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Looks like Ballack and Schev are costing Chelsea the title.


Parky
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Two mind boggling obvious purchases gone wrong?

 

Ballack is back in Deutschland and been interviewed in some of the papers. He say that Makalele and Drogba have been complaining about his performances directly to Mourinho. Ballack is also none too happy that the fans are getting on his back.

One of the papers quoted Prozone stats showing that he is the least productive mf and Schev hasn't been that much better.

We go on about Luque, but this does show that even for the best in the world it takes time to adapt.

 

Buying players is more of a gamble than most managers would like to admit. I think these two are typical in showing how much more dynamic and faster the English game really is. With the Jan window a case in point, perhaps it is better to stick to proven PL players.

 

What's the thinking on this?

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Still think Shevchenko has a chance of doing well for them but I see the Ballack (and Lampard) thing as being a bit like Lampard and Gerrard for England, i.e. two players who can't really play together in a midfield four/both would be better off as the attacking midfielder. Still early days yet though and winning the Champions League is really what these signings were about imo.

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Guest Smudger

chelsea will still win the league. they have over 5 months to regain 6 points.

 

Agreed although I dont think it will be as easy for Chelski as last season. Ballack and Shev will be sold in the summer imo if they dont improve.

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The difference with most clubs who bring in foreign players is they actually give them time, bring them in slowly to adapt to the Premier League and I think Arsenal and Liverpool would be great examples of this which is what we should be doing also, but unfortunately due to our thin squad and injuries we don't have that luxury.

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Two mind boggling obvious purchases gone wrong?

 

Ballack is back in Deutschland and been interviewed in some of the papers. He say that Makalele and Drogba have been complaining about his performances directly to Mourinho. Ballack is also none too happy that the fans are getting on his back.

One of the papers quoted Prozone stats showing that he is the least productive mf and Schev hasn't been that much better.

We go on about Luque, but this does show that even for the best in the world it takes time to adapt.

 

Buying players is more of a gamble than most managers would like to admit. I think these two are typical in showing how much more dynamic and faster the English game really is. With the Jan window a case in point, perhaps it is better to stick to proven PL players.

 

What's the thinking on this?

 

To be fair, and it's obviously random guesswork, but I reckon any other team in the Premiership could've bought one of those two, and they would've succeeded.  I think there's more a problem of adapting into Chelsea's team, than the Premiership.  Shaun Wright-Phillips (Premiership proven) being the case in point, and Parker, I guess.

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Guest eyeball_tickler

chelsea will still win the league. they have over 5 months to regain 6 points.

 

:thup: 

i've got a £20 bet on

 

7/4 at blue square  bluebiggrin.gif

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I think its Ballack rather than Shevchenko thats messed Chelsea up this season. Not denying he's a good player, but they were so successful using the 4-3-3 system with Lampard, Essien and Makelele in the middle. Now he comes in and the system has to be changed to 4-4-2, to accomodate all 4. With them all being central players it means they are really congested and only rely on the full-backs to create any width. As soon as they go to 4-3-3 they are so much better, but then its always Essien that gets thrown to RB, with Geremi being subbed off.

 

Mourinho should have the balls to go back to that formation, leave Ballack and Shevchenko on the bench and play them when an injury/suspension/poor form arises.

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chelsea will still win the league. they have over 5 months to regain 6 points.

 

:thup: 

i've got a £20 bet on

 

7/4 at blue square  bluebiggrin.gif

 

mine's with my mate, so got evens 

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Two mind boggling obvious purchases gone wrong?

 

Ballack is back in Deutschland and been interviewed in some of the papers. He say that Makalele and Drogba have been complaining about his performances directly to Mourinho. Ballack is also none too happy that the fans are getting on his back.

One of the papers quoted Prozone stats showing that he is the least productive mf and Schev hasn't been that much better.

We go on about Luque, but this does show that even for the best in the world it takes time to adapt.

 

Buying players is more of a gamble than most managers would like to admit. I think these two are typical in showing how much more dynamic and faster the English game really is. With the Jan window a case in point, perhaps it is better to stick to proven PL players.

 

What's the thinking on this?

 

To be fair, and it's obviously random guesswork, but I reckon any other team in the Premiership could've bought one of those two, and they would've succeeded.  I think there's more a problem of adapting into Chelsea's team, than the Premiership.  Shaun Wright-Phillips (Premiership proven) being the case in point, and Parker, I guess.

