Shays Given Tim Flowers

I was actually disappointed with the Anzhi team, have they been over-hyped? (apparent 2nd favourites to win it!) Or was it just a measure of how we played/controlled the game?

 

Going off the game, we should beat these at home really - and I'm confident we will.

Because they were drawn against us

Feel for him a bit. Was playing well in the team. Got dropped. Must be hard to get into a rhythm. Needs to do better. 

Sir Les  bigging up Campbell 

We're and ITV4 club, and thats ok.

I love this club.

I saw him against Cardiff in pre-season (where he looked like our best player during a 10 min cameo), he's a clever footballer and quick. Links well with players. In that game he looked like he was more suited to playing as a number 10. Kind of like a half off the shoulder half marveaux hybrid. If nothing else he will work hard.

judging by some comments on facebook and twitter, some Newcastle fans seem more excited by Man Utd vs. Real Madrid tonight than they probably are for our game on Thursday.

 

Grim, imo and thus a new pet hate.

 

Totally agree on that, know a lad who has agreed to do overtime 'for a free pizza' rather than watch us. He declined their offer on Tuesday though.

 

On a similar theme, few mackems were saying that we should all have got behind Man Utd as they were English. When asked about tonight they said 'f*** off' to supporting us

 

I never do this, I couldn't care less if Man Utd get knocked out of Europe. Or any other English club except Newcastle.

 

If anything i want them to lose, as most of the other clubs in England in Europe i've come to despise for various reasons.

My housemate (a Manchester United fan and former Season ticket holder) spoke to me about this last night. I said I wanted English teams to get knocked out because: their success means they just have more money and better players than the rest of the teams in their domestic league, the media constantly rams these teams down our throats and also coverage is so biased of English Teams in Europe that it is sickening to watch them.

Out between 3 and 7 weeks according to Pardew. Two broken bones in his back, gone back to Argentina.

Conspiracy time.

As much as I love Santon can anyone remember his god-awful throw in that bounced up and hit colo in the thigh that got him into the overhead kick mess in the first place. Dear me.

James Gandolfini would make an excellent Martin Jol.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/21691929

That's what I don't understand. We expect more from Shola than he can give and we abuse him when he doesn't live up to it. Yet, Cisse under performs when we know he can play so much better but it is ignored and at worst, blamed on other less talented players.

Its a point Ive made a couple of times myself. Not only Cisse - happened many times in the past many on here mock and sneer at Shola, but defend others not performing I can't understand it either. What is even more baffling is how those ranting at Shola rant all the louder when this is pointed out, as if you're "not supposed to mention this, just take it for granted that it's right"

 

To be fair on Cisse, I just don't think the lucks with him this season though. No lack of effort, certainly

 

Poor players get criticised for being poor, some fans are even intelligent enough to assess performance relative to the player.

 

No. Certain players get scapegoated, a  good example was when we beat QPR 1-0 and Shola produced, none of the others did. Within hours, he was getting mocked again while those who DIDN'T produce didn't get a bit of criticism. Most fans will just jump on the bandwagon

By some fans sure. Doesn't contradict what I said at all.

No it's about constructive criticism. Constantly berating weaker players is stupid. Especially when they're playing close to their peak. They often get criticised for the sake of scapegoating.

 

Others, deserve constructive criticism because they're not playing as well as they can. No point burying your head in the sand and pretending it's everyone elses fault. That doesn't benefit anyone.

 

We are happy with less from our better players than they can give in terms of quality but demand more from our weaker players than they can give.

Constructive criticism is equally stupid. The players won't ever hear it so how is it possibly constructive? People will praise the good and criticise the poor. Who is burying their head in the sand? Nothing we say on here benefits anyone except the people who post it and those who read it. If anything whinging about shit players is more constructive because it at least allows us to vent  .

Plenty think Cisse has been poor. People like him so maybe he gets an easy ride, doesn't matter.

Poor players get criticised for being poor, some fans are even intelligent enough to assess performance relative to the player.

That's what I don't understand. We expect more from Shola than he can give and we abuse him when he doesn't live up to it. Yet, Cisse under performs when we know he can play so much better but it is ignored and at worst, blamed on other less talented players.

 

So we shouldn't criticise Shola?

 

 

 

We should when necessary. Under-achievement is always worse than lack of skill/talent/ability though.

 

Why criticise someone so harshly when they're playing to their level, they're not good enough and need diminished squad roles or sold. But someone with ability under-performs and everyone else gets the blame and the player at hand rarely receives constructive criticism.

Because he's shit, he's been shit for ages, he isn't going to get any better and its inherently frustrating. Our criticism doesn't have to be constructive at all. Some of us might just want to whinge  . We all love Shola, but sometimes he is infuriating on the pitch for us.

Cisse has shown himself to be capable of producing for us at the highest level (albeit for half a season). Arguably there were numerous factors contributing to this. Over the past few pages plenty people have expressed his own form hasn't been good enough. People have also said that some of it is symptomatic to the way the team are playing and the chances created for him.

For me the biggest criticism I have is the fact he hasn't put the ball in the net when he has been presented with decent opportunities to do so. If he had done so this debate wouldn't even be occurring.

Pards needs to have an extra-marital affair or something just to move the discussion on a bit.

