St James' Park

[r0cafella]

Just now, TheGuv said:

I understand that. But it’s not a golden bullet for success is it?

 

They’ve finished in the top 4 once since it opened and haven’t won a trophy since 2008.

 

 

No, of course not but this isn't about guarantees. It's about giving ourselves the best chance to compete with the best on a consistent basis. We want to be able to keep our best players and build upon them and not be forced to sell because we hit a glass ceiling. 

 

It's a litmus test for our ambition.

[TheGuv]

4 minutes ago, r0cafella said:

No, of course not but this isn't about guarantees. It's about giving ourselves the best chance to compete with the best on a consistent basis. We want to be able to keep our best players and build upon them and not be forced to sell because we hit a glass ceiling. 

 

It's a litmus test for our ambition.

The real ambitious route is therefore to stay at St James with a temporary stadium elsewhere in the mean time 

[Elliottman]

3 minutes ago, TheGuv said:

The real ambitious route is therefore to stay at St James with a temporary stadium elsewhere in the mean time 

What is the only option for an expansion is say, an extra 6-8k seats?! 

[r0cafella]

3 minutes ago, TheGuv said:

The real ambitious route is therefore to stay at St James with a temporary stadium elsewhere in the mean time 

You mean to knock down the exiting stadium and rebuild and play somewhere else whilst this occurs?

 

I can get behind that personally as long as we can get all that money we'd be leaving on the table by not building a new stadium elsewhere. 

[54]

I don't pertain to know alot about the situation with Castle Leazes, but hasn't Newcastle City Council just brought it back under their own estate portfolio, after the company they gave the lease to couldn't keep up the funding? Or am I making that up?

 

Ultimately, the council would be a bit silly if they had objections to it, atleast in my, admittedly ill informed view. According to Kieran Maguire The Tottenham Hotspur Stadium apparently makes an average of £4.8m per match, that's £91m per year on Premier League games alone, you add in Champions League or European games and domestic games, that could easily take it above £100m, add in to the design the ability to host gigs and other sporting events you're laughing. There would be a massive amount of trickle down to the city as a whole too, and the Council would probably end up raking in a lot of money from people just being out more, and more people coming to the area, to spend in the City. It could arguably be transformative.

 

Again, this is just fag paper maths, and i'm not an economist  

[Keegans Export]

17 minutes ago, TheGuv said:

I understand that. But it’s not a golden bullet for success is it?

 

They’ve finished in the top 4 once since it opened in 2019 and haven’t won a trophy since 2008.

 

That's at least in part because Spurs have the PSR headroom and don't use it, it's much more of a business decision than a football one. The suggestion from our owners is that they will look to spend the maximum allowable under the rules.

 

 

[Heron]

Just find it all a bit shit tbh PSR supposed to protect clubs in communities but foreign money tearing existing heritage away in favour of revenue to overcome rules that are currently being proven to be a pile of shite. Working man's game my arse.

 

 

 

Edited November 21, 2024 by Heron

[r0cafella]

1 minute ago, Heron said:

Just find it all a bit shit tbh PSR supposed to protect clubs in communities but foreign money tearing existing heritage away in favour of revenue to overcome rules that are currently being proven to be a pile of shite. Working man's game my arse.

 

 

 

 

I mean regardless of PSR we have a situation whereby a lot of fans are locked out and our fanbase isn't being renewed due to this. 

 

The goal should be a stadium which can accommodate everyone regardless of where they are from. 

[Heron]

4 minutes ago, r0cafella said:

I mean regardless of PSR we have a situation whereby a lot of fans are locked out and our fanbase isn't being renewed due to this. 

 

The goal should be a stadium which can accommodate everyone regardless of where they are from. 

Appreciate your point but not for me.

 

We will have fans if we play good football.

 

The rules make us move stadium to enable us to invest and utilise revenue to then enable us to play better football through increased "natural" revenue.

 

Can build seats but folk won't come unless we play attractive football and unless tickets are priced fairly. Next after the stadium move will be a ticket price hike to pay for it.

 

 

Edited November 21, 2024 by Heron

[r0cafella]

Just now, Heron said:

Appreciate your point but not for me.

 

We will have fans if we play good football.

 

The rules make us move stadium to enable us to invest and utilise revenue to then enable us to play better football through investment.

 

Can build seats but folk won't come unless we play attractive football and unless tickets are priced fairly. Next after the stadium move will be a ticket price hike to pay for it.

