Shadow Puppets

Mid 30s. And yes...I went to my first game in 92. Kids don’t care who owns the team...if it’s run well / badly. They care about the buzz you get from it. And the players. And dare I say they care about being with their dad / mum / friends making memories. When I took my 4 year old to the friendly last week he LOVED Saint Maximin because he kept running past people. And he loved his hair! ? That was his first up close experience with it. He’ll grow to love the roar of the crowd etc etc. And in the grand scheme of where we could be as a football club, it’s not “mediocre”, is it...it’s just normal for most PL teams? Sure, in comparison to where we were under Keegan and Bobby, but outside of those cumulative 7 years, much of our existence as a football club has been like this.

No different to Rafa against Big 6 sides Newcastle 5 v 1 Spurs/Poch Newcastle 3 v 0 Chelsea/Conte Newcastle 2 v 1 Man City/Guardiola Newcastle 2 v 1 Arsenal/Wenger Newcastle 1 v 0 Man Utd/Mourinho Even in his last home game against a Big 6 side(Liverpool) we had the most shots on target of any side that played them last season. If you think today was similar to that then wow. List all of the narrow defeats against the big teams as well, before I bother taking your post remotely seriously. You can’t just rewrite history to back up your point man. You know fine well there were many games against big teams under Rafa that we barely had a kick in. I obviously was talking about those games, ffs. Stop being so fucking defensive. Imagine thinking this wasn’t enough wins from a newly promoted side against the Big 6 who didn’t give the manager any financial backing Still the only team in the Premier League to beat Man City in 2019. You just saw what they did to West Ham. Ungrateful pal. Seriously, what the fuck are you banging on about? You’re arguing about something completely unrelated to what I posted about. How many fucking times do I have to say I loved Rafa and what he did for the club. All I said above was, performance wise, today’s performance was very similar to many performances under Rafa against big teams....the three 2-1 defeats to Spurs, Chelsea and Arsenal at the start of last season for a start. You are literally making up a topic to argue about. Just ignore him. He's got that post copied out in a Word document ready to reply to anyone who mentions any football manager. Thanks. I thought I was going crazy for a second.

I can’t argue with that. To each their own. For me, it’s far more important to build memories with my kids than to worry a great deal about my money funding Ashley’s NUFC. I’d be a crap father if I let something so trivial get in the way of my kids enjoyment. I’m all for protesting on your principles...I’ve been a regular participator in climate change and Brexit protests over the years for example...issues that actually really matter to the world. I guess I just don’t feel quite as strongly about Ashley’s ownership as some of you do. I’d prefer it if we competed and spent more, obviously. I don’t like Ashley’s ownership. But it’s football...it’s hardly life or death and I don’t think it’s worth ruining your hobby and enjoyment for. Force him out by other means, sure. But walking away seems to me like you’re punishing yourself for something that will never catch on. Steve Bruce, though. Steve Bruce. I mean, where's the line? It's not just 'his ownership', like that's merely strategic or perhaps political. What's happening is an absolute pisstake. I respect you continuing to fight your battle in here, where you're fighting against the tide, mind. I wish you saw things differently. I agree with you at heart. I know it’s a pisstake. An ultimately crap appointment, on paper. We only differ in as far as how much we’re willing to let it bother us in the long run.

Tell me how? First half we played fairly well...plenty of good spells with no end product. Second half we struggled to get out of our own half, but still managed one or two half chances. There was many a game under Rafa where we barely had an attempt, and you know there was. Stop trying to rewrite history. Some of those games were frustrating as fuck, just like today.

I hated Pardew. Never felt so strongly to feel “sick” about it though. Got more important things to worry about ?

No different to Rafa against Big 6 sides Newcastle 5 v 1 Spurs/Poch Newcastle 3 v 0 Chelsea/Conte Newcastle 2 v 1 Man City/Guardiola Newcastle 2 v 1 Arsenal/Wenger Newcastle 1 v 0 Man Utd/Mourinho Even in his last home game against a Big 6 side(Liverpool) we had the most shots on target of any side that played them last season. If you think today was similar to that then wow. List all of the narrow defeats against the big teams as well, before I bother taking your post remotely seriously. You can’t just rewrite history to back up your point man. You know fine well there were many games against big teams under Rafa that we barely had a kick in. I obviously was talking about those games, ffs. Stop being so fucking defensive. Imagine thinking this wasn’t enough wins from a newly promoted side against the Big 6 who didn’t give the manager any financial backing Still the only team in the Premier League to beat Man City in 2019. You just saw what they did to West Ham. Ungrateful pal. Seriously, what the fuck are you banging on about? You’re arguing about something completely unrelated to what I posted about. How many fucking times do I have to say I loved Rafa and what he did for the club. All I said above was, performance wise, today’s performance was very similar to many performances under Rafa against big teams....the three 2-1 defeats to Spurs, Chelsea and Arsenal at the start of last season for a start. You are literally making up a topic to argue about.

