naive to think otherwise.

 

 

Edited April 26 by duo

[bobbydazzla]

The cups are usually won and contested by the same handful of teams because the top flight of English football is financially rigged to ensure the same handful of teams usually contest and win the cups 

 

Instead of looking for a complicated solution to ease the symptoms, it’d be better to look for a cure for the disease. 

 

 

Edited April 26 by bobbydazzla

[bobbydazzla]

5 minutes ago, duo said:

Two clubs who swam against the tide - Chelsea run to the final this season was as easy as it gets.  Football is corrupt and the the rule favour the big six -  it's naive to think otherwise.

It’s naive to think that I don’t think that football is financially corrupt and the financial rules favour a small number of teams who have been allowed to create a set of financial rules that can be compared to the rules the pigs created for themselves in Animal Farm. 

 

 

Edited April 26 by bobbydazzla

[Superior Acuña]

Chelsea are shite, it’s a heartwarming story to see such a shit team make the final 

[The College Dropout]

Chelsea have finished something like 12th, 6th, 4th, 6th-9th.  
 

Is this not their first FA Cup final under these owners?

[Deuce]

30 minutes ago, Heron said:

For me the CL should consist of champions of the the domestic league and cups and not the top 5 or 6 in the league. Might not fix this particular issue, but might put more focus on winning the cups and being champions of something and not happy go lucky runners ups in the league (at varying levels).

CL as comprised of the actual champions of each domestic league makes too much sense. Won’t happen in a million years, as we all know.

Create a separate European competition for the winners of each country’s domestic cup. They might even call it the “Cup Winners’ Cup” or something silly like that.

 

[Geordie_once_removed]

14 minutes ago, Moose said:

I understand the frustration and sentiment, domestic cups usually seem stale and more often than not, won by teams who treat them as an afterthought, but unfortunately that's just the nature of football. This isn't a problem exclusive to England, look at the most successful cup teams across Europe, outside of freak seasons, it tends to be the ones fighting at the summit of the table.

 

 

 

You're not wrong. Doesn't mean we should just accept this.

[Stifler]

4 minutes ago, Pata said:

Only thing I would change is that the semis shouldn't be on Wembley, use a neutral stadium. Takes some shine away from the big day that you just were there few weeks prior. Replays were cool but not feasible anymore with the current schedule. Also arguably made it tougher for the underdog to advance when you had to match the superior team for two full games instead of one and an extra time/pens.

I agree, but we probably need to have a period where more clubs build new stadiums or renovate and expand their existing stadiums.

Sending clubs to say Villa Park, Anfield etc with them getting 20k tickets at most is no good.

 

I’ve said it before, but building Wembley was a mistake. England, and cup finals should have been shared around with money given to clubs to help renovate their stadiums. It was an even bigger mistake not to sell it to the Jacksonville Jags owner and to sack playing football off there altogether.