St James' Park

[bobloblaw]

35 minutes ago, OpenC said:

 

Aye, I guess  I just keep reading people talking about how it's impossible to maximise potential revenue at SJP but it seems to be a pretty vague concept in most people's minds what we would do differently.  Maybe Newcastle is ready for underground go karting and I'm just getting old

 

I keep thinking back to Cuban selling the controlling share of the Mavs and his reasoning.

 

https://apnews.com/article/dallas-mavericks-sale-mark-cuban-adelson-f2dff76f286d79a4be0708f7a929b5ce

 

“The advantage is what can you build and where and you need to have somebody who’s really, really good at that,” Cuban said before the Mavs’ game against Cleveland on Wednesday night. “Patrick and Miriam, they’re the best in the world at what they do. Literally, around the world.

 

“When you get a world-class partner who can come in and grow your revenue base and you’re not dependent on things that you were in the past, that’s a huge win,” Cuban said.

 

I wonder if the club knows anyone with experience in real-estate development.

 

An NFL example https://www.titletown.com/#:~:text=Welcome to Titletown,relax - no matter the season. 

 

 

Edited March 19 by bobloblaw

[OverThere]

I can only compare SJP with stadiums I've been in in the US. The US stadiums have much more indoor food / drink / merch opportunities ringing the entire inside of the stadium. In addition there are more levels of seats above the basic level with various lounges etc 

[timeEd32]

32 minutes ago, OpenC said:

 

Aye, I guess  I just keep reading people talking about how it's impossible to maximise potential revenue at SJP but it seems to be a pretty vague concept in most people's minds what we would do differently.  Maybe Newcastle is ready for underground go karting and I'm just getting old

 

I don't think it's very vague 

• More seats
• More expensive seats / "experiences"
• More corporate options
• More food and drink at various price points
• More non-NUFC football events with all of the above
• More non-football events with all of the above (Beyonce, Bruce Springsteen, and Rihanna should not have to go to Sunderland. Ever.)

That's before you get into anything like events spaces, hotels, etc. And yes, naming rights for a new stadium are a whole different thing compared to renaming.

[cubaricho]

6 hours ago, OverThere said:

I can only compare SJP with stadiums I've been in in the US. The US stadiums have much more indoor food / drink / merch opportunities ringing the entire inside of the stadium. In addition there are more levels of seats above the basic level with various lounges etc 

This makes me want to hear the opinions of my American dudes who have been ( @Kanji @Ameritoon etc) - how do the facilities at SJP compare with say the Bucs or Lions stadiums? Or even baseball stadiums? As far as the experiences go. Is it a pretty stark difference in facilities when you walk in?

[Ameritoon]

It's much more bare. I haven't been since right before the SD signs came down, but it's basically food/drinks and toilets. Best concourse I can compare it to is an old school hockey barn. 

[cubaricho]

9 minutes ago, Ameritoon said:

It's much more bare. I haven't been since right before the SD signs came down, but it's basically food/drinks and toilets. Best concourse I can compare it to is an old school hockey barn. 

I figured it probably felt pretty brutalist kind of energy? Seems like it. 

[OpenC]

Well, I did ask and cheers for the responses.. but reading all of this just makes me want to stay at SJP and keep it as it is even more  just whack an extra 6k seats on the top of Gallowgate and leave it alone

Do all these things have to be tied to the stadium? Could we not buy and offer conferencing facilities elsewhere in town under the nufc brand? Better food and drink options are the reason it’s fucking great to have a city centre stadium surely? Pursuing a more corporate high end experience for folk who just want to watch the poorer people bawling and yelling at a little game of football? To each their own but none of these benefits sound like they’re adding up to a better matchday experience to me.

 

Leaving SJP in pursuit of bigger concourses so we can peddle tat to casuals, and glass fronted rooms that people can hire to put management consultancy training on, and desperately trying to cater for all food and drink options when there is a whole city just outside the doors  fuck me lads, times are changing. I would honestly rather just have us obscenely and shamelessly bankrolled

 

 

Edited March 20 by OpenC

[Keegans Export]

2 hours ago, OpenC said:

Well, I did ask and cheers for the responses.. but reading all of this just makes me want to stay at SJP and keep it as it is even more  just whack an extra 6k seats on the top of Gallowgate and leave it alone

Do all these things have to be tied to the stadium? Could we not buy and offer conferencing facilities elsewhere in town under the nufc brand? Better food and drink options are the reason it’s fucking great to have a city centre stadium surely? Pursuing a more corporate high end experience for folk who just want to watch the poorer people bawling and yelling at a little game of football? To each their own but none of these benefits sound like they’re adding up to a better matchday experience to me.

