mrmojorisin75

where'd you get those black and white glasses pal? specsavers? i need a new pair 'cause mine are f*cked....i can barely see the top half of the table these days, top four is a dim and distant blur

the whole thing has the classic hallmarks of the manager having lost the players and dressing room they'll say they're all behind him but continue to perform like sh!te week in week out when a new manager eventually comes in the same players will play with unbeforeseen belief, verve and confidence 'cause they'll be playing for their big contracts at SJP we've seen the same sh!t ever since keegan left and i don't think the cycle will change until we have a TOTAL clearout of the players, backroom staff and probably boardroom that seem to permit this to go on unabated

surely if there was someone lined up it would be better to get them in, give them a few competitive games in charge with which to assess the players before butchering the squad, which is what needs to happen problem is that would assume that the board have bothered identifying potential replacements - i wouldn't be for another knee-jerk sacking and signing again obviously

I was just highlighting the difference between Farrington who has laid the blame on all involved while Oliver never has a bad word for the person who sat next to him during talk-ins. oops, jumped on me high horse a bit quick there then!!

no, i'm not saying the manager is blameless but nor are the players if someone is so totally out of his depth and is getting tortured on the pitch then it's up to the players to get involved if the manager can't see it, or won't do anything about it - do you think shearer would have sat in the dressing room saying "yes boss" if he'd had to watch a bairn out of position get murdered and see nothing done about it? would he f@ck they're all culpable but the idea that some of the blame should be taken away from the players enrages me my point about the board is that it's an argument for another time and place - everyone on here tries to turn everything into pro or anti board arguments when there's no need....the group of players, on paper, were good enough to win the tie on thursday, that they didn't comes down to the players AND manager

At least he's put some of the blame away from the players, unlike the prick who reports for the Chronicle. why would you want to take any of the blame away from the players? fact of the matter is that the players blew it even though they had the knowledge that they could better alkmaar from the first leg - never mind all this manager/tactics sh!t...if it was all down to that, and roeder told them to do exactly what they did, then they should be ashmed of themselves that they couldn't take the game by the scruff of the neck and ignore the managers tactics and win the game blame the manager all you want but they players we had out had enough experience beyween them to win regardless of whatever tactics they were given - furthermore they were sh!te til half time so if it was all tactics then they should have told the manager at half time to change it or we'd lose the idea that our players are empty vessels with no autonomy is fucken tragic - the players are at least as much to blame as the manager, arguably more as they're better paid and there are more of them and any board related arguments don't come into it, it was a problem on the pitch this time not in boardroom

soundbite journalism - sounds like it was written by a 14 year old journalism student

fact of the matter is the season hasn't been a disaster - it's been (and still is) a morale sapping limp through a season strewn with the usual indignities and humiliaitons, but the only way it could ever be considered a disaster is if we're relegated, which we won't be the fact shepherd starts every season with some pitifully unrealistic target for his perpetually imbalanced and weak squad to achieve and which he then has to backtrack from is neither here nor there, if you believe him then i pity you; nor will it be any different next year when freddy points out he's expecting "top four" in august...."a cup run" in september...."top six" in november...."european qualification (of ambiguous nature)" in december and finally "a good finish" come march we ARE in groundhog day, it's just funnier when bill murray is killing himself and taking the p!ss out of yokel americans

too true, he'd just offer us calamity wes brown, john o'pies and ole "no-knees" solksjaer in exchange and we'd bite his hands off thinking it was a good deal

i dont even like Ronaldinho that much, but I feel this comment should receive more mocking than it has so far. someone has listed ronaldinho's scoring in the league this season and it's good - i always saw/see him as the player making the goals more often than scoring them, hence i was surprised by how many he'd got this season so, smart arse, in the course of their club careers so far ronaldinho has scored at a rate of approx 2.5 games per goal vs rooneys 2.9....neither are what you'd consider "great" for a striker are they? but they both bring more to games than goals, which was the point you fucken balloon you can look at it 2 ways - ronaldinho has had much more time to rack up his total including arguably weaker leagues such as brazil and france.....the flipside being rooney has peaked and won't get any better (but has played in a tougher league for a shorter period, i'd argue) so ridicule me then, go on...in fact i've made such a total and utter c*nt of myself i think i might end it right now

