You can always trust the Scousers...

[Sima]

Just a co-incedence then?

 

Righto.

[Jay Jay Sea]

a WELL ORGANISED PROTEST i MIGHT ADD FROM WHAT I HAVE SEEN ON BBC SO FAR.....

[Guest]

Yep, we've got the message. Justice for the 96.

[Guest Phil K]

What the F***?  Heavy confusion here.

 

What they wanting justice for?  Just in general?   

 

EDIT:  May I add, I think that's a very fair post by Nut.

I agree too.

Too effing ridiculous for words.

 

[Wullie]

That was ridiculous. All the country has seen now is Liverpool fans on about Hillsborough... again... in January. Do themselves no favours.

[brummie]

The wallowing in it is one thing, but anyone who suggests Hillsborough was the fault of the Liverpool fans is way, way off the mark. Heysel was, yes, Hillsborough wasn't.

 

I guess there's a whole generation of fans now who have grown up with all seater stadia and never known what it was often like in standing days - I've been in loads of situations on packed terraces where I really thought people were going to die. The really surprising thing about Hillsborough is that it didn't happen sooner, tbh.

 

EDIT although, slightly different circumstances, but it did happen before, at Ibrox.

[Guest STaylor87]

This protest makes me sick...

 

 

[Tom_NUFC]

To be honest, I think there's a lot of you being very harsh.

 

I don't think it is 'wallowing'.

 

We're talking about people who lost their lives by going to a game to watch their team.

 

It wasn't because of Scousers turning up pissed, it was down to Police incompetance,  and the whole thing has never really come to a decent finding. There's people who should have gone down for their incompetance, but it hasn't happened, and family and friends of the people who died haven't seen anyone punished for the deaths of the people they've lost. Its a disgrace, and I think they have every right to keep on fighting for that. That is not 'wallowing'.

 

Football supporters of all clubs should be backing them because it could have happened to any team.

 

In fact, there was an incident two years before Hillsborough, which could have turned out similarly, and it involved us.

It was an FA Cup Quarter Final between Spurs and Newcastle at White Hart Lane in 1987. Like the Liverpool fans at Hillsborough, Newcastle fans were channeled into the central sections of the away terracing. However, the police realised, and opened up the side sections in time. If they hadn't, it would have been 'our Hillsborough' (in fact Hillsborough itself probably wouldn't have happened), and if there'd been a similar verdict, wouldn't we be calling for justice for our relatives, friends and fellow Newcastle supporters? Of course we fucking would!

 

Kelvin Mackenzie is absolute fucking scum for suggesting that Liverpool fans were drunk, and stealing from and pissing on the dead, and the fact that although The Sun has since offered an apology (albeit a luke-warm one in the hope of recovering some sales on Merseyside), Mackenzie continues with his disgusting view is appalling, but entirely characteristic of the heartless Thatcherite fucking worm that he is.

 

I've got no particular love of Liverpool, wasn't at Hillsborough etc, but I remember that day VERY CLEARLY.

We were away to Arsenal (lost 1-0), but my aunt and uncle were going to watch their team Tranmere play Hartlepool, and then come and stay with us, so me, my brother and my Mam went down to Hartlepool on the train, to meet them and go along to the game. We heard vague reports of something going on at Half Time, but didn't realise the severity of it. We only found out listening to the radio afterwards, driving back up to Newcastle. We had Radio 2 on (which covered the sport back then - it was pre-Radio 5), and the news reports and the reports of the commentators (Peter Jones and Alan Green - I think) sounded horrific. Then coming home and seeing the pictures on the news is one of the most harrowing things that I have ever seen. I think only September 11 compares. My aunt and uncle, living on Merseyside (my Uncle follows Liverpool as well as Tranmere) were upset by it, and had friends and colleagues who were going to the game. They were phoning people up for news, it was just horrible.

 

If some of you want to do a Boris Johnson and accuse the Scousers of 'wallowing', well fair enough, but you can't include Hillsborough in that, by any means, because its not. Its unresolved stuff, which causes a lot of people pain. They want closure on it, so they don't have to keep on going on, but while they don't have that, its fair enough, don't you think?