 

Leaving SJP in pursuit of bigger concourses so we can peddle tat to casuals, and glass fronted rooms that people can hire to put management consultancy training on, and desperately trying to cater for all food and drink options when there is a whole city just outside the doors  fuck me lads, times are changing. I would honestly rather just have us obscenely and shamelessly bankrolled

 

But I'm not sure why any of that would necessarily affect your experience? 

 

Imagine our own version of the Yellow Wall behind each goal? Or stands that don't suck any atmosphere out into the sky?

 

If you're stood with 10k others, making a racket, trying to out-sing the 10k stood at the opposite end, who cares if there's a few mugs sat in another stand paying £1k to sit in a squishy seat and eat truffle-infused caviar at half time? Does it matter that the bloke next to you spent £15 for a deluxe hot dog on the concourse before the game rather than a few pints in Rosie's with you?

 

 

Edited March 20 by Keegans Export

[OpenC]

Aye, all fair points. I guess I just see this as a fundamental shift away from what I think of as a football experience is all about and will inevitably change the feel and the clientele. It's not for me, but that's just my opinion

 

 

Edited March 20 by OpenC

[madras]

2 hours ago, OpenC said:

Well, I did ask and cheers for the responses.. but reading all of this just makes me want to stay at SJP and keep it as it is even more  just whack an extra 6k seats on the top of Gallowgate and leave it alone

Do all these things have to be tied to the stadium? Could we not buy and offer conferencing facilities elsewhere in town under the nufc brand? Better food and drink options are the reason it’s fucking great to have a city centre stadium surely? Pursuing a more corporate high end experience for folk who just want to watch the poorer people bawling and yelling at a little game of football? To each their own but none of these benefits sound like they’re adding up to a better matchday experience to me.

 

Leaving SJP in pursuit of bigger concourses so we can peddle tat to casuals, and glass fronted rooms that people can hire to put management consultancy training on, and desperately trying to cater for all food and drink options when there is a whole city just outside the doors  fuck me lads, times are changing. I would honestly rather just have us obscenely and shamelessly bankrolled

 

 

 

The obvious solution to this would be for current season ticket holder to be allowed in to a new stadium from when the turnstiles open and come in as late as they like. The newly created season ticket holders have to be in by a certain time, say 2 hrs before KO, to spend their coin in the concourses etc. No loss of revenue for the city centre, extra revenue for the club, what's not to like 

 

 

Edited March 20 by madras

[Dr.Spaceman]

17 minutes ago, OpenC said:

Aye, all fair points. I guess I just see this as a fundamental shift away from what I think of as a football experience is all about and will inevitably change the feel and the clientele. It's not for me, but that's just my opinion

 

 

 

 

I can totally understand where you're coming from.

 

I've been a huge advocate of an official streaming service like what the NFL has but it'll be the end of more long term ST holders who prefer a more traditional match day experience. I'd certainly prefer to just roll down the hill and watch us at my local club, few pints with like minded folk, cut out the fluff around actually going to the match. It's already becoming a bit of a shit experience since the intro of the e-tickets and I'm about as far from a technophobe as you can get.

 

SJP with an extra 7 thousand people trying to get in to the Gallowgate will be a fucking nightmare.

[Doctor Zaius]

SJP could have the worlds best food/drink options and ill still prefer to be in the city centre before the match. Its absolutely unique in the UK that you can be in the city centre and then in your seat within half an hour and vice versa. Nowhere else ive been has the plethora of amenities a stones throw from the ground (aside from some London clubs perhaps) and frankly, other clubs matchdays look shite compared to ours. 

Taking trade away from businesses in the city to be absorbed by the club isnt actually a good thing for those of us that live here too. It was hinted that the takeover would be a positive for the local area, more people choosing to forgo food and drink in the city for more time in the concourse isnt conducive of that. A move away from the city centre would be the total opposite. Think some would do well to remember Newcastle United and its matchday revenue isnt the be and end all for the city and its people. 

 

 

 

Edited March 20 by Doctor Zaius

[Fezzle]

1 hour ago, Dr.Spaceman said:

 

SJP with an extra 7 thousand people trying to get in to the Gallowgate will be a fucking nightmare.

Even bigger nightmare solving the meltdown of the entire Gallowgate/corners being empty for best part of 2 seasons to acheive it. Is it really worth 7000 extra bums on seats when the financial reward is almost nonexistent? We still wouldnt have adequate commercial revenue to advance the club where people want to be. How do you sell a stadium renaming when Ashley did it and the overwhelming reaction was 'it will always be called St James anyway' Not exactly a soldi case to the FMV panel....