Great metaphor, but it’s quite obviously not the same thing...unless you leave the games feeling massively cheated or “poisoned”...I’m willing to guess most people don’t feel so strongly as that.

I can’t argue with that. To each their own. For me, it’s far more important to build memories with my kids than to worry a great deal about my money funding Ashley’s NUFC. I’d be a crap father if I let something so trivial get in the way of my kids enjoyment. I’m all for protesting on your principles...I’ve been a regular participator in climate change and Brexit protests over the years for example...issues that actually really matter to the world. I guess I just don’t feel quite as strongly about Ashley’s ownership as some of you do. I’d prefer it if we competed and spent more, obviously. I don’t like Ashley’s ownership. But it’s football...it’s hardly life or death and I don’t think it’s worth ruining your hobby and enjoyment for. Force him out by other means, sure. But walking away seems to me like you’re punishing yourself for something that will never catch on.

No different to Rafa against Big 6 sides Newcastle 5 v 1 Spurs/Poch Newcastle 3 v 0 Chelsea/Conte Newcastle 2 v 1 Man City/Guardiola Newcastle 2 v 1 Arsenal/Wenger Newcastle 1 v 0 Man Utd/Mourinho Even in his last home game against a Big 6 side(Liverpool) we had the most shots on target of any side that played them last season. If you think today was similar to that then wow. List all of the narrow defeats against the big teams as well, before I bother taking your post remotely seriously. You can’t just rewrite history to back up your point man. You know fine well there were many games against big teams under Rafa that we barely had a kick in. I obviously was talking about those games, ffs. Stop being so fucking defensive.

I don't mean this a dig at you (I really enjoy our discussions on this actually) but I've said this before, it's sometimes like people who still go the game think it's been easy for us to walk away, that we didn't really enjoy it in the first place, not like they did, the true fans. Let me tell you, fans far more devoted than you have walked away, look at Keith Barrett, organised travel to every Newcastle game across the continent for decades, now in exile, and I see others on his Facebook commenting the same. All those things you said you loved about going to the match, do you not think the rest of us used to feel like that? That feeling has been completely taken away from us by Mike Ashley. We miss it and we're desperate to get it back. But it won't ever come back while people fill his pockets and give him no reason to go away and leave us alone. A full stadium is a ringing endorsement that he's keeping people happy. That is why we get so frustrated with those doing everything they can to keep him here. I completely understand all of that man. And sympathise. But I guess it’s all personal. I keep using the expression, but I’ve been reminded recently of just how short and unknown life is, so for me something which is “relatively” trivial in the grand scheme of things (ie the way a football club is run) is not worth treating quite so drastically as some people on here do. I admire people who have given up everything for the cause...I just think they’re going about it the wrong way. I genuinely don’t think it’ll work. I genuinely think they’re wasting their time, in the current climate, and they may as well just go if they want to. As you know...I’ve been involved in protests in the past...particularly in the promotion of them. The only time I ever felt we were making progress was when we stopped Sports Direct tweeting, which led to a clear PR push from Ashley.