 

For all that I'm defending them, I clicked the link on TT to the Liverpool forum where they're slagging us off.

Absolute fucking bunch of pricks for slagging all NUFC fans off just for a few.

[Dave]

There were plenty of reasons why Hillsbrough occurred. Some should remember that.

[BlufPurdi]

There were plenty of reasons why Hillsbrough occurred. Some should remember that.

 

WELL SAID, DAVE!  YEAH!

 

bluebigrazz.gif

[Dave]

[Guest bovril]

Excellent post Tom.

 

nothing else to add on this, this thread has made me ashamed to be a Geordie.

 

 

 

[Guest Gemmill]

Just a co-incedence then?

 

Righto.

 

Must've been.  An AMAZING one at that.  Two people that have read the same book.  That's almost inexplicable.

[Guest bigdunc]

I'm glad there's some sense on this lot.

 

Some people on here take the piss.

 

People lost their lives after going to watch the team they loved.

 

it wasn't 100% the fans fault, the warning signs were there before hand.

 

it was like that with every group of fans in the 80's, pissed up and looking for a scrap.

 

If this was at St James Park, there'd be a swift change of tune from a lot of you.

 

 

and this is coming from an Everton fan.

 

[madras]

I'm glad there's some sense on this lot.

 

Some people on here take the piss.

 

People lost their lives after going to watch the team they loved.

 

it wasn't 100% the fans fault, the warning signs were there before hand.

 

it was like that with every group of fans in the 80's, pissed up and looking for a scrap.

 

If this was at St James Park, there'd be a swift change of tune from a lot of you.

 

 

and this is coming from an Everton fan.

 

i haven't read all this thread,contributed a bit but i don't think anyone says  it was all the liverpool fans fault ,however liverpool fans don't want to admit they had a large part to play in it.i brought up that it could easily have been nufc fans at spurs,and i would have accepted criticism of a section of nufc fans.....LFC fans wont!

[Guest bigdunc]

I'm glad there's some sense on this lot.

 

Some people on here take the piss.

 

People lost their lives after going to watch the team they loved.

 

it wasn't 100% the fans fault, the warning signs were there before hand.

 

it was like that with every group of fans in the 80's, pissed up and looking for a scrap.

 

If this was at St James Park, there'd be a swift change of tune from a lot of you.

 

 

and this is coming from an Everton fan.

 

i haven't read all this thread,contributed a bit but i don't think anyone says it was all the liverpool fans fault ,however liverpool fans don't want to admit they had a large part to play in it.i brought up that it could easily have been nufc fans at spurs,and i would have accepted criticism of a section of nufc fans.....LFC fans wont!

 

I got the impression from a few posters that the tragedy was solely LFC fans fault, which I wouldn't have expected from NUFC fans, seeing as the usuals I have spoken to have been very clued up about the real events.

 

fair enough like, the real LFC supporters will continue believing what they want to believe in. And aslong as they take SOME (not all) of the blame for it, who has the right to criticise them, about events which happened in front of some of them?

[Guest BooBoo]

What happened at Hillsborough that day was terrible and although i was too young at the time to acknowldege it, i think in the subsequent years i have given my respect to those that lost their lives in the correct fashion. I think the Liverpool fans need to let those who lost their lives rest in peace. The constant reminders and wringing of hands does nothing barring make those lives who were affected all the more poignant.

 

I thought todays protest bordered on the ridiculous tbh.

[Wullie]

What happened at Hillsborough that day was terrible and although i was too young at the time to acknowldege it, i think in the subsequent years i have given my respect to those that lost their lives in the correct fashion. I think the Liverpool fans need to let those who lost their lives rest in peace. The constant reminders and wringing of hands does nothing barring make those lives who were affected all the more poignant.

 

I thought todays protest bordered on the ridiculous tbh.