i actually think it's all idle speculation too...i just don't see a "win" in it for shepherd any more.... i'm sure until the souness fiasco he thought all was well and that he was doing a good job and the fans and city loved him for it - once it started to turn nasty under souness and as it has treatened to do with roeder at times i that changed and i think he'll ship himself out in the not too distant future my rumours, if you will, of the game come from the national broadhseets and they all basically reported the same thing the last time we had some "shepherd out" stuff....that his wife was/is sick and he's starting to get sick of taking the flack for the halls (which he more or less came out and said himself) well if he's sick of taking the flack for the halls i find it very unlikely that he'll put himself in the position to be the sole target for fan disgruntlement in what would have to be a long term venture the other option is that he's thick-skinned enough yo believe he CAN turn the club around but just needs the hall monkey off his back, but i just don't see it....he'll sell but will guarantee himself a place within the club as a result and that'll suit him fine

he's a slightly better version of bramble - no positional sense and can ball watch...on the plus side seems to realise his own limitations and keeps it simple most of the time

one thing (i can't remember) being mentioned is the following: we have no full backs, none, at all, during the whole time roeder has been in charge we have shedloads of central defenders, got 'em coming out of our a&sehole... we have have lots of wide players and 2 players who can play defensive midfield why, on gods green earth, have we not played 3-5-2 or 5-3-2 whatever you want to call it? this isn't even complicated stuff and i'm a 4-4-2 man at heart but at the end of the day a good manager plays a system the players suit not the other way around think about it: ----------------taylor-bramble-edgar--------------- ------------------parker------butt-------------------- milner-----------------dyer---------------zog------- ------------sib----------------martins---------------- we have the options in the squad to cover injuries/suspensions in all/most of those positions and it would offer us more in every department, there's flexibility to change personnel within a basic formula until we can get some actual full backs then we need to go down this route and who knows, the natural width it would provide might mean the squad actually find the confidence to play football.....let's face it could it be worse than what we've seen with strict adherance to 4-4-2

titus bramble and the implication of any kind of intelligence should never be allowed in the same sentence there should be a law against it and against titus bramble perhaps?

the thing that gets missed about woodgateis that he wasn't the "talker" people think he was at newcastle in my opinion....he obviously did that but his reading of the game was so exemplary that he just saw off danger on behalf of his CB partner most of the time he was never part of a solid rock partenrship like bruce/pallister, adams/bould or something but he was playing at such a high level (when he did play) that it masked the problems we had with our other players....once he was gone we felt it all the more

if ayala couldn't make an impression on taylor et al in the 1-2 years he'd be there then at least we'd know they weren't good enough right now we're in limbo 'cause we've got a load of young lads who MIGHT be good enough but we'll never know 'cause they're forced to play with fucken comedians week in week out i made this point a while back - taylor didn't make basic, stupid mistakes when he first started playing in the team but time spent with bramble and so on has taught him bad habits....edgar will follow suit unless there is someone teaching him how to defend on the pitch

bollocks, we need a horrible, cynical b*stard (or three) to turn us from the last decades soft touches into the next decades feared back four sod mincing ball playing defenders, at least that lad ben haim everyone is harping on about is a bit of a hard case and doesn't take any sh!t

apology? for f#cks sake... i'd rather the set of f#ckwits we call players pissed off, hid away and kept their mouths shut for the next few weeks rather than issue platitudes, apologies and soundbites like the above 'cause we all know they don't give a flying f#ck other than they might have missed out on a win bonus the quieter these wankers are between now and the moment they are shuffled off out of the club to go and play for the mackems or wolves or some sh!te where they belong then the better we should have players who talk on the pitch - the fact we have had players that talk in the newspapers and get laughed off the pitch regularly says it all fucken apologies, i ask you....

we need an old head to come in organise and teach for a couple of seasons while we look around and pick someone who'll do for the future roberto ayala would be a good example; if anyone knows how defend in the way we need players to defend it's an argentinian....they live for cynicism and being horrible b*stards on the pitch and that's what we need to instill in the likes of taylor, huntington and edgar right now.... at their early age we need to instill in them the VALUES of defending; to die before you let the man beat you; to foul in the RIGHT areas, i.e. not right in front of the fucken goal; to cut out balls at the near post and mark strikers in the box.... if we can get these ideas drilled into their heads from someone with the experience of ayala we'll be right enough failing that go and sign 4 germans to make up a new back four; there's plenty of them and they all know how to defend...

