manorpark

He should mature, hopefully, in less than 5 years. About three years I think, with concentrated (regular, but not every game) first team experience, over that time. Hopefully learning from the various (many!) top-class defenders that Sam and Ashley will bring in (hasn't started yet, but will start doing so soon . . . )

I do not think Owen or Martins will leave, whether we buy Alan Smith or not. The future here is so strong now - even they must know that!

Hehe, i`m f****** with your mind Yeah, it sort of "hurts my eyes" too!! I keep on trying to focus it, and of course, I can't . . Excellent.!

My guess small, about 5ft 5-7. Looked small imo, could totally be wrong. This being the case, if we do get him, massive IF i know as sounds like there's huge interest in him. I really hope we get Micha Richards as a RB to add height to our back four even though he'll cost quite a bit. I'm hoping our back 4 looks someting like this: RAMAGE NOBBY HUNTY EDGAR EDGAR/BABA RICHARDS TAYLOR ROZEHNAL DRENTHE shocking lack of cover in that defence. would need at least another cb and another left back as baba is likely on his way and edgar far from natural in that position. I'd like to add Campbell to that list ideally, but we are not bleedin Chelski though who can afford several top players for one position and could put a second XI out better than most teams first. Good for teams like us to have players who can do a decent job in more than one position as we can only put 5 on the bench. If we got a top quality LB in, do we really really need another straight away? Edgar, Baba and Duff can all cover if needs be. Edgar (although used usually as a CB) was awesome (MOM no less) against Man u in that position before Roeder unbelievably/stupidly decided to drop him. Duff was also very good (unusually) at LB when tried. If baba gets sold then yes get someone else in, i don't think he's quite as bad as some make out although admittedly a poor season. Will be interesting if Sam does keep him. A question : Where you say "Good for teams like us" etc - do you not think we are moving on from that "inferior" position? Or do you think a bloke called Ashley has just thrown £133M into the river Tyne, having suddenly realised he had bought a football club, but had no idea (no PLAN) as to what to do with it? Seriously, do you not think we have moved on at all?? Big sam has only just taken over ffs (we don't even know what if anything he has to spend), we can't be comparing ourselves to the Chelski's and man u's of this world just yet. A wee bit premature don't you think? Do i think we will move on ? - Yes i'm very optomistic that sam (given time) will do well for us and i'm hopefull Ashley will pump some money into our club. Have we moved on? - Well no we haven't YET, its way too early, a ball hasn't been kicked yet and Sam may be a complete disaster and we could be relegated. We do not KNOW anything. Is Sam Allardyce going to be a good manager at Newcastle United FC? We don't know. We do not know what money he will have to spend. We just do not know. Does Sam Allardyce need time? We don't know, probably, but we don't know. Prior to Ashley buying the club, that "probably" was a strong "definitely", but is it the same now (post-billionaire)? We don't know. Will Ashley "pump some money into our club"? We don't know. Will Sam Allerdyce be a complete disaster and we will be relegated? We don't know. Well, as with everything in life, until it has actually happened and we are looking back on it - we don't know (what will happen). OK then, should we always talk, act and think, as if nothing (here at this football club) has (already) changed? The answer this time is not "we don't know". The answer this time is NO - because of the indisputable fact that a billionaire has spent £133M on our club. We don't know this next bit (for "certain") but on-the-balance-of-probabilities, our billionaire owner will NOT want to just sit there and let the club 'carry on as before'. The pivotal change has already happened, and surely some of our thinking / hoping / planning, should reflect this more positively?? The 'new realism' of the world we now live in should (at least) reduce the amount of negative (sometimes seeming-frightened) thinking, that is still quite prevelant. The PAST (our club's immediate past) does NOT any longer forcibly dictate (either in fact or in style) the future of what is in many ways, a NEW club!!