 

It truly did. The players were clearly distracted, the commentators didn't really know what it was in aid of, Thierry Henry at the end said he didn't know what was going on, even the Liverpool fans on here don't really seem to know what it was in aid of. They sang "Justice for the '96" but from who and to what end? Some of the lads on here have said it was in protest about Kelvin Mackenzie getting a job at the BBC, but that doesn't seem to make any sense on any level.

 

At the end of the day, all this "The Truth" and "Justice" stuff is going nowhere. They're not going to open up a new inquiry on the back of a protest at the match, no police officers who may have been at fault are going to be brought to task now and Mackenzie is a millionaire, whether he gets a job is neither here nor there to anyone.

 

What happened was terrible, but going on about it now, seventeen years later, will solve nothing.

[Guest fru]

What happened at Hillsborough that day was terrible and although i was too young at the time to acknowldege it, i think in the subsequent years i have given my respect to those that lost their lives in the correct fashion. I think the Liverpool fans need to let those who lost their lives rest in peace. The constant reminders and wringing of hands does nothing barring make those lives who were affected all the more poignant.

 

I thought todays protest bordered on the ridiculous tbh.

 

It truly did. The players were clearly distracted, the commentators didn't really know what it was in aid of, Thierry Henry at the end said he didn't know what was going on, even the Liverpool fans on here don't really seem to know what it was in aid of. They sang "Justice for the '96" but from who and to what end? Some of the lads on here have said it was in protest about Kelvin Mackenzie getting a job at the BBC, but that doesn't seem to make any sense on any level.

 

At the end of the day, all this "The Truth" and "Justice" stuff is going nowhere. They're not going to open up a new inquiry on the back of a protest at the match, no police officers who may have been at fault are going to be brought to task now and Mackenzie is a millionaire, whether he gets a job is neither here nor there to anyone.

 

What happened was terrible, but going on about it now, seventeen years later, will solve nothing.

 

For your information and for clarification;

 

Today's protest was aimed at Kelvin Mackenzie, the man who continues to mantain that the proven lies (proven by a Judicial Government Enquiry) peddled by The Sun in 1989 are infact the truth. We know this to be a campaign by Mackenzie to delibrately spread misinformation and smear 96 of our dead friends for profitable gain, we are seeking justice and truth for the 96 Hillsborough dead.

 

Sorry if this seems pointless, ridiculous or OTT to you , but it is a cause close to the heart of every liverpool supporter, as 12,000 people on the Kop showed you tonight. Like it or lump it geordies.

 

[madras]

What happened at Hillsborough that day was terrible and although i was too young at the time to acknowldege it, i think in the subsequent years i have given my respect to those that lost their lives in the correct fashion. I think the Liverpool fans need to let those who lost their lives rest in peace. The constant reminders and wringing of hands does nothing barring make those lives who were affected all the more poignant.

 

I thought todays protest bordered on the ridiculous tbh.

 

It truly did. The players were clearly distracted, the commentators didn't really know what it was in aid of, Thierry Henry at the end said he didn't know what was going on, even the Liverpool fans on here don't really seem to know what it was in aid of. They sang "Justice for the '96" but from who and to what end? Some of the lads on here have said it was in protest about Kelvin Mackenzie getting a job at the BBC, but that doesn't seem to make any sense on any level.

 

At the end of the day, all this "The Truth" and "Justice" stuff is going nowhere. They're not going to open up a new inquiry on the back of a protest at the match, no police officers who may have been at fault are going to be brought to task now and Mackenzie is a millionaire, whether he gets a job is neither here nor there to anyone.

 

What happened was terrible, but going on about it now, seventeen years later, will solve nothing.

 

For your information and for clarification;

 

Today's protest was aimed at Kelvin Mackenzie, the man who continues to mantain that the proven lies (proven by a Judicial Government Enquiry) peddled by The Sun in 1989 are infact the truth. We know this to be a campaign by Mackenzie to delibrately spread misinformation and smear 96 of our dead friends for profitable gain, we are seeking justice and truth for the 96 Hillsborough dead.

