Allardyce to be given £50m by Ashley - The Times

[KaKa]

What a depressing thread ... news that we've got a bit of money and people want us to go splashing out on name players, many of whom we are not certain will even perform in the premiership and who will all be coming because they heard our owner is a billionaire and has money to throw around.

 

It's no wonder Freddy always went for the trophy signing. Looks like he knows us better than we know ourselves.

 

Why don't we let Allardyce bring in players who he knows are good and will get us to where we want to go. he has his techniques for scouting players and it isn't based on how high their transfer price is, so let him do his thing. What's to say Rozehnal won't be the next Vidic, or Beye the next Gallas??? 

 

Wenger has won the Premiership by buying players who were considered nobodies or cheapies but he knew their abilities and he went for them for that reason. Why not let Allardyce do the same thing. He is obviously going for players he knows and players he is confident will get the job done for us.

 

This is not a video game people. I for one am very happy to have a manger who is smart enough to know that a good player isn't necessarily one with a big name and a big price tag. I will continue looking forward to Sam bringing in players who he is confident in regardless of their name or price tag.

 

What a totally patronizing post tbh.

 

 

 

No offence Big Bird ... it's just that I don't think it makes sense to say that we have all this money therefore we should make a trophy signing.

 

If the manager identifies a player that he feels he absolutely must have and this player costs £15 million then fine let's go for it, but if this player costs £2 million then that's fine too. It doesn't make sense to me for the manager to go out of his way to sign a big player just to make a statement.

 

Every transfer is a gamble, even the supposed sure things (i.e. Duff) so a manager, in my opinion, should only ever go for a player who they know very well and who they know will contribute to their plan for the team. Irregardless of if this player costs £500,000 or £50 million. I think it is unfair to critisize Allardyce for buying 'Bolton players' whatever that means. These so called 'Bolton players' have been whipping our behinds for years now!

 

If bolton had enough money to build a full squad of these type of players rather than just a first team, they would have been in the champions league by now. I will be more than happy if Sam could build a full squad of players of the quality he has pursued so far.

[Jay Jay Sea]

I'd rather put £20 million into buying top young talent for the youth team rather than blowing it on a trophy signing tbh.

Not for me sir.  I'd rather sign a team of Hyypia's, Viduka's and Barton's and win one single trophy than sign yet more kids for the youth team.  Kids playing in the youth team will not keep Allardyce his job nor will it bring silverware that his boss and the fans are so desperate for.  Correct me if I am wrong but it seems to me that Newcastle Utd's policy been to sign young players for relatively vast sums of cash and then see them NEVER become great players or fulfil their potential. I suppose I'd put the likes of Jenas, Dyer or even Bramble in the category.  Proven experienced players win the day for me at the moment in time.

[Nobody]

Isn't this story the same as the one we had when Ashley bought the SJH shares? That he'd spend 250m in five years or something like that?

[James]

Up front, we arguably have the best bunch of strikers in the country now (better in depth, although Man U and Chelsea have higher quality first choice strikers), so this season, we can probably avoid spending in that area now.

 

In midfield, we have a good bunch of players, most of whom would get in the squad of most teams, although we could be improved with an athletic defensive midfield destroyer, and with a player who can score goals and create more chances.

 

In defence, we basically have two senior defenders, a centre back with great potential in Taylor, plus Rozehnal who I perceive to be Allardyce's upgrade on Craig Moore. We also have two other centre backs with potential.

 

In my opinion, we are going to need between 3 and 6 new defenders, and that will deplete the budget.

 

I'd say, get three defenders, not exceeding £6m, and then another exceptional centre back if available, like Andrade. That would basically be half the budget then spent.

 

Then it is a straight choice as to whether to burn the other £20m on a defensive or offensive midfielder. I'd go for the offensive options, as Rozehnal, Barton, Butt should be able to cover the defensive position for now.

[LateRegistration]

I think with our squad being so depleted and severely lacking in depth I think our approach to transfers should be that of Spurs when Martin Jol initially took over (actually that former french national coach took over 1st, can't remember his name).

 

Their 'revolving door' approach where they signed lots of decent, cheaply priced players for all positions building up quite a tidy squad, fair enough finishing in 9th place but with clear progress being made If players didn't make it they were then shipped out e.g. davenport, davies, mendes, etc. This policy actually suits allardyce as if you look at his transfers at bolton he signed lots of players, many not managing a 1st team appearance.