 

Good point. Parker doesn't fit at Newcastle and he didn't fit at Chelsea either. Solution: Sell him back to Charlton.

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I think its Ballack rather than Shevchenko thats messed Chelsea up this season. Not denying he's a good player, but they were so successful using the 4-3-3 system with Lampard, Essien and Makelele in the middle. Now he comes in and the system has to be changed to 4-4-2, to accomodate all 4. With them all being central players it means they are really congested and only rely on the full-backs to create any width. As soon as they go to 4-3-3 they are so much better, but then its always Essien that gets thrown to RB, with Geremi being subbed off.

 

Mourinho should have the balls to go back to that formation, leave Ballack and Shevchenko on the bench and play them when an injury/suspension/poor form arises.

 

This is also one of my contentions, Geremi isn't flexible enough for the 433. He has average ball skills and little pace. Mourinho has made tactical blunders this year and big names can't fix a stuttering system. I agree he should have stuck to the 433 and with a different RB.

 

Agree with Bluf too in that it has been somewhat of a shock for th star of German football finding there are other big ego's in the dressing room.

It is said that him and Lampard are no longer on speaking terms.

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I fancy Man United for the title tbh. 

 

Would probably rank as SAF's greatest title win, after the way people wrote off Man Utd and said Chelsea would dominate for years to come.

 

exactly. Would love to see ManU recapture the title over this current Chelsea lot.

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I fancy Man United for the title tbh. 

 

Would probably rank as SAF's greatest title win, after the way people wrote off Man Utd and said Chelsea would dominate for years to come.

 

Definetely.

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Chelsea reminds me of England tbf, 2 big stars, both undropable but both can't play together. If Ballack is to succeed at Chelsea it will have to be without lampard in the team, ie play him along side a dm instead of another 'attacking midfielder'. Shevchenko doesn't succeed in the chelsea team simply because they don't play to the way he is suited to, because lets face it, he is not going to take people on and beat them, he needs crossers, balls over the top to latch onto.. but instead whenever I've watched chelsea he is forced out wide to create chances for drogba etc.. hence why he seems to be a failure so far.

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Two mind boggling obvious purchases gone wrong?

 

Ballack is back in Deutschland and been interviewed in some of the papers. He say that Makalele and Drogba have been complaining about his performances directly to Mourinho. Ballack is also none too happy that the fans are getting on his back.

One of the papers quoted Prozone stats showing that he is the least productive mf and Schev hasn't been that much better.

We go on about Luque, but this does show that even for the best in the world it takes time to adapt.

 

Buying players is more of a gamble than most managers would like to admit. I think these two are typical in showing how much more dynamic and faster the English game really is. With the Jan window a case in point, perhaps it is better to stick to proven PL players.

 

What's the thinking on this?

 

its a classic case of having too many big names and egos in the same club, and trying to fit too many similar players into the same team, and the "adapting to the premiership" problem.

 

All of these things.

 

Personally I wouldn't have bought either, as Ballack has an ego problem and I suspect that Shevchenko doesn't seem so quick as he was a few years ago. At a different club and different circumstances they would have done better. Its a lesson in judging characters and current ability before you buy players, in fact a huge lesson. They are going to lose a lot of money when they offload them, I'm not surprised that Abramovic will demand better value transfers in future.

 

I don't know where Shevchenko will go but I would expect Ballack will go somewhere else where he is the number 1 man again and be a better player for the experience he's had.

 

I fancied Manu at the start of the season because I thought Chelsea would have these sort of problems, and Alex Ferguson has re-shaped his team for the better, with Rooney, Saha and Ronaldo adding more pace and mobility all round instead of the poaching of RVN. They have a better all round team now and I think they will finish top, although it will be close.

 

 

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When Chelsea signed them two i thought they were going to be looking at this type of formation:

 

                            Cech

 

Boularouz    Cavalho  Terry    Cole

 

                          Essien

          Lampard              Ballack

Cole                                          Robben

                      Shevchenko

 

Fair enough Mourinho has had injuries to key players but it was his choice to fiddle around with the formation which in my eyes is what has cost them. If Mourinho decided to revert back to his old system he could still win the title but that would be like saying he was wrong and hes too stubborn for that.