There was no booing man. Where the hell did you hear that? There was the usual mooted applause, slight grumble, like you’d get at any narrow defeat. I agree with you about the lack of volume from our fans in terms of raising them...but isn’t that a problem with pretty much every PL club. I’ve been to plenty of away games where the away fans are the only ones to be heard. I think you’re describing a culture of “entertain me”, rather than it specifically being a problem with our fans. I'm not, I'm just asking in relation to our fans, many of claim they are going almost out of some sort of self sacrifice, "I need to be there to support the players!" No you want to go and watch the match, don't pretend otherwise. It's all me me me, I don't want to give up MY day out. Again, that's fine but don't lie about it. The players in reality couldn't give much of a shit whether you're there or not. Mike Ashley is the owner and Steve Bruce is the manager, I think they've got bigger problems than whether or not Alf from Westerhope goes and grumbles to himself. Oh yeah...I agree with that then. I don’t think I’ve ever really hid the reasons I go to the match. I enjoy it, win or lose. I still get that same buzz I got when I was 8 going to my first game when I walk out and see the pitch. The hairs on the back of my neck still stand up when local hero plays. I still go crazy and hug the person next to me when we score. It’s a massive part of my upbringing, and I want to take my son and daughter moving forward to share the same experiences my dad shared with me. Sure, I guess that’s selfish in your eyes. And I’m fine with that. I would argue that it’s selfish of you to tell me I shouldn’t be doing it, especially when 95% of the stadium have absolutely no intention of walking away. As I’ve said so many times on here before, life is too short and too important to miss potentially cherished memories just because I’m angry at how the club I love is run. I maintain that the only way Ashley will ever leave is on his own terms or if he’s pressured into it from the shareholders of Sports Direct. 5k, 10k, 15k empty seats every now and again...he simply won’t give a shit. Anyway, I feel like a broken record. I guess one of the saddest things about all this is that people feel the need to justify their decisions online to other fans. At the end of the day, do what you see fit. There’s no right answer, just opinions. You didn't answer me earlier, do you not think he might think "is this worth it?" if we were in the Championship and the gates were 20k and the club was haemorrhaging money? I think more than 5% of the stadium have already gone btw, they've just had their seats filled by many people who don't give as much of a shit imo. Yeah, perhaps if we were in the Championship for several seasons and the gates were low for a prolonged time. But like it or not the attendances won’t drop significantly for as long as we’re in the PL. That’s all that matters to most fans...to go and watch some top tier football on a weekend.

There was no booing man. Where the hell did you hear that? There was the usual mooted applause, slight grumble, like you’d get at any narrow defeat. I agree with you about the lack of volume from our fans in terms of raising them...but isn’t that a problem with pretty much every PL club. I’ve been to plenty of away games where the away fans are the only ones to be heard. I think you’re describing a culture of “entertain me”, rather than it specifically being a problem with our fans. I'm not, I'm just asking in relation to our fans, many of claim they are going almost out of some sort of self sacrifice, "I need to be there to support the players!" No you want to go and watch the match, don't pretend otherwise. It's all me me me, I don't want to give up MY day out. Again, that's fine but don't lie about it. The players in reality couldn't give much of a shit whether you're there or not. Mike Ashley is the owner and Steve Bruce is the manager, I think they've got bigger problems than whether or not Alf from Westerhope goes and grumbles to himself. Oh yeah...I agree with that then. I don’t think I’ve ever really hid the reasons I go to the match. I enjoy it, win or lose. I still get that same buzz I got when I was 8 going to my first game when I walk out and see the pitch. The hairs on the back of my neck still stand up when local hero plays. I still go crazy and hug the person next to me when we score. It’s a massive part of my upbringing, and I want to take my son and daughter moving forward to share the same experiences my dad shared with me. Sure, I guess that’s selfish in your eyes. And I’m fine with that. I would argue that it’s selfish of you to tell me I shouldn’t be doing it, especially when 95% of the stadium have absolutely no intention of walking away. As I’ve said so many times on here before, life is too short and too important to miss potentially cherished memories just because I’m angry at how the club I love is run. I maintain that the only way Ashley will ever leave is on his own terms or if he’s pressured into it from the shareholders of Sports Direct. 5k, 10k, 15k empty seats every now and again...he simply won’t give a shit. Anyway, I feel like a broken record. I guess one of the saddest things about all this is that people feel the need to justify their decisions online to other fans. At the end of the day, do what you see fit. There’s no right answer, just opinions.

There was no booing man. Where the hell did you hear that? There was the usual mooted applause, slight grumble, like you’d get at any narrow defeat. I agree with you about the lack of volume from our fans in terms of raising them...but isn’t that a problem with pretty much every PL club. I’ve been to plenty of away games where the away fans are the only ones to be heard. I think you’re describing a culture of “entertain me”, rather than it specifically being a problem with our fans.