 

We only need to look at ourselves and Souness's spending of 43.5m on expensive players instead of building a squad i.e. luque 9.5m, owen - 16m, boumsong - 8m, parker 5.5m and emre 4.5m, when they inevitably got injured or didn't perform we simply didn't have the players and still don't as roeder basically failed to get players in over the 2 transfer windows he was in charge. We're also paying these players ridiculous wages to convince them to play here and in owen's case inserting a series of daft clauses that will probably fuck us over. 

 

Once we've built a squad of players (perhaps even qualifying for europe via the league), then we can look to add the big money signings, the andrade's , miguel's and gattuso's (plus we may even be able to convince them to come here without putting ridiculous transfer clauses in their contracts). Again this is effectively what spurs started to do as of last summer adding berbatov and this summer bale and probably bent on big money.

 

 

[Slugsy]

I'd like us to stop paying mediocre amounts for mediocre defenders - you get what you pay for and its time we started buying decent full backs in particular and stop bargain basement hunting in the £1-2m bracket.  We won't get a decent defence till we buy a couple of quality full backs and at least one more decent centre back.  These players don't come cheap but if we are serious about improving the team then we need to focus on areas where historically we have been inept or just plain tight at addressing.

[Leazes1986]

I'd like us to stop paying mediocre amounts for mediocre defenders - you get what you pay for and its time we started buying decent full backs in particular and stop bargain basement hunting in the £1-2m bracket.  We won't get a decent defence till we buy a couple of quality full backs and at least one more decent centre back.  These players don't come cheap but if we are serious about improving the team then we need to focus on areas where historically we have been inept or just plain tight at addressing.

 

Big money will not always get you a top defender. A good manager can identify a quality defender though even if he isn't a big name.

[ToonTastic]

I'd like us to stop paying mediocre amounts for mediocre defenders - you get what you pay for and its time we started buying decent full backs in particular and stop bargain basement hunting in the £1-2m bracket.  We won't get a decent defence till we buy a couple of quality full backs and at least one more decent centre back.  These players don't come cheap but if we are serious about improving the team then we need to focus on areas where historically we have been inept or just plain tight at addressing.

 

Instead buy a £8m defender like Boumsong

[Guest Sheriff John Bunnell (Ret]

I think with our squad being so depleted and severely lacking in depth I think our approach to transfers should be that of Spurs when Martin Jol initially took over (actually that former french national coach took over 1st, can't remember his name).

 

Their 'revolving door' approach where they signed lots of decent, cheaply priced players for all positions building up quite a tidy squad, fair enough finishing in 9th place but with clear progress being made If players didn't make it they were then shipped out e.g. davenport, davies, mendes, etc. This policy actually suits allardyce as if you look at his transfers at bolton he signed lots of players, many not managing a 1st team appearance.

 

We only need to look at ourselves and Souness's spending of 43.5m on expensive players instead of building a squad i.e. luque 9.5m, owen - 16m, boumsong - 8m, parker 5.5m and emre 4.5m, when they inevitably got injured or didn't perform we simply didn't have the players and still don't as roeder basically failed to get players in over the 2 transfer windows he was in charge. We're also paying these players ridiculous wages to convince them to play here and in owen's case inserting a series of daft clauses that will probably f*** us over. 

 

Once we've built a squad of players (perhaps even qualifying for europe via the league), then we can look to add the big money signings, the andrade's , miguel's and gattuso's (plus we may even be able to convince them to come here without putting ridiculous transfer clauses in their contracts). Again this is effectively what spurs started to do as of last summer adding berbatov and this summer bale and probably bent on big money.

 

 

 

 

Totally agree with your post LateReg!!

 

What Top Top players are gonna want to join us this season, alright things are looking good for the future but with No Uefa Cup let alone CL footy next season who is gonna want to unless they are offered mega bucks?! I think he shld use the money to strengthen our squad with good quality, reliable players who actually want to play for us and arent just there to pick up there wages!

 

Next season, fingers crossed we get into Europe, then we'll be able to attract the bigger names!

[Guest WalkervilleMag]

no big money will be spent until late July/ early August in my opinion, until Big Sam has worked with the players he has and then can see at 1st hand the positions he needs to bolster.  At the moment he is getting in players he was looking at whilst at Bolton, with the view of getting them in there. He probably at this moment does not know how much he has to spend, so is having to use funds from the Parker sale, and from reducing the wage bill with the release of players.