 

Sorry if this seems pointless, ridiculous or OTT to you , but it is a cause close to the heart of every liverpool supporter, as 12,000 people on the Kop showed you tonight. Like it or lump it geordies.

 

i'll back your calls against mackenzie when liverpool fans admit their part.

[Wullie]

What happened at Hillsborough that day was terrible and although i was too young at the time to acknowldege it, i think in the subsequent years i have given my respect to those that lost their lives in the correct fashion. I think the Liverpool fans need to let those who lost their lives rest in peace. The constant reminders and wringing of hands does nothing barring make those lives who were affected all the more poignant.

 

I thought todays protest bordered on the ridiculous tbh.

 

It truly did. The players were clearly distracted, the commentators didn't really know what it was in aid of, Thierry Henry at the end said he didn't know what was going on, even the Liverpool fans on here don't really seem to know what it was in aid of. They sang "Justice for the '96" but from who and to what end? Some of the lads on here have said it was in protest about Kelvin Mackenzie getting a job at the BBC, but that doesn't seem to make any sense on any level.

 

At the end of the day, all this "The Truth" and "Justice" stuff is going nowhere. They're not going to open up a new inquiry on the back of a protest at the match, no police officers who may have been at fault are going to be brought to task now and Mackenzie is a millionaire, whether he gets a job is neither here nor there to anyone.

 

What happened was terrible, but going on about it now, seventeen years later, will solve nothing.

 

For your information and for clarification;

 

Today's protest was aimed at Kelvin Mackenzie, the man who continues to mantain that the proven lies (proven by a Judicial Government Enquiry) peddled by The Sun in 1989 are infact the truth. We know this to be a campaign by Mackenzie to delibrately spread misinformation and smear 96 of our dead friends for profitable gain, we are seeking justice and truth for the 96 Hillsborough dead.

 

Sorry if this seems pointless, ridiculous or OTT to you , but it is a cause close to the heart of every liverpool supporter, as 12,000 people on the Kop showed you tonight. Like it or lump it geordies.

 

What justice are you searching for?

 

Mackenzie is not going to be taken to court or have anything done about what he printed seventeen years ago. You were holding up "The Truth", most right thinking people already know 'the truth', that what The Sun printed was defamatory rubbish. What, exactly, are you hoping to acheive from today? I bet the vast majority of people don't even know it was aimed at Mackenzie, which seems to totally defeat the point... surely?

[Guest fru]

What happened at Hillsborough that day was terrible and although i was too young at the time to acknowldege it, i think in the subsequent years i have given my respect to those that lost their lives in the correct fashion. I think the Liverpool fans need to let those who lost their lives rest in peace. The constant reminders and wringing of hands does nothing barring make those lives who were affected all the more poignant.

 

I thought todays protest bordered on the ridiculous tbh.

 

It truly did. The players were clearly distracted, the commentators didn't really know what it was in aid of, Thierry Henry at the end said he didn't know what was going on, even the Liverpool fans on here don't really seem to know what it was in aid of. They sang "Justice for the '96" but from who and to what end? Some of the lads on here have said it was in protest about Kelvin Mackenzie getting a job at the BBC, but that doesn't seem to make any sense on any level.

 

At the end of the day, all this "The Truth" and "Justice" stuff is going nowhere. They're not going to open up a new inquiry on the back of a protest at the match, no police officers who may have been at fault are going to be brought to task now and Mackenzie is a millionaire, whether he gets a job is neither here nor there to anyone.

 

What happened was terrible, but going on about it now, seventeen years later, will solve nothing.

 

For your information and for clarification;

 

Today's protest was aimed at Kelvin Mackenzie, the man who continues to mantain that the proven lies (proven by a Judicial Government Enquiry) peddled by The Sun in 1989 are infact the truth. We know this to be a campaign by Mackenzie to delibrately spread misinformation and smear 96 of our dead friends for profitable gain, we are seeking justice and truth for the 96 Hillsborough dead.

