Would you take Sam Allardyce?

[Guest alex]

For me (and I'm not an 'Allardyce lover') he: can motivate/manage 'stars' / foreign players - Diouf, Anelka, etc.; he is an innovative coach always looking to new techniques and new coaching aids, he seems to be able to instill discipline and maintain the respect of his players, he can run a club on a budget but he's also done alright when he's been allowed to splash the cash. I've probably missed a few things but he's light years ahead of Roeder as a manager (something imo Roeder isn't).

[Northern Monkey]

Yep. I imagine many of us could think of people we'd rather have to some degree or other, but I've said for some time that some of his particular strengths are areas in which we're particularly weak. Cutting-edge off-field techniques, a Manager who knows his own mind and will demand the best from the Board, and the knowledge of how not to throw the ball directly to the opposition in your own half, for example.

 

Get out. And take your new-fangled thinkings with you. There's no place for the likes of those ideas at SJP.

 

so Roeder is a crap manager because he doesn't spend his training time with his international footballers telling them not to throw the ball to the opposition?

 

Not going to answer the question Alex put to you or will that show you up as being someone who puts in a random comment without the knowledge to actually back it up?

 

How is he anything like Roeder?

 

 

down boy

 

he's an average English type motivator and tactician who doggedly sticks by his favourite players

 

howzzat for starters?

 

You said average. Therefroe he is nothing like Roeder.

 

funny how the players would rather blame the fans for their lack of confidence than the piss poor roeder though isn't it? How odd. Like to see how Bolton would perform infront of 52,000 Northern Monkeys

 

I would love to see examples of Roeder being even average.

 

Well? Playing Carr as soon as he's fit? Solano off for Milner? Letting Bramble ever play for us?

 

I'm sure you have loads of examples, though.

 

[ChezGiven]

Yep. I imagine many of us could think of people we'd rather have to some degree or other, but I've said for some time that some of his particular strengths are areas in which we're particularly weak. Cutting-edge off-field techniques, a Manager who knows his own mind and will demand the best from the Board, and the knowledge of how not to throw the ball directly to the opposition in your own half, for example.

 

Get out. And take your new-fangled thinkings with you. There's no place for the likes of those ideas at SJP.

 

so Roeder is a crap manager because he doesn't spend his training time with his international footballers telling them not to throw the ball to the opposition?

 

Not going to answer the question Alex put to you or will that show you up as being someone who puts in a random comment without the knowledge to actually back it up?

 

How is he anything like Roeder?

 

 

down boy

 

he's an average English type motivator and tactician who doggedly sticks by his favourite players

 

howzzat for starters?

 

You said average. Therefroe he is nothing like Roeder.

 

funny how the players would rather blame the fans for their lack of confidence than the piss poor roeder though isn't it? How odd. Like to see how Bolton would perform infront of 52,000 Northern Monkeys

 

They won 2-1.

[Guest Gemmill]

Ooooo it's the fans fault!  Oooo how controversial!  Oooo!

[Guest alex]

How about doing a shite job at every club he's been manager of? If you're looking for examples.

[Rich]

Good Lord, we've reached new lows here - because I'd love to see how Milner/anyone else would have fared here had he/they come out and blamed Roeder for that defeat, rather than the frustrations of the supporters. Cracking idea to say they should come out in the media and say it's Glenn's fault - not theirs, or the fans. I'm sure that would go down a fucking treat. Who else blamed the fans, other than Milner, like? Aye they might make martyrs of themselves doing so, but they'd not have much of a future here and they'd end up having a tarnished reputation because of it. Deary, deary me.

 

This thread is starting to look like Vic being chucked into a tank of piranha's - although he'll no doubt tell us he's the shark in amongst the little fishies.

[Guest Gemmill]

This thread is starting to look like Vic being chucked into a tank of piranha's - although he'll no doubt tell us he's the shark in amongst the little fishies.