[Mr Logic]

Isn't this story the same as the one we had when Ashley bought the SJH shares? That he'd spend 250m in five years or something like that?

 

Yes, just a magical rehash. But you won't get many noticing it because they're all off on a spending spree.

[Mick]

I can't see any reason why players already playing in this Country would not want to play for us next season regardless of Europe.  Most players will see our club for what it is now, not what it has been for the last 4 years or so.  We are a club who will have 52,000 at every home league game next season and the atmosphere will be as good as it has been for many years.  Everything at our club is on the up and every player in the Country will know it.

 

I don't think we're a club who needs to make a trophy signing at this time, a trophy signing will not sell a single ticket as they'll all go anyway.  We need value for money, that goes for players who cost next to nothing as well as the big money signings, getting a player like Boumsong for nothing doesn't make him any better than the one we paid a fortune for, he'd still be shite.

 

A trophy signing might sell a few shirts but people like Owen will do that already.

 

We need a squad but we also need special players, we've got at least one and we need to add to that number.  If Ashley has £250 million to spend over 5 years then the bulk should be spent at the beginning because that's when we need the most players.  I can understand if this year is a year of caution because it doesn't matter what anybody says, Allardyce is unproven when it comes to spending large sums of money.  You can afford to get 20 players for nothing and see a large percentage dissapearing, you can't do that when you're spending £millions, we know that because we've been through it with Souness, no I'm not trying to say Allardyce is another Souness.

 

 

[hakka]

If he did hand over 50m i`d expect us to aim for 5th in the league.

 

No I disagree. Is 5th really worth having if it costs £50 million? sorry I think we have the players already (midfield and attack) to get 6th with simply spending a fraction of that £50million on defence.  If we get Geremi and Rozenhal I believe we already have better defenders than we previously had and it cost us hardly anything.

 

End of the day, we haven't got that bad players... we've had shite managers who used poor tactics, man management and regimes which led to players not deliverying their best form for some time.  Sam has taken a Championship club to Europe without £50 million to spend in one season.  Why blow £50 million to get one more league position spot that we can already acheive spending much less? surely we have a better squad than Bolton? yet they've done us for final league positions of late.

 

Think about it.  With a shite defence, Roeder steered us in to 7th.  With a manager that's proved to have an approach to managing a club and players that gets results out of players that on paper shouldn't, we should do much better than Souness and Roeder with Big Sam.  Given that the shite defence apppears to be disappearing and a new one of possibly of Rozenhal, Geremi, Taylor (so far) I'm very optimistic that we can get 6th without spending £50million.  I know we've seen some poor performances over the years, but we did make 7th with a silmiar squad, if not better now.  Getting in to Europe is what we need to do, but what's the point in blowing £50 million to do it.  If we blow £50million and don't make 6th/5th, were fucked and back to square one.  Too expensive risk, as spending £50million is no guarantee, Souness proved that.

 

Having money means nothing if you can't attract the right players.  The proper top players that can get us in to the top 4 will only join clubs that have European football, unless your mad enough to spend £17million on talent like Darren Bent.  And even then its an expensive gamble as to whether Bent would fire us to anywhere near 4th.

 

Spend wisely... that is the answer... have we not learnt from past mistakes? all does everyone just go mad for the idea of us blowing more money when we don't need to.  So far Sam spent wisely, I hope it continues. 

 

[hakka]

Not for me sir.  I'd rather sign a team of Hyypia's, Viduka's and Barton's and win one single trophy than sign yet more kids for the youth team.  Kids playing in the youth team will not keep Allardyce his job nor will it bring silverware that his boss and the fans are so desperate for.  Correct me if I am wrong but it seems to me that Newcastle Utd's policy been to sign young players for relatively vast sums of cash and then see them NEVER become great players or fulfil their potential. I suppose I'd put the likes of Jenas, Dyer or even Bramble in the category.  Proven experienced players win the day for me at the moment in time.

 

Bang on.  The average age of our squad has always been pretty low in recent years.  Experience and proven footballers at EPL level is what is needed, not expensive young flops that never come close to the rep they came with.  Bring in expensive youth slowly... not in one big go... it's easier to get 1 young lad adapting and easing in to the team than several.  We can't afford to keep them upset sitting on the bench and we can't afford to have more than a few on the pitch as they may not deliver.