 

 

 

I'm not sure what your point is here tbh?

 

SJP doesn't have the capacity or future capacity to accommodate everyone who wants to attend I think this is something we can all agree on. 

 

So we are left with, locking people out indefinitely or trying to accommodate them. The fact this may also potential help our PSR situation is a bonus. 

 

Prices for entertainment in any forn will increase football is no different, this is the society we live in I'm afraid. 

[54]

1 minute ago, r0cafella said:

I'm not sure what your point is here tbh?

 

SJP doesn't have the capacity or future capacity to accommodate everyone who wants to attend I think this is something we can all agree on. 

 

So we are left with, locking people out indefinitely or trying to accommodate them. The fact this may also potential help our PSR situation is a bonus. 

 

Prices for entertainment in any forn will increase football is no different, this is the society we live in I'm afraid. 

Just as an example, I live in Cornwall, and would love to come up and visit, and watch a game, but because of the demand, I don't have a hope of getting a ticket unless I go corporate, which costs as a minimum of £250, which i'm just not going to do. 

[Jackie Broon]

46 minutes ago, TheGuv said:

If @LFEE doesn’t know about it yet as a Freeman, who do we know it’s Castle Leazes?

 

It does make me chuckle mind - the sea change in supporter’s sails. The Club have played a blinder.

 

I’ve recently seen Spurs’ supporters bemoaning their new stadium. It’s arguably the best of the new builds.
 

How is PSR working for them?

 

Unless I've missed something he has been pretty tight lipped about what he does or doesn't know.

 

Stuff I've heard and stuff in the press has suggested that the club has been in contact with the Freemen about buying land.

 

We don’t know Castle Leazes is what they're going for, it's just the most obvious option.

 

 

Edited November 21, 2024 by Jackie Broon

[r0cafella]

1 minute ago, 54 said:

Just as an example, I live in Cornwall, and would love to come up and visit, and watch a game, but because of the demand, I don't have a hope of getting a ticket unless I go corporate, which costs as a minimum of £250, which i'm just not going to do. 

For sure, you aren't the only one either. I think it's an issue which is bigger than any individual fan. It's literally the future of the club and a chance to define who we want to be going into the next 125 years. 

 

I understand the tradition and people struggling to let go but for me we have to move forward and embrace our potential, if we miss this opportunity we will be kicking ourselves in the future I'm sure of it. 

[Elliottman]

7 minutes ago, r0cafella said:

I'm not sure what your point is here tbh?

 

SJP doesn't have the capacity or future capacity to accommodate everyone who wants to attend I think this is something we can all agree on. 

 

So we are left with, locking people out indefinitely or trying to accommodate them. The fact this may also potential help our PSR situation is a bonus. 

 

Prices for entertainment in any forn will increase football is no different, this is the society we live in I'm afraid. 

 

This is the situation in a nutshell. 

[Stifler]

2 minutes ago, 54 said:

I don't pertain to know alot about the situation with Castle Leazes, but hasn't Newcastle City Council just brought it back under their own estate portfolio, after the company they gave the lease to couldn't keep up the funding? Or am I making that up?

 

Ultimately, the council would be a bit silly if they had objections to it, atleast in my, admittedly ill informed view. According to Kieran Maguire The Tottenham Hotspur Stadium apparently makes an average of £4.8m per match, that's £91m per year on Premier League games alone, you add in Champions League or European games and domestic games, that could easily take it above £100m, add in to the design the ability to host gigs and other sporting events you're laughing. They would be a massive amount of trickle down to the city as a whole too, and the Council would probably end up raking in a lot of money from people just being out more, and more people coming to the area to spending in the City. It could arguably transformative.

 

Again, this is just fag paper maths, and i'm not an economist  

The council don’t own it, the Freeman of the city own it. The council are in charge of managing it, and they passed that on to a company to manage, and they did such a poor job of it, that they ended up pulling the contract from them.

 

The council won’t be able to object to any planning application that they have no legal objection too. If they did, it would go to central government to make a decision on when it is appealed. Leazes Park being a protected park doesn’t automatically rule out development of it. My opinion is that the majority of it will be built on Castle Leazes (which isn’t protected), with a little encroachment on Leazes Park.

Where SJP is will be turned into an extension of Leazes Park, with a wide walkway leading from Strawberry Place, to the stadium. The entrance of which will likely house the old SJP gates.

The stack will be taken away, and a permanent fan park facility will be built, with better access to SJP Metro station.