[JonBez comesock]

Guessing we won’t have a refurbished / extended St James Park until at least 2032? (Ish) 

 

Based on the Euros 2028?

time to build thereafter 

 

 

New Stadium options / locations seem very difficult to achieve / Viable in the discussed locations (arena site / town moor / castle leazes) 

 

 

 

 

[madras]

20 minutes ago, Fezzle said:

Even bigger nightmare solving the meltdown of the entire Gallowgate/corners being empty for best part of 2 seasons to acheive it. Is it really worth 7000 extra bums on seats when the financial reward is almost nonexistent? We still wouldnt have adequate commercial revenue to advance the club where people want to be. How do you sell a stadium renaming when Ashley did it and the overwhelming reaction was 'it will always be called St James anyway' Not exactly a soldi case to the FMV panel....

Why would the gallowgate/corners need to be emptied?

[Fezzle]

15 minutes ago, madras said:

Why would the gallowgate/corners need to be emptied?

You are knocking down the entire stand to rebuild it. Theres obviously going to be some point where its unusable due to access/safety reasons

[madras]

4 minutes ago, Fezzle said:

You are knocking down the entire stand to rebuild it. Theres obviously going to be some point where its unusable due to access/safety reasons

Whyvare we completely knocking it down ?How long did Liverpool need to shut their stand for?

 

 

Edited March 20 by madras

[Fezzle]

4 minutes ago, madras said:

Whyvare we completely knocking it down ?How long did Liverpool need to shut their stand for?

 

 

 

For one thing it was widely stated that the Gallowgate isnt build strong enough to hold more fans/expand its size. The entire fountadions will need to be completely rebuild and reinforced. The sheer scale of it is undersetimated by loads of people. Saw one lad on Facebook say we can just stick another tier on stilts and its easy ffs. Also Liverpools new stand is completely different situation entirely

[madras]

2 minutes ago, Fezzle said:

For one thing it was widely stated that the Gallowgate isnt build strong enough to hold more fans/expand its size. The entire fountadions will need to be completely rebuild and reinforced. The sheer scale of it is undersetimated by loads of people. Saw one lad on Facebook say we can just stick another tier on stilts and its easy ffs. Also Liverpools new stand is completely different situation entirely

Years ago under Hall and Shephard they said it was doable engineering wise but financially not worth it. Engineering has moved on since then and we have deeper pockets.

[Fezzle]

Just now, madras said:

Years ago under Hall and Shephard they said it was doable engineering wise but financially not worth it. Engineering has moved on since then and we have deeper pockets.

Thats great, we can afford to put 7000 people in the gods than most on here refuse to sit in. That doesnt change how hard and lengthy the whole task will be, just look how high the back will need to be given the drop off. The metro station and current road are issues that will require a hell of a lot of work and expense. If we are wrapping Level 7 all around how do you solve the carpark and disruption to Barrack Road. Its a huge task regardless of what Shepherd though was possible

[madras]

6 minutes ago, Fezzle said:

Thats great, we can afford to put 7000 people in the gods than most on here refuse to sit in. That doesnt change how hard and lengthy the whole task will be, just look how high the back will need to be given the drop off. The metro station and current road are issues that will require a hell of a lot of work and expense. If we are wrapping Level 7 all around how do you solve the carpark and disruption to Barrack Road. Its a huge task regardless of what Shepherd though was possible

Of course it's a huge task, hence the feasibility study, but it's not impossible. As for putting people in the gods, we do that already and people go.

 

Edit....there are currently examples of roads, even railways going "under" stands.

 

 

Edited March 20 by madras

[Fezzle]

1 minute ago, madras said:

Of course it's a huge task, hence the feasibility study, but it's not impossible. As for putting people in the gods, we so that already and people go.

Thats what i said from the start, doesnt change that we are booting thousands out during the task which is why you replied in the first place.

[madras]

2 minutes ago, Fezzle said:

Thats what i said from the start, doesnt change that we are booting thousands out during the task which is why you replied in the first place.

But we may not be booting people out re Anfield Road extension.

 

 

Edited March 20 by madras

[OverThere]

Traditional match day experience? Was that when we had to climb through the piss river into the Gallowgate or sometime else. At what date did progress stop to define the traditional match day experience. 1983, 1996, 2004 or what??

[Kanji]

7 hours ago, Ameritoon said:

It's much more bare. I haven't been since right before the SD signs came down, but it's basically food/drinks and toilets. Best concourse I can compare it to is an old school hockey barn. 

Given SJP hasn’t really gotten much investment outside of then new owners pumping a little money in, it’s about as simple as you get. Not comparable at all. I assume Spurs new stadium is about as close as you get to the newer American stadium quality. Been to Wembley and that is quite comparable to American stadiums.