[hakka]

I can't see any reason why players already playing in this Country would not want to play for us next season regardless of Europe.  Most players will see our club for what it is now, not what it has been for the last 4 years or so.  We are a club who will have 52,000 at every home league game next season and the atmosphere will be as good as it has been for many years.  Everything at our club is on the up and every player in the Country will know it.

 

I don't think we're a club who needs to make a trophy signing at this time, a trophy signing will not sell a single ticket as they'll all go anyway.  We need value for money, that goes for players who cost next to nothing as well as the big money signings, getting a player like Boumsong for nothing doesn't make him any better than the one we paid a fortune for, he'd still be s****.

 

A trophy signing might sell a few shirts but people like Owen will do that already.

 

We need a squad but we also need special players, we've got at least one and we need to add to that number.  If Ashley has £250 million to spend over 5 years then the bulk should be spent at the beginning because that's when we need the most players.  I can understand if this year is a year of caution because it doesn't matter what anybody says, Allardyce is unproven when it comes to spending large sums of money.  You can afford to get 20 players for nothing and see a large percentage dissapearing, you can't do that when you're spending £millions, we know that because we've been through it with Souness, no I'm not trying to say Allardyce is another Souness.

 

 

 

I'm shocked why you can't see why players don't feel going to a club that is in Europe is better than going to one that has a big ground.  We've been a shower of shite compared to how we were under Robson, who would you rather player for... a team that's at the level where they regularly play in Europe or one that's got 52,000 fans kicking their arse with screams and boo's because they playing shite and not they ain't reaching European football at the moment.  Having a big ground means fuck all, after all a flash 150,000 seater stadium in Division 2 hardly would dictate that players would come running from clubs around the world if we tried for them. Being in a winning side that isn't making headlines for the wrong reasons is.  Having 52,000 stadium and regular in Europe is different all together however... and with Sam we can make that a combo that DOES attract the big players.  Just need to get there again first.

[Guest Guinness]

I won't believe this mooted £50m until I actually see it being spent. The cynic in me says that information like this along with other stuff such as the "5 year plan" could have been released explicitly to gain the fans support of the takeover and encourage people to sell shares. I've got my hopes up so many times in the past only to be shot down. It's horrible but whenever I read something positive like this I always have to look for negatives . However the one thing I can look at in a positive light is that Ashley won't get anything out of this club unless he invests.

[hakka]

Also, the more we bang on "hey were rich! hey were gonna spend £50million" the more clubs will think to fleece us the second they hear were interested.  It happened to Chelsea, and if we officially announce were going to spend £50 million, even if we don't need to, were just spending it cause it looks good, then were just asking for clubs to sell us shite for a few million more.

 

Keep quiet, sign the players who can do a job and spend big when there is less risk and better chance of value for money at higher prices.

 

Darren Bent at £17million anyone? fucking bollocks.  West Ham agreed to pay it, MUGS!

[Thespence]

Also, the more we bang on "hey were rich! hey were gonna spend £50million" the more clubs will think to fleece us the second they hear were interested.

 

We have been rich for a while now & we have got fleeced a stacks of times because we are big spenders.

[hakka]

Also, the more we bang on "hey were rich! hey were gonna spend £50million" the more clubs will think to fleece us the second they hear were interested.

 

We have been rich for a while now & we have got fleeced a stacks of times because we are big spenders.

 

Well it will only get worse if we are shouting were are even richer now.  Time to stop the habbit, and use our brains when purchasing. 

[Optimistic Nut]

Also, the more we bang on "hey were rich! hey were gonna spend £50million" the more clubs will think to fleece us the second they hear were interested.

 

We have been rich for a while now & we have got fleeced a stacks of times because we are big spenders.

 

Do you think it'll be different if we went, "Shhh man, we're skint. Only got £5m to spend". I think the takeover has given it away that we'll be spending money like.

[hakka]

Also, the more we bang on "hey were rich! hey were gonna spend £50million" the more clubs will think to fleece us the second they hear were interested.

 

We have been rich for a while now & we have got fleeced a stacks of times because we are big spenders.

 

Do you think it'll be different if we went, "Shhh man, we're skint. Only got £5m to spend". I think the takeover has given it away that we'll be spending money like.