the title was honest assessment of the squad - i'd take that to mean players that can stay at the club for say 4-5 years+ and be successful in improving our situation (albeit not immediately) coupled with the addition of new players, thus: Established and good enough - Given Harper Parker (needs better coaching and a defined role in the team, however) N'Zogbia Milner Taylor (again needs to be coached better and have a settled, experienced partner brought in) Martins Owen Ameobi (as back up, he's equally the equivalent of Mido at spurs for 4th choice for example) Unproven but look like they have enough potential and therefore should be kept - Edgar Huntington (obviously not at fullback any more though) Krul (the likes of Carroll, Lua Lua etc... can't be judged from a first team perspective right now but may end up being good enough who knows?) i don't include Butt/Solano/Sib maybe as i'd see them staying one more season each and being replaced naturally over the course of things...EVERYONE else i'd sell on the first day of the transfer window this year that is a BRUTALLY honest assessment of the squad

but there's no way out of the situation we're in - fans can sing shepherd out and roeder out all they want and get on message boards kicking off but at the end of the day the first guy runs the club and dictates the future of the second guy.... it's no use believing that making noise will push the board members to oust shepherd 'cause that won't happen 'til they stop getting dividends, the dividends become very small, or we're headed for relegation it's no use believing that shepherd will sack roedebot 'cause he won't for the simple fact Glenn will do what he says, never criticise shepherd, and again unless we're headed for relegation there's no catalyst for change at that level accepting mediocrity doesn't come into it anymore, accepting the reality of where our club is does You're wrong there - putting pressure on the Fat Man is the best way of getting shot of Roeder - Fatty will sacrifice anyone before he falls on his own sword. that's my point, no-one will have to fall on their sword unless we are headed for relegation which we probably won't be, due to the side having a few decent players in it who show up from time to time and (presumably) decide to ignore what they've been told to do in training and go out to actually win a football match roedebot deserves a boatload of stick for this result, no mistakes about that, but he'll be here next season and so will the fans - the continued presence of the latter ensures the continued presence of the former in my opinion...talk about your irony!!! You said it right there.... the only way to make FFS so something about it is if he sees empty seats. Its a difficult balance I know because we want to get behind and support the team but at some point we have to try and make a difference and the way to do it is with our feet. Dont re-new the seasons tickets and he will sharp take notice.... or at best it might get something done because while we have this tag of "Great Supporters" and the press saying "52,000 loyal fans every week" FFS is just sitting there laughing all the way to the bank. This has nothing to do with being fairweather fans. We have to use our power to make things happen yep....not suggesting we do it mind, it'd play into the hands of the media and rival fans if we stayed away - imagine the fucken mackems if we did that? hence my bleak outlook for the near future... our best hope is he eats one pie too many or chokes on a strippers edible g-string

hm firstly i disagree that numbers 2 & 3 are entirely controlled by the fans shepherd effectively has the local media in his pocket so they'll still continue to fill us full of his sh!te....and lets imagine, somehow, that all the NUFC supporters boycotted him and everything he said and stopped buying papers where he featured then you still face the problem of the rest of the world don't you? if i was a villa fan i wouldn't stop reading and listening to his tripe just 'cause the newcastle fans did, it would still make me laugh if you believe for a second that it would be possible in 2007 in england to do what you describe to make his life intolerable without being thrown in jail then i feel you're deluding yourself...money talks and bullsh!t walks.... your #1 is the ONLY thing that would affect anything 'cause it would hit both FS and the club in the pocket and it's the only one of the three things they'd not accept....and as we both agree #1 won't happen then i feel justified in my pessimistic outlook to be honest!!

totally agreed...not gumna happen though!!

but there's no way out of the situation we're in - fans can sing shepherd out and roeder out all they want and get on message boards kicking off but at the end of the day the first guy runs the club and dictates the future of the second guy.... it's no use believing that making noise will push the board members to oust shepherd 'cause that won't happen 'til they stop getting dividends, the dividends become very small, or we're headed for relegation it's no use believing that shepherd will sack roedebot 'cause he won't for the simple fact Glenn will do what he says, never criticise shepherd, and again unless we're headed for relegation there's no catalyst for change at that level accepting mediocrity doesn't come into it anymore, accepting the reality of where our club is does You're wrong there - putting pressure on the Fat Man is the best way of getting shot of Roeder - Fatty will sacrifice anyone before he falls on his own sword. that's my point, no-one will have to fall on their sword unless we are headed for relegation which we probably won't be, due to the side having a few decent players in it who show up from time to time and (presumably) decide to ignore what they've been told to do in training and go out to actually win a football match roedebot deserves a boatload of stick for this result, no mistakes about that, but he'll be here next season and so will the fans - the continued presence of the latter ensures the continued presence of the former in my opinion...talk about your irony!!!

but there's no way out of the situation we're in - fans can sing shepherd out and roeder out all they want and get on message boards kicking off but at the end of the day the first guy runs the club and dictates the future of the second guy.... it's no use believing that making noise will push the board members to oust shepherd 'cause that won't happen 'til they stop getting dividends, the dividends become very small, or we're headed for relegation it's no use believing that shepherd will sack roedebot 'cause he won't for the simple fact Glenn will do what he says, never criticise shepherd, and again unless we're headed for relegation there's no catalyst for change at that level accepting mediocrity doesn't come into it anymore, accepting the reality of where our club is does