Didn't Bruce keep them up or am I mistaken?

 

Just checked - he got them to 11th.

Glenn Roeder's win percentage is less than 1% less than Sir Bobby's

Souness' win percentage is 8% higher than Pardew's.

Mick McCarthy has enjoyed more success as Manager of the Republic of Ireland than Giovanni Trappatoni.

Steve Coppell oversaw Reading win the Championship with 106 points (now director at Crawley Town).

Joe Kinnear was voted the Manager of the Year.

John Toshack won La Liga as a manager with Real Madrid.

This is one of the things that pisses me off more than anything. They have done jack shit for ages really and have been really badly run for a number of years (in a football sense).

You've lost me?

 

Not really directed at you, mate. More of a comment on those stating what we SHOULD be capable of with this squad. It's all opinions anyway.

Didn't think it was  I get what you're saying too. Re: Martinez, I think it is a big achievement to keep them up and I really don't think many managers could. That being said its all conjecture and its all if's and maybes. . I have asked the question in this thread whether people think Management is a Science or an Art. I certainly think there is a lot of luck involved at times. Its also very difficult to compare like for like.

Probably the only real yardstick is consistency. Whilst you can perhaps infer things from Pardew's past managerial experience he hasn't really been here long enough to say whether or not he is consistently good or consistently bad. It gets difficult to assess him objectively anyway as there will always be a combination of bias, the irrationality of emotion and forum rhetoric.

You've lost me?

 

Inochi Banter is Best Banter. You'll learn to admire it's subtle punch.

I think I got the theme of his post (kind of agree too) just didn't really see its relevance to what I said.

You've lost me?

Which managers out there (and would want to manage Newcastle) are you suggesting could do more with this team?

I have no idea which managers would want to manage Newcastle or not so anyone I suggest would be pointless

 

I think most managers with a track record of playing expressive attacking football would be a better choice though, preferably from the continent.

 

Pardew simply isn't amongst the top bracket of managers imo.

 

Really I only put that down to try and stop people being lazy and just naming the best managers currently in the game, who I can't imagine would jump at the chance to manage us.

 

Are people wanting someone like Sousa or Martinez?

 

Relegation survival expert, Roberto Martinez? Of course, of course.

Look at the calibre of player Wigan have had during his tenure as manager. The fact they have retained Premier League status for the 3 seasons he has been manager is borderline miraculous. That's before you factor in a lack of any decent investment or decent home support. His Swansea League One side were one of the best teams I can remember seeing (aesthetically).

I'm not saying I want him here, but the idea that some people do isn't at all ridiculous.

For me, the main issue is that in a 4-3-3, the central striker can't just hang around between the centre backs, waiting for chances to come his way. At that level, there needs to be more flexibility about the movement of the team as a whole. If the striker is static, he ends up isolated and the team looks predictable. It's like playing with 10 men. He also needs to be able to hold the ball up.

 

In fairness to Cisse, in recent weeks we have seen him occasionally move around deeper and wider to link with his team-mates. His work rate is fine. The trouble is, he's not very good at it. He has a poor first touch and the ball often bounces off him towards an opponent, or he mis-places a pass.

 

As for his finishing, we could discuss all day whether his conversion rate is better than this, that or the other striker, but it's apparent that last year he was on a good streak (as can happen) and what we see now is what we can expect.

 

Another weakness that he shows in his all round game is a lack of appetite for competing physically in the penalty area. He looks for gaps between defenders rather than make a challenge (esp at the near post). Obviously that's not always the right decision.

Good streak last year, poor one this time so now we can only expect poor? His debut game against Villa he dropped deep, brought players in with clever touches. He looks out of sorts at the moment and his touch has certainly been poor these last few games. However at times earlier in the season he was working diligently on a thankless task for the benefit of the team. His general play has been competent for most of the season I think. It does appear to be dipping of late.

The point you make about movement in your first paragraph is true, I think with Ben Arfa back he will be helped in this regard (fluidity of the attack). This should encourage him to take up better positions but again his positional play since January has been poor.

An unnamed consortium with unnamed members pledging to buy a club for 2-3 times it's stock market value despite loads of other similar clubs being available for much less that would require less/similar levels of investment.

 

Yeah right.

 

Not read the article too closely, but I don't see it as completely unreasonable at all. Who else could they buy that would require less investment? That just seems like a weird thing to say. Their ground is one of the biggest and best in the world, the location is fantastic, the team have qualified for every CL for years.

 

In fact, the more I think about it, the more bizarre your post sounds.

 

I have to say, though, that if this happened I would be very, very tempted to just walk away. What's the point?

Would you be in favour of forming a breakaway league with a salary cap and transfer spend cap? It's kind of a difficult question for you I guess because Spurs are just about there now in terms of being a 'big club', by which I mean richer than everyone else by virtue of playing the Champs league. I would certainly trade European football for a fairer, competitive league. Would almost be in favour of the smaller clubs telling the richer clubs to sod off.

As things stand football is getting pretty pointless, I think Qatar 2022 will probably be when football jumps the shark.

He's all we have got till the end of the season. Lets hope he hits some form soon.

Future's bright, present is balls. Felt we were good for a point.