 

your missing the point.  This club shouldn't spend £50 million on players at this time, it would probs do more damage as its no garauntee to make any difference on us getting 6th.  Without European football to offer your most likely not being able to attract the right type of expensive player for Newcastle.  You will get over-priced one season wonders from smaller clubs who may or may not do it again.  Truth is we don't need to spend £50 million, so why harp on about having it.  If we spent £50 million for the sake and thrill to spend "£50million" then we are complete dickheads and not spending money cause we need to, but because we think we have to, despite the clubs circumstances and managers requirements.  We've already bought and sold and received compensation so that we've made money and brought good players in.  If Allerdyce pulls a few more cheap ones out for better quality players you suddenly have nothing to spend £50 million on, other than over price shite that will just increase wage bill and force a rotation system of expensive players.  Forget the amount, focus on what is right for Newcastle and wait to see who we buy.  If we don't spend £50 million, people will moan as they have now read it in a paper and think it will happen.  All I care about is finishing 6th as cheaply as possible.  We have good players, but we don't need another £50 million pounds worth if its the type of player who signs for clubs who outside of Europe.

 

 

 

 

[madras]

Also, the more we bang on "hey were rich! hey were gonna spend £50million" the more clubs will think to fleece us the second they hear were interested.

 

We have been rich for a while now & we have got fleeced a stacks of times because we are big spenders.

 

Do you think it'll be different if we went, "Shhh man, we're skint. Only got £5m to spend". I think the takeover has given it away that we'll be spending money like.

 

your missing the point.  This club shouldn't spend £50 million on players at this time, it would probs do more damage as its no garauntee to make any difference on us getting 6th.  Without European football to offer your most likely not being able to attract the right type of expensive player for Newcastle.  You will get over-priced one season wonders from smaller clubs who may or may not do it again.  Truth is we don't need to spend £50 million, so why harp on about having it.  If we spent £50 million for the sake and thrill to spend "£50million" then we are complete dickheads and not spending money cause we need to, but because we think we have to, despite the clubs circumstances and managers requirements.  We've already bought and sold and received compensation so that we've made money and brought good players in.  If Allerdyce pulls a few more cheap ones out for better quality players you suddenly have nothing to spend £50 million on, other than over price s**** that will just increase wage bill and force a rotation system of expensive players.  Forget the amount, focus on what is right for Newcastle and wait to see who we buy.  If we don't spend £50 million, people will moan as they have now read it in a paper and think it will happen.  All I care about is finishing 6th as cheaply as possible.  We have good players, but we don't need another £50 million pounds worth if its the type of player who signs for clubs who outside of Europe.

 

 

 

 

the manager needs to spend as much as he can get his hands on to get us as high up the league as possible.

[Optimistic Nut]

Yep.

[Slugsy]

I'd like us to stop paying mediocre amounts for mediocre defenders - you get what you pay for and its time we started buying decent full backs in particular and stop bargain basement hunting in the £1-2m bracket.  We won't get a decent defence till we buy a couple of quality full backs and at least one more decent centre back.  These players don't come cheap but if we are serious about improving the team then we need to focus on areas where historically we have been inept or just plain tight at addressing.

 

Big money will not always get you a top defender. A good manager can identify a quality defender though even if he isn't a big name.

 

True but there are also top players out there who would cost money and historically we have bought cheap fullbacks who have been nothing short of mediocre.  Unless you get them on a bosman or in their last year of a contract, good full backs and centre backs tend not to be cheap, as with any player. 

 

I would love us to do an Arsenal and find obscure young players who turn out to be class - hopefully that will be the case but all I meant was apart from Woodgate and Boumsong, since Keegan, we never spend any serious cash on defenders and most of the time you get what you pay for.

[Slugsy]

I'd like us to stop paying mediocre amounts for mediocre defenders - you get what you pay for and its time we started buying decent full backs in particular and stop bargain basement hunting in the £1-2m bracket.  We won't get a decent defence till we buy a couple of quality full backs and at least one more decent centre back.  These players don't come cheap but if we are serious about improving the team then we need to focus on areas where historically we have been inept or just plain tight at addressing.

 

Instead buy a £8m defender like Boumsong

 

The only other time we have spent that sort of money in the last 10 years was Woodgate and he was the best defender I have ever seen in a black and white shirt.

 

We spend £1.5m on Stephen Carr - sh*t

 

We spend £1m on Babyaro - sh*t

 

I'm not saying the money hasn't got to be spent wisely, it shouldn't be wasted and if Allardyce can find obscure players from nowhere then great or proven top players on free transfers - brilliant - but historically we tend not to spend a lot on our defence on real top - proven defenders  - instead we go out and spend shed loads on cr*p left wingers and I think that has contributed to our woeful defence.