My guess small, about 5ft 5-7. Looked small imo, could totally be wrong. This being the case, if we do get him, massive IF i know as sounds like there's huge interest in him. I really hope we get Micha Richards as a RB to add height to our back four even though he'll cost quite a bit. I'm hoping our back 4 looks someting like this: RAMAGE NOBBY HUNTY EDGAR EDGAR/BABA RICHARDS TAYLOR ROZEHNAL DRENTHE shocking lack of cover in that defence. would need at least another cb and another left back as baba is likely on his way and edgar far from natural in that position. I'd like to add Campbell to that list ideally, but we are not bleedin Chelski though who can afford several top players for one position and could put a second XI out better than most teams first. Good for teams like us to have players who can do a decent job in more than one position as we can only put 5 on the bench. If we got a top quality LB in, do we really really need another straight away? Edgar, Baba and Duff can all cover if needs be. Edgar (although used usually as a CB) was awesome (MOM no less) against Man u in that position before Roeder unbelievably/stupidly decided to drop him. Duff was also very good (unusually) at LB when tried. If baba gets sold then yes get someone else in, i don't think he's quite as bad as some make out although admittedly a poor season. Will be interesting if Sam does keep him. A question : Where you say "Good for teams like us" etc - do you not think we are moving on from that "inferior" position? Or do you think a bloke called Ashley has just thrown £133M into the river Tyne, having suddenly realised he had bought a football club, but had no idea (no PLAN) as to what to do with it? Seriously, do you not think we have moved on at all??

Exactly - we need about seven good quality defenders FIRST. Out of the 5 defensive positions (including goalkeeper) we need, ideally, two good players in each position. That equates to 10 players (if we are to be successful) and we currently have 3 (Given/Harper/Taylor). So defenders ONLY, please!

Can't really argue with any of that mate. One point I would make is that looking at the fixtures, up until mid-Novemeber every game we play is winnable. That suggests to me that if Sam can get a few decent defenders in, and Owen starts scoring we could be in a very decent position come January. Cannot see a billionaire businessman like Ashley, allowing his 'strategic review' to drag on very long. He will be as aware as we are of the need to strengthen the playing staff as soon as possible (ie, this summer) a fact that is VERY likely to be confirmed by part of his review that covers the playing staff, and he is most unlikely to in any way devalue his £133M investment by artificially and unnecessarily restricting his manager from doing what is required - ASAP. The review will cover all aspects of the workings of the club, not just the playing staff, and its objective will be to improve everything, not restrict it by itself, 'dragging it on' and preventing early implementation of some of its inevitable findings (re the playing staff). Ashley will also be as aware as we are, of the problems of trying to recruit in the short January (mid-season) window, and I am sure his business sense (and common sense) will lead him to try and avoid the January window as much as is possible. He now owns the club, so the review will (I'm sure, even if not 'announced' or picked up by the papers where WE get our information from) be well under way, already. He will be aiming to take the club private in mid-July (as already stated) and I am sure that he will have advised his manager of his level of funding to be available to him, prior to then, actually releasing the funds by mid-July, if not earlier. This guy has not purchased our club to pussyfoot around and/or 'do the wrong thing' - he has (I am certain) purchased Newcastle United FC to "get it right" and one way he can do that is by doing things at the right time. He will not regard 'doing things quickly' as "rushing things" - he has the (oft talked about) 'people' to do things speedily and accurately. He is here to win things with us, and to me that means he is not going to hang around in trying to achieve that. Agree with that - the 'review' will be all done/dusted by end of July in my opinion. How long will it take for any sound business person to see what the glaring problems have been at SJP..? I expect big changes in SOME areas of the Club's day-to-day running, and a much tougher approach to Agents etc. Cannot see a guy like Ashley taking much crap from some of these shysters , and we will probably end up with a new Chief executive who will have a very hands-on role at the club. Cannot see Shepherd being there long for a number of reasons, not least of which are his health problems and his diminishing power to influence major decisions at the Club. The only way I can see a major transfer spend in Jan is if we have managed to cling on to the top 4 teams and both manager & Owner feel there is a good chance of Champs League -otherwise it will be next close season before the big spend happens.. Agree mostly merlin, except I do see the possibility of the 'big spend' this close season, rather than next. The DEFENCE alone, requires it!!

Are you referring to Michael Owen? If so, I think an early contract extension (removal of 'the clause') might well be an idea for Ashley to try. Would that also mean a 'wage increase' for Owen also, though? (!!!)