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Chelsea reminds me of England tbf , 2 big stars, both undropable but both can't play together. If Ballack is to succeed at Chelsea it will have to be without lampard in the team, ie play him along side a dm instead of another 'attacking midfielder'. Shevchenko doesn't succeed in the chelsea team simply because they don't play to the way he is suited to, because lets face it, he is not going to take people on and beat them, he needs crossers, balls over the top to latch onto.. but instead whenever I've watched chelsea he is forced out wide to create chances for drogba etc.. hence why he seems to be a failure so far.

 

I think it should have been a straight choice between Lampard and Gerrard from day 1, a few years ago, and Gerrard is miles ahead as the choice to play.

 

 

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Guest kleinhero

I think it just takes time to get used to premier leageu football. In Germany we play a completly different style of football. But Ballack also needed like half a season to be included in the team of bayern munich when he moved there from Leverkusen.  He will soon be respected in London and he will help Chelsea to win the Champions League.

 

And Sheva, I would say he will go back to Milan again cause his good old friend Berlusconi wants him back.

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Guest Bellers

To be honest I think Mourinho has got has hands tied with this one.

 

One Chelsea were at their peak they were playing the 4-3-3 formation to great effect. Makelele would hold which would give Lampard and his midfield partener a chance to bomb on into the box while the wingers essentialy acted as two extra strikers supporting the central forward. When they were attacked the wingers would fall back into the midfield and the defence would clean up.

 

To take this one step further Chelsea were probably at their best when they had Gudjohnsen in the lone striking position. He was capable of scoring goals but aswell as this he'd bring the wingers into play allowing them to score enough goals to finish the game.

 

Although we don't know if selling Gujohnsen was Mourihno's choice it would appear recently Kenyon's influence has grown larger. Everyone knows Mourinho has an eye for a young player with bags of talent. So all of a sudden why would his policy change?  Well we always hear Kenyon banging on about the commercial side of the game, it is apparent himself and Roman are set on having a team of superstars to fire Chelsea into the big bucks.

 

So when Shevchenko and Ballack suddeny arrive the team is shuffled round into a diamond formation. All of a sudden results change, the diamond is too defensive, Chelsea's attack isn't as ruthless as the team of old. The loss of Terry and Gallas then opens the back gate for teams to attack.

 

So if the general football fan is noticing this then Mourinho the manager he is, is surely noticing this. So why hasn't he attempted to change things? Well I think he probably has. Kenyon and Mourinho have never seen eye and with the backing of Roman I can see Kenyon telling Mourinho he is unable to drop the two big guns signed in the summer.

 

The thing is we all know Mourinho won't stand for this. Is this why the rumour of Mourinho quitting has suddenly resurfaced?

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Guest bovril

Would love to see ManU recapture the title over this current Chelsea lot.

 

love is probably a bit strong, but i would prefer ManUre won the title, leaving SAF to retire and his successor having a slow season to settle in.  This along with the breakdown of chelsea after loosing everything this season, should pave the way for a fully fit Newcastle side to grab the title.

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To be honest I think Mourinho has got has hands tied with this one...

 

...

 

Although we don't know if selling Gujohnsen was Mourihno's choice it would appear recently Kenyon's influence has grown larger. Everyone knows Mourinho has an eye for a young player with bags of talent. So all of a sudden why would his policy change? Well we always hear Kenyon banging on about the commercial side of the game, it is apparent himself and Roman are set on having a team of superstars to fire Chelsea into the big bucks.

 

...

 

So if the general football fan is noticing this then Mourinho the manager he is, is surely noticing this. So why hasn't he attempted to change things? Well I think he probably has. Kenyon and Mourinho have never seen eye and with the backing of Roman I can see Kenyon telling Mourinho he is unable to drop the two big guns signed in the summer.

 

The thing is we all know Mourinho won't stand for this. Is this why the rumour of Mourinho quitting has suddenly resurfaced?

 

The loss of Terry, and to a (slightly) lesser extent Gallas, has been massive. If Gallas had been there now he could have slotted in at centre back to cover Terry's injury.

 

I don't understand why Kenyon/Roman wouldn't just forget their own agendas and let Mourinho get on with the job. He was on course to win them the title again, and probably the champions league eventually.

 

As much as I'd love to have unlimited spending power as a manager, if I wasn't allowed to employ it how I saw fit then I'd be off. I think Man Utd will have enough to see out the title this season.

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