 

He never learns.  It's like punching a dog.  No matter how many times you do it, you know when you shout for it, it'll still come running over wagging its tail......aaaaand SMACK!

[Guest Invicta_Toon]

This thread is starting to look like Vic being chucked into a tank of piranha's - although he'll no doubt tell us he's the shark in amongst the little fishies.

 

He never learns.  It's like punching a dog.  No matter how many times you do it, you know when you shout for it, it'll still come running over wagging its tail......aaaaand SMACK!

 

only accountants doing the running round here boy

 

here boy, get it

[Guest Gemmill]

This thread is starting to look like Vic being chucked into a tank of piranha's - although he'll no doubt tell us he's the shark in amongst the little fishies.

 

He never learns.  It's like punching a dog.  No matter how many times you do it, you know when you shout for it, it'll still come running over wagging its tail......aaaaand SMACK!

 

only accountants doing the running round here boy

 

here boy, get it

 

See what I mean?  Vic, your tail's wagging.

[Guest Invicta_Toon]

This thread is starting to look like Vic being chucked into a tank of piranha's - although he'll no doubt tell us he's the shark in amongst the little fishies.

 

He never learns.  It's like punching a dog.  No matter how many times you do it, you know when you shout for it, it'll still come running over wagging its tail......aaaaand SMACK!

 

only accountants doing the running round here boy

 

here boy, get it

 

See what I mean?  Vic, your tail's wagging.

 

your lipstick is showing though

[Rich]

This thread is starting to look like Vic being chucked into a tank of piranha's - although he'll no doubt tell us he's the shark in amongst the little fishies.

 

He never learns.  It's like punching a dog.  No matter how many times you do it, you know when you shout for it, it'll still come running over wagging its tail......aaaaand SMACK!

 

Who would punch a dog!? :-[

[Guest Invicta_Toon]

This thread is starting to look like Vic being chucked into a tank of piranha's - although he'll no doubt tell us he's the shark in amongst the little fishies.

 

He never learns.  It's like punching a dog.  No matter how many times you do it, you know when you shout for it, it'll still come running over wagging its tail......aaaaand SMACK!

 

Who would punch a dog!? :-[

 

A cat?

[Guest alankhaw]

I would carry Big Sam on my back all the way from Bolton to the toon if he was prepared to take the job - absolutely light years away from our current incumbent in so many ways.

 

Hopefully bring Speedo back with him as well in player/coaching capacity.

 

I think you'd break your back doing that. You better resort to another form of transport

[Guest Invicta_Toon]

I would carry Big Sam on my back all the way from Bolton to the toon if he was prepared to take the job - absolutely light years away from our current incumbent in so many ways.

 

Hopefully bring Speedo back with him as well in player/coaching capacity.

 

I think you'd break your back doing that. You better resort to another form of transport

 

probably lose your shirt too

[Guest Lee-T]

If Sam took over I would have to top myself, can't stand the fat cunt.

[Baggio]

Average manager but likely to be the best out of Shepherd's list.

[NUFC06]

He is proving again this year with Bolton that he is the best manager out of the top 4 in the Premiership

I would love to see him here

[wibble]

The only time (in recent memory) we've enjoyed any success was with Keegan and Robson, both of whom seemed capable of inspiring/motivating players to play above their normal levels.

 

Big Sam can do that, and that's the major reason I'd have him here.  He's consistently pushed Bolton way higher up the table than you'd have thought possible with their squad.  Add to that his ability to innovate and pretty much lead the way when it comes to training methods - he'd do a great job of finally organising our squad into a proper team.

 

If he's even remotely interested in the Toon job, FS needs to do absolutely everything to get this man in this summer and stop faffing about with second-rate, tactically inept managers.

[ohmelads]

I hate Sam Allardyce and I hate the way his team plays football. At times they have seemed like fluky blaggers and you get the feeling that 1-0 wins would start turning into 1-0 losses sooner or later and the bubble would burst.