I am hoping that the days of "make do and mend" are very nearly over!!

I cannot imagine Ashley/Allardyce "panic buying". Acting with appropriate speed (if and when 'speed' is required - as in THIS case with our defensive problems) is not the same thing. I expect Ashley/Allerdayce to get (at least) close to the seven, and to avoid January if they can. you're optimistic bonny lad, optimistic indeed 7 defenders of the required quality is gonna take some amount of doing & no little amount of cash but i hope you're right anyways the original point wasn't about defenders, come january like i said i think the problem is gonna be with attackers Optimistic, I suppose you are right!! But, as I have said on this board a few times recently, we should be adjusting (all of us) to the "New Realism" associated with this new club of ours. That of getting it RIGHT, as we have the business organisation and finance to do so. With regard to "attackers needed". As I say, I think we will all be a little bit surprised at how well the existing rest of the team performs, with a solid defence behind it - and with the "Sam factor" geeing them up and sorting them out!

Absolutely - January is to be avoided, if at all possible.

I cannot imagine Ashley/Allardyce "panic buying". Acting with appropriate speed (if and when 'speed' is required - as in THIS case with our defensive problems) is not the same thing. I expect Ashley/Allerdyce to get (at least) close to the seven, and to avoid January if they can.

Those you quote, do not demonstrate a very positive outcome to January purchases! Dabbling in the January window is to be avoided, if possible. Also, I would expect an Ashley-led Sam Allardyce to get as close to the seven we need, as is possible, as soon as possible. This club should (from right now onward) be operating at a different level of competence from previously.

Can't really argue with any of that mate. One point I would make is that looking at the fixtures, up until mid-Novemeber every game we play is winnable. That suggests to me that if Sam can get a few decent defenders in, and Owen starts scoring we could be in a very decent position come January. Cannot see a billionaire businessman like Ashley, allowing his 'strategic review' to drag on very long. He will be as aware as we are of the need to strengthen the playing staff as soon as possible (ie, this summer) a fact that is VERY likely to be confirmed by part of his review that covers the playing staff, and he is most unlikely to in any way devalue his £133M investment by artificially and unnecessarily restricting his manager from doing what is required - ASAP. The review will cover all aspects of the workings of the club, not just the playing staff, and its objective will be to improve everything, not restrict it by itself, 'dragging it on' and preventing early implementation of some of its inevitable findings (re the playing staff). Ashley will also be as aware as we are, of the problems of trying to recruit in the short January (mid-season) window, and I am sure his business sense (and common sense) will lead him to try and avoid the January window as much as is possible. He now owns the club, so the review will (I'm sure, even if not 'announced' or picked up by the papers where WE get our information from) be well under way, already. He will be aiming to take the club private in mid-July (as already stated) and I am sure that he will have advised his manager of his level of funding to be available to him, prior to then, actually releasing the funds by mid-July, if not earlier. This guy has not purchased our club to pussyfoot around and/or 'do the wrong thing' - he has (I am certain) purchased Newcastle United FC to "get it right" and one way he can do that is by doing things at the right time. He will not regard 'doing things quickly' as "rushing things" - he has the (oft talked about) 'people' to do things speedily and accurately. He is here to win things with us, and to me that means he is not going to hang around in trying to achieve that. i think you're right and i never said i think he'll restrict anything, but what i think we'll see is similar to villa after they were taken over last season fat sam will be given cash to overhaul the defence but don't forget we have a number of high profile, highly paid, supposedly talented players that we need our talented manager to try and get the best out of before we replace them - to do otherwise is contrary to your opinion of ashley as a man and a businessman so i'll reiterate, it's just my opinion, that i don't see massive overhauls to the squad in the summer except in defence...other positions (where we are numerically at least well covered) will be dealt with later down the line i feel - i mean we have 4 strikers, 2 wingers for each side, 3 cen mids and, ahem, dyer...i just can't see massive changes or replacements to that lot without fat sam having a go at making it work Yeah, the main thing is the defence. We need (as Sam himself has said) two good players for every position. This means that defensively (including the goalkeeping position) we should have 10 good (first-team quality, ideally 'better' than other teams have) players. How many do we already have? GOALKEEPER - 2 (Given/Harper) CENTRE BACK (A) - 1 (Taylor, so ONE needed) CENTRE BACK (B) - 0 (so TWO needed) RIGHT BACK - 0 (so TWO needed) LEFT BACK - 0 (so TWO needed) So - we NEED to acquire a total of SEVEN new, top quality, defenders (in my view). So, I can see, from todays date onward this close season - it is almost ONLY the defence that needs to be sorted. Ashley's money will be released soon, for that purpose I am sure. With a good defence, I think most of us will be quite surprised at how well our existing players (throughout the rest of the team) will then be able to perform. That would happen anyway (the natural benefits of a sound defence) but if you add in the "Sam factor" also (as you say, mr m75) then things could be really good. I think most of us agree that new defenders (this close season) are the key. I am certain that Ashley will also agree (and soon)!!