 

Sorry if this seems pointless, ridiculous or OTT to you , but it is a cause close to the heart of every liverpool supporter, as 12,000 people on the Kop showed you tonight. Like it or lump it geordies.

 

i'll back your calls against mackenzie when liverpool fans admit their part.

 

What part? If the Taylor Enquiry says that Liverpool fans were entirely blameless then why should we accept guilt for something that we are not guilty of? Just because a few misinformed gobshites tell you things about Hillsborough, doesn't mean that they are true. The spread of misinformation, as evidenced by people like yourself and others on here is precisely the reason this protest was necessary and precisely the reason why we won't just 'let it lie'.

[Guest spike spiegel]

I always thought Justice was for the police officers who made the inept decisions which cost the lives of 96, and damaged many other people. The most they got was . It's very comparable to the Charles De Manez(sorry, can't spell his name) case where the officers got away scot free with killing an innocent person.

 

That was my thinking as a fan anyway, the MacKenzie thing is a different thing - it just got people to remember to ram it home what we're fighting for.

[madras]

What happened at Hillsborough that day was terrible and although i was too young at the time to acknowldege it, i think in the subsequent years i have given my respect to those that lost their lives in the correct fashion. I think the Liverpool fans need to let those who lost their lives rest in peace. The constant reminders and wringing of hands does nothing barring make those lives who were affected all the more poignant.

 

I thought todays protest bordered on the ridiculous tbh.

 

It truly did. The players were clearly distracted, the commentators didn't really know what it was in aid of, Thierry Henry at the end said he didn't know what was going on, even the Liverpool fans on here don't really seem to know what it was in aid of. They sang "Justice for the '96" but from who and to what end? Some of the lads on here have said it was in protest about Kelvin Mackenzie getting a job at the BBC, but that doesn't seem to make any sense on any level.

 

At the end of the day, all this "The Truth" and "Justice" stuff is going nowhere. They're not going to open up a new inquiry on the back of a protest at the match, no police officers who may have been at fault are going to be brought to task now and Mackenzie is a millionaire, whether he gets a job is neither here nor there to anyone.

 

What happened was terrible, but going on about it now, seventeen years later, will solve nothing.

 

For your information and for clarification;

 

Today's protest was aimed at Kelvin Mackenzie, the man who continues to mantain that the proven lies (proven by a Judicial Government Enquiry) peddled by The Sun in 1989 are infact the truth. We know this to be a campaign by Mackenzie to delibrately spread misinformation and smear 96 of our dead friends for profitable gain, we are seeking justice and truth for the 96 Hillsborough dead.

 

Sorry if this seems pointless, ridiculous or OTT to you , but it is a cause close to the heart of every liverpool supporter, as 12,000 people on the Kop showed you tonight. Like it or lump it geordies.

 

i'll back your calls against mackenzie when liverpool fans admit their part.

 

What part? If the Taylor Enquiry says that Liverpool fans were entirely blameless then why should we accept guilt for something that we are not guilty of? Just because a few misinformed gobshites tell you things about Hillsborough, doesn't mean that they are true. The spread of misinformation, as evidenced by people like yourself and others on here is precisely the reason this protest was necessary and precisely the reason why we won't just 'let it lie'.

did liverpool fans attempt to entire the groung illegally ?

did liverpool fans attempt to rush the gates when it seemed liked they'd miss the kick off ?

 

 

don't get your keks in a knot,i'm not slagging off liverpool fans for this,as i've pointed out numerous times nufc came very close on a number of occasions..........no doubt lfc fans were queueing orderly afetr leaving the tea and scone shop at 2pm ?

[Wullie]

I always thought Justice was for the police officers who made the inept decisions which cost the lives of 96, and damaged many other people. The most they got was . It's very comparable to the Charles De Manez(sorry, can't spell his name) case where the officers got away scot free with killing an innocent person.

 

That was my thinking as a fan anyway, the MacKenzie thing is a different thing - it just got people to remember to ram it home what we're fighting for.

 

My point exactly. Liverpool fans themselves don't even know. I don't know why you expect anyone else to pay the slightest bit of attention.