 

But you've got to hand it to him, he's doing it season on season and proving he knows how to win football games. His teams are always very organised, espescially in defence, and he knows how to change a game. You also have to hand it to him for buying Anelka, it's a sign he is prepared to introduce class when the money is available. And year on year he builds his squad, he knows how to work the transfer market and doesn't make costly mistakes, nor does he offload important players. His Bolton squad may have more graft and less flair than ours, but he gets them extremely organised and if he could do the same with our lot it'd make us a lot harder to beat. Perhaps above all else his team rarely ever picks up injuries, and that alone could make a big difference to a Newcastle side which consistently tops the injury table year on year.

 

I still have reservations but if you're asking whether I'd take him over Roeder, it's an unequivocal YES.

 

I don't see him leaving Bolton though unless we promise him a handsome transfer kitty. They're in the running for a Champions League place and will probably have UEFA Cup next year, which we won't. A transfer kitty and promise of a 60,000 stadium might tempt him, but I imagine he'd ask for a longer contract like the massive one Bolton gave him. Whether Freddy would ever offer something like that I'm doubtful.

[STM]

He's the best english manager. Sadly, the standard of english managers is terrible. I agree with most of what people have said that he is way better than what we have got but i'm not a better than what we have got person so no.

 

That doesn't mean that i think we can realistically attract anyone better.

[BlueStar]

After Souness I'd have been disappointed with him, at the moment I'd bite his hand off, savouring every big sausage-like finger.

[Guest Knightrider]

Back-room boy keeping Bolton ahead of the game

 

Saturday March 17, 2007

The Guardian

 

The continuing quest for improvement took Bolton Wanderers' performance director to New York recently, but not to scrutinise the sporting techniques of the Giants, Knicks or Yankees. Instead Mike Forde sat in a 16th-floor office at Saatchi and Saatchi's headquarters high above Greenwich Village as the advertising company's world CEO, Kevin Roberts, talked ideas. "People wonder what a Premiership football club can learn from a business like Saatchi, but the similarities in what we're aiming at were actually stunning," offered Forde. "Both of us are always asking, how do we stay ahead of the game?"

 

Bolton travel to Manchester United this lunchtime attempting to maintain another campaign spent apparently punching above their weight near the top of the Premier League. They will end the weekend in fifth place, yet they are blazing their own trail off the pitch in order to remain hugely competitive on it.

 

It is eight years since Sam Allardyce recognised the need to find an edge that would hoist his side clear of the also-rans. Forde, the man behind Big Sam whether in the stands or at the training ground, is one of a few key staff at the Reebok Stadium seeking to guide this club's long-term vision. The 31-year-old, whose background is in sports science and psychology, oversees a strategy that should keep Bolton competitive in the years to come.

 

Forde's job effectively entails scouring the globe for innovations that may be relevant to the club, whether they be in IT, scouting, psychology or people-management. This week he met Roger Draper, CEO at the Lawn Tennis Association, to examine its infrastructure, following up visits to 25 teams in the United States, from NFL to NBA, and a spell with Honda observing formula one testing in Barcelona.

 

Later this year he will meet the All Blacks before the rugby World Cup. "They've just appointed a guy whose job is to blue-sky, ignoring this year's tournament but exploring sports science and coaching techniques to see how they are going to win the next World Cup in 2011. In any leading business there's always someone whose job is to pinpoint what's around the corner because what was extraordinary yesterday is very ordinary tomorrow.

 

"Every six weeks I take the staff away for a strategic-planning day: we'll examine the next phase of the season but then spend half a day brainstorming. I presented what I'd learnt from Saatchi's, showing how we can link it with what we do. They have a handful of designers as talented as the players we have and, like us, probably spend a high percentage of their costs on a small percentage of staff. But they have created a framework which allows them to be successful today while planning for tomorrow. It ties into the quantum changes we've had at this club."