Can't really argue with any of that mate. One point I would make is that looking at the fixtures, up until mid-Novemeber every game we play is winnable. That suggests to me that if Sam can get a few decent defenders in, and Owen starts scoring we could be in a very decent position come January. Cannot see a billionaire businessman like Ashley, allowing his 'strategic review' to drag on very long. He will be as aware as we are of the need to strengthen the playing staff as soon as possible (ie, this summer) a fact that is VERY likely to be confirmed by part of his review that covers the playing staff, and he is most unlikely to in any way devalue his £133M investment by artificially and unnecessarily restricting his manager from doing what is required - ASAP. The review will cover all aspects of the workings of the club, not just the playing staff, and its objective will be to improve everything, not restrict it by itself, 'dragging it on' and preventing early implementation of some of its inevitable findings (re the playing staff). Ashley will also be as aware as we are, of the problems of trying to recruit in the short January (mid-season) window, and I am sure his business sense (and common sense) will lead him to try and avoid the January window as much as is possible. He now owns the club, so the review will (I'm sure, even if not 'announced' or picked up by the papers where WE get our information from) be well under way, already. He will be aiming to take the club private in mid-July (as already stated) and I am sure that he will have advised his manager of his level of funding to be available to him, prior to then, actually releasing the funds by mid-July, if not earlier. This guy has not purchased our club to pussyfoot around and/or 'do the wrong thing' - he has (I am certain) purchased Newcastle United FC to "get it right" and one way he can do that is by doing things at the right time. He will not regard 'doing things quickly' as "rushing things" - he has the (oft talked about) 'people' to do things speedily and accurately. He is here to win things with us, and to me that means he is not going to hang around in trying to achieve that.

You know, John Trewick was our "Record Buy" (£375,000 I think?) for many many years! He was sh*te!

Why don't you stop beating about the bush ('pussy-footing' around) and say what you mean!!! Certainly agree about the atmosphere at matches - dire.

The way some people talk, they must be either very young (ie - never knew what football coverage was like pre-Sky) or (simply) are not football fans. I remember my first introduction to Sky Super Sunday. I couldn't believe it! I was suddenly faced with a 'two hour' build-up to every match, followed by much better coverage of the actual match - then in-depth analysis afterward. The way I described it then (to others who did not have Sky) was - "every match is treated like the FA Cup Final!!!" In those days the only "really long" coverage you got on TV of a match, was on actual Cup Final day (the build up, analysis, live match, etc). How can any football fan not just "Love It" (as KK once said). And that (sort of thing) is another reason (among many) to like Sky Football . . . . . don't you think it has gone just a bit too far though? once sky started, to all intents and purposes, dictating the fixture lists for the season i think some control was lost and now there's likely no turning back plus the point has been made elsewhere about bias coverage, if man u and chel$ki were limited to one game between them per week and it'd make a huge difference i reckon It is not perfect. Neither the coverage itself (preference for some teams / over-hyping at times) or the impact of it (a knackered Fixture List / players mad wages) but it is just SO MUCH better than before. We, the supporter, are just so much better off than we would be without it. Not having it now, would be like turning off the light and not even having a candle to see by . . . in my opinion. oh aye, i'm in agreement with you - look at my earlier post a prime example to refer to is the champions league when they changed to 2 group stages;it was overkill and people lost interest so they soon changed it back what we need is a similar reeling in of the amount of coverage back to something like when it started, or at least something in between then and now I am a great believer in 'supply and demand' enabling things to find their right (sustainable) level. Again, that method (philosophy) is not perfect, but I think that Sky coverage of football will find its natural level.