[Doctor Zaius]

All this chat about Spurs and the revenue from their stadium. Don't want a situation where a new stadium takes away from the city. It doesn't matter in London. It makes a difference here.

 

Even castle leazes is a bit far for my liking.

 

Edit: I've also 0 interest in any 'fan park' either like. Plastic rubbish imo.

 

 

Edited November 21, 2024 by Doctor Zaius

[Stifler]

13 minutes ago, Heron said:

Appreciate your point but not for me.

 

We will have fans if we play good football.

 

The rules make us move stadium to enable us to invest and utilise revenue to then enable us to play better football through increased "natural" revenue.

 

Can build seats but folk won't come unless we play attractive football and unless tickets are priced fairly. Next after the stadium move will be a ticket price hike to pay for it.

I was one of the ones who gave up my season ticket when Rafa left out of what I thought would be best for the club (people are free to different on that view).

 

This season, the Leicester match is the first match that I’ll be able to attend because of the demand for tickets.

I am resigned that I’ll now never be able to get a season ticket alongside a friend, or any kids I might have.

If we are ran in the right way, demand will only increase. A new stadium with a much bigger capacity is likely the only way I’d be able to take future little Stiflers to the match, or get a season ticket for us together.

[Turnbull2000]

I can't see the Freeman entertaining the loss of land

[TheBrownBottle]

43 minutes ago, TheGuv said:

The real ambitious route is therefore to stay at St James with a temporary stadium elsewhere in the mean time 

Lost on this one tbh.  Why is this so?

[Jackie Broon]

1 minute ago, Turnbull2000 said:

I can't see the Freeman entertaining the loss of land

 

They already have before, when the stadium was planned there in 1997. 

[CheikBoom]

7 minutes ago, Stifler said:

I was one of the ones who gave up my season ticket when Rafa left out of what I thought would be best for the club (people are free to different on that view).

 

This season, the Leicester match is the first match that I’ll be able to attend because of the demand for tickets.

I am resigned that I’ll now never be able to get a season ticket alongside a friend, or any kids I might have.

If we are ran in the right way, demand will only increase. A new stadium with a much bigger capacity is likely the only way I’d be able to take future little Stiflers to the match, or get a season ticket for us together.

This is exactly it for me as well. Gave mine up under Carver, but since last season I've only been succesful in 1 ballot.

 

As much as I love SJP, I want to be able to get to games as well. 

[TheBrownBottle]

The club just needs to crack on.  SJP is not fit for purpose, nor can it be redeveloped to be fit for purpose.  Let’s get spades in the ground and get on with the agenda of being all we can be.  By a back of a fag packet calculation I reckon I’ve been in SJP 500+ times.  I have very little sentiment for the lopsided monolith that was pretty much built in the ‘90s.  Get a new ground built in the city centre and let’s fulfil our potential.  

[Sibierski]

As much as I’d love to remain at SJP, and bring it up to spec, let’s be honest, it’s bit of a dive inside. Can slap some paint on and what not, but fundamentals can’t be changed. 
 

Only because they could smash down countless crack dens to expand 2 (and assume eventually 3 stands), Liverpool will be only top half club in Premier League who’s been able to remain at their ground. Even if we could build out the east stand, Milburn is still limited because of Barrack Road. As highlighted earlier, the newer stadiums are mostly larger (and newer stands) because of what they pack inside, rather than just squeeze seats which is what our stands are.

[Fezzle]

17 minutes ago, TheBrownBottle said:

Lost on this one tbh.  Why is this so?

Its a bizarre take as regardless of rebuilding SJP and finding a mythical replacement during it, using the current land doesnt solve the Leaze Terrace/Metro/Barrack Road issues that is boxing us into a set footprint that will limit any meaningful expansion and cost a fucking shitload to boot.

[TheBrownBottle]

Just now, Fezzle said:

Its a bizarre take as regardless of rebuilding SJP and finding a mythical replacement during it, using the current land doesnt solve the Leaze Terrace/Metro/Barrack Road issues that is boxing us into a set footprint that will limit any meaningful expansion and cost a fucking shitload to boot.

Yep.  There simply isn’t a ‘temporary’ ground solution for an SJP rebuild - and the footprint isn’t big enough even if it was possible.

 

Yes, PIF has a lot of money.  But it isn’t going to spend c.£200m+ on a temporary stadium which would last a year or so and wouldn’t even bring in enough revenue to cover cost.  Anyone who thinks this is delusional.