Was it hell...my mate sent me loads of photos during the game. East Stand and Gallowgate were basically completely full. Leaves had that large pocket of about 1000 empty seats. Milburn Stand was full apart from the usual empty seats at the top of the platinum club. Level 7 looked basically full apart from pockets missing in the corner. bless, you’re in seventh heaven. No I’m not. I stayed away, just like everyone wants everyone to. But as predicted, staying away is a waste of fucking time. Honestly, it really is. There’s no desire at all for it on a large scale, and definitely not sustained. Today was the one opportunity people had to send a message and they didn’t. Because they wanted to go and support the team. That’s just not ever going to change while we’re in the premier league. I’ve said it a million times (but of course get labelled a WUM because my opinion varies to whatever is popular on here), but the only way Ashley will sell NUFC is if it becomes an inconvenience to him. Target the crap out of his businesses. Stop them from tweeting, Facebooking, sour their name even further. Picket the shops weekly. Ashley is under pressure from his shareholders, particularly at the moment. If they show concern that his running of NUFC is negatively affecting Sport Direct, he’ll be a lot more inclined to get out. Why didn't they bother then? Didn’t they? Sounded pretty loud first half. Flat, like the team, second.

Was it hell...my mate sent me loads of photos during the game. East Stand and Gallowgate were basically completely full. Leaves had that large pocket of about 1000 empty seats. Milburn Stand was full apart from the usual empty seats at the top of the platinum club. Level 7 looked basically full apart from pockets missing in the corner. bless, you’re in seventh heaven. No I’m not. I stayed away, just like everyone wants everyone to. But as predicted, staying away is a waste of fucking time. Honestly, it really is. There’s no desire at all for it on a large scale, and definitely not sustained. Today was the one opportunity people had to send a message and they didn’t. Because they wanted to go and support the team. That’s just not ever going to change while we’re in the premier league. I’ve said it a million times (but of course get labelled a WUM because my opinion varies to whatever is popular on here), but the only way Ashley will sell NUFC is if it becomes an inconvenience to him. Target the crap out of his businesses. Stop them from tweeting, Facebooking, sour their name even further. Picket the shops weekly. Ashley is under pressure from his shareholders, particularly at the moment. If they show concern that his running of NUFC is negatively affecting Sport Direct, he’ll be a lot more inclined to get out.

Was it hell...my mate sent me loads of photos during the game. East Stand and Gallowgate were basically completely full. Leaves had that large pocket of about 1000 empty seats. Milburn Stand was full apart from the usual empty seats at the top of the platinum club. Level 7 looked basically full apart from pockets missing in the corner.

First half we looked decent. Gave as good as we got. Nullified pretty much everything they had to offer. Looked pretty dangerous at times. But alas, didn’t score. Second half was just shit. Bruce’s substitutions played a huge part in that, but also an absolutely infuriating lack of ability from some players in not being able to play a simple pass. All in all I don’t think the performance was much different at all to various performances under Rafa against the bigger teams. I watched plenty of games under Rafa where we couldn’t retain the ball or get forward. What I didn’t see from Rafa very often though was completely mental subs, although he wasn’t without the odd moment of madness in that regard too. Hoping Bruce realises that he fucked up his sub selection today and doesn’t make the same mistake again. (Not holding my breath though)

I don't think anyone is struggling to explain the woeful second half I mean the substitutions were baffling. I could quite clearly see why it went to shit. Steve Bruce is the answer. I know. I still think his every word doesn’t deserve to be torn apart like, but that was shite!

I don't think anyone is struggling to explain the woeful second half I mean the substitutions were baffling. I could quite clearly see why it went to shit.

I’m not going to spin anything. I thought the first half was decent. Lively, although without many clear cut chances. Second half was woeful. Absolutely baffling.

My mate who’s there reckons there’s pockets of empty seats but estimates about 49k there.

I watched that too. He was definitely fucking joking man. Smiling the whole time he says it. It’s just a bit of shit banter with the interviewer. Nothing more. Nothing less. Overreactions are one of the foundations of this forum though. Horseshit Perfect example. Get tae fuck is it. I hope you die. ?

You do know that that’s not how we’ve been playing in pre season at all, don’t you?

I watched that too. He was definitely fucking joking man. Smiling the whole time he says it. It’s just a bit of shit banter with the interviewer. Nothing more. Nothing less. Overreactions are one of the foundations of this forum though. Horseshit Perfect example.

Like the rest of us, then. I still might. I haven’t decided yet.