The way some people talk, they must be either very young (ie - never knew what football coverage was like pre-Sky) or (simply) are not football fans. I remember my first introduction to Sky Super Sunday. I couldn't believe it! I was suddenly faced with a 'two hour' build-up to every match, followed by much better coverage of the actual match - then in-depth analysis afterward. The way I described it then (to others who did not have Sky) was - "every match is treated like the FA Cup Final!!!" In those days the only "really long" coverage you got on TV of a match, was on actual Cup Final day (the build up, analysis, live match, etc). How can any football fan not just "Love It" (as KK once said). And that (sort of thing) is another reason (among many) to like Sky Football . . . . . don't you think it has gone just a bit too far though? once sky started, to all intents and purposes, dictating the fixture lists for the season i think some control was lost and now there's likely no turning back plus the point has been made elsewhere about bias coverage, if man u and chel$ki were limited to one game between them per week and it'd make a huge difference i reckon It is not perfect. Neither the coverage itself (preference for some teams / over-hyping at times) or the impact of it (a knackered Fixture List / players mad wages) but it is just SO MUCH better than before. We, the supporter, are just so much better off than we would be without it. Not having it now, would be like turning off the light and not even having a candle to see by . . . in my opinion.

The way some people talk, they must be either very young (ie - never knew what football coverage was like pre-Sky) or (simply) are not football fans. I remember my first introduction to Sky Super Sunday. I couldn't believe it! I was suddenly faced with a 'two hour' build-up to every match, followed by much better coverage of the actual match - then in-depth analysis afterward. The way I described it then (to others who did not have Sky) was - "every match is treated like the FA Cup Final!!!" In those days the only "really long" coverage you got on TV of a match, was on actual Cup Final day (the build up, analysis, live match, etc). How can any football fan not just "Love It" (as KK once said). And that (sort of thing) is another reason (among many) to like Sky Football . . . . .

EDIT - Duplicate Post, sorry.

Michael Owen, perhaps? Alan Shearer made a good captain, leading from the front, so why not Owen?

"Top 8" eh? WOW! Not long ago our usual objective was "Top 6" Not long before that it was "Champions League Qualification" (ie - Top 4) Not long before that (as recently as under SBR) the expectation was "challenging for the title". AMAZING. Now, at this very moment that our aready rich club has been purchased by an ambitious English Billionaire and we have acquired the services of someone regarded as "the best English Manager" of his time - people STILL keep downgrading our ambitions. Down and down and down. Amazing. When will reality bite?? Previous ambitions were based on our previous squads. Right now we're threadbare with a locker room full of players who don't want to be here. We're a different squad. I think you underestimate the damage done by previous bad management. Reality has bitten, just waiting for it to bite you. I appreciate and understand the points you (and others) are making on this - but I think that some of us may be finding it hard (impossible even) to adjust to the 'new reality' at our club.

"Top 8" eh? WOW! Not long ago our usual objective was "Top 6" Not long before that it was "Champions League Qualification" (ie - Top 4) Not long before that (as recently as under SBR) the expectation was "challenging for the title". AMAZING. Now, at this very moment that our aready rich club has been purchased by an ambitious English Billionaire and we have acquired the services of someone regarded as "the best English Manager" of his time - people STILL keep downgrading our ambitions. Down and down and down. Amazing. When will reality bite??

:lol: Even since Ambramovich took over they're not anywhere close to being the biggest club in the world, and they never will be. Chelsea may (however) now be the biggest JOKE (formerly a football club) in the world. They become bankrupt EVERY year, by millions and millions of pounds, until someone gives them a cheque. One year (soon) that cheque will not appear . . . could almost have happened this year, the signs are there . . then they will simply disappear. The things some footballers say (or are quoted as saying) are 'amazing' at times - NOBODY could believe what he has just said, so why say it!! "Embarrassing".