Nate

It's not about what Smith has done individually so far, it's about playing the best partnership. I just think the game against Birmingham, similar to that against Arsenal at home, is one where we are going to need to fight for every single 50/50 and close them down all over the pitch. With Owen and Martins up front i can see Birmingham dominating possession because their defence will not be put under any pressure on the ball. We need one forward to chase the lost causes, to drop into the midfield to defend or indeed to link up play. Our central midfield is currently far too weak to support any other kind of strike force, especially in this type of away game. I do not think Smith is good enough in the long term, so i'm not painting him as somebody who can do all of these things consistently well, but at the moment he is the closest we've got.

We all know that he's been a horrendous signing and we all know that he's nowhere near good enough in the long term... but, in our five remaining away fixtures, Martins and Smith would be my first choice partnership. In Owen and Viduka we have two gifted players, undoubtedly the two most talented strikers at the club, but on the road they simply do not offer enough to the general play of a struggling side, and when the former is not even taking the chances given to him, he offers virtually nothing. I also think it would be comical to give Carroll his first Premier League start in a relegation '6-pointer', away from home, and expect him to make any kind of impact. For all of his faults (notably appearing to have lost all of his striking instincts ), Smith does bring certain qualities to the team. As i said in the match thread, he will defend from the front, he will make opposing defenders work and the fact that he constantly gets involved in the game means he offers more ball retention than any of the alternatives. I could see any other combination of our strikers going missing for the 90 minutes against Birmingham and we cannot afford that at this stage.

Don't worry brummie, Villa will finish 5th. ...with Everton 4th, Liverpool winning the Champions League, and you still not getting into the UEFA Cup.

We were never in the bottom three at this stage of the season, though, or as close to it if i remember correctly. 5 points from relegation last year is also a bit of a red herring as we were safe very early on and only then hit an awful run of form which saw us plunge down the table. I know personally this is the most concerned i've been about us actually going down in recent times, not that that is the core of the argument. Aye, we only won one of our last 11 games last year. But your season is 38 games innit. I reckon we've had our nighmare run over the last 12 or so games. Hopefully. The reason i've grown more pessimistic of late is Reading's form. It means our home games against them, Fulham and Sunderland have really become must win and at the moment i don't have any faith in this sorry group of players to perform under that kind of pressure.

We were never in the bottom three at this stage of the season, though, or as close to it if i remember correctly. 5 points from relegation last year is also a bit of a red herring as we were safe very early on and only then hit an awful run of form which saw us plunge down the table. I know personally this is the most concerned i've been about us actually going down in recent times, not that that is the core of the argument.

Just because our predicament has followed a board change, it doesn't mean our predicament is due to a board change. We've still got every chance of getting more points than we did last year and finishing above where we did last year, I think we will, but we'll see. We're still only one place lower than we finished last year for fucks sake, it's not like there's been a drastic drop in quality since the club changed hands. I appreciate all of that, but i think his point still stands. The very reason relegation seems so unthinkable to a large proportion of our fans is due to the success we had under the previous board, under the man who almost everybody wanted rid of. The fact that the closest we've come to it for some time has coincided with the change in ownership, wether as a direct result of it or not, only strengthens his position. Unfortunately NE5 has become something of a parody of himself, perhaps people would be more receptive to his views if he wasn't.

You can see where NE5 is coming from, to be fair. Over the two and a half years i've been reading this forum the majority of threads have had the same theme: people slating the old board and desperately wanting Shepherd out, and NE5 opposing them. Then, this summer, everybody got what they wanted and yet we're currently on the brink of relegation as a direct result of decisions taken by the new owner. You can hardly expect him to sit there and be quiet now. To compound things, people are talking about not renewing, how awful the situation is, being past caring etc. when NE5 has had first hand experience of far more difficult times than one relegation, one season in the second tier. The great irony of course being that it would seem unthinkable to be out of the top flight for any longer than that, due to the work Shepherd and the Halls did here.

Butt, then? I think any two of Emre, Geremi, Lua Lua and Milner would get overrun in the middle.

Harper Beye Caçapa Faye Diatta LuaLua Geremi Barton N'Zogbia Martins Smith Birmingham do not play with a great deal of width so i'd go with a very compact back four. I like Enrique but at this stage we can't be relying on a youngster who he is low on confidence and still adjusting to English football. I know there's a contradiction there in selecting Diatta, but he is experienced and there's the added bonus that he's played with Beye, Faye and Caçapa before. Geremi did reasonably well at Anfield. He at least looked like a central midfielder and tried to pass the ball. I would however be hesitant about partnering him with Emre away from home, if Emre is even available. So whilst Barton may be in poor form, he won't hide away in this game and still offers some steel. Milner is giving us nothing at the moment and we know Lua Lua has a bit of pace about him. It would be a gamble, but Kazenga has looked confident in his short cameos to date and we're crying out for a player to pick the ball up and run with it. If N'Zogbia is not having a good game we become frighteningly static. Smith obviously won't be a popular choice, but who else do you start now? Owen has been absolutely nonexistent in recent games and has not even taken his chances when they have come. I still rate him to an extent but he does not bring enough to a struggling side. Viduka? There's a question mark over his fitness too and i would be worried about his attitude in a potentially cold, wet and windy Monday night away game. Carroll? Perhaps from the substitutes' bench but it would be a big ask for him to make any kind of impact on an experienced Premier League defence from the start. We all know how bad Smith has been but we need someone up there who will make their defence work, defend from the front and give us some kind of ball retention. Any other combination i could see completely disappearing for 90 minutes and we simply can't afford that.

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Does anybody honestly think we would be 3 points from the relegation zone, having conceded 23 goals in 8 games, if Sam had stayed and been backed in January? If we do get relegated, it will be as a direct result of Mike Ashley's decision to change managers in the middle of the transfer window and nothing else.

We've conceded 23 of those since he left, tbf.

Surely at 1-0 down you bring on Martins and switch Duff to the right wing? Ed: Game over. Could be an embarrassing scoreline.

Bolton now lead Sporting Lisbon at the Reebok. Fiorentina 0-0 Everton at half time, they need Johnson's pace.

The only reason we could sign him is because he's a free agent so who is on loan from? Oh yeah. That is what they said, though.

Sky Sports News now reporting he has joined on loan...

Arsenal versus Barcelona would have to be the dream final. With Thierry losing again.

Porto V Schalke going to Extra Time. Anyone see Lopez's goal?

Torres, Babel, Gerrard and Mascherano have all started tonight. I doubt Rafa will play them three times in seven days.

Has Phil Neville been excellent for Everton? 1878 described him as 'one of the worst midfielders I've ever seen in my life' a few months ago.

'Good to see Ashley Cole scoring again.'

Does Pearce coach it in to the U21s to beat their man a minimum of three times? Walcott should have scored himself there.

Pretty much. Lose to Blackburn and those three games literally become must win and at the moment i don't have faith in this group of players to perform under that kind of pressure. I pointed out a couple of weeks ago that all the clubs around us have been mentally prepared for a relegation fight from day one and are now scrapping for everything; whereas we have a squad with no confidence whatsoever, who have suddenly found themselves right in the thick of it and are currently playing the worst football of the lot. If Reading or Fulham put a string of results together i'd say we are in a lot of trouble. ^ ...Reading's win has left me feeling quite ill. They also have Man City, Birmingham and Blackburn at the Madjeski this month.

Ignoring everything else that is wrong with this thread: why would Moyes want to leave a club which most neutrals would regard bigger than our own, where he has gradually built a side capable of regularly qualifying for Europe, to come here and start all over again?

If Smith plays in midfield he's in a more influential position where he offers even less.