 

When Forde was recruited by Allardyce and his then assistant, Phil Brown, in 1999, Bolton had an ambitious Championship side, a fine new stadium but a decrepit training ground. Steered by the manager, with Forde overseeing development in the background, they have finished eighth, sixth and eighth in the top flight over the past three years and their ability to attract such players as Nicolas Anelka, Jay-Jay Okocha and Youri Djorkaeff to a small town near Manchester is remarkable. The full-time backroom staff has swollen from five to 21, covering coaching, medicine, sports science, performance analysis and administrative support.

 

"And the scouting operation has gone through the roof," said Forde. "We've created a no-excuse environment which will allow our players to flourish. The squad has gone from 80% British to 80% foreign and we ensure whoever we bring here can settle. It's about the small things: opening bank accounts, finding schools or houses, showing them where they can eat out or where their local mosque or church is.

 

"But we also offer a unique experience. At one stage our squad boasted 25 championships, two World Cups and seven Champions Leagues. Fernando Hierro had played for Real Madrid for 14 years but his desire to plan for a career beyond playing - like Gary Speed - meant that he recognised us as a fantastic opportunity to learn from our coaching, sports-science and game-analysis techniques.

 

"Last year every member of our squad had played on average for six different teams, eight managers and in 250 games. We looked at where they had each been most successful and picked out anything we could from that environment we could replicate here. It's a very deductive process, but it might be the smallest thing. A player might have come from a bigger club where he was a fringe player and he might relish having a bigger role here.

 

"Our screening process is so extensive. We recruit possibly eight players every year on, say, an average wage of £1m. If you went into the private sector, the due diligence around recruiting someone on that amount would be incredible, but we're making the same investment here so we have to be as thorough. It's actually quite difficult to sign for this club because of the due diligence we undertake."

 

Those recruited benefit from a revamped training ground, complete with tranquil suites with Chinese medicine techniques to hand. The international players are accompanied by club masseurs, fitness staff or nutritionists when abroad with their countries. "We can't control the environment they're in when they're away but we can influence it. We want to keep them thinking: 'I am a Bolton player.' It's about making the players feel wanted and creating the conditions for success. You can never guarantee you'll win, but how can you take away the excuses for failure?"

 

On-pitch analysis is adding to Bolton's options. They were one of the first Premiership clubs to adopt ProZone, the player-tracking service which produces detailed data of every move, kick or spit that occurs in a game. Dave Fallows has been recruited from ProZone as the club's head of technical scouting, with his seven-man team scrutinising matches on-site. "Any club can have ProZone but some use it better than others," said Forde. "We have a fantastically talented analysis team who, on matchday, are wired up and give constant feedback. The future of sport is real-time science.

 

"Our IT suite can, on request, call up certain passages of play. When Sam walks in at half-time he can play those incidents on screen. It's a 15-minute window of opportunity and another competitive edge we exploit."

 

Such innovative thinking has attracted interest from around the globe, with Aussie rules clubs and the LA Lakers visiting the Reebok to view Bolton's techniques. At Old Trafford this lunchtime the Wanderers will have a high-profile stage on which to put them into practice.

[Guest Knightrider]

I very much doubt Big Sam will be our manager at any stage of his career while Freddy Shepherd is still at the club, as the two don't get on apparently and even then, I couldn't see us going for someone who has previously turned down the job. More is the pitty as he is exactly what we need and would do very well here. He is without a doubt the best manager outside of the top four in my humble opinion and by some considerable distance too. Furthermore he has all the qualities to become an even better manager, i.e. someone who could conceivably join the "elite" tier of managers in this country and abroad, given the right opportunity. Big Sam ticks all the boxes for me and is someone I've been a big admirer of since Sir Bobby's days and someone who I would welcome to St. James' Park with open arms. Won't happen though.

[Guest Sniffer]

But he didn't have the balls to come out and take the Newcastle position when it was vacant. Scared of the size of the job by the looks of things.

[Cajun]

But he didn't have the balls to come out and take the Newcastle position when it was vacant. Scared of the size of the job by the looks of things.

 

